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americanlawn
08-18-2008, 08:07 PM
Does anybody buy from fertilizer "manufacturers" instead of "distributors"? We're currently checking our usual sources (distributors) , but we also have two 'new' sources that we found at the Iowa State fair last week, and they want to provide quotes. Anybody else do this? rscvp, thanks :usflag::canadaflag:

phasthound
08-18-2008, 08:25 PM
Does anybody buy from fertilizer "manufacturers" instead of "distributors"? We're currently checking our usual sources (distributors) , but we also have two 'new' sources that we found at the Iowa State fair last week, and they want to provide quotes. Anybody else do this? rscvp, thanks :usflag::canadaflag:

When you're buying Nutrients PLUS by the truckload from me you are buying from the manufacturer. You can't buy by the pallet from Nutrients PLUS, but you can from me.

rcreech
08-18-2008, 10:09 PM
When you're buying Nutrients PLUS by the truckload from me you are buying from the manufacturer. You can't buy by the pallet from Nutrients PLUS, but you can from me.

I thought he said he is looking for FERTILIZER! :laugh:

Hey American....I have some "stuff" that you can buy by the truckload also. It isn't fertilizer but will try and convince you it is....and it is cheaper also!

Just kidding Phasthound! :laugh:

Gotta have some fun!

whoopassonthebluegrass
08-19-2008, 01:11 AM
Before I went liquid, I bought raw ingredients from an ag co-op. I'd show up, tell them what I wanted for my blend and they'd mix it up and fill up my truck bed.

Saved a fair amount of money up front, but the time wasted this way eventually ate the initial savings...

LawnTamer
08-19-2008, 01:35 AM
I go straight to the cow. Skip the middle man.:laugh::laugh:

I used to buy from a manufacturer/blender, no middle man. It was great, till they went out of business. I was saving quite a bit of money.

JLC
08-19-2008, 09:52 PM
American, I'd be interested in who you talked with...I didn't notice any wholesalers at the fair, then again, I didn't get to spend as much time as normal this year. I've also been talking with a couple of all liquid fert guys...Souix city area...not sure how they are going to compare pricewise yet. Gotta start exploring some diffent options than our "normal". Also been thinking of prebuying a couple of semi loads now to get the "semi load discount", which really isn't that much.

ALC-GregH
08-19-2008, 10:01 PM
I go straight to the cow. Skip the middle man.:laugh::laugh:

I used to buy from a manufacturer/blender, no middle man. It was great, till they went out of business. I was saving quite a bit of money.

Apparently they were selling, too cheap.

americanlawn
08-20-2008, 07:38 PM
Hi JLC -- I called both of them Monday. I won't mention the names, but one manufacturer (Wisconson) told me they only sell to distributors (UAP and D & K in central Iowa). The other sells direct -- they are a natural organic fert company, but after speaking with them I realized 2 things: 1) they have a very limited product selection, 2) their prices were higher than Tech Terra (phasthound represents them here on lawnsite, and he's a swell guy to deal with). So for me right now, I'll soon choose between UAP, Tech Terra, & JD Landscapes. Since fert prices have skyrocketed, I shop around much much more. I know it's a PIA for fert distributors, but I have no choice now.

American, I'd be interested in who you talked with...I didn't notice any wholesalers at the fair, then again, I didn't get to spend as much time as normal this year. I've also been talking with a couple of all liquid fert guys...Souix city area...not sure how they are going to compare pricewise yet. Gotta start exploring some diffent options than our "normal". Also been thinking of prebuying a couple of semi loads now to get the "semi load discount", which really isn't that much.

turf hokie
08-20-2008, 10:09 PM
I too have found that many "manufacturers" will only deal with the middle man and not the end user. I buy truckload quantities like you Larry (not as many trucks)but I have found that distributers are the only way I can get fert. It stinks b/c I always thougth a trailer load cost the same to send to me or to the distributor but I guess the manufacturer is afraid to cut out the middle man.

I use phasthounds partner in CT for my organic based ferts. Good stuff great results and he too is a great person to deal with and very knowledgeable.

phasthound
08-21-2008, 07:54 PM
I too have found that many "manufacturers" will only deal with the middle man and not the end user. I buy truckload quantities like you Larry (not as many trucks)but I have found that distributers are the only way I can get fert. It stinks b/c I always thougth a trailer load cost the same to send to me or to the distributor but I guess the manufacturer is afraid to cut out the middle man.

I use phasthounds partner in CT for my organic based ferts. Good stuff great results and he too is a great person to deal with and very knowledgeable.

Rob (in CT) is a great guy and a good friend.

For truck load buyers of Nutrients PLUS, buying from the rep gets you the same price as buying directly from the manufacturer. Nutrients PLUS is unique with it's infrastructure. You deal with the rep & the product is shipped direct to you from one of several bagging facilities nationwide, keeping shipping costs at a minimum. The drawback is we ask you to plan ahead to save money rather than drive in to pick up product on a whim. Hey, this costs you time and money, maybe it's not a drawback? When you buy from a stocking distributor, you are also paying for their warehouse & utilities, equipment, staff and advertising.

In addition to the lower prices, some reps may also supply other products in similar manner. And we are a great source of information, just like stocking distributors are.

OK, done patting myself on the back. :)

americanlawn
08-21-2008, 09:51 PM
Been talking to local competitors (friends). They're thinking about cutting back on the N rate for late fall --winterizer. Instead of 4 pounds per 1000 s/f, they're thinking about going with 3 pounds per 1000 s/f. Just trying to save money.

I know "natural organic" fertlizer is good, but does it take years to see the results??? Cuz their analysis is usually much lower in nutrients.??

rscvp, thanks. p.s. I want to know the cost per acre in order to make my customers' lawns look as green as their neighbors'.

phasthound
08-22-2008, 11:49 AM
Been talking to local competitors (friends). They're thinking about cutting back on the N rate for late fall --winterizer. Instead of 4 pounds per 1000 s/f, they're thinking about going with 3 pounds per 1000 s/f. Just trying to save money.

I know "natural organic" fertlizer is good, but does it take years to see the results??? Cuz their analysis is usually much lower in nutrients.??

rscvp, thanks. p.s. I want to know the cost per acre in order to make my customers' lawns look as green as their neighbors'.

OK here we go. 3lb of N is what we shoot for with our organic based fertility programs. The reason why the lower nutrient works is because a higher % of it gets to the plant compared to salt based ferts.

Our best selling product, Nutrient PLUS Screamin' Green 16-2-3 has 5 sources of N with 5 different release curves.
Urea gives a quick green up for 2-3 weeks
Ammonium Sufate releases for 3-4 weeks
Sulfur Coated Urea releases for 4-6 weeks
Composted Poultry Manure for 6-10 weeks
Grade A BioSolids release for 10+

It's called Screamin' Green because it performs. It provides a quick green up without the flush of growth and continues to stay green. Because of the organic matter, turf is less susceptible to disease pressures, has higher drought tolerance and bounces back better after drought.

On Tues I met with a client who had tried a pallet of 16-2-3 in May and is now ordering by the truckload because he saw a thicker lawn with no disease just after one application.

60% of NP sales increase last year came from existing clients who increased their orders. We have a 95% retention rate with our clients. That's gotta say something, right? :)

Here is a good basic cool season 5 step program with application rates and costs per acre. These are truckload prices, including shipping. This will provide 3lb of N and 8lb of organic matter annually per 1000/sq ft.

Just like any other fertilizer company today, we cannot guarantee prices, they are subject to change without notice. Every applicator business must prepare for further price increases throughout 2009, especially with conventional ferts. :(

5-5-0 with 0.37% Cavalcade
3 lb/1000 $17.00/bag 2.6 bags/acre $44.20/acre
Screamin' Green 16-2-3
4.1lb/1000 $16.95/bag 3.6 bags/acre $61.02/acre
Screamin' Green 16-2-3
4.1lb/1000 $16.95/bag 3.6 bags/acre $61.02/acre
Screamin' Green 16-2-3
4.1lb/1000 $16.95/bag 3.6 bags/acre $61.02/acre
Screamin' Green 16-2-3
4.1lb/1000 $16.95/bag 3.6 bags/acre $61.02/acre
Total annual cost $288.28/acre

heritage
08-22-2008, 02:04 PM
OK here we go. 3lb of N is what we shoot for with our organic based fertility programs. The reason why the lower nutrient works is because a higher % of it gets to the plant compared to salt based ferts.

Our best selling product, Nutrient PLUS Screamin' Green 16-2-3 has 5 sources of N with 5 different release curves.
Urea gives a quick green up for 2-3 weeks
Ammonium Sufate releases for 3-4 weeks
Sulfur Coated Urea releases for 4-6 weeks
Composted Poultry Manure for 6-10 weeks
Grade A BioSolids release for 10+

It's called Screamin' Green because it performs. It provides a quick green up without the flush of growth and continues to stay green. Because of the organic matter, turf is less susceptible to disease pressures, has higher drought tolerance and bounces back better after drought.

On Tues I met with a client who had tried a pallet of 16-2-3 in May and is now ordering by the truckload because he saw a thicker lawn with no disease just after one application.

60% of NP sales increase last year came from existing clients who increased their orders. We have a 95% retention rate with our clients. That's gotta say something, right? :)

Here is a good basic cool season 5 step program with application rates and costs per acre. These are truckload prices, including shipping. This will provide 3lb of N and 8lb of organic matter annually per 1000/sq ft.

Just like any other fertilizer company today, we cannot guarantee prices, they are subject to change without notice. Every applicator business must prepare for further price increases throughout 2009, especially with conventional ferts. :(

5-5-0 with 0.37% Cavalcade
3 lb/1000 $17.00/bag 2.6 bags/acre $44.20/acre
Screamin' Green 16-2-3
4.1lb/1000 $16.95/bag 3.6 bags/acre $61.02/acre
Screamin' Green 16-2-3
4.1lb/1000 $16.95/bag 3.6 bags/acre $61.02/acre
Screamin' Green 16-2-3
4.1lb/1000 $16.95/bag 3.6 bags/acre $61.02/acre
Screamin' Green 16-2-3
4.1lb/1000 $16.95/bag 3.6 bags/acre $61.02/acre
Total annual cost $288.28/acre


Barry,

How long can I keep the 5-5-0 Cavalcade and the Screamin Green in storage???

How "Dusty" is the product when applying?

How is the Smell right after application?

Thanks,

I may put in and order soon.

Pete

phasthound
08-22-2008, 02:35 PM
Barry,

How long can I keep the 5-5-0 Cavalcade and the Screamin Green in storage???

How "Dusty" is the product when applying?

How is the Smell right after application?

Thanks,

I may put in and order soon.

Pete

The products will still perform well after a year in dry storage.

Dust is not an issue, the synthetic portion is what you are used to. The organic matter is processed as a true granule, not pressed pellets. It flows & spreads pretty much the same as any synthetic. The only difference to the applicator is the dark color, they might not think they are applying enough since it's not as visible. Make sure they are aware of that.

There is an odor, as there is with anything. It will dissipate. Maybe someone who has been using the product will share their thoughts?

One important thing to keep in mind, in order to keep prices as low as possible NP is a streamlined company. That means we try not to build up too much stock, which would mean more expensive warehouse space added to your price. Production is based on projected and firm orders so we don't leave product sitting on the loading dock.

If you are seriously thinking of ordering, contact me at
techterra@comcast.net.

And Pete, I'll be glad to show you some product.

jbturf
08-22-2008, 07:56 PM
i got 4 pallets of the 'whole shabang 6-2-4' this spring and have been slowly
using it as a trial on some select properties. Some of my thoughts and opinions
thus far, NP is very well packaged, it is very clean product(not dusty), very small
and uniform particle size-flows well without clogging spreader- though after
a while the small particles gum up the plate mechanism of my spreader.

i have observed very slow release of product, excellent color
i am happy with the results of this procuct. i havent been happy with
an organic based product since i stopped using sustane(as they seem
to have effectively priced themselves out of the professional market )

in my experience NP shipping is less than stellar compared with some
other suppliers i use

i would like to try the 16-2-3 product and make comparison to
a similar 15-3-7 jdl product

i think Np has a new 15? product?

Josh

turf hokie
08-22-2008, 08:58 PM
I would say
Spreadability is no different than anything else you have used. Product is a bit bulkier so setting need to be opened up a bit to accomodate.

Not dusty at all in my experience.

Good color and turf quality.

Able to reduce N slightly in first season of use. Hopefully more as we build organics.

Pricing is very competitive when looking at cost per k.

Smell seems to be an earthy type of smell, not what most would think from an organic and it usually dissipates before you have even left the property. It does smell a bit more if applied when humid out.

Grass seed is very good as well ( plug for you phasthound) blue rye mix germinates quickly, evenly and with good color.

My sales rep has been more than helpful, and very knowledgeable when I have questions whether they are product related or not.

My only complaint is delivery, they seem to have a hard time getting truck and drivers even on full truck load orders. So just plan accordingly, my suggestion is to set your delivery date about 1 week prior to actually needing the product.

heritage
08-22-2008, 09:32 PM
The products will still perform well after a year in dry storage.

Dust is not an issue, the synthetic portion is what you are used to. The organic matter is processed as a true granule, not pressed pellets. It flows & spreads pretty much the same as any synthetic. The only difference to the applicator is the dark color, they might not think they are applying enough since it's not as visible. Make sure they are aware of that.

There is an odor, as there is with anything. It will dissipate. Maybe someone who has been using the product will share their thoughts?

One important thing to keep in mind, in order to keep prices as low as possible NP is a streamlined company. That means we try not to build up too much stock, which would mean more expensive warehouse space added to your price. Production is based on projected and firm orders so we don't leave product sitting on the loading dock.

If you are seriously thinking of ordering, contact me at
techterra@comcast.net.

And Pete, I'll be glad to show you some product.


Thanks for the feedback!

Looks to be better than I expected.

The shipping is concern as the price for small order...2-3 pallet.

Pete

rcreech
08-22-2008, 10:40 PM
What about spread pattern?

Are samples available? I would like to see this product!

Are the prices "truck load pricing", pallet price or bags? Send me a PM if you want.

I would like to test this product and atleast see what it does in my testing area.

RC

Mscotrid
08-23-2008, 10:55 AM
I'm concerend the program stated only provides 2.77lbs N. I know in my area the rate of Prodiamine listed less than a 1/2 lb actual would not provide the control I need. I like the idea of incorporating organics in the program and have used a variety of them over the years.

phasthound
08-24-2008, 05:12 PM
Thanks for the feed back. You only know how good or bad something is until you try it yourself. We can discuss it to death over the Internet if you like. I hope that hearing from some folks who are using Nutrients PLUS, has put a few misconceptions to rest. The product line is different than others you may have tried.

To answer some questions;
To be on the safe side give yourself 2 weeks from order & delivery date.
The prices quoted are FTL delivered. Obviously LTL orders cost more per bag.
Prices will go up in relation to how much synthetics are in the blend. However, due to the organic bases the price has and will not rise as fast as conventional fert.
As users have noted, you will get the green with less N.
I only posted one possible program. NP has several more product blends and programs can be tweaked for your needs. However, one of the main advantages is to be able to provide the same results with less nutrient inputs.

Please any questions on pallet pricing contact me at
techterra@comcast.net

Lawn Tech LLC
08-24-2008, 07:04 PM
Phasthound,
I have been reading this form and would like to know how your programs would work in the St. Louis Missouri area. We take care of Condominium and Homeowners associations and our weather will be 75 one day and 100 the next. Precip is the same all or nothing. I like what I hear and would like to find out more. Can you point me in the right direction?

Thanks in advance

Bill
Lawn Tech LLC

phasthound
08-24-2008, 07:38 PM
Phasthound,
I have been reading this form and would like to know how your programs would work in the St. Louis Missouri area. We take care of Condominium and Homeowners associations and our weather will be 75 one day and 100 the next. Precip is the same all or nothing. I like what I hear and would like to find out more. Can you point me in the right direction?

Thanks in advance

Bill
Lawn Tech LLC

Hi Bill,

Nutrients PLUS fertilizer is currently being used by truckload buyers in 40 States.

Tech Terra is also connected with a marketing association that connects community owned organizations with companies that emphasis "Green".

We are right up your alley.

Contact me at techterra@comcast.net for more info.