View Full Version : Pumps - sizing help too
05-07-2008, 03:41 PM
New to the water stuff - need to expand from just the hardscape side.
Existing customer wants a pond - it'll be about 11x14 w/ max 3' depth in center to winter over plants - ave will be about 2'.
From the waterfull it'll be 22', twin streamed (about 3' wide and 6" deep) with small center island per se, so call it 44' total stream
To calculate : I'm looking at 4.5' friction head on stream - correct?
plus 3' static lift - 3' height of falls -correct.
So it's 8' then rounding up?
Want some decent gusto at the weir - not rushing but nice flow. Thinking a EasyPro 3900 or Tsurumi 50PN2.255 (little small?) might do the job or what do you think? I'm using these 2 brands since I know others like them. I'd consider maybe AS but real spendy and some have swore them off around here for various reasons.
Thanks for input.
**used 11x14x2x7.7=2310 gal plus some obviously in stream. Don't know how to calculate a stream volume.
05-07-2008, 08:52 PM
in case it matters - the weir will be 20" across.
thanks for any help
05-07-2008, 09:24 PM
Are there some parts of your stream or falls that you want to have 3' wide waterflow? or 3' wide total including your rocks. If you want 3' wide water you are going to need some substantial flow.
05-08-2008, 09:12 AM
Venture - I'm looking at the 3' total width that will include the rock w/i that 3' section so in reality it will be 1.5-2'' actual average with maybe a small shallow 3' pond below a slight drop somewhere within but that's it. It will get choked up a bit to maybe a 1' in spots too. As natural and meandering as possible on the site. I'm sorry I wasn't clear on this above.
I redid the site layout last night to tighten it up some - the section that will have the 2 streams will come off the waterfall area and be about 11' on one side and then 14' on the other, with a island in the middle (small with plants) and both streams at will be at narrowest ranges around this island. I'm trying to create a decent flow but not break her electric bills on the pump(s) either - I suspect she will continue this out via expansion in years ahead as money permits. I can envision a long stream with a bigger shallow pond on side lot someday. It would be perfect fit on that lot.
**The 14' side could be restricted down in flow - I'm toying with a slow trickle out feed to it and using as a filtration area that could be planted heavy, similar to a bog filtration maybe?, then trickle feeds into the main stream - the combined stream would then run about 12' into the pond then. Using whatever pump is used I could restrict it down to this "boggish" area and kick up to the other freelowing stream and maybe it would result in something nice too!???!
I haven't brought it up to her yet - she wants a bog and we were discussing a stand alone in different area. This idea I'm sure will appeal to her too. I just wasn't sure if it was viable. Your thoughts on this????
05-08-2008, 09:38 AM
The Easypro 3900 will cost about $333.00, your end result flow will be in the 3,300 range given yor head, friction loss, etc.
A Cal. mag drive 5200 will cost $162.00, or 175.00 with riser and you'll have much more water and be able to save $160-$170 dollars. Let me know if I can help, maybe I can point you in the right direction.
05-08-2008, 12:47 PM
Hey TR - I had looked at that Cal pump but the high 4's to 5a draw range it uses chased me off. She's got some huge electrical bills as it is - she said in excess of $900 a month in summer right now. Lotta elect junk on that property - pools, greenhouses, monster house. $$$ getting tighter with the nonstop rises in energy costs. I'd rather drop some money and do a real efficient pump(s) and have her happy long term - this back pond I'll not make much at all on and that's fine. I'll catch some decent profit on the side when it occurs- that will be a 2-3 week project or more and need a lot of juice and pumps. It's a real natural for a massive waterfall.
I swear she's given me more real huge and profitable referral business by word of mouth than I've generated by ads the last 5 years. I know its 33-35 big jobs, and I mean big $$$$, at least from her and they keep coming. If I can get the water side too in future -- live would be great:dancing:
I gather your thinking more in the 5000 plus gal range on a pump then huh? I sure was off on this one if that's the case. I talked to 3 places who supply and they ranged from a 2900g to low 4000g. 2 I swear don't know any more than I do and the third loves profit above family even. Even if he knows his stuff he's about 2x anyone else. He's an AS guy who carries other stuff at different location. He catches it serval different ways I guess.
05-08-2008, 01:45 PM
The Easy Pro lists only 4a and I bet that's on the low range. The mag drive cal 5200 lists 4.12-5.27 a range.
05-08-2008, 01:50 PM
Hmmmmmmmmmmmm - okay lets assume these amps close for comparision sake. How well have the Cal's help up for you?
I'm guess I'm open - well maybe not to AS at this time for reasons stated above.
05-08-2008, 02:02 PM
They hold up very well. I've had one go out in 7 years. If you didn't want the cal you could go with a Savio solids 5000gph for $315.00
P.S. Please avoild the evil empire at all costs
05-08-2008, 02:13 PM
Can I assume the EE to be the 'scape from it all thing?;)
Look for a message later on today eh!
05-08-2008, 02:21 PM
You got it.
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