Another Blade Sharpening ?

[groundsmechanic]

Hey all.

I am the mechanic for our grounds crew and have been for the last couple years. I have a couple questions about how you all do your blade sharpening.

Currently I use a dewalt angle grinder to get out as many of the nics as I can, then switch to a B.G.-121 rotary blade grinder. It usually takes me 15 - 20 mintues to do a set of 3 blades. I have 8 Toro 345 mowers with 3 blades each, 2 Exmark Lazer-Zs with 3 blades each and a Toro 4700-D with 7 blades. Plus the Land Pride with 9 blades.

So a total of 46 blades. At 5 mintues each, thats almost 4 hours. Based on some of the other threads I have read, 60 blades runs anywhere from 1 to 1.5 hours. Plus, the 4700 blades have a twist to them so I cannot get a very good cut and the exmark blades are too long for the machine.

I only sharpen blades maybe every 50 hours, maybe longer. Quality of cut doesn't really matter here, so long as they get the grounds done and the grass is short.

I would prefer to keep them sharpened more but I would need to have an assistant just to do blades so I can keep up with all the other stuff they break.

My supervisor has been talking about trying to get an automatic sharpener for me, but he has been saying that since before I got here. I have yet to see anything "automatic" in my searches. I see the Magna-Matic sharpeners and from what I read, are very good. Any ideas on automatics? Any ideas on my technique?

Cliffs Notes: 5 mintues/blade = too long, automatic sharpener existance?, technique recommendations? Magna-matic 8000 or 9000?

BTW, money isn't really a factor.

[MowerMedic77]

http://www.franzen-maschinen.de/e_pages/e_schaerftechnik/start.php?pid=1
They make both a chain sharpener and blade sharpener, I think Stens is the US distributor for them.

[jkason]

Get a bigger (more torque) grinder and put the biggest wheel you can on it.
Either you're really anal about the sharpening, are being too dainty or the blades are just hammered when they come to you.

If they're hammered, sharpen more often - and start charging the crew for damage on the units.

If the blades are too long for your grinder, you need a new grinder. Don't be dainty. work them blades on the wheel. Throw sparks - you want to almost bog down the wheel of the grinder. Don't let them get hot, though, or they lose the heat treatment.

If money is no object - http://www.bernhard.co.uk/rotamaster.0.html

[Happy Frog]

I used a home made rig using a belt sander from Harbor Freight Tools for a few months and it worked great but with the sandy soil I mow, I have to sharpen my blades after only one hour of mowing (they become badly rounded in two hours).
So after a lot of research, I bought a RBG-1012-C commercial grinder ($640 at Russo Equipment on eBay).
It looks like the smaller grinders but this monster is about 142 lbs and has a 12" ceramic wheel mounted on a 1 H.P. commercial duty motor. They have only one grinder bigger than this one and it weights 195 lbs with 14" wheel and 2 H.P. motor (way too heavy for me to move around).
It still take me a while to sharpen my blades but it is much quicker than the belt sander. The biggest difference is that I can push the blade against the wheel without slowing down the motor and I get a real good cutting edge on my blades.
Without a continuous blade cooling system, I don't see how any device (including the over priced Magna-Matic 9000 and 8000) can sharpen blades faster: The faster you want to go, the more you have to push the blade against the wheel and the more heat you create on the blade edge (you need a bucket of water close by to cool down your blades all the time).
You just have to find the right amount of pressure to grind the blade without burning the edge and loosing the temper.
Unless you have real sandy soil like me, it should take you but a minute or two to sharpen a blade with this grinder :drinkup:

[DiyDave]

Try a Neary or RBG blade grinder, it'll about cut your time in half, for under a grand.:waving:

[Breezmister]

Hey all.
I am the mechanic for our grounds crew and have been for the last couple years. I have a couple questions about how you all do your blade sharpening.


Here is a link to another thread that might help, every one will have there opinion on what works " for them " like me :) Also, there is a second link in that thread to another that might help as well

http://www.lawnsite.com/showthread.php?t=199967&highlight=grinder

Just keep it simple

[Two Seasons]

We've been in business a short time and made the investment in a MAG-8000 from Magna-Matic. Got the stand and the seven ball-bearing balancer too. I can clean and sharpen 12 blades in 50 minutes. We amortized out the cost and did the deal. Well worth the money. Precision sharpened/balanced blades makes a big difference in: cost of fuel (less parasitic loss), healthier grass (less tearing), and probably is less costly when maintenance time comes into play.

And your employees will enjoy less vibration in the machine!

[groundsmechanic]

Get a bigger (more torque) grinder and put the biggest wheel you can on it.
Either you're really anal about the sharpening, are being too dainty or the blades are just hammered when they come to you.

If they're hammered, sharpen more often - and start charging the crew for damage on the units.

If the blades are too long for your grinder, you need a new grinder. Don't be dainty. work them blades on the wheel. Throw sparks - you want to almost bog down the wheel of the grinder. Don't let them get hot, though, or they lose the heat treatment.

If money is no object - http://www.bernhard.co.uk/rotamaster.0.html

The grinder I currently have is an RBG-121, the smallest rotary grinder they make. I can stop the motor pretty easily, plus what it does stop, it has discolored the metal from the heat. The blades are usually torn up pretty bad by the time I get to them. Some of the workers will destroy a set pretty quickly since their IQ rivals that of the grass they are cutting. They hang the decks over the curbs and grind them on the concrete, hit stones, mow dirt and mud. I don't sharpen them as often as should be because I don't have the time. I am the only mechanic for over 40 pieces of equipment so I stay busy with that.

Thanks for the link, I will be looking into that one also.

[groundsmechanic]

http://www.franzen-maschinen.de/e_pages/e_schaerftechnik/start.php?pid=1
They make both a chain sharpener and blade sharpener, I think Stens is the US distributor for them.

Thanks, I will see if I can get Stens to find our account. We have Stens blades but aparently we don't have an account according to them. Go figure.

[tomo]

hello ,
If u have either
1/red neck operators [causing physical damage to blade ] or
2/ blade sharpening at long intervals

The condition of the blades will always be poor prior to resharp
Therefore more metal is required to be removed at each service
The priority is then a machine that will torerate this
eg [long constant heavy use ]
my own experience with dedicated blade grinders suggests that a min of 1 1/2 hp is required .[oregon or the 2hp RBG]
Cooling of the blade tip in a container of water every pass or every 2nd pass is required .

Although there is an automatic feed blade sharpener available it is not water cooled therefore only usefull for slightly worn blades .aargh !!

tomo:waving:

[groundsmechanic]

hello ,
If u have either
1/red neck operators [causing physical damage to blade ]
Not redneck, just idiots. They used to be the janitors and they were moved to grounds when janitorial services were contracted out.

Although there is an automatic feed blade sharpener available it is not water cooled therefore only usefull for slightly worn blades .aargh !!

The Rotamaster 4000 is liquid cooled. It can run straight water, but they recommend a 20% solution of their "special" coolant and water. I called my local dealer about the Rotamaster and our price is $5700. We would have to get prior approval for this purchase.



''''''''''

[topsites]

I don't worry about the nicks but then I sharpen them every day, that way it doesn't take long...

As for the nicks, I sharpen them all the same way, nick or not, and let those things work themselves out over time.

A really bad nick might last a month but most are gone within a week, like I said I just let it work itself out over time, I can't afford to waste that much steel (don't forget you have to take as much steel off the other side or it's off balance).

I used to do it all with a hand held angle grinder, the price of these tools and the replacement wheels made this very attractive, but it does consume time... Now I use a dedicated blade sharpener, they run 6-700 for the machine and the stupid wheel is another $120 but it only takes about 15-20 seconds per blade in actual time under the wheel, now with the balancing and all the bs I'd say 15-20 maybe 30 minutes for 30 blades, somewhere in that range.

Now that's a lot more sharpening than you do, probably around 10 times more often, so it might still work out to 5 minutes a blade lol

Way I do it is I have enough blades to last me like a week, so I usually just swap them out then when I start to run low I sharpen up a slew... I find it easier on myself this way, and seeing how the time is all the same why not give them a nice cut, too...

[groundsmechanic]

I got a reply from one of my parts dealers about the Franzen grinder. His cost, $19,500 from Stens who is the dealer in America. Wow.



my own experience with dedicated blade grinders suggests that a min of 1 1/2 hp is required .[oregon or the 2hp RBG]

I just looked and noticed my RBG is a huge 1/2 horse. No wonder I can stop the wheel very easily.

[MowerMedic77]

His cost, $19,500 from Stens who is the dealer in America. Wow.

BTW, money isn't really a factor.

I would suspect that this previous statement has now changed.
I will be putting this grinder on my wish list right behind New Ferrari....:laugh:

[groundsmechanic]

I would suspect that this previous statement has now changed.

Yeah, just a bit. Aparently the Franzen is made of gold.

[Happy Frog]

Back to drawing board, aren't you?
If money is no object (kinda) I would suggest you the biggest and baddest RBG grinder with their vacumm stand (RBG-20014-C & RBG-330) and a Mag-1000 blade balancer.
Probably one of the best setting you can find on the market and you will stay under $2,000 at the proper dealer.
I would be surprised if you could find a better set-up for the money.

[DiyDave]

Enco, or MSC, or McMaster-Carr. What you want to look at is surface grinders. There are several varieties of these, with the proper jig, whether shop built, or commercial, you should be able to set it up for automated blade grinding. Where there's a will, there's a way!:cool2::cool2:

[paolaken]

I used a home made rig using a belt sander from Harbor Freight Tools for a few months and it worked great but with the sandy soil I mow, I have to sharpen my blades after only one hour of mowing (they become badly rounded in two hours).
So after a lot of research, I bought a RBG-1012-C commercial grinder ($640 at Russo Equipment on eBay).
It looks like the smaller grinders but this monster is about 142 lbs and has a 12" ceramic wheel mounted on a 1 H.P. commercial duty motor. They have only one grinder bigger than this one and it weights 195 lbs with 14" wheel and 2 H.P. motor (way too heavy for me to move around).
It still take me a while to sharpen my blades but it is much quicker than the belt sander. The biggest difference is that I can push the blade against the wheel without slowing down the motor and I get a real good cutting edge on my blades.
Without a continuous blade cooling system, I don't see how any device (including the over priced Magna-Matic 9000 and 8000) can sharpen blades faster: The faster you want to go, the more you have to push the blade against the wheel and the more heat you create on the blade edge (you need a bucket of water close by to cool down your blades all the time).
You just have to find the right amount of pressure to grind the blade without burning the edge and loosing the temper.
Unless you have real sandy soil like me, it should take you but a minute or two to sharpen a blade with this grinder :drinkup:
same grinder i have. i love it. if you don't sharpen but every 50 hrs they must really be rounded off. we sharpen everyday and it only takes seconds to put the edge back on.

[groundsmechanic]

Problem with my sharpening everyday is by the time I get to work, they are already out mowing. Plus I have another location where I take care of their equipment too and it takes 15-20 mintues to get there.

That is why I was shooting for weekly changing of the blades. I bought 74 new blades toward the end of last season since our credit cards were being shut off. That and a lot of the current blades were getting to the end of their lifespan.

As I mentioned before with the RBG, I have blades with cutting edges that run almost half the length of the blade and they just hit the motor supports. If I move the blade so it slides under the motor, the angle to the wheel causes a bad grind. That is where I can see the advantage of the Magna grinders.

same grinder i have. i love it. if you don't sharpen but every 50 hrs they must really be rounded off. we sharpen everyday and it only takes seconds to put the edge back on.

Yeah, the blades get very rounded. And very gouged. What doesn't help is when they hang the deck over a curb and I can hear the blades grind on the concrete from across the parking lots.

[Two Seasons]

Problem with my sharpening everyday is by the time I get to work, they are already out mowing. Plus I have another location where I take care of their equipment too and it takes 15-20 mintues to get there.

That is why I was shooting for weekly changing of the blades. I bought 74 new blades toward the end of last season since our credit cards were being shut off. That and a lot of the current blades were getting to the end of their lifespan.

As I mentioned before with the RBG, I have blades with cutting edges that run almost half the length of the blade and they just hit the motor supports. If I move the blade so it slides under the motor, the angle to the wheel causes a bad grind. That is where I can see the advantage of the Magna grinders.



Yeah, the blades get very rounded. And very gouged. What doesn't help is when they hang the deck over a curb and I can hear the blades grind on the concrete from across the parking lots.

Sounds like you have some employees that aren't very careful with the equipment.

Originally you stated that it is taking you WAY TOO LONG to keep up with the blade maintenance. You said money isn't an issue. You also said that at the end of last season you purchased some more blades to, I assume, give you some breathing room with the blade change-outs.

With all this, I'm puzzled that you haven't contacted Magna-Matic and explored your options with them. I would think your business doesn't probably use mulching blades, so you could buy the MAG-9000. Along with that, I'm assuming that you need to keep your mowers in good shape. Well then, you need to consider one of their balancers too.

We've been in business a very short time compared to all the experts here, but I'm telling you that our MAG-8000, balancer, and stand have made this CHORE more pleasant than what I was doing before---vise and hand grinder!

Your rounded blade issue is simply that you are waiting too long before the blades are swaped out and sharpened.

Call Magna-Matic.

[jkason]

Talk to your Supervisor, and tell him/her that there needs to be a policy in place to deal with the abuse that the crews are dishing out to the equipment. If the crews are going to beat the equipment to death, I feel that they need to replace it, also.

[Happy Frog]

As I mentioned before with the RBG, I have blades with cutting edges that run almost half the length of the blade and they just hit the motor supports. If I move the blade so it slides under the motor, the angle to the wheel causes a bad grind. That is where I can see the advantage of the Magna grinders.

The big RBG grinder has a 11" sharpening depth for each side of the blade, how much do you need :confused:

[groundsmechanic]

Talk to your Supervisor, and tell him/her that there needs to be a policy in place to deal with the abuse that the crews are dishing out to the equipment. If the crews are going to beat the equipment to death, I feel that they need to replace it, also.

Well, the supervisor knows how I feel and knows about the damage and lack of care. He usually gets an earful from me when something major goes wrong. I even went so far as to create a "Equipment Care" list on things NOT to do with the mowers.

Only one person has been written up for damage to a machine. The employee drove over a curb to mow an island with about 4 square feet of grass with the Toro 345 and when he came off, he broke the hydraulic fitting off which in turn broke the axle housing. $2000+ in damage.

The supervisor also does things that I don't like so he isn't much help at times. My supervisor is different from the crews in my building.

The big RBG grinder has a 11" sharpening depth for each side of the blade, how much do you need :confused:

My Exmark blades have a 9" cutting edge and our BG-121 only has a 7" cutting depth. So the large grinder would be better in this aspect.

[groundsmechanic]

This is the idiocy I have to deal with. The guy on the right is the worst. He is the one who broke the axle housing. He called me because he was going to tip over. It wasn't going to go over, the deck was stopping it. I just stood on the high side and drove it down.

http://www.greatlakes4x4.com/imagehosting/33684843fca43b844.jpg

http://www.greatlakes4x4.com/imagehosting/33684843fca4e23b0.jpg

[DiyDave]

GM-that guy reminds me of a few of the county workers around here! He needs a bubble over his head that says DUH! As someone once said, I've seen more intelligent expressions on the face of a wrastler:laugh::laugh:

[MrRob]

that hill doesnt look that steep.

[jkason]

It's actually too steep to mow with that piece of equipment.
Some people should not be allowed near equipment.

If the Supervisor is part of the problem, talk to their boss. Might help, but might also create stress.
A creative way I have found to deal with the problem is to say "I'm so busy fixing everyone's f***-ups, that I don't have time for anything else right now. Put that machine over there and I'll fix it when I can."

[groundsmechanic]

It's actually too steep to mow with that piece of equipment.
Some people should not be allowed near equipment.

If the Supervisor is part of the problem, talk to their boss. Might help, but might also create stress.
A creative way I have found to deal with the problem is to say "I'm so busy fixing everyone's f***-ups, that I don't have time for anything else right now. Put that machine over there and I'll fix it when I can."


That slope has been mowed with those machines for years and nobody has ever had a problem. This guy is just an idiot. For the last few years they have been using the 4700 to mow it since it has a wider track and can get it mowed in two passes with the 7 decks.

The supervisor's supervisor is going to retire in a year and isn't interested in dealing with problems. Makes it kinda tough.

I also already say what it is that you say. I had to replace a caster cap on a mower but I made the 30 second job take 2 days so he had to use the crappy backup mower we have. It doesn't help though.

[jkason]

Get yourself a cattle prod, and inform him he's not allowed to use any machine when you are on the clock.

When they ask what the cattle prod is for, tell them it's for dumb-asses who screw up machines by being stupid.

[groundsmechanic]

I went off on him today. We will see if HR contacts me about making it a "Hostile" work environment. I think it is a ******ed work environment.

[Breezmister]

I went off on him today. We will see if HR contacts me about making it a "Hostile" work environment. I think it is a ******ed work environment.

Been there done that and I got the sticky end of the stick :) Any way, this has gone far beyond sharp blades. You could do like I did and move on to another job. There are alot of LCOs that do care about their equipment and will back you up. Then again there are a few that look at it as the cost of doing business. Or just bite your lip and just do your job.

If you are not happy there, then move on, your mental health will be better off and your blood pressure will go down. Keep an eye out for an opening in the papers. Start talking to other landscapers that you see along the road, get then phone book out and start making calls. Talk to the people that you buy parts from.

I worked for one LCO for 6 weeks, bad place, drug users and just in general a bad attitude from the owner. I was talking to the owner about how the equipment was getting abused and he said to me " quite your bitching and just do your job"
The next morning I got the fork lift out and loaded my toolbox in my truck and never looked back, best move I ever did :)
With in 2 days I had a better job, more money and was closer to home.

What ever you do, don't let other people walk over your conscience...So what are you going to do ?

[treemonkey]

I went off on him today. We will see if HR contacts me about making it a "Hostile" work environment. I think it is a ******ed work environment.


GM, I have been in your shoes. It is very difficult to work under bad conditions.

Have you weighed the pros and cons of your job? Does it pay well? Could you find similar employment in Michigan? Do you get health care benefits? Does your employer have a good retirement plan where they make a good contribution? Do you have union protection? Things to consider before looking to jump the fence to find "Greener" grass.

Have you considered just doing your job well, without taking responsibility for other's actions? What happens when others tear up machinery? You don't get yelled at, correct? You don't pay for their mistakes, correct? If you are not their supervisor, why do you feel responsible to manage them? If the lawns don't get mowed, it's really no skin off your back, correct? Put some music on and enjoy your 4 hours a week sharpening blades.

Be the best mechanic you can be and let it rest there. Let your workplace deal with all the other problems. Don't take the situation personally.....it's not your equipment. You don't pay the consequences, your work place does. Once you relieve yourself of the responsibility to be personally liable for the equipment, you will have removed a great burden off yourself. Your supervisor is getting paid the big bucks to get an ulcer, not you. You never know when you might just up and die from a heart attack under the stress you are putting yourself under.

Enjoy your wrenching career and let the workplace beauracracy go on like it has for the past 150 years. Instead of fighting it, learn to work it to your advantage.

Good luck. Take advantage of your workplace EAP (Employee Assistance Program) for some helpful advice if possible.

[groundsmechanic]

GM, I have been in your shoes. It is very difficult to work under bad conditions.

Have you weighed the pros and cons of your job? Does it pay well? Could you find similar employment in Michigan? Do you get health care benefits? Does your employer have a good retirement plan where they make a good contribution? Do you have union protection? Things to consider before looking to jump the fence to find "Greener" grass.

Have you considered just doing your job well, without taking responsibility for other's actions? What happens when others tear up machinery? You don't get yelled at, correct? You don't pay for their mistakes, correct? If you are not their supervisor, why do you feel responsible to manage them? If the lawns don't get mowed, it's really no skin off your back, correct? Put some music on and enjoy your 4 hours a week sharpening blades.

Be the best mechanic you can be and let it rest there. Let your workplace deal with all the other problems. Don't take the situation personally.....it's not your equipment. You don't pay the consequences, your work place does. Once you relieve yourself of the responsibility to be personally liable for the equipment, you will have removed a great burden off yourself. Your supervisor is getting paid the big bucks to get an ulcer, not you. You never know when you might just up and die from a heart attack under the stress you are putting yourself under.

Enjoy your wrenching career and let the workplace beauracracy go on like it has for the past 150 years. Instead of fighting it, learn to work it to your advantage.

Good luck. Take advantage of your workplace EAP (Employee Assistance Program) for some helpful advice if possible.

Great advice. Thanks. I guess the reason I take it personally is because I have to bail them out when they mess up. I am the one to get them unstuck when they drive through a wet, muddy area. I try to save money on equipment and parts by telling them how to properly use it.

Technically, I DO pay for the stuff they break. And you do too. I work for the State of Michigan so anything we buy, you and I pay for. I have tried to just let the idiotic stuff they do not get to me, but then somebody does something even more dumb, and I get pissed again.

I get sick of repairing the same thing over and over again because they don't pay attention to what they are doing. How can somebody who has been doing this job for almost 30 years, mowing the same area, hit a manhole that has been there just as long? They don't care. A couple of people also break stuff or get stuck on purpose just so they don't have to mow until they are unstuck or fixed. That is the kind of stuff that gets me upset.

Plus, their supervisor isn't a whole lot better than they are. And the supervisor's supervisor is worthless as well. He is going to retire soon and doesn't want to deal with any problems.

[groundsmechanic]

Been there done that and I got the sticky end of the stick :) Any way, this has gone far beyond sharp blades. You could do like I did and move on to another job. There are alot of LCOs that do care about their equipment and will back you up. Then again there are a few that look at it as the cost of doing business. Or just bite your lip and just do your job.

If you are not happy there, then move on, your mental health will be better off and your blood pressure will go down. Keep an eye out for an opening in the papers. Start talking to other landscapers that you see along the road, get then phone book out and start making calls. Talk to the people that you buy parts from.

I worked for one LCO for 6 weeks, bad place, drug users and just in general a bad attitude from the owner. I was talking to the owner about how the equipment was getting abused and he said to me " quite your bitching and just do your job"
The next morning I got the fork lift out and loaded my toolbox in my truck and never looked back, best move I ever did :)
With in 2 days I had a better job, more money and was closer to home.

What ever you do, don't let other people walk over your conscience...So what are you going to do ?

Well, if it wasn't for the pay and the benefits, I wouldn't have taken the job. I would probably still be fixing cars. I quit auto repair because I made a different amount of money every week and I couldn't buy a house because I might not make enough to cover the payment and my other bills.

The overtime I get here in the winter is great. I get a lot of extra money and if I was smart I would save it but it doesn't usually happen.

I guess I just need to deal with it and try again to not let it get to me.

And I am still open to blade advice. I talked to my supervisor and he can get a demo Rotamaster 4000 for like $1900. Otherwise he is talking about getting a Foley-Bellsaw or Magna-matic.

[Breezmister]

Well, if it wasn't for the pay and the benefits, I wouldn't have taken the job.

I can understand that, but it should not stop you from looking. There are better jobs out there with LCOs and repair shops that do pay better and have benefits, and the snow money is just as good. You have a skill that is in high demand and you can write your own ticket if you find that just right place to land.

I guess I just need to deal with it and try again to not let it get to me.

Just don't take it home with you :nono: You can all ways vent in here.

And I am still open to blade advice. I talked to my supervisor and he can get a demo Rotamaster 4000 for like $1900. Otherwise he is talking about getting a Foley-Bellsaw or Magna-matic.

Neary and Baldor, as well as Foley-Bellsaw have been around forever, all will do the job. Check them out on the web. Good Luck

[mike r]

Groundsmechanic,

agreed with two seasons there, the mag 9000 from magnamatic IMO IS the very best there is.

[jeffslawncare]

my shop just got a Magna-Matic sharpener and it is a tiny bit faster but not really as much as they say.
Also if you have mulching blads if you use a snaller grinding wheel it eats the wheel up kind of fast.

[Diamond Dave]

We use a Oregon 1 1/2 HP at work and it makes pretty quick work of sharpening blades. Previously we used a bench mounted belt sander which worked pretty well also, but not as quick.

[groundsmechanic]

We use a Oregon 1 1/2 HP at work and it makes pretty quick work of sharpening blades. Previously we used a bench mounted belt sander which worked pretty well also, but not as quick.

My other job has an Oregon grinder and it looks like a rebadged RBG. Has the same frame as the RBG and the problem with my current RBG is my Exmark blades won't fit. The grinder only has 7" of depth while the blades have 9" of cutting edge. I have to grind them on an angle which gives a bad cut.

[Breezmister]

The grinder only has 7" of depth while the blades have 9" of cutting edge. I have to grind them on an angle which gives a bad cut.

Here is what you can do, just do the first 7 inches of the blades. it won't make any differences to the grass.

Really, the only part of the blade that needs to be sharp is the section with the air lift, that is the working part of the blade. Try it for a few weeks and you will see the difference, that extra 2 inches will look the same as it did a few weeks ago.

I do 2 to 3 hundred blades a week for a 1/2 dozen LCO and this is the way I sharpen the blades. These are Scag blades. As you can see in this picture, the air lift is the same no matter the lenght of the blade and the original grind of the OEM blade.

[DiyDave]

BM, You have it right with one caveat. The first inch of the blade does 90 % of the cutting, has little to do with the length of the airfoil. I also use a similar grinder(neary), when the blade is too long, just put it on about a 30 degree angle, to the grinder(motor) shaft, and it'll sharpen the whole length just fine, There are those who say stick to the factory angle, to them I say BS. Blades will stay sharper longer if you set the grinder to the steepest angle possible, on mine that's about 50 - 60 degrees. Want proof? look at an agricultural hammermill, what is the blade angle? (90 degrees) When is it wore out? When the TIP is rounder over!:cool2:

[Breezmister]

BM, You have it right with one caveat. The first inch of the blade does 90 % of the cutting, has little to do with the length of the airfoil.

I'll agree with you on that :rolleyes: I still get the funny looks from LCOs who come to see me about sharping blades when I tell them I only grind the first 4inches. I could have so much work grinding blades.

There are those who say stick to the factory angle, to them I say BS. Blades will stay sharper longer if you set the grinder to the steepest angle possible, on mine that's about 50 - 60 degrees. Want proof? look at an agricultural hammermill, what is the blade angle? (90 degrees) When is it wore out? When the TIP is rounder over!


For guys that change their blades every day, I'll follow the factory angle. But with the once a week guys, I'll go to about 45 degrees. Then there are the guys that don't care what they run over, sand, gravel, sticks, water meter caps, dead wild life, live wild life :nono: I don't know what to do with them.

[groundsmechanic]

I grind ours at about a 45. This is what the previous guys told me they did, so I have been doing it. They hit things like crazy so I think any less of an angle would really get damaged easily.

Breezmister, thanks for the info. Maybe I will try that for a while. I had been grinding those blades on an angle so I could get the whole thing.

On a side note, I really need a new sharpener with a stronger motor. This little 1/2 horse just isn't working for me. I can stop the wheel way easily. It is a PITA!

[dependablelawn1]

Sounds like you have some employees that aren't very careful with the equipment.

Originally you stated that it is taking you WAY TOO LONG to keep up with the blade maintenance. You said money isn't an issue. You also said that at the end of last season you purchased some more blades to, I assume, give you some breathing room with the blade change-outs.

With all this, I'm puzzled that you haven't contacted Magna-Matic and explored your options with them. I would think your business doesn't probably use mulching blades, so you could buy the MAG-9000. Along with that, I'm assuming that you need to keep your mowers in good shape. Well then, you need to consider one of their balancers too.

We've been in business a very short time compared to all the experts here, but I'm telling you that our MAG-8000, balancer, and stand have made this CHORE more pleasant than what I was doing before---vise and hand grinder!

Your rounded blade issue is simply that you are waiting too long before the blades are swaped out and sharpened.

Call Magna-Matic.

I haven't been doing this long ether. I have the Mag set up. It makes things easier but it's not as fast as they claim

[groundsmechanic]

Well, since my supervisor kept lagging on getting me a new grinder, I asked HIS supervisor. He said go ahead and just put it on his card. SWEET!! I ordered the RBG - 20014-C. $2500 with vac stand.

Then my supervisor found out. He was pissed. I told him he has been talking about it for over two years and never did anything about it. Blah Blah Blah. He ended up telling me to cancel the order. So I called the shop and canceled the order. They were unloading it off the semi as we were talking. The shop was pissed now too.

ANYWAY, my supervisor ordered me a new grinder. He got me a Neary 450 with vac stand. I hate it. No matter where I stand, I get sparks in the face. I will have to now buy a full face shield just so I can sharpen blades. Those of you that have not used one of these before, the wheel spins upward. Throwing all the sparks at you and the dust out the top of the machine. Even with the vac on, which sits at the bottom of the wheel, it comes out the top and onto the machine.

My supervisor was sooooo confidant that this is the best machine out there and all his shops used this machine when he was in charge. But he is suprised at how it works and also thinks that it is stupid that it spins the way it does. He called the company and asked about it and they said that is just they way they are engineered.

Anybody else have this machine, and like it?

[BigFish]

You aint gonna believe this, but I use a 1/4 straight die grinder with a 3/4" dia.X 1" or so CARBIDE burr! Usually just clamp the blade to a 2x4 laying on the lift table and use the edge of the table as a guide. Very fast, and NO BURN! Kinda messy with with the minute metal chips, but ya can't have everything. I'll hit a really banged up blade with the angle grinder first, then finish with the carbide. Try it!!

[Breezmister]

My supervisor was sooooo confidant that this is the best machine out there and all his shops used this machine when he was in charge. But he is suprised at how it works and also thinks that it is stupid that it spins the way it does. He called the company and asked about it and they said that is just they way they are engineered.


Just a thought, I don't know if it can be done, but could you reverse the
polarity so that the motor will turn the other way ? I know nada about electrical stuff other then it hurts if you touch the wrong wires :hammerhead:

[topsites]

One thing about sharpening blades is it takes practice!

For several years I used a 4.5" angle grinder, it would take 1-2 minutes per blade, I have never
had it take more than 5 minutes for all 3, that is, once I had it down to some kind of a system.

As a solo operation I more than likely could have stayed with that method, nowadays Harbor Freight
sells these 4.5" grinders for $10 each and it is a rather cost effective method.

But I got tired of the daily grind, and bought a 1.5hp 12" Oregon.
I found mine at a guy's house I deal with, he had one that was a
'fixed' warranty return... Folks who used it and it broke so they got
another and now the mfg'er can't sell the return but the only thing
wrong with it was a fried $2 toggle switch.
I paid $3-400 cash for it, works real nice.

Just a thought, I don't know if it can be done, but could you reverse the
polarity so that the motor will turn the other way ? I know nada about electrical stuff other then it hurts if you touch the wrong wires :hammerhead:

You don't want that wheel spinning the other way, on mine there is a switch to reverse direction but it's so
you can sharpen blades from the other end of the wheel... I am guessing maybe for left-handed folks but more
likely either for certain blades or specific setups...

Putting a blade into a grinder with the wheel spinning downwards isn't normal operation,
it could spell bad news but it will burn the steel almost for sure, that stuff will tear into
the steel hard and it's not supposed to be used unless you intend on taking a LOT of steel off.
It's also somewhat dangerous.

On another note, why didn't the guy just get an RBG?
They're only 5-6-700 new.

[DiyDave]

I've had one for years, no problem. Couple of thoughts: Don't stand in front of it, stand to the side. It has a hood that will keep the sparks off your face, if you stand in the right place. The wheel has to rotate upward, or you'd trap the blade between the wheel and table, you think sparks are bad, wait till you feel shrapnel of a wheel breaking! The switch to reverse direction is for sharpening left handed blades, yes there are a few that go the other way! Make do and quitcherbitchin.:laugh::laugh:

[groundsmechanic]

When I started here the previous mechanic was sharpening blades on the BG-121 with the wheel spinning downward. Never had the wheel stop suddenly but it would slow then stop without a whole lot of pressure. That is why I don't like it. It has a reversing switch so it can be done either way.

With the Neary, I would have to stand directly behind the machine in order to not get hit by sparks. That makes it a little hard to see what I am doing.

On another note, why didn't the guy just get an RBG?
They're only 5-6-700 new.

I tried to get an RBG, although it was going to run $2500. I was getting the RBG-20014-C with a vac stand. After seeing one model lower, I think I can go a bit smaller than the big one.

[Breezmister]

You don't want that wheel spinning the other way,
Putting a blade into a grinder with the wheel spinning downwards isn't normal operation, it could spell bad news but it will burn the steel almost for sure, that stuff will tear into the steel hard and it's not supposed to be used unless you intend on taking a LOT of steel off.


I don't think I have ever seen a bench grinder that is not turning downward. Anyway, If you hold the blade with the sharp edge up, the air lift resting on the rest, you control the contact pressure of the blade. The sparks go south and if you have a vac set up, in to the back of the grinder and into your vac.

[DiyDave]

The subject wasn't a bench grinder, its a neary or rbg type grinder. Do a google search and you will see the difference, the motor actually sits over the table that you slide the blade on, so if the wheel were to turn the other way, you risk jamming the blade into the wheel, and the table, simultaneously. :dizzy:

[Breezmister]

so if the wheel were to turn the other way, you risk jamming the blade into the wheel, and the table, simultaneously. :dizzy:

I was thinking about holding the blade vertically, instead of laying it flat, my bad. :hammerhead: That way all the sparks would not get sent in your direction. I'll guess that you can not do that with a RBG ?

[DiyDave]

The solution to the rbg, and neary type sharpeners is to mount the grinder on a bench, at a height that is suitable to operate the grinder at a seated position. I used an old cash register stand that I bought at an auction for a dollar. I sit on a 5 gallon bucket and feed the blade into the wheel from the front end of the grinder. All the sparks shoot out to my left, most under the table, a little dust lands on my left hand and arm. I don't use a dust catcher or shop vac, just let it fly away from me. Of course, I am a one man show, and don't have to answer to OSHA!:laugh::laugh: