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View Full Version : I Hate Wiring Trouble!!!!!


evergreensolutions
08-04-2008, 10:01 PM
Went to a job tonight. Master valve (DV100) diaphragm needed replaced. Went ahead and replaced entire top half with a DVF100. All zones worked like a champ.

Then comes zone 6. The last one, but the closest one to the controller. I test my voltage at the clock, 27.5 volts. 521 leads me to a rats nest of splices wrapped in duct tape in the flower bed so I fix that. After the splices, I am getting 24 volts about 20 feet from the controller.

At some point in the yard, the installers went from 7 strand multi-line to 3 strand multi-line and crammed 2X1 inch valves in a 6" box. Zones 5 and 6 are in the same box. I am getting 27.5 volts to zone 5, but nothing at zone 6. This is multi-line wire in a single wire sheath.

Common sense tells me that it would be very difficult to cut just one wire (zone 6) but not the other 2 (I know it is still possible). My feeling is that the splice came undone at the conversion from 7 strand to 3 strand. The zone works if I run a whole new 18G valve wire to the controller. I have decided to replace the valve wire altogether. Am I missing something? 106* heat does not lend itself to hand trenching.

Bigred350
08-04-2008, 10:10 PM
Put the zone 5 wire on the zone 6 valve. If valve 6 comes on the you know the wire is for sure bad.

evergreensolutions
08-04-2008, 10:14 PM
Done. Worked fine. I know the wire is bad. I guess my question is, is there a good way to find the splice from 7 strand to 3 strand. One more bit of info, when I hooked up my 521 to the zone 6 wire, I got no reading on the meter on the 521 unit. When I hooked it up to zone 5 wire, I got a good reading. Does any of that help?

Dirt Boy
08-04-2008, 10:22 PM
:cry:You have my sympathy!
I am undergoing some of the same troubles myself. Apt. complex, sometimes the zones were working, turn your back, and they don't. Traced wires, re-spliced, :cry::cry:
Dummies:hammerhead: that installed left all of 2" of free wire in valve boxes, left it exposed where it enters the building, so it's all cracked, frayed due to exposure.

I'm just going to replace it all, but was just trying to get it working temporarily so the lawn don't fry in the 100 deg. temp.

FIMCO-MEISTER
08-04-2008, 10:22 PM
Done. Worked fine. I know the wire is bad. I guess my question is, is there a good way to find the splice from 7 strand to 3 strand. One more bit of info, when I hooked up my 521 to the zone 6 wire, I got no reading on the meter on the 521 unit. When I hooked it up to zone 5 wire, I got a good reading. Does any of that help?

You need a pulser/fault finder 901 to be exact. The lower your 521 reading the closer the problem is to it. When I get a weak 521 reading at max strength (5 I think) that tells me my problem is very close to where I'm hooked up at.

evergreensolutions
08-04-2008, 10:28 PM
You need a pulser/fault finder 901 to be exact. The lower your 521 reading the closer the problem is to it. When I get a weak 521 reading at max strength (5 I think) that tells me my problem is very close to where I'm hooked up at.

My ground will be close to it, or my "red wire" will be close to it? I am getting 0 for a reading at max strength.

FIMCO-MEISTER
08-04-2008, 10:31 PM
My ground will be close to it, or my "red wire" will be close to it? I am getting 0 for a reading at max strength.

Red wire.............

evergreensolutions
08-04-2008, 10:38 PM
Who makes the 901? I can't find it on line anywhere.

FIMCO-MEISTER
08-04-2008, 10:43 PM
Who makes the 901? I can't find it on line anywhere.

Greenlee fault finder, A frame looking tool with a small 501 looking box.

Waterit
08-04-2008, 11:45 PM
Who makes the 901? I can't find it on line anywhere.

Progressive used to, now I think they go by Tempo. Look on eBay, I've seen some deals there lately. http://cgi.ebay.com/Greenlee-PE2003-Pulser-Fault-Locator-to-identify-breaks_W0QQitemZ300242616803QQcmdZViewItem?_trksid=p3286.m20.l1116

Fimco is right, you'll have to have pulser to find fault. You can try to 521 one of the unused wires on the 18/7 to the end, and hope it gets you to the 7/3 junction.

bicmudpuppy
08-05-2008, 12:41 AM
THey went from 7 to 3 and it wasn't at a valve? did they go from 7 to 2 3's? or did they actually just drop 4 wires? if they truly dropped 4 wires, the connect to one of them. The signal stops where the wire stops. If they split the 7 into 2 seperate 3's, hook your red to one direction and your black to the other. You will get a null signal until they split and then be able to follow both directions with good signal.

AI Inc
08-05-2008, 05:45 AM
Im quessing they dropped from 7-3 at the next valve box in line. Screw the zone wire , track the common from either the rats nest or the 2 valves in the 6" can. Thats where your problem will be.

CAPT Stream Rotar
08-05-2008, 06:34 AM
Blow that jobsite off.

FIMCO-MEISTER
08-05-2008, 07:08 AM
Wiring problems are the backbone of the Dallas irrigation service industry. They give you the big checks. Attacking wiring problems besides having the right and best equipment is an attitude thing as well. I go into wiring problems with a chip on my shoulder. It is a very different mental feeling than busted pipes, lousy coverage, raising heads, etc. Those are all physical jobs which beat me down. Wiring jobs I could tackle all day. Always save your cut out splices to show the customer. When they get handed that bill you want to have the ammo to justify it and ALWAYS CYA. Every wiring repair should include the caveat "I can't guarantee this is the last time you will see me on this issue."

bicmudpuppy
08-05-2008, 07:34 AM
Im quessing they dropped from 7-3 at the next valve box in line. Screw the zone wire , track the common from either the rats nest or the 2 valves in the 6" can. Thats where your problem will be.

READ what he says is wrong. The transition from 7 to 3 strand is "somewhere in the yard" and he talks about having been in the various valve boxes. Is he missing a valve? a splice? or a direct buried splice. A lost splice box is almost as irritating as a direct buried splice unless they left a coil of wire in the splice box.

Still waiting a reply from the guy in the ditch.

FIMCO-MEISTER
08-05-2008, 07:46 AM
READ what he says is wrong. The transition from 7 to 3 strand is "somewhere in the yard" and he talks about having been in the various valve boxes. Is he missing a valve? a splice? or a direct buried splice. A lost splice box is almost as irritating as a direct buried splice unless they left a coil of wire in the splice box.

Still waiting a reply from the guy in the ditch.

You used to work in dallas Bic. Lost splice box? I doubt there ever was a splice box. Probably taped wire in the ditch is a potential problem. One splice I always redo is the entry splice to the garage.

evergreensolutions
08-05-2008, 09:40 AM
There are actually 2 sets of 7 strand wire in the clock. They go all the way to the rats nest. I have been in all of the valve boxes and they are all 2 valves with a 3 strand wire. I will try hooking up to an unused wire to try to find the end of the 7 strand. I know that I am on the right 7 strand because I am getting a reading where I corrected the splice. Thanks for everyones help.

WalkGood
08-05-2008, 11:13 AM
Always save your cut out splices to show the customer. When they get handed that bill you want to have the ammo to justify it and ALWAYS CYA.

Take pictures as well. These days, digital cameras are cheap and so are memory chips. Even camera phones. A few pics are worth a few thousand words.

Mad Estonian
08-05-2008, 11:45 AM
How do I delete this post

Wet_Boots
08-05-2008, 12:01 PM
How do I delete this postAdd a Peter Pan picture to it, and it will go away by itself :)