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mzgloves20
08-12-2008, 12:11 AM
Well, it's time. I've come to a point in business where I need more muscle in smaller areas.

I want to get a mini skid steer. I've been net browsing the Vermeer, Boxer, Ditchwitch (those 3 primarily). I'm looking for good lift height, good tipping capacity and tracktive performace. I've seen the bobcat mini's get stuck in MINImal wetness. Oh, and it has to be a stand on, diesel and tracked. No walking if im spending that much cabbage.

Anyone use or have any input on models? I stopped at my local and only Vermeer shop and they only had chippers and boring machines. I was also ignored for twenty minutes before I left the store. Grr....


Thanks :)

White Gardens
08-12-2008, 09:55 AM
I like the toro dingo the best. (any model) They seem to have just as many or more attachments than anyone else and if I need a specialized attachment I can go to the local chain rental company and usually they have the attachment I need.

Oasis-Outdoor
08-12-2008, 12:42 PM
http://www.lawnsite.com/showthread.php?t=93903&highlight=mini+skid+discussion

Here is a long thread that is all about the different brands of mini-skids, as well as the attachments. Check it out!...there is a lot of good information on there.

Bigred350
08-12-2008, 11:18 PM
Ive got a diesel boxer. I would buy 2 more if I could afford it. Ive got 600 hard hours on it and never had any problems. I have buried it up the the frame in mud many times and it still kept pulling through it.

Branch manager
08-12-2008, 11:43 PM
If experience has taught me anything, it might be go beyond your current expectations. My brother bought ASV30 from Vermeer in Pella,Ia. We call it the 'back-saver'; we used to bull chunks onto truck, and throw them off. Now we load with grapple over side and rear, and dump load on the 2500HD with hoist from Canada,via Buffalo. I know what these compact loaders cost; just suggesting upgrade,upfront. I can carry 1000# and do a 180 on a 4x8 with little scuffing, and love every minute init!.:rolleyes::waving:

BrandonV
08-13-2008, 06:33 PM
the vermeer is by far the most fun to drive, the dw sk650 is the workhorse out of the group, very powerfull and very fast... I own 2.

mzgloves20
08-24-2008, 12:36 AM
So, I'd like to thank Jon from Vermeer (who happened to read my post) for stepping up to the plate and making his company look good. He helped arrange a demo of the 600Tx.

Let everyone know how it goes!

Thanks Jon

mzgloves20
08-24-2008, 12:38 AM
If experience has taught me anything, it might be go beyond your current expectations. My brother bought ASV30 from Vermeer in Pella,Ia. We call it the 'back-saver'; we used to bull chunks onto truck, and throw them off. Now we load with grapple over side and rear, and dump load on the 2500HD with hoist from Canada,via Buffalo. I know what these compact loaders cost; just suggesting upgrade,upfront. I can carry 1000# and do a 180 on a 4x8 with little scuffing, and love every minute init!.:rolleyes::waving:


Looks like a neat little skidder. I have been interested in the ASV stuff for a while. Seem to have very efficient track machines. How is the pushing power for grading and such?

I still need something narrow to fit through a lot of residential gates....

mzgloves20
08-24-2008, 12:40 AM
Ive got a diesel boxer. I would buy 2 more if I could afford it. Ive got 600 hard hours on it and never had any problems. I have buried it up the the frame in mud many times and it still kept pulling through it.


Does yours have the retractable tracks?

ropinghorns
08-24-2008, 08:32 AM
I have the 224 and it's tracks go down to 22 1/2 inches. It is gas 24 hp.

mag360
08-24-2008, 03:02 PM
We have an rc30---decent little machine but not as nimble as a stand on unit. The speed is better if you have room to use it and we got ours with cab and heat for winter which is very nice.

I've used boxers with retractable tracks and the honda gas motors. They seem like solid machines and can do alot but the controls are very clumsy for loader work and they were too slow to repetitively make long runs with.

nosparkplugs
08-24-2008, 03:21 PM
Love the Mini-Skids, expect you cannot really perform lawn maintenance or long term rough mowing ie "all day work". Rented the Toro Dingo 525 wide trac 25hp Kohler gasburner, pallet forks & materials bucket. Great machine, powerful; however the gas engine did "grunt" under heaver lifts or digging with bucket. The diesels would be a must for these machines running high flow attachments, and for the exta torque while digging with the bucket would be a huge plus.

The Toro Ding 525 wide track 25hp Kubota diesel, with a grapple bucket, materials bucket, palle forks, ridding plateform, 60"Brush wolf rough mower was $25,550.

The Boxer 532D is the top of the line machine, and is the spec sheet king in ALL areas, this domination comes at a price the base Boxer 532D is aprox 22,000 no attachments.

I really liked the Toro Dingo; becuase I can, and have actually used one with attachments, were some of the other models are not avaliable for rental or Demo locally here.

ViceNut
08-25-2008, 03:24 PM
We went through this same decision a couple years back when we were looking at buying one. We went to the outdoor expo in kentucky and tested all of them. Dingo, vermeer, boxer, kanga, you name it. When we walked in the very first thing we saw was the vermeer, and I literally thought it was a small skid steer, as in the size of an asv. We had rented dingo's and all before and the vermeer looked like 10x the machine by looks alone. Then getting up close to it you could see the difference in the way it was built as well. Anyway, it wound up coming down to the vermeer and boxer. Similar machines, but one big thing was the controls of the vermeer. You can do everything you want, and not move your hands pretty much. Liked the joystick compared to the 2 controls of the boxer similar to the dingo. Also liked the platform of the vermeer much better. Much more stable, and it didn't feel like you would get vaulted in the air if you hit a bump. Only thing we could find that we liked better on the boxer was the variable tracks. The option of being close together or far apart was nice. Prices were almost identical on the two machines, and we decided to go with the vermeer. The variable tracks would be nice, but then again I cant think of a time that the vermeer wasn't able to do anything because it didn't have those. Been a great machine for us. Got it with the kubota diesel, 4n1 bucket, and low speed high torque auger powerhead with an 18in and 36in augers. (18" for shrubs and 36" for trees)

BTW, the vermeer pulled out our old 773 bobcat after it had rained and we tried grading off a place for a play area. The bobcat sunk and the vermeer was in the mud up to the frame, and still had the power/traction to pull the bobcat out. Notice I said old 773, the next day we bought a T190. :laugh::cool2:

BrandonV
08-25-2008, 05:54 PM
the main reason I went with my sk650 over the vermeer was the fact I could still walk behind it if I had to, we're very hilly here I'd expect that's not a problem in SC. I loved the vermeer though great little machine, I was uneasy however (at least here) in lack of dealer support. I REALLY wanted to demo the diesel, but only got the gas. They were kind of oblivious and told me "we don't really know much about this, we sell chippers" so I was a little put off by that. I'll say this to anyone looking the ditch witch and the vermeer are the BEST units out there. dingo, boxer, bobcat none of them hold a candle to what these two units do.

ViceNut
08-25-2008, 07:40 PM
yeh that was another selling point, the vermeer dealer is about 15 minutes from our shop, where there wasn't a boxer dealer within an hour. We were the first ones around the area with the vermeer, but I think a few more have been sold since we bought ours.

Lawnworks
08-25-2008, 09:52 PM
Wow 25k... I am going to buy a second dingo just for a back-up and still have less than 10k in both machines.

The diesel is nice and I would love to have one... but it is a doodad and will never pencil out... just get you into more unnecessary debt.

Lawnworks
08-25-2008, 09:54 PM
We went through this same decision a couple years back when we were looking at buying one. We went to the outdoor expo in kentucky and tested all of them. Dingo, vermeer, boxer, kanga, you name it. When we walked in the very first thing we saw was the vermeer, and I literally thought it was a small skid steer, as in the size of an asv. We had rented dingo's and all before and the vermeer looked like 10x the machine by looks alone. Then getting up close to it you could see the difference in the way it was built as well. Anyway, it wound up coming down to the vermeer and boxer. Similar machines, but one big thing was the controls of the vermeer. You can do everything you want, and not move your hands pretty much. Liked the joystick compared to the 2 controls of the boxer similar to the dingo. Also liked the platform of the vermeer much better. Much more stable, and it didn't feel like you would get vaulted in the air if you hit a bump. Only thing we could find that we liked better on the boxer was the variable tracks. The option of being close together or far apart was nice. Prices were almost identical on the two machines, and we decided to go with the vermeer. The variable tracks would be nice, but then again I cant think of a time that the vermeer wasn't able to do anything because it didn't have those. Been a great machine for us. Got it with the kubota diesel, 4n1 bucket, and low speed high torque auger powerhead with an 18in and 36in augers. (18" for shrubs and 36" for trees)

BTW, the vermeer pulled out our old 773 bobcat after it had rained and we tried grading off a place for a play area. The bobcat sunk and the vermeer was in the mud up to the frame, and still had the power/traction to pull the bobcat out. Notice I said old 773, the next day we bought a T190. :laugh::cool2:

So you get a machine stuck and then go buy a brand new one? Sounds savy....

mag360
08-25-2008, 10:46 PM
So you get a machine stuck and then go buy a brand new one? Sounds savy....

Research the poster.

mzgloves20
08-25-2008, 11:07 PM
wow thanks for all the input!!

I was afraid the boxer would have silly controls. I like the idea of the added work load rating and the high tip rating on the boxer. I think the Vermeer has a 1400lb tip and rated working load of 500lb. The boxer is 1100lb and 2000lb in ther same order. Overall it has to be the total package though....

I really hope I can demo a harly rake or tiller with the demo. I have two yards to renovate in the next week or two.:rolleyes:

nosparkplugs
08-25-2008, 11:19 PM
wow thanks for all the input!!

I was afraid the boxer would have silly controls. I like the idea of the added work load rating and the high tip rating on the boxer. I think the Vermeer has a 1400lb tip and rated working load of 500lb. The boxer is 1100lb and 2000lb in ther same order. Overall it has to be the total package though....

I really hope I can demo a harly rake or tiller with the demo. I have two yards to renovate in the next week or two.:rolleyes:

The Boxer's 532D's auxiliary high flow hydraulics GPM are impressive in the range of a skid steer, and will run the attachments more efficiently than the Dingo or Vermeer. The Boxer's extra lifting capacity is the difference between being able to lift a $1,800 lb pallet of field stone or not, if you go with one of the other models. The variable track does serve to increase it's lift capacity "wider stance" ,as well as to get through

Lawnworks
08-26-2008, 06:31 AM
The Boxer's 532D's auxiliary high flow hydraulics GPM are impressive in the range of a skid steer, and will run the attachments more efficiently than the Dingo or Vermeer. The Boxer's extra lifting capacity is the difference between being able to lift a $1,800 lb pallet of field stone or not, if you go with one of the other models. The variable track does serve to increase it's lift capacity "wider stance" ,as well as to get through

I personally think the boxer's are a second tier machine. The controls are absolutely horrid. The variable width tracks w/ exposed cylinders that get scratched and leak. The hydro motors also have problems.

You will never ever lift an 1800 pallet of field stone off the ground w/ a Boxer... You might be able to drag half of that.

2 clowns mowing
08-26-2008, 07:03 AM
Well, it's time. I've come to a point in business where I need more muscle in smaller areas.

I want to get a mini skid steer. I've been net browsing the Vermeer, Boxer, Ditchwitch (those 3 primarily). I'm looking for good lift height, good tipping capacity and tracktive performace. I've seen the bobcat mini's get stuck in MINImal wetness. Oh, and it has to be a stand on, diesel and tracked. No walking if im spending that much cabbage.

Anyone use or have any input on models? I stopped at my local and only Vermeer shop and they only had chippers and boring machines. I was also ignored for twenty minutes before I left the store. Grr....


Thanks :)rent,rent,rent they do repairs

nosparkplugs
08-26-2008, 08:36 AM
rent,rent,rent they do repairs

Yep, thats what I figured out with these puppies

ViceNut
08-26-2008, 11:54 AM
renting gets old though. Wondering whether or not they will have the machine available when you need it, whether or not its broken down at the time, yadda yadda yadda. If you rent it enough, then its cheaper to go ahead and buy one anyway. Plus, if there is just a small job that doesn't hardly have enough profit in it to rent one, but it will make the job 100% easier if you have it, its good to own one then too. You have it there when you need it.

nosparkplugs
08-26-2008, 07:23 PM
True not all rental companies "stock" these mini skid steers, and some companies that do, their POS. I use Hertz Rental their equipment is always well maintained & newer, the Toro Dingo 525 WT pallet fork, material bucket, two tree augars for $175 a day. If they could mow faster:laugh: I would be all over owning one.:)

mzgloves20
08-27-2008, 12:12 PM
renting gets old though. Wondering whether or not they will have the machine available when you need it, whether or not its broken down at the time, yadda yadda yadda. If you rent it enough, then its cheaper to go ahead and buy one anyway. Plus, if there is just a small job that doesn't hardly have enough profit in it to rent one, but it will make the job 100% easier if you have it, its good to own one then too. You have it there when you need it.


Yea, i have rented some things for jobs in the past, but time constraints (everything always takes a little longer then planned :)) travel times (no one within 30mins) and availability of what I want (most places don't have more then one unit to rent) makes that tough most of the time.

The vermeer rep told me they would bring the machine and show me how to operate it and I could try it for a little bit. Maybe if the sales Mgr ok'd it they could leave it. Didn't sound like he be pusing for that option, though.
Is that the norm? Before I spent $90,000 on skidders and a mini x, the Cat rep dropped off the skid steer and said "see ya in a week"...lol he came back in two.

I really just want to get the best overall machine for the money. If some people think the boxer will only perfom at half of what it is rated, where does that leave a machine that is already rated at half of the boxer to start with. Vermeer seems to have a history of quality products. I guess the bigger nums on the boxer keep pulling me back with interest. I guess :confused:

Vermeer
08-27-2008, 02:07 PM
The question of operating capacity seems to get brought up alot and how numbers are published. For consistency all machines have a tip capacity which is the maximum amount of weight that can be lifted safely before the machine tips forward. Operating capacity is a specification that differs between track an rubber tired equipment. Rubber tired skid steer loaders are rated at 50% of tip. For example if a rubber tired skid steer's tip capacity is 1000 pounds its operating capacity is 500 lbs. A track skid steer loader however is rated at 35% of its tip capacity so if the unit had 1000 lbs tip capacity it's operating capacity should be rated at 350 lbs. Unfortunately not all mfg's rate their equipment the same way and rate tracked equipment at 50% of tip which is not consistent. There are companies that also differ in performing tip tests so this information may be manipulated to look better than it actually might. At the end of the day spec's are ok to use as a guidline but a side by side comparison is where you get the true information.

mzgloves20
08-27-2008, 07:59 PM
The question of operating capacity seems to get brought up alot and how numbers are published. For consistency all machines have a tip capacity which is the maximum amount of weight that can be lifted safely before the machine tips forward. Operating capacity is a specification that differs between track an rubber tired equipment. Rubber tired skid steer loaders are rated at 50% of tip. For example if a rubber tired skid steer's tip capacity is 1000 pounds its operating capacity is 500 lbs. A track skid steer loader however is rated at 35% of its tip capacity so if the unit had 1000 lbs tip capacity it's operating capacity should be rated at 350 lbs. Unfortunately not all mfg's rate their equipment the same way and rate tracked equipment at 50% of tip which is not consistent. There are companies that also differ in performing tip tests so this information may be manipulated to look better than it actually might. At the end of the day spec's are ok to use as a guidline but a side by side comparison is where you get the true information.


I see...sales spec manipulation...lol...thanks for the tip! Can't wait to try your machine!

Chestnut Oaks Prez
08-28-2008, 02:09 PM
We didn't buy all the attachments but Vermeer has been there to help us out when we needed to demo one:) Our Vermeer service guy Steve in Greenville is a gem and we would buy another just because of his prompness to get us on the job again:weightlifter:

LB1234
08-30-2008, 08:22 PM
for those that say just rent...

have you factored in the true costs of 'renting' the machine over and above the actual rental cost?

In other words, extra wear/tear on the truck to drive the extra mileage to pick it up, extra fuel to do the same, the labor cost of someone driving in the truck to go rent it and drop it off, etc. For us that cost really started to add up and it was cheaper to actually purchase the machine. Just curious.

MowingisMaddness
08-31-2008, 08:55 AM
You need to give the Ditch Witch Sk650 a better look. It makes the Vermeer look like a toy. I demoed them side by side and the Sk650 can move twice the material. Vermeer brags on their controls, however, the Sk650 is much smoother and I prefer to have two controls for the tracks. With two controls I have complete control of each track independently. Vermeer also likes to brag on their hydraulics controls, but I say no major advantage over the Sk650. And don't rule out the benefit of being able to walk along side the Sk650 when needed(we do it at least once a day).

Power and speed are superior with the Sk650. We use a 54" bucket on it as proof. Thanks, aj

BrandonV
08-31-2008, 09:13 AM
And don't rule out the benefit of being able to walk along side the Sk650 when needed(we do it at least once a day).

that is exactly why we bought the sks and not the vermeer

MowingisMaddness
08-31-2008, 09:57 AM
I thought of two advantages of the Vermeer over the DW...

1) Its prettier
2) More safety switches

MowingisMaddness
08-31-2008, 10:11 AM
http://www.lawnsite.com/showthread.php?t=210169

This thread made me give the Ditch Witch a better look. I was about to sign on the dotted line for a Vermeer and decided to get on lawnsite and then setup a DW demo...

syzer
09-02-2008, 11:08 PM
http://www.lawnsite.com/showpost.php?p=1584243&postcount=468

Focal Point Landscapes
09-03-2008, 11:09 PM
This is kinda like a Ford - Chevy - Dodge discussion . I demo them all in Louisville every year ; they are all good products , long on some features and short on others . I'm a committed Dingo guy because it suits my needs nicely - wide tracks , simple controls and you can train someone to proficiency in a short amount of time . Also , we have excellent dealer support which imo is a critical parameter when making a purchasing decision . I use mine nearly every day and haul the major attachments with me on the Dingo trailer - it is a crazy tough machine and I push it very hard - just wish it was a diesel :)

mzgloves20
09-03-2008, 11:48 PM
Man!!

I just spent 40mins typing about the Vermeer and the Ditch Witch I demo'd this week. Did not post for some reason.

YardPro
09-04-2008, 09:19 PM
we demo's the boxer, sk350, sk500, mt52 and the dingo.....

the dingo was the best fit for us...
the ditch witch is a VERY capable machine.. a little more of a brute than the dingo... but for us minimal turf damage and a more compact unit was of paramount importance.

the ditch witch turf tracks are terrible, and thier standard lugs are too aggressive,

mzgloves20
09-06-2008, 11:43 PM
I get the 525 Dingo Monday or Tuesday for a demo.

LB1234
09-07-2008, 02:12 PM
I get the 525 Dingo Monday or Tuesday for a demo.


I have to agree with YardPros statement 110%. I've demoed the ditchwitch, dingo, and bobcat tracked units. As far as turf damage the dingo does hands down less damage than the other two. And after 500-600 hours on my Dingo I have yet to get it stuck. So IMHO, the dingo tracks are hands down superior to the other two...I have NOT demoed or looked at the vermeer or boxer so I can't comment on those.

There is actually another LONG thread on this topic called "revisit mini-skid..." or something like that which was/is really helpful. There were a few things I learned about when reading that thread. One of the main things was to look at the underside of the ditchwitch and compare it to the dingo. The dingo was one solid plate and the pumps and lines were all covered...basically one giant skid plate. The ditchwith on the other hand had the two rear pump lines sticking out underneath. That scared me b/c I can see me ripping that thing off when clearing out brush or slamming the line between the machine and the curb. Perhaps they have changed the design since then, but like I said there is some pros/cons to all the machines and that thread brings them out.

And for anyone to say that the controls on the ditchwitch are better than the TRACKED dingos...I just can't see it. Left hand controls ALL the steering while the right hand controls ALL operations of the attachment (except when attachments need hydraulics of of course).

Good luck with your decision.

W.L.M.
09-07-2008, 03:49 PM
So, I'd like to thank Jon from Vermeer (who happened to read my post) for stepping up to the plate and making his company look good. He helped arrange a demo of the 600Tx.

Let everyone know how it goes!

Thanks Jon

I think you will be pleased I ran a vermeer s600 (the wheeled version of what you are looking at) and I was pretty impressed with it. It was stable for a mini stand on and had nice power. This unit had kubota 25 horse diesel and I ran it with the bucket and harley rake.

jeremy's lc
09-07-2008, 08:01 PM
I was going though the same thing about a month a go. I demo the dingo 525 & the ditchwitch sk 650. To me the sk has more lifting height & can move more material fast. Also is more stable on hills. I bought the sk 650 and I love it. It is really smooth to operate. We go the 52' 4N1 Bucket, narrow bucket, pallet forks, carry all leveler, trencher, auger with 12' & 24' bit, harley rack, & sod roller.

P.Services
09-07-2008, 08:21 PM
I was going though the same thing about a month a go. I demo the dingo 525 & the ditchwitch sk 650. To me the sk has more lifting height & can move more material fast. Also is more stable on hills. I bought the sk 650 and I love it. It is really smooth to operate. We go the 52' 4N1 Bucket, narrow bucket, pallet forks, carry all leveler, trencher, auger with 12' & 24' bit, harley rack, & sod roller.

dang what did that little purchase run ya? $35k?

jeremy's lc
09-07-2008, 10:40 PM
It was around $39k. But the best money I have ever spend. It is a big different from a compact tractor with a loader. I can use one unit to do so much more then before.

mzgloves20
09-13-2008, 09:32 PM
Well, Toro was a no call, then I called them, then they didnt show up or call... so Boxer and ASV are next week...

I still feel its going to be between the Vermeer and the Ditchwitch in the end.

jeremy's lc
09-14-2008, 11:34 AM
Good luck.

MowingisMaddness
01-14-2009, 10:09 PM
Well, Toro was a no call, then I called them, then they didnt show up or call... so Boxer and ASV are next week...

I still feel its going to be between the Vermeer and the Ditchwitch in the end.

So what did you buy?

I was going though the same thing about a month a go. I demo the dingo 525 & the ditchwitch sk 650. To me the sk has more lifting height & can move more material fast. Also is more stable on hills. I bought the sk 650 and I love it. It is really smooth to operate. We go the 52' 4N1 Bucket, narrow bucket, pallet forks, carry all leveler, trencher, auger with 12' & 24' bit, harley rack, & sod roller.

Amen, brother...

DUSTYCEDAR
01-14-2009, 10:24 PM
What no demo pics?

rthomas
01-17-2009, 11:21 AM
Hey how do these mini skid steers hold their value? (Dingos). Do they sell quick when posted

letsplay
01-19-2009, 10:32 PM
I am looking at doing a demo of the dingo 525 wide track and was wondering about more details of pros and cons. I just don't see how you can safely, quickly and productively run the dingo tracked units with the platforms? I have a wheeled unit and love it but putting on the rubber tracks on the wheeled units is horrible and many other problems. So we are looking at a tracked unit and we have good toro support here.

Any more thoughts on the subject would be great. Thanks.

Forkster
01-20-2009, 11:21 AM
You might think of the StepUp Platform. We sold a lot of them to Toro Dingo owners and never received any complain!
www.forkster.com
Caroline

mzgloves20
01-20-2009, 12:23 PM
What no demo pics?


Unfortunatley no pics from the demos. The demo's were so short (3-4hrs) for the units that I had to use them on jobs I was actually completing, leaving me no time to take pics.

I have read on here that some people demo'd these machines for a few days!!!

I really had to beg to get them for as long as I did. The sales guys told me that they usually stay with the machine for the demo. I can't see that being for a very long time...lol...

mzgloves20
01-20-2009, 12:49 PM
[QUOTE=MowingisMaddness;2698843]So what did you buy?



Well, nothing yet. Business died in late October. Fall cleanups were nearly non existant for us this year for some reason. Now, the commercial snow plowing accounts we have are facing termination of service for lack of payment. I have been plowing and salting since November and received payment from one account.

I couldn't make a purchase and shell out the payments for the unit to sit till spring. Esp. with money tight and the economy as bad as it appears to be.

So, it will be a spring purchase now. :)

As far as the units go... I love love love the Vermeer 600tx diesel!!!! Bestl controls, best looking, best sized unit on the market, in my opinion.

That machine can be operated as fast as you can think, the minute you step on it, if you have any time in a modern, pilot operated skidsteer. Otherwise, give it five minutes and you'll be in love.

That being said, I can't see the reasoning for Vermeer to not put the turbo on it. It is the same engine as the Sk650 Ditch Witch. They have the turbo and a substantial bump in power.

The newest 600tx models to roll off the assembly line got a few tweaks (what I was told) to help performance. Vermeer was nice enough to bring one of those out for me to try, but again, not for very long.

--

The Ditch Witch has awesome stability and great power tainted by mediocre controls, a platform that digs into slopes when backing up. Oh, I think it a little funny looking also...haha...

Dingo and Boxer... to sum them up... Dingo, way to short to reach into dump truck and im not walking behind anything all day.

mzgloves20
01-20-2009, 01:19 PM
...posted too soon by accident... here's the rest..

I had the 525 desiel. It does have good power and the track treads are really nice. The Boxer is just so clumsy to operate... it fights your instinct to hold on while trying to operate it. The big one is very rear heavy. I guess to help counter balance. I wheelied it twice going on the trailer and up hill. Didn't like that. None of the others did that. Ever.

Dw or Vermeer in the spring... wonder if I can bolt the DW turbo on the Vermeer!!!??? haha

MowingisMaddness
01-20-2009, 07:13 PM
The SK650 has a third hydraulic pump too. Don't forget to bolt it on the Vermeer. I love the controls on my SK650. More freedom to move the tracks independently. The SK650 turned very smoothly when moving at a good forward speed, where the Vermeer was jerky, throwing me back and forth...

...posted too soon by accident... here's the rest..

I had the 525 desiel. It does have good power and the track treads are really nice. The Boxer is just so clumsy to operate... it fights your instinct to hold on while trying to operate it. The big one is very rear heavy. I guess to help counter balance. I wheelied it twice going on the trailer and up hill. Didn't like that. None of the others did that. Ever.

Dw or Vermeer in the spring... wonder if I can bolt the DW turbo on the Vermeer!!!??? haha

polska
01-21-2009, 05:45 PM
Would you be interested in a 2005 Bocat MT50??

LB1234
01-21-2009, 06:18 PM
You might think of the StepUp Platform. We sold a lot of them to Toro Dingo owners and never received any complain!
www.forkster.com
Caroline

Not a single complaint? Not one??? I find that hard to believe. Not even a complaint about the price? I find that hard to believe:nono:



Sorry, I just couldn't resist.:waving: We have one for our Toro tx425 that we bought a few years ago and like it a lot...come to think of it I don't think I have a single complaint about it :laugh: Seriously, it is a nice platform, folds up neat and out of the way and withstands the abuse of backing into curbing, boulders, trees, etc. I did have the opportunity to see toro's version of there own platform a year or two ago at a few trade shows and man I did not like that thing at all.

Forkster
01-21-2009, 08:22 PM
You make my day:)! I could imagine that it's hard to believe that they never complain...just a little bit ...but only about the price...but still under the other brands...and there's always a place for negociation otherwise where the pleasure is!!!
Thanks again, Caroline

mzgloves20
01-21-2009, 08:59 PM
The SK650 has a third hydraulic pump too. Don't forget to bolt it on the Vermeer. I love the controls on my SK650. More freedom to move the tracks independently. The SK650 turned very smoothly when moving at a good forward speed, where the Vermeer was jerky, throwing me back and forth...


I liked the Sk650 alot, that's why it's still in the running. I just didn't like how far away the loader control is from the armrest/handle. It needs to be moved where the aux hyd control lever is and I think it would be a hard machine to beat!

I may still get one anyway...lol...

DitchWitch has great controls on the Zahn...just like the Vermeers why not put them on the Sk???? I see all these companies need to pay more attention to what we say!!!

mzgloves20
01-21-2009, 09:02 PM
Not a single complaint? Not one??? I find that hard to believe. Not even a complaint about the price? I find that hard to believe:nono:



Sorry, I just couldn't resist.:waving: We have one for our Toro tx425 that we bought a few years ago and like it a lot...come to think of it I don't think I have a single complaint about it :laugh: Seriously, it is a nice platform, folds up neat and out of the way and withstands the abuse of backing into curbing, boulders, trees, etc. I did have the opportunity to see toro's version of there own platform a year or two ago at a few trade shows and man I did not like that thing at all.


The 525 I demoed had the Toro platform on it. Man, it was mangled and wouldn't latch all the time and would fall and hit you in the shin :dizzy: ...

yuckk

mzgloves20
01-21-2009, 09:07 PM
Here's a vid on the 600TX

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3aJSNTKzMCA

anyone have any vids of these little guys in operation?

mzgloves20
01-21-2009, 09:09 PM
Would you be interested in a 2005 Bocat MT50??

No thanks, too short for what we need...

BrandonV
01-21-2009, 09:15 PM
i' don't know what you're terrain is like up there but the one big advantage on the dw over the vermeer (which I love to death, but couldn't buy) is you can walk behind the dw. we've driven our up hill where you couldn't stay on the machine it's so steep... with the vermeer you have to be on the platform at all times, it's a good thing on paper but not for us in hilly areas.

LB1234
01-22-2009, 09:21 AM
The 525 I demoed had the Toro platform on it. Man, it was mangled and wouldn't latch all the time and would fall and hit you in the shin :dizzy: ...

yuckk

One of the main reasons I did not like it was due to the fact that it had individual foot plates. I can't tell you how many times there are two of us on the back of that thing to act as a counter balance (***DISCLAIMER*** I'm not recommending this:laugh:) to move heavy pallets around. With the new toro platform (at least when I looked) each person would basically have to stand on one leg...I'm not that gifted!!

mzgloves20
01-22-2009, 01:06 PM
One of the main reasons I did not like it was due to the fact that it had individual foot plates. I can't tell you how many times there are two of us on the back of that thing to act as a counter balance (***DISCLAIMER*** I'm not recommending this:laugh:) to move heavy pallets around. With the new toro platform (at least when I looked) each person would basically have to stand on one leg...I'm not that gifted!!


haha I'm sure that looked interesting from the street...

There is a lot of terrain in this area. We are in a hilly section of the country too.

I really like the visibilty of the end of the bucket with the Vermeer. I didn't have much trouble with the DW because I'm used to running bigger machine with limoted visibilty but I think more visibility would be good for some of the less experienced guys on the job.

Im starting to get that I don't know what to buy headache again...lol :confused:

Forkster
01-22-2009, 01:10 PM
too bad, I would have loved to see pictures of you working on one leg!!!

Forkster
01-22-2009, 01:11 PM
with our platform you can quickly fold it up and don't be worry about hills.

mzgloves20
01-22-2009, 04:16 PM
with our platform you can quickly fold it up and don't be worry about hills.


What is retail on the platform?

mzgloves20
01-22-2009, 04:22 PM
O yea, do all these machines air intakes have to suck the dusty dirty air between your legs....????? hahah

Forkster
01-22-2009, 04:36 PM
$429.00 +S&H
How many do you want?!

mzgloves20
01-22-2009, 04:47 PM
hopefully im getting a machine that has a platfom on it...lol... are there shock absorbing properties to it?

Forkster
01-22-2009, 05:14 PM
On the Step Up Platform, you tend to ride on the balls of you feet on the center of the grips strut area and it has a "softer ride feel". Want to try?

mzgloves20
01-22-2009, 05:25 PM
I dont have anything to try it on. Unless I mount it to the back of my truck...lol...

bobw
01-22-2009, 06:06 PM
i' don't know what you're terrain is like up there but the one big advantage on the dw over the vermeer (which I love to death, but couldn't buy) is you can walk behind the dw. we've driven our up hill where you couldn't stay on the machine it's so steep... with the vermeer you have to be on the platform at all times, it's a good thing on paper but not for us in hilly areas.

I have a DW SK350; love it to death. The whole platform issue is important.

1) Don't get a machine without an operator platform. Why pay money for equipment you can't use to its full potential and speed?

2) Platforms that require ground contact (i.e. have wheels) make no sense to me. I'm running all over uneven terrain like crazy, I can't imagine the issues associated with keeping a platform on a wheel in uneven ground or mud.

3) The vermeer setup that more or less requires you to be standing on the platform would bother me from a safety perspective. I understand why they think its safer, and for 80% of the time its a real good idea. However, you get to working and getting into some strange slope and cross slope situations, and it really is a lot safer to be OFF of the machine in case she's going over. There are lots of time I walk beside or behind reaching for the controls.

Forkster
01-22-2009, 06:44 PM
1) Agreed!
2) The wheels of the StepUp Platform are next to the machine so they follow exactly where the machine goes and work well on uneven ground.
3) the StepUp platform fold up easily so you use it when you need it.

mzgloves20
01-22-2009, 09:02 PM
I like the idea of being off the machine and still controlling it if need be.
I like the instant safety of the auto park brake like Vermeer.
The park brake on the DW I had didn't even work...lol..
I like the slighty more compact size of the Vermeer.
I love the power the DW has.

I see this is going to be a long painful decision process.
I'm going to have to start my own company.
Maybe Caterpillar should make a mini, I bet that would be cool!!

Chestnut Oaks Prez
01-22-2009, 10:49 PM
MZ! Here's a time you want to be on the platform with cushions for the Boys:laugh:

Lawnworks
01-22-2009, 11:04 PM
Just don't back the forkster platform into a tree... you will then have a forksteer rear ground scraper until you get out the sawzall and cut off the unnecessary metal. But overall it is a great addition to a mini... but please be sitting down when you get the invoice for a forkster platform.

Lawnworks
01-22-2009, 11:07 PM
MZ! Here's a time you want to be on the platform with cushions for the Boys:laugh:

lol... I see you discovered the secret to getting out the tough ones!

I tried to lift a few to many pounds of flagstone out of my flatbed... got my amigo to stand on the dingo ride plate with me for a little extra ballast... it didn't work out to well for us! My amigo says(in his hispanic english Chich and chong lingo), "hey man, I know why they call it a toro now"

Chestnut Oaks Prez
01-22-2009, 11:14 PM
lol... I see you discovered the secret to getting out the tough ones!

I tried to lift a few to many pounds of flagstone out of my flatbed... got my amigo to stand on the dingo ride plate with me for a little extra ballast... it didn't work out to well for us! My amigo says(in his hispanic english Chich and chong lingo), "hey man, I know why they call it a toro now"

Yea, I can amagine that was a ride:) I think I remember that the tree in that pic gave us our 1st scratch on that fuel tank:cry:

letsplay
01-22-2009, 11:24 PM
That is a great picture. We call that "tip toeing through the yard!"

The worst is when someone gets in this situation and tries to quickly correct the situation and slams the boom down......it will make your teeth rattle.

How high are the sides of everyones dump trucks or trailers that they use with the vermeer or ditch witch? I have a wheeled dingo and can only go over the sides of my over the wheel dump trailer with two foot sides.

This is one reason I want to upgrade to another model that will dump higher.
I have never seen a vermeer compact loader here in Raleigh, NC. Most units I see are dingos and ditch witch.

Forkster
01-23-2009, 12:48 PM
what would be the best price for a platform?

mzgloves20
01-24-2009, 09:00 AM
MZ! Here's a time you want to be on the platform with cushions for the Boys:laugh:


That's some way to get extra leverage!!! haha did it come out????

Looks like the first time I drove a bobcat.

mzgloves20
01-24-2009, 06:10 PM
How high are the sides of everyones dump trucks or trailers that they use with the vermeer or ditch witch? I have a wheeled dingo and can only go over the sides of my over the wheel dump trailer with two foot sides.

This is one reason I want to upgrade to another model that will dump higher.
I have never seen a vermeer compact loader here in Raleigh, NC. Most units I see are dingos and ditch witch.

That's the reason I can't go with a dingo. We use a 4x4 mule regularly to move mulch or soil (etc) across yards and properties. The dingo barely cleared the mule bed. The Ditch Witch has the best lift height, but the dump angle stops well short of vertical. You end up doing a lot of bucket shaking to empty.

The Vermeers dump angle is great, but it's an inch or two shorter to the pins. Still better then the dingo.

I am dumping into chevy 3500 dumps and the Mule. I have bigger machines for full time dumping into trucks, but on occassion, if need be, I don't want to shovel into a truck or mule when I have a mini near.

letsplay
01-24-2009, 06:26 PM
Thanks for the lifting height info. Sorry. I am not sure what a piece of equipment called a mule is. That is good to know about the differences in the hinge pin for the bucket. I need to do some demos. I am trying to find some used units but the vermeers used don't seem to be readily available. Oh, I keep forgetting to ask if the vermeer and dw units will take toro dingo attachments since we already have those.

Chestnut Oaks Prez
01-24-2009, 06:42 PM
Thanks for the lifting height info. Sorry. I am not sure what a piece of equipment called a mule is. That is good to know about the differences in the hinge pin for the bucket. I need to do some demos. I am trying to find some used units but the vermeers used don't seem to be readily available. Oh, I keep forgetting to ask if the vermeer and dw units will take toro dingo attachments since we already have those.

We built our sides on our dumps so we could use the Vermeer. I want to say they are 80" to the top. Dingo attachments will work on Vermeer. I think a mule is a mulch blowing piece of equipment.:confused:

mzgloves20
01-24-2009, 11:17 PM
Sorry. I am not sure what a piece of equipment called a mule is.


The Mule is the 4x4 utility vehicle that I posted the picture of with the lift height info.

It's deisel, has a 900 and some odd cc engine, four wheel drive, has a dump bed, and can be converted to a four seater if people are what need to be hauled...lol...

letsplay
01-24-2009, 11:26 PM
Yea, I finally looked at the photo up close and could see mule on the side.
Are you saying the tracked model dingos would barely dump into the back of the "mule"?
It does not look that high off the ground from the photo....

When you say 80inches for the sides of your dump truck, was that measurement taken from the ground to the top of the sides or from the bottom of the dump bed to the top of the sides?

mzgloves20
01-24-2009, 11:53 PM
The Dingo will clear the bed of the mule easily. It was when I dumped the bucket that I had problems. Dumping more than one bucket into the Mule from the side or back caused the bucket to mash the pile and spill stuff everywhere. Couldn't lift the arms high enough to make a clean dump.

The 80" is from the gound to top of the sides of the bed. I can remove the side boards on the bed to make it lower.

letsplay
01-25-2009, 12:11 AM
Thanks for the info and clarification on the height of the dump truck. I agree with the problem with dumping mulch or soil out of the dingo into equipment like the mule or even large wheel barrows some times. We have a 322 dingo wheeled unit and I don't think the track units dump any higher then the wheeled units.

We have a flatbed over the wheels dump trailer with wood sides that I have built that will barely let the dingo dump into it, and then we are using the four n one bucket for that. I don't think my guys or myself would want to make ramps high enough to drive up into the bed and dump debri, soil etc. I would like to upgrade to a dump truck so this is why I am asking questions about dump heights from real contractors that use mini skids. The dealers and brochures can be misleading on actual dump height and how much you can lift and dump. There has to be better setups for using mini skidsteers with just a speciliaty trailer and 3/4 ton truck like I see so many contractors using like myself. But that is another discussion I guess

I think the dingo has been a great product for my company over the years but have been disappointed that toro has not done more advancements with their products, such as higher lift, more weight that can be carried or lifted, and a unit like vermeer or ditch witch that has tracks but you can stand on. No matter what everyone says, the toro track units were never designed to have platforms for an operator to ride on.

We have strong toro brand use and support here in Raleigh NC, but I am seeing more and more ditch witch products replacing toro units that contractors first bought.

mzgloves20
01-25-2009, 04:47 AM
Hopefully you'll be able to find a dealer local to you and take one for a test drive...

Just remember that the (safe operating) lift ratings for tracked machines should be fairly listed at 35% of the machines total lift capacity. All the dead lift (max lift) comparisons are on flat ground, in a controlled environment, probably while standing still in a factory or test facility.

A ditchwitch, boxer, vermeer, or any mini skidder won't lift their max capacity and drive around with it, esp on uneaven ground like real world worksites. Just try and see what machine works best for you (size, controlability, traction...) where your going to use it and under the conditons you will use it.

I hope your decision is more easily made then mine. I just hate buyers remorse and want the best machine I can get...

BrandonV
01-25-2009, 08:34 AM
what we do w/ our sk650 when loading the larger dump trucks is we load from the back and using the combo bucket keep pushing it as far forward as possible. of course the best solution for us when we MUST use the dw and have no access for the big stuff is our switch-n-go bed, we just drop it down, load it and go.

ODU Lawn Man
01-25-2009, 11:40 AM
Thanks for the info and clarification on the height of the dump truck. I agree with the problem with dumping mulch or soil out of the dingo into equipment like the mule or even large wheel barrows some times. We have a 322 dingo wheeled unit and I don't think the track units dump any higher then the wheeled units.

We have a flatbed over the wheels dump trailer with wood sides that I have built that will barely let the dingo dump into it, and then we are using the four n one bucket for that. I don't think my guys or myself would want to make ramps high enough to drive up into the bed and dump debri, soil etc. I would like to upgrade to a dump truck so this is why I am asking questions about dump heights from real contractors that use mini skids. The dealers and brochures can be misleading on actual dump height and how much you can lift and dump. There has to be better setups for using mini skidsteers with just a speciliaty trailer and 3/4 ton truck like I see so many contractors using like myself. But that is another discussion I guess

I think the dingo has been a great product for my company over the years but have been disappointed that toro has not done more advancements with their products, such as higher lift, more weight that can be carried or lifted, and a unit like vermeer or ditch witch that has tracks but you can stand on. No matter what everyone says, the toro track units were never designed to have platforms for an operator to ride on.

We have strong toro brand use and support here in Raleigh NC, but I am seeing more and more ditch witch products replacing toro units that contractors first bought.



You can get the Dingos with an optional platform that you can stand on. Just dont buy the Toro Platform because it digs in the ground in reverse. The forkster platform for the Dingo is the way to go. You can stand on it which allows you to pick up more weight and when its unsafe to ride on the machine you just fold it up out of the way.

The problem with the DW is that it weighs about a 1000lbs more than the Dingo. This extra weight really helps tear up the grass on the customers lawns.

rshsales
01-28-2009, 12:01 PM
Dump height on wheels there is only one unit out there, Boxer 700 serie, up to 105" in a 39" wide unit 726DT , 117" in a 48" unit 735DT. Check them out. Something new to think about.

Forkster
01-28-2009, 12:02 PM
Do you mind if I use your words as a testimonial in our website?
Thanks

ODU Lawn Man
01-28-2009, 04:06 PM
Dump height on wheels there is only one unit out there, Boxer 700 serie, up to 105" in a 39" wide unit 726DT , 117" in a 48" unit 735DT. Check them out. Something new to think about.

How much do the units weigh

rshsales
01-28-2009, 07:41 PM
The 726 1876 lbs
The 732 2271 lbs
To do any lifting I would add the weight kit 416 lbs.

The 749 3440 lbs.
The weight kit add 1014 lb.

There is also a saddle weight kit to can add up to 400lbs + or – more.
Fill the back tires to counter balance it even more.

Model # 726DT Specifications
Engine Power: 26 HP
Engine Manufacturer: Vanguard
Engine Description: Diesel
Width: 39 "
Tip Capacity: 2,248 LBS
Hydraulic pressure: 3,050 PSI
Hydraulic flow: 13.8 GPM
Hydraulic tank capacity: 9.2 GAL
Hinge pin height: 90.5-105 "
Travel speed: 7 MPH
Fuel tank capacity: 6.34 GAL
Operating Capacity, 50% of tip load: 1,124 LBS
Weight (without bucket): 1,874 LBS
Pushing Capacity: 2,513 lbs


Model # 732DT Specifications
Engine Power: 32 HP
Engine Manufacturer: Yanmar
Engine Description: Diesel
Width: 47.2 "
Tip Capacity: 2,976 LBS
Hydraulic pressure: 3,050 PSI
Hydraulic flow: 13.8 GPM
Hydraulic tank capacity: 10 GAL
Hinge pin height: 98-117 "
Travel speed: 6.8 MPH
Fuel tank capacity: 6.34 GAL
Operating Capacity, 50% of tip load: 1,488 LBS
Weight (without bucket): 2,271 LBS
Pushing Capacity: 3,197 lbs

Model # 749DT Specifications
Engine Power: 49 HP
Engine Manufacturer: Yanmar
Engine Description: Diesel
Width: 58.7 "
Tip Capacity: 4,520 LBS
Hydraulic pressure: 3,050 PSI
Hydraulic flow: 17.8 GPM
Hydraulic tank capacity: 21 GAL
Hinge pin height: 122-146.4 "
Travel speed: 13.7 MPH
Fuel tank capacity: 7.92 GAL
Operating Capacity, 50% of tip load: 2,260 LBS
Weight (without bucket): 3,440 LBS
Pushing Capacity: 5,512 lbs

I have seen the 749 pickup over 3000 lbs of stone, and a 732 load a 1800lbs log over the side of a dump truck.

letsplay
01-28-2009, 09:17 PM
The boxer spec numbers are interesting but for what it costs for some of the 700 series it better lift alot! The fuel tank sizes are small compared to what we are use to. The travel speeds are almost double what the dingo are. I have not demoed one of these units but will look into it in the spring. I have only seen one boxer unit in the Raleigh/Durham NC area before. I would like to see more pictures or video of the units in action.

ODU Lawn Man
01-29-2009, 10:38 AM
The 726 1876 lbs
The 732 2271 lbs
To do any lifting I would add the weight kit 416 lbs.

If the weight kit is necessary for the machine to lift why doesnt it come standard?

hardscaper
02-11-2009, 09:07 AM
The Dingo will clear the bed of the mule easily. It was when I dumped the bucket that I had problems. Dumping more than one bucket into the Mule from the side or back caused the bucket to mash the pile and spill stuff everywhere. Couldn't lift the arms high enough to make a clean dump.

The 80" is from the gound to top of the sides of the bed. I can remove the side boards on the bed to make it lower.

You need one of these,tracked,ride on, self loading, high dump, 13 cu.ft capacity.

EVM
03-26-2009, 09:07 AM
MZ! Here's a time you want to be on the platform with cushions for the Boys:laugh:

So a shrub made that thing tip forward? Kinda lame if you ask me...

Lawnworks
03-26-2009, 10:42 AM
I am sure the vermeer won, but these mini's are in no way lame. I make more money off my dingo than my fullsize cat.

mzgloves20
03-26-2009, 10:12 PM
I've latched onto some lagre Yew's with my 8,300lb excavator and have been tipped over just like that. A deeply rooted shrub with thousands of pounds of compacted Earth on it can be challenge!

My Cat skid is just too brutal for many applications. I still love it though.

pikewillis1
03-27-2009, 06:39 PM
Hey Gloves,

I got these Dingos and attachments for sale in Northern Virginia

a Used TX 425 with 323 hours on it. Comes with standard bucket and standplatform. $9500
a Used TX 425 with 467 hours on it. Comes with a standard bucket. $8500
a Used Diesel TX 525 Narrow Track with 100 hours on it. Comes with standard bucket and standplatform $16,990
a Used Dingo 220 with 240 hours on it. Comes with a bucket and stand platform $5,500
a Used Dingo 420 with a brand new engine (0 hours on it). Comes with a bucket. $9500
a Used backhoe attachment for the Dingo, used twice, 2 total hours on attachment $5500
a Used jack hammer attachment for the Dingo $2500
a Used high torque auger head for the Dingo $1250
a Used universal auger head for the Dingo $1250
a Used 36" wide auger, 4 foot long $600
a Used harley rake attachment for the Dingo $4500
a Used adjustable forks $400
a Used 12" wide auger bit $200
a Used 8” wide auger bit $190
a Used 6” wide auger bit $150
a Used light materials bucket for the Dingo $300


Call me if your interested

Trey
703 919 5291

mzgloves20
03-27-2009, 11:28 PM
Hey Gloves,

I got these Dingos and attachments for sale in Northern Virginia



Call me if your interested

Trey
703 919 5291



Will any of these fit a Vermeer or Ditchwitch? We will be getting one of those soon.

pikewillis1
03-28-2009, 08:56 AM
Will any of these fit a Vermeer or Ditchwitch? We will be getting one of those soon.


Hey Gloves,

All these attachments will fit a ditchwitch or vermeer.