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View Full Version : Any reason not to buy a tri axle?


mrusk
08-26-2008, 07:42 PM
Since I bought the 150 I have been slowly looking for a dump truck. I found a good deal on a 2000 Western Star tri axle. The guy I bought the excavator is telling me I am better off with a tandem. He said if I was just trucking a tri would be fine.


This make any sense?

punt66
08-26-2008, 07:51 PM
Since I bought the 150 I have been slowly looking for a dump truck. I found a good deal on a 2000 Western Star tri axle. The guy I bought the excavator is telling me I am better off with a tandem. He said if I was just trucking a tri would be fine.


This make any sense?

depends on what your using it for. The plus with the triaxle you can work for a broker hauling if you or your driver is slow.

PROCUT1
08-26-2008, 09:18 PM
I cant think of the last time ive seen a tandem. Everything is triaxle around here.

mrusk
08-26-2008, 09:21 PM
Where I like it seems like most trucking companies run tri axles while the excavation/sitework companies run tandems. They say tandems are easy to move around with on site.

stuvecorp
08-26-2008, 09:29 PM
depends on what your using it for. The plus with the triaxle you can work for a broker hauling if you or your driver is slow.

I would have to agree with you, out here the tri is getting phased out and people are going with quads. The only way I could see a tandem is if it was super lightweight so you could haul alot. Just remember that you aren't going to make your fortune with the truck and you will be fine.

mrusk
08-26-2008, 09:33 PM
In jersey we can run 80k gross with tris and 70k with tandems.

bobcat_ron
08-26-2008, 09:35 PM
Tight, tight turns are a bad reason to go tri-axle, I have seen long tandems turn inside tri-axle's circles, they are just terrible.

stuvecorp
08-26-2008, 09:39 PM
In jersey we can run 80k gross with tris and 70k with tandems.

Here tandems are 54,000 typically, tri can go to 62,000 or 64,000(can't rember exact) and quads go to 73,000, semi's are 80,000. How big is the dump box usually out there?

mrusk
08-26-2008, 09:42 PM
18 foot boxes on tris.

DUSTYCEDAR
08-26-2008, 09:54 PM
I DONT KNOW ABOUT BUYING ANYTHING RIGHT NOW
BUT only u can know what u r making.
i would go tri as u can haul more and its all about what u can carry.

Gravel Rat
08-26-2008, 10:30 PM
What in the h*ll do you want to carry more than 15 ton for. Out here in B.C. is all we use is tandems the trucks are paid by the hour. More you haul on the truck more your killing it and burning excessive fuel.

We have tridrive trucks and tandem tandem trucks both are tire eaters and you don't get paid anymore for it. If you want to haul more buy a pup trailer.

A tandem axle is good for 57,540lbs thats good enough a tridrive is good for 72,000lb gross but the frigging truck can't go anywhere but a straight line.

When you have 3 drive axles loaded and 12 drive tires scuffing on the ground it doesn't matter how sharp the front wheels turn the truck goes straight. You lock all 3 drive axle lockers and power dividers and turn the steering wheel it will just push the steering tires sideways on dry pavement.

Guys were using tandem tandem they steer a little better but with tandem steering axles the truck needs a foot ball field to turn around. A tandem tandem is good for 77,000lb gross.

Now to reshod a tridrive dump truck your looking at 9500 dollars in tires a regular tandem axle your looking at 6000 dollars. The drive tires on a tridrive dump last about 3 months if you rotate them so every three months your gauranteed a 4000 dollar tire bill just for drive tires.

A tandem axle dump you can squeek 6 months out of a set of drives maybe a year if your easy on the sharp turns. A recapped drive tire is 500 dollars each a supersingle steer tire is 1200 each.

If this is going to be your own use truck go with a tandem its cheaper on tires and the truck isn't busting a gut. Guys hauling by the ton have to have their head examined. Trucks here are paid 100 dollars per hour work 8-10 hours a day.

CAT powered
08-26-2008, 10:31 PM
Boy. All the landscape boys want to play with the real toys don't they.

I own two triaxles and can't even think of surviving without either one. There are times where having two triaxles and a 25 yard dump trailer isn't enough.

You can save yourself a ton of cash on jobs if you have your own trucks versus hiring trucks all the time.

Plus any time you want to have a truck you can have it. With someone else's trucks they might have a big job that they need all their trucks on and you can't have any so you're stuck. If it's your truck you always have it.

The only downside to having a truck is once you have a truck everyone wants you to run it for free. Keep in mind a triaxle costs you 1$ a mile in fuel alone nevermind rubber, driver, etc.

CAT powered
08-26-2008, 10:40 PM
GR your tandems might work in BC, but the standard in the US is a triaxle. If you don't have a triaxle you're not worth having.

If you've got ANY knowledge of driving a triaxle you know that you pick up your push axle to make a tight corner and put it down once you're on the other side. Even my guy that doesn't have a CDL knows to pick up the push axle! (he was ridin in the passengers seat and reminded me of it)

With a pup trailer you might as well get yourself a truck tractor and dump trailer. That way you can switch to a lowbed to move around all your heavy stuff.

The real reasons triaxles are a good idea are:

1: you can drive them with just a straight truck license
2: they're maneuverable
3: they're simple to operate

Gravel Rat
08-26-2008, 10:42 PM
If he is hauling for his own jobs the customer pays his trucking so if he is only hauling 15 tons worth of material so what thats all what the truck hauls.

If a home owner wanted a contractor to operate a truck that hauls more than a tandem the contractor would tell the home owner to stick it up their you know where. Dump trucks are already profit loosing if you can't do ALL the repairs yourself and you drive the truck yourself.

A tandem axle dump with a tandem axle pup trailer will gross 94,000lbs so you can pack about 30 tons of material. A tandem and quad axle transfer will gross 135,000lbs and carry 40 tons of material.

Scag48
08-26-2008, 10:48 PM
Seems to me a triaxle is the only way to go. There are quite a few quads out here as well. Go big or go home.

CAT powered
08-26-2008, 10:52 PM
I can pack 20 yards of topsoil into my triaxle just fine. Maybe with your @$$ backwards laws in Canada you can only haul 15 tons, but I'm putting 25 or so in my triaxle. Why in the hell would I want another vehicle to register, insure, and maintain?

Dangit I just figured out your problem, GR. You deal with homeowners. What on earth would possess you do do that?

I do commercial and government jobs ONLY. The closest I get to working with a homeowner is installing a new septic system in a group home for the Department of Mental ******ation.

This year I have had more work than I know what to do with. REAL work is still going on.

Your homeowner work has gone down the tubes yes, but when I'm working on a 3 million dollar project to install wood heat for 5 acres of greenhouses and doing 40+ hours of D8 sized dozing per week with 2 guys we stay busy.

P.Services
08-26-2008, 10:55 PM
I can pack 20 yards of topsoil into my triaxle just fine. Maybe with your @$$ backwards laws in Canada you can only haul 15 tons, but I'm putting 25 or so in my triaxle. Why in the hell would I want another vehicle to register, insure, and maintain?

Dangit I just figured out your problem, GR. You deal with homeowners. What on earth would possess you do do that?

I do commercial and government jobs ONLY. The closest I get to working with a homeowner is installing a new septic system in a group home for the Department of Mental ******ation.

This year I have had more work than I know what to do with. REAL work is still going on.

Your homeowner work has gone down the tubes yes, but when I'm working on a 3 million dollar project to install wood heat for 5 acres of greenhouses and doing 40+ hours of D8 sized dozing per week with 2 guys we stay busy.



wow that was a verbal ass whoooooooopin!!!

Dirt Digger2
08-27-2008, 12:08 AM
Mrusk was right...guys that haul equipment run tandems...plain and simple, you have to plan for future jobs...if you use the quarry to haul your stone then it doesn't really make sense to buy a tri...if you need to haul a lot of material from a job then you hire a trucking company anyway...tandems are so much easier to back into jobs and pull trailers

if you plan an trucking more then trailer pulling then a tri might be a better option...they can only haul about 5 more tons but if you are trucking 300 tons of material to a job on your own that adds up...

all of you that say a tri is the only way to go....have you ever tried to pull equipment with a tri? you have no idea what the roads here on the east coast are like...the shorter the better

Dirt Digger2
08-27-2008, 12:13 AM
Here tandems are 54,000 typically, tri can go to 62,000 or 64,000(can't rember exact) and quads go to 73,000, semi's are 80,000. How big is the dump box usually out there?

17-18 on tri's...theres a guy around here that has a 16 on a tri and everytime he gets pulled over and weighed on movable scales he gets smacked because theres too much steering axle weight...

we run a 15 on our tandem

CAT powered
08-27-2008, 12:18 AM
Dirt digger I pulled equipment on Connecticut roads with a triaxle and tag for years until I got a lowbed and a truck. It's not bad as long as you know what you're doing.

I have relatives in the Chester area of Pennsylvania and the roads there aren't much worse than roads up here.

The road my yard is on has potholes that are probably a foot deep and take up half the road. I'll try to get some pictures of the road some other time.

Dirt Digger2
08-27-2008, 12:28 AM
wells here is also a little of what i see....Mrusk i don't mean to take any shots at you, this is just an observation...

i see a guy who just bought a relatively large machine that is only learning to operate the thing...he fired his past operator (from previous threads) so he now is the only "operator"...which is fine...being that way though, i also see a guy that doesn't know a whole lot about trucking, fine as well (you can't pick it up overnight) so either he will have to get a CDL or he will have to hire a driver...if he gets it then a tandem is the way to go because a tri is harder to maneuver into jobsites, especially with his RESIDENTIAL landscaping work...if he hires a driver then he really has no idea whether this guy is a real driver or not because he might not have experience with larger trucks to be able to judge the guy...in which case if he doesn't have the skill to back a tri into a job, unloads on the road and Mrusk gets a bill from the township to fix the scratch marks on the pavement....

Mrusk hopefully you correct me if i am wrong in any of this but based on previous posts i think i am fairly right in the assumptions i made....again they are only assumptions

CAT powered
08-27-2008, 12:32 AM
Aha. If you're doing all resi and you don't even have a CDL then a tandem would be a decent truck I suppose. I do all commercial/gov't work and all my guys but 1 have a Class A CDL. And if marks on the street are an issue throw down tires. The few times I couldn't back the trailer onto the site directly that was my course of action.

Gravel Rat
08-27-2008, 01:04 AM
Commercial projects are non existant in most rural places in B.C. if there is commercial jobs they go to large companies. Subdivisions are done by multiple contractors if it needs to be. New shopping centers are non existant residents don't want large store chains like Walmart. The B.C. gov't isn't planning on major road improvements.

The big problem with dump trucks is braking power. A tandem axle dump overloaded to 18 ton your really pushing it for brakes. Going down hills a JAKE is a must without a Jake you will roast your brakes in seconds. I hope you can write your last will and testiment fast.

The big difference in B.C. and the USA is we are allowed 37,478lbs on tandem axles in the USA you guys are only allowed 34,000lbs. Our max steer axle weight is 20,000lbs. We are allowed 140,000lb gross and in the USA you guys need permits to run that.

B.C. has gravel mines all over most areas it is only 1 hour round trip from the mine to the job site. Maybe in places like Vancouver its longer.

Like I said trucks are paid by the hour the customer pays what ever it costs. The average house site takes 150-200 tons worth of material. Heck that much material is just to get a driveway built. A homeowner can pay upto 10 grand in trucking that doesn't include material cost.

Here is a standard West Coast tandem some Al Roy Vids

www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-en52q1vu4

Here is a West Coast Tridrive

www.youtube.com/watch?v=mwRNyFvem8g

A tridrive can pack 23 tons of material legally they run a 21 foot box. To buy a brandnew T-800 Kenworth with C-15 550hp 18spd with a 21 foot transfer your looking at 190-200,000 dollars a Tandem axle with C-15 18spd 16'6" box your looking at 150,000.

mrusk
08-27-2008, 07:36 AM
Since all my stone currently comes from the quarry, tri axles have never had trouble getting into my job sites.


I am not buying anything yet.


I will be hiring a full time operator/driver.

SLSNursery
08-27-2008, 11:21 AM
I thought you might enjoy some pics of a 2000 Western Star Triaxle that we run. Green is before, Red is after some body work and a paint job.

I say go for the truck, especially if you need it. What is the condition and cost?

Acquisition is not usually the problem, the recurring costs are what make operating heavy trucks costly. The insurance, heavy use tax, fuel, etc. plus the wages of the driver make up your cost basis. Until you operate it for a while, you can only assume what those actual costs are going to be. If you charge the truck out based upon this assumption plus profit, you can adjust as you go, to hit your number. If you don't get the number, don't turn the key. If you can't afford to have it parked, don't buy the truck. A lot of trucks run for by the ton payment around here, and consistently overload, because the revenue beats the odds and cost of a ticket. We try to run hourly, and for ourselves and that has worked for me. I dabble in hauling every now and then, if the payment works. This is often hit or miss, and has been a compelling reason not to upgrade or buy an additional dump truck.

My Western Star is fairly reliable, with about 300k on it. We bought it used an really put light miles on it - 10k this year. No Hauling. Maybe 20-30k during years we haul. The year to year maintenance we perform is usually less than $10k, including keeping the paint up, new tarp, tires, suspension replacement, clutch, etc. Even with light use, you need to stay up on the stuff.

It is indispensible for moving material and bringing stuff into the yard. I find that if you are making money on the product in the truck, and the trucking it is worthwhile. When you are just providing the trucking component, things get sketchy.

mrusk
08-27-2008, 08:09 PM
Truck is a 2000. Has the 430hp cat engine. 275K miles on truck. 60k on a new motor.


35k for the truck. Guy tried trucking for a year but with the downturn ecomony could not make it. He had it forsale for almost a year now. He went from 40k to 35k without me asking to lower the price.

Dirt Digger2
08-27-2008, 08:23 PM
air to the rear?

mrusk
08-27-2008, 08:35 PM
air to the rear?

It needs to be plumbed. It was set up and used for just hauling material.

Gravel Rat
08-27-2008, 08:56 PM
SLS Star car is a rare one you don't see the 4964 series with a set back axle that one was custom ordered at one time.

The truck mrusk is looking at has the C-13 if its only rated at 430 you want the C-15 or ISX Cummins if you want to pull a tilt or tag trailer. The C-13 is okay I would rather have a C-15 or 3406E. The N-14 Cummins is good the ISX Cummins is so so. The big block Series 60 is good. The MBE Mercedes is okay new watch out when it comes to repairs.

Western Stars are okay but watch out for RUST they are bad for cab rust and the frame rusts.

mrusk
08-27-2008, 09:20 PM
Gravel rat is a tri going to be pain to pull a machine with because of length?


I do spend alot of $ on trucking. But thats not whats attracting me to buying a truck. My business is different then alot of yours. I deal with wealthy clients and so far I have been able to get away with alot of the job site. Not every customer is willing to let me dump 5 or 6 loads of material on site and stock pile. Some jobs I am bidding now we can only bring in 1 load at a time due to space. Also we waste to much time stock piling spoils then trucking out later.

The truck might not make me a profit trucking, but it will make me money by keeping my site clean and the client happy.

Gravel Rat
08-27-2008, 10:32 PM
A triaxle won't make it tougher to pull a tag you guys on the East use really short wheelbase trucks out here a regular tandem axle truck runs a 16-17 foot box and a wheelbase of 236-238 inches.

I don't think a triaxle is good because your beating the crap out of a truck that is essentially a tandem with a drop axle. Your putting 20 tons on the truck its hard on drive axles and tires etc. You look at a truck tractor it may be grossing 80,000lbs or more but its not carrying that weight on its back.

Are you really going to be production hauling ?

If this truck is for your own use for hauling to and away from your site and use the truck to pull a tag to move your equipment. Your truck is for your convenience so your not relying on a trucking company. If you have a job that requires lots of material have that subbed out or hire a extra truck. Why beat the snot out of your truck hauling load after load.

The dump truck isn't your bread and butter the driver you hire should beable to run equipment too so when there is no driving he/she could be running hoe or skid etc.

mrusk
08-27-2008, 10:57 PM
GR- I need to hire a full time operator. But I do not have a full 40 hours per a week of operating. But with a truck to drive I now can keep a qualified worker busy and make my life alot easier.

How does the price sound on that W.S.? I know its hard to say without seeing it or knowning all specs.

Gravel Rat
08-27-2008, 11:50 PM
Western Star trucks hold their value or they do out here in B.C. because they are the direct competitor for Kenworth and Pete.

A 4964 standard hood Star with the Constellation cabs ie pre 99. If you look at a Western Star that is from 93-97 they have a narrow cab like a Pete I drove those style Star cars. The cab is very cramped like I said its like a Pete with a narrow cab. Western Star changed the cab to the Constellation cab on the vocational trucks it makes them more room.

Price range on a 99 and newer Star I would say minimum I would find 30 grand if you get a 4900 series.

I looked on Truckpaper.com they don't show much Stars they are not that common in the USA.

mrusk
08-28-2008, 04:09 PM
The only negative - see is that the truck has 40 rears. The front is 16.5k

stuvecorp
08-28-2008, 09:27 PM
How are you going to load this truck? Your 150 won't be on every site and can your skid load it? Just something to think about.

mrusk
08-28-2008, 09:32 PM
How are you going to load this truck? Your 150 won't be on every site and can your skid load it? Just something to think about.

I did not measure the the height of the box. I have loaded tandems with the skid.


If the 150 is not on site we are most likely just moving a few yards. I could always just open up the tail gate and dump in the back of the truck.



After talking to a few excavators I am leaning away from this truck and more towards a tandem.

Gravel Rat
08-28-2008, 09:33 PM
If the truck only has 40s its a converted tractor or a lightly spec'ed truck. You want minimum 44,000lb rears or 46,000lbs rear especially if you want the truck to be a drop axle truck.

ksss
08-28-2008, 10:03 PM
I did not measure the the height of the box. I have loaded tandems with the skid.


If the 150 is not on site we are most likely just moving a few yards. I could always just open up the tail gate and dump in the back of the truck.



After talking to a few excavators I am leaning away from this truck and more towards a tandem.


If you like the truck and the price is right, you can always pull the drop axle off and sell it. They bring about 3K here with the cab controls used.

Gravel Rat
08-28-2008, 10:37 PM
After he said the truck has 40,000lb rear axles I would reconsider the truck. A truck with 40s is okay if you run strictly legal and on pavement you start working offroad and loaded up your going to be really carefull about what you do or you will be hearing snap and bang.

Even pulling a tag trailer with a truck with 40s you can feel it in the truck.

ksss
08-28-2008, 11:04 PM
I would have bet that the WS had 46's on it. It seems that when you do see one around here it is always a heavy spec. truck. They are not that common around here but when you do see them for sale, they always have heavy specs.

Mike33
08-28-2008, 11:05 PM
I have loaded many tri-axles ( steel beds ) with my bobcat 185
Mike

CAT powered
08-29-2008, 12:03 AM
Why even take it off? You're limiting yourself severely by taking it off. Taking it off doesn't shorten the frame length and if you want to have that push axle capability you can still have it, but nobody is forcing you to put it down if you don't need it for the weight you're carrying.

ksss
08-29-2008, 12:36 AM
Why even take it off? You're limiting yourself severely by taking it off. Taking it off doesn't shorten the frame length and if you want to have that push axle capability you can still have it, but nobody is forcing you to put it down if you don't need it for the weight you're carrying.

I agree, I was assuming the drop axle was in the way somehow. I have been reading all this and I will confess I am confused. Why would you get a tandem, like CATpowered says just don't put it down if you don't want it. I guess only if it prevents getting around off road would you not want one. I see no down side to it.

CAT powered
08-29-2008, 12:46 AM
My thoughts exactly. You're talking about how 40 rears on a tri is too light, but you're telling him to get a tandem? I just don't get it.

Gravel Rat
08-29-2008, 01:16 AM
The offroad thing can be cured by taking the wheels off and leave the axle. The drop axle will affect offroad use because it will contact the ground and lift your drive wheels and you loose traction. I guess you guys don't offroad your trucks much. I have backed gravel trucks down driveways where the break over angle at the top of the road is almost touching the fuel tanks.

You guys can keep you tri axles a tandem axle is a money maker in B.C. your being paid by the hour to haul 15 tons at a time it has been that way for 40 years.

We have never had problems with 44 or 46 rear axles anything like 40s and 38s you have troubles.

A truck with 40s in soft gound you can loose a axle quick if your not carefull.

ksss
08-29-2008, 01:28 AM
The offroad thing can be cured by taking the wheels off and leave the axle. The drop axle will affect offroad use because it will contact the ground and lift your drive wheels and you loose traction. I guess you guys don't offroad your trucks much. I have backed gravel trucks down driveways where the break over angle at the top of the road is almost touching the fuel tanks.

You guys can keep you tri axles a tandem axle is a money maker in B.C. your being paid by the hour to haul 15 tons at a time it has been that way for 40 years.

We have never had problems with 44 or 46 rear axles anything like 40s and 38s you have troubles.

A truck with 40s in soft gound you can loose a axle quick if your not carefull.


Here drop axles get another 5-10 dollars an hour depending on contractor your working for. So it is not like your not compensated for carrying more weight.

stuvecorp
08-29-2008, 01:36 AM
The offroad thing can be cured by taking the wheels off and leave the axle. The drop axle will affect offroad use because it will contact the ground and lift your drive wheels and you loose traction. I guess you guys don't offroad your trucks much. I have backed gravel trucks down driveways where the break over angle at the top of the road is almost touching the fuel tanks.

You guys can keep you tri axles a tandem axle is a money maker in B.C. your being paid by the hour to haul 15 tons at a time it has been that way for 40 years.

We have never had problems with 44 or 46 rear axles anything like 40s and 38s you have troubles.

A truck with 40s in soft gound you can loose a axle quick if your not carefull.

Dude, Rusk is in hardscaping/landscaping. He is not running bonzi across the wilderness. He needs to haul out spoil and bring in base/stone on regular roads.

CAT powered
08-29-2008, 01:40 AM
Who cares what it is to hire out to the hour?
I thought he was looking at this truck for his own use. If it's for his own use why not just have the push axle in case he wants or needs it?

As for your whole offroad reasoning in my mind he is far better off to spend the few thousand to rent an ADT for a month instead of putting all that unnecessary stress on his truck. I avoid using an OTR truck as a site truck whenever possible. And if it has to be used as a site truck it gets a dozed out road and it doesn't get overloaded.

And Gravel Rat in case you didn't notice not everyone lives in BC. Just because something wouldn't work in your mountainside village doesn't mean it wouldn't work for what he needs to do.

ksss
08-29-2008, 01:41 AM
Dude, Rusk is in hardscaping/landscaping. He is not running bonzi across the wilderness. He needs to haul out spoil and bring in base/stone on regular roads.


The visual I get on that makes me laugh.:laugh:

Gravel Rat
08-29-2008, 01:54 AM
Even 10 dollars per hour doesn't pay for the extra fuel and wear and tear on the truck.

When your hauling 20 tons on a truck that peals tires off like you wouldn't believe. You guys are only allowed 34,000 on tandem axle group then 12,000 on the drop axle and 12,000 on the the steer.

A tandem axle dump gets 95-100 dollars per hour the time doesn't stop if the truck is waiting its still on the clock. Soon as the driver starts the truck and heads to the pit the customer pays. Some jobs you can only get 4 loads in a day because of the travel time.

Customer pays for 8 hours of trucking 760 dollars. If its a high rise drain field it could take 15 loads of material that is 4 days worth of hauling or 3000 dollars in trucking.

If its a short haul and your doing a driveway fill that takes 20 12 yard loads you can get 10 loads a day so the customer pays 1500 dollars in trucking.

There is no scales in the area so you can run a little overloaded adding a extra ton.

The CVSE just reduced the front axle capacity of vocational trucks it used to be legal to gross 20,000lbs with 425/65R22.5 supersingle steer tires now we are only allowed to gross 17,000lbs. If we want to gross 20,000lbs then 445/65R22.5 tires are required they are murderously expensive.

A regular 11R22.5 steer tire is only good for 12,000lbs which is totally useless.

Nobody in the dump trucking business is interested in hauling more than you have to. A 15 ton load is standard and its what customers expect.

Oh ya most new construction sites you need to have both axles locked up and a excavator helping you get the loaded truck up or down the access roads into the building sites. Some places you have to have a cable hooked to the front bumper to keep the truck from sliding away.

People want to build on tough properties the access roads are tough they are narrow roads make a mistake you can write the truck off by rolling it over.

CAT powered
08-29-2008, 02:13 AM
Well the good news for rusk is I very highly doubt he will be building anything in your BC hillside village, GR.

Jersey overall is far flatter than your area, GR.

And I can get as long out of a set of tires on my triaxle as I can get out of a set of tires on my tandem axle truck tractor.

If you've got half a brain in your head you pick up your push axle for tight corners that way you aren't scuffing around as much rubber. Then as soon as you're on the other side you put it back down. To the casual observer the axle doesn't come up far enough to make it look like you did anything, but it comes up enough that it isn't contacting anymore.

punt66
08-29-2008, 08:59 AM
Well the good news for rusk is I very highly doubt he will be building anything in your BC hillside village, GR.

Jersey overall is far flatter than your area, GR.

And I can get as long out of a set of tires on my triaxle as I can get out of a set of tires on my tandem axle truck tractor.

If you've got half a brain in your head you pick up your push axle for tight corners that way you aren't scuffing around as much rubber. Then as soon as you're on the other side you put it back down. To the casual observer the axle doesn't come up far enough to make it look like you did anything, but it comes up enough that it isn't contacting anymore.


yea i have been following this thread and wondering why people are pushing a dual over a tri axle. It doesnt make sense. I have been running tri axles for years and pulling 20 ton tags with shovels on them and a load in the box. The tag goes up and down so cornering isnt any different. Also if your driver has nothing to do send him of in the tri axle to work for a broker. You wont make much money on that but your truck and driver will be getting paid for. They wont hire you with a dual.

stuvecorp
08-29-2008, 10:18 PM
If you've got half a brain in your head you pick up your push axle for tight corners that way you aren't scuffing around as much rubber. Then as soon as you're on the other side you put it back down. To the casual observer the axle doesn't come up far enough to make it look like you did anything, but it comes up enough that it isn't contacting anymore.

Most late model trucks have steerables here so you don't even have to lift as the DOT/5.0 boys frown on that pusher coming up.

CAT powered
08-29-2008, 10:29 PM
Those boys can't even tell when mine comes up. It comes up so slow that it probably isn't even a half inch off the road, but it's not contacting.

My truck isn't exactly a "Late model truck."

I bought my triaxle Mack DM brand new in 1987.

Gravel Rat
08-29-2008, 10:36 PM
Its up to mrusk on how much weight he wants to haul. Myself I don't see the point in hauling more than 15 ton on the truck it stresses all the parts on the truck. You start dumping 20 plus ton its tweaking the frame behind the cab your box is twisting.

I guess the biggest limitation you guys have is 80,000lbs is the most you guys can max without major expenses. A tandem axle dump and pup can haul 22 yards of material. You have the option to haul say topsoil in the truck and a load of sand in the pup etc.

CAT powered
08-29-2008, 10:39 PM
Why would you want to maintain an entire extra vehicle like a pup trailer to carry a grand total of 2 extra yards of material? I can fit 20 yards of screened topsoil in my triaxle and *gasp* these trucks are built to handle the loads put on them. Who would've thought?!
There is absolutely no advantage to having a tandem axle rather than a triaxle. It's just dumb.

Gravel Rat
08-29-2008, 10:54 PM
We put 20 yards of topsoil into rolloff trucks no big deal oh ya the rolloff trucks are tandem axles with 40 yard bins.

We haul sand and gravel not topsoil you haul topsoil in underpowered light speced trucks like a Ford L8000 with 3208 power.

Like I said you guys probably can't pull a pup trailer because the gvw would be 92,000lbs. A tandem pulling a quad axle transfer grosses 134,000lbs.

Are you guys making 95 dollars per hour with your trucks ? Probably not.

I mentioned this once before but one of the smaller contractors paid over 200,000 dollars in trucking last year just for hauling material to his jobs.

punt66
08-29-2008, 10:58 PM
We put 20 yards of topsoil into rolloff trucks no big deal oh ya the rolloff trucks are tandem axles with 40 yard bins.

We haul sand and gravel not topsoil you haul topsoil in underpowered light speced trucks like a Ford L8000 with 3208 power.

Like I said you guys probably can't pull a pup trailer because the gvw would be 92,000lbs. A tandem pulling a quad axle transfer grosses 134,000lbs.

Are you guys making 95 dollars per hour with your trucks ? Probably not.

I mentioned this once before but one of the smaller contractors paid over 200,000 dollars in trucking last year just for hauling material to his jobs.

a triaxle is getting $90 per hour here in CT.

CAT powered
08-29-2008, 10:58 PM
My trucks aren't for hire. My trucks are either running my jobs or they're parked. It's not worth my time to get involved with other contractors.

And by the way I've got a 92 Peterbilt 357 with a Galbreath hoist and a tarp on it.
It is a triaxle too.

mrusk
08-29-2008, 11:12 PM
Why would you only put 15 tons on a truck??? Why buy a heavy duty truck then? Makes no sense to me? In Jersey we can gross 80k with a tri and 70k with a tandem. You mind as well haul what you are rated for.


I have been running the #s. Unless I find a cheap truck, running a truck right on the boarderline of not being profitable when you just look at the hauling. It was so easy to figure how at what point the excavator would start putting money in my pocket. And it will. The excavator will without a doubt boost my profit on these large jobs.

With the truck it will come down to the convience factor.

Gravel Rat
08-29-2008, 11:15 PM
Ya but you must charge the customer per hour for your truck working on their job. It is the way the contractors do it here the customer pays 95 dollars per hour for the contractors truck to haul to the jobsite. Contractors rarely haul for another contractor its all their own jobs. Only the owner operators haul to different contractors and or home owners etc.

For example the contractor is working on a sand system drain field the C-33 Septic sand is used. So each 12 yard load is 640 dollars the sand is 450 dollars for 15 tons the trucking is 190 dollars. A sand system field depending on the size needs minimum 4 loads of sand.

A tridrive dump hauls 22 tons of material its hourly rate is 125 dollars per hour.

I know mrusk isn't going to get into hauling for every Tom, Dick or Harry he needs a good truck to pull a tag to move his 16 ton machine and what ever work the truck is used for.

mrusk
08-29-2008, 11:24 PM
Right now I am right around 375-400 loads per a year in or out of my jobs. A typical delivery runs me between 95-125 dollars. By the time I pay a employee to drive the truck the quarry or pit, put fuel in the thing, make my payment, etc I will be lucky to make 25 bucks a load.

punt66
08-29-2008, 11:30 PM
What i did when i had 2 triaxles and drivers running was hire them out to a broker to keep them busy if i didnt have something immedietly for them to do. For example. If u pulled a 1000 gallon underground oil tank and needed a load of fill and that was the only load i needed that day i would send my driver to work for a broker for the day and call the material yard and have them deliver me the material or go get it with the single axle i towed the machine with. You have to maximize you equipments usage. Any equipment just sitting is losing. It at least needs to pay for itself. The only day my tri axles sat was sunday.

CAT powered
08-29-2008, 11:35 PM
I don't charge by the hour. I build my delivery costs into my yardage costs. It makes less paperwork and arguing with the customer in the end for me. The further they are from my material source the higher their cost per yard is. It's simple for me really.

mrusk
08-29-2008, 11:35 PM
How do you find a broker to work with?

Gravel Rat
08-29-2008, 11:42 PM
You need a truck to pull a trailer to move your 16 ton so you have to figure in what it costs you each time you have to hire a contractor to move that for you. I imagine you want to get more work for your 16 ton machine.

You do know a 15,000-20,000 dump can do the same job if your not doing lots of hauling.

mrusk
08-30-2008, 06:02 PM
The guy I bought the machine from is trying to sell me his 1983 autocar tandem and tag trailer for 20k. Truck has 440k miles. Not sure of the motor but it only has 300hp.

I am just very nervous of owning a older truck. I am very big on company image and would rather have a newer truck just because of perseption.

punt66
08-30-2008, 06:20 PM
How do you find a broker to work with?

call any material yard near you and they will tell you. Many material yards are also brokers.

RockSet N' Grade
08-30-2008, 07:20 PM
mrusk: I would rather own an older truck and spend the money to make it "classic". The older rigs are built better, less computor stuff (which equates to huge repair costs), less to insure/register, etc. The only thing I don't like right off the bat about the truck you are considering is that it is only 300 hp., that has got to work real hard to do anything. Check it out though.....all my equipment is older, but you wouldn't know it......all my stuff is decked out and I did it over time. My dream would be to buy an older Pete and redo it into a "nice" dump truck. You are right though, high end residential clients "perception" is a huge part of selling a job: I have no oil leaks or hydraulic leaks of any kind on anything, our shirts have logo's and we all are presentable leaving the site each day trash free and picked up. Another point: an older "clean" truck does not smack of "I am making too much money" like a brand new dump truck or whatever can.

Mike33
08-30-2008, 11:49 PM
I have a good system, i pay some one else to truck for me. I pay a guy 65.00/hr with single axle can haul 13 ton legal. I normally can give 1/2 day notice and he is there on a dime. Some times when i have the room on wall jobs, i get the quarry to haul its normally 80-85 per 23 ton of stone. I will neber own a truck again, i think they are the neccessary evil. When i get things hauled in or out i just write a check and dont have to work on the truck. Last year i spent 21k on trucking and could write it all off. Now owning your own depr. will hit you. If your going to own your own truck great but than your in a different world of the trucking business. Tags, ins., fuel will eat hard on you. I know we all have different needs in our business but mine works goog for me the way i di it. You have to have it on the road and working all the time than maybe it can make you money. But remember when these big toys break, they eat top shelf.
Mike

bobcatuser
08-31-2008, 01:17 AM
I would only buy the truck if you are having a hard time scheduling the hired trucks.

Making a profit trucking comes down to supply and demand. If you can get a good rate it might be worth owning.

Dirt Digger2
08-31-2008, 03:52 AM
I have a good system, i pay some one else to truck for me. I pay a guy 65.00/hr with single axle can haul 13 ton legal.

i can't believe that...i know maryland is messed up with their DOT but there is no way he is getting 13 on a single...that means his truck only weighs 7-8000lbs...thats less then a 3/4 ton truck

Mrusk...you don't make money by owning 1 truck, its convenience....basically you will will break even with one truck if you can keep it busy when you factor in fuel, repair, driver, insurance, etc... what it comes down to is would it be cheaper to buy the truck and pay the expenses or hire out another company

also have no fears about an older truck...they will run circles around newer trucks any day of the week...they don't have all that electronic crap...plain and simple haulers...slap some paint on it and 9 out of 10 people wouldn't know the difference...we have a '88 Pete that I would put up against a newer truck anyday...Pete never changes thier style so it looks the same and the truck is much more easy to work on by yourself then the newer ones

Gravel Rat
08-31-2008, 04:19 AM
Another truck option is buy yourself a decent used conventional rail rolloff truck get a low side box for hauling gravel. Then you could have a 30-40 yard box and a flatdeck for hauling supplies.

mrusk
08-31-2008, 11:22 AM
Another truck option is buy yourself a decent used conventional rail rolloff truck get a low side box for hauling gravel. Then you could have a 30-40 yard box and a flatdeck for hauling supplies.

Thats what I would rather by. So then I could pick up cubes of block and pavers. Never need a dumpster again. Haul the skid or mini on the flatbed.

I just need to find one around 50k or less.


The auto car just looks too OLD. I'll get some pics of it.


The truck is for convience. I really want to keep the job site cleaner. So that means no more stock piling 6 or 7 loads of material in one day then pulling form it for the next couple of days. I am trying to make the experience better for all my customers.

CAT powered
08-31-2008, 11:29 AM
Dangit, rusk. If you'd have decided you wanted a rolloff a month ago you could've headed up my neck of the woods.

You could've had a 99 Peterbilt 357 triaxle rolloff with a gal-fab hooker system on it and it had a tarp in good condition for 33k.

Petrowsky Auctioneers in Franklin, CT had 36 rolloffs at their last sale.

I picked up a 92 Peterbilt 357 triaxle with a tarp a Cummins and in good condition for 18k

mrusk
08-31-2008, 11:50 AM
Anymore auctions coming up?

PROCUT1
08-31-2008, 12:14 PM
Now that it was brought up. I dont know much about your business except what you post here but the rolloff or a hooklift sounds like a great idea.

When I was in the business, if I stayed I was going to get a hooklift to replace some of the trucks I have.

Mike33
08-31-2008, 05:30 PM
i can't believe that...i know maryland is messed up with their DOT but there is no way he is getting 13 on a single...that means his truck only weighs 7-8000lbs...thats less then a 3/4 ton truck

Mrusk...you don't make money by owning 1 truck, its convenience....basically you will will break even with one truck if you can keep it busy when you factor in fuel, repair, driver, insurance, etc... what it comes down to is would it be cheaper to buy the truck and pay the expenses or hire out another company

also have no fears about an older truck...they will run circles around newer trucks any day of the week...they don't have all that electronic crap...plain and simple haulers...slap some paint on it and 9 out of 10 people wouldn't know the difference...we have a '88 Pete that I would put up against a newer truck anyday...Pete never changes thier style so it looks the same and the truck is much more easy to work on by yourself then the newer ones

Im serious, the way he has it tagged i have had plenty of 12.5-13 ton delvered to me. Some of the loads he has hauled away for me of course we didnt weigh them are pretty darn heavy. Im talking about loading that you cant get anymore dirt on.
mike

punt66
08-31-2008, 05:48 PM
Im serious, the way he has it tagged i have had plenty of 12.5-13 ton delvered to me. Some of the loads he has hauled away for me of course we didnt weigh them are pretty darn heavy. Im talking about loading that you cant get anymore dirt on.
mike


good way to kill people on the road.

CAT powered
08-31-2008, 06:05 PM
Rusk I'm not sure if they'll have any left at their next sale. I think pretty much all of them got bought.

I know you can get a 2003 Kenworth T800 triaxle with the Gal-fab hooker unit on it from a local guy who is pretty scummy, but did buy one and is reselling it. He's asking 73,000 but I know he didn't pay more than 68,000.

Mike33
08-31-2008, 11:33 PM
good way to kill people on the road.

I disagree, this guy owned and operated t/t/ all of his life. His truck isn't one of the single axles you see on the ford lot. Its a 900 series that at one time was a tractor, descent size bed large cummins engine. I have road with him several times truck pulls a load like crazy and has no problem stopping.
Mike

Dirt Digger2
09-01-2008, 02:28 AM
Mike what is the GVW on that truck?....i am just very curious how he gets 13 ton on a single...if thats the case then it eliminates the need for a tandem almost...4 less tires to worry about

Gravel Rat
09-01-2008, 04:19 AM
The most I have put on a single axle is 9 ton and thats heavier than h*ll you are overloaded. I wouldn't be running a single with 13 tons on its back.

bobcat_ron
09-01-2008, 11:59 AM
The most I have put on a single axle is 9 ton and thats heavier than h*ll you are overloaded. I wouldn't be running a single with 13 tons on its back.

Uhhhh, you should see my dad's truck, single axle 1992 Mack midliner, 215 hp with a 10 speed, empty weight is 9 tons on the Vedder scales, he regularly packs his (8 ton) PC-60 in the back of the box, inside and gets away with it. :dizzy:

http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=IerGivuWxyc
http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=vXdNM3nvOgA

Gravel Rat
09-01-2008, 02:10 PM
Most single axles have a gvw of 35,000lbs so Ron your Dad is still legal if his truck only weighs 18,000lbs empty. Putting 13 ton on a single axle is grossly overloaded.

Single axle trucks lack brakes big time you only have one set of brakes stopping that weight. The front brakes on a air braked truck does some it is the rear brakes that do it all.

In B.C. max single axle weight is 20061 lbs and front axle wieght can be the same with proper sized tires.

Most single axle trucks have a 12,000lb capacity axle because the tires are 22.5 or 24.5 wheels with the same tires you run on a class 8 tractor.

You don't see too many single axle trucks with super single steer tires that can provide the 20,000lb axle capacity.

Mike33
09-01-2008, 11:57 PM
Mike what is the GVW on that truck?....i am just very curious how he gets 13 ton on a single...if thats the case then it eliminates the need for a tandem almost...4 less tires to worry about

I will call him and ask him, but im leaving for beach tomm. let you know next week.
mike

mrusk
09-03-2008, 07:43 PM
He is a pick of the old auto car. Its 15k for the truck. 5k for the tag trailer.

mrusk
09-03-2008, 07:44 PM
I am going to go get my permit for the CDL. Then they will teach me how to drive. Once i get my cdl then I will decided if I want to buy this truck or not.

Gravel Rat
09-03-2008, 09:25 PM
Thats a nice old truck it is sure short wheelbase :dizzy:

What is in the truck for power hopefully not a driptroit if its got a 335,350,400 Cummins or a 3406 it would be good.

The only thing you might have problems with is the truck doesn't have front brakes. Not a big deal but the front brakes do help a little.

It also looks like its running big rubber something like 12:00-24 not cheap but it works.

stuvecorp
09-03-2008, 09:50 PM
To be honest, there may not be anything mechanically wrong with that truck but image wise no way. Just my opinion.

mrusk
09-03-2008, 09:56 PM
Truck does look ruff. The guy put 10k into mechanicals on the truck. Looks like I would have to put at least 5k into comestics!

stuvecorp
09-03-2008, 10:02 PM
It probably would work fine if you were more in to excavating but from how you are set up your clients would expect something prettier. Something I have started to think about(for equipment/trucks) is would you like to run that all day? Another thing would be could you sell it easily without taking a beating?

CAT powered
09-03-2008, 10:06 PM
Those old Autocars are inspection MAGNETS. Get something more presentable. You can find something better than an autocar for 15 thousand dollars.

And why on earth would get a tandem? It just doesn't make sense!

stuvecorp
09-03-2008, 10:14 PM
And why on earth would get a tandem? It just doesn't make sense!

I would usually argue you are right but have found a tandem and it specs out very well(lightweight) and can have a lift axle installed for a reasonable price, sometimes you have to look at plan B.

CAT powered
09-03-2008, 10:24 PM
Yes, but the frame on a triaxle is longer as well as the box. That would take a lot of modifying to make it equal to a triaxle. In reality you are a lot better off with something that was built from the factory as a triaxle. They just work a lot nicer than anything else. You can haul a lot more on a triaxle rather than a tandem. And to those of you that say "oh triaxles dont turn well" then WHAT makes you think that a tandem w/pup would go better? That's just silly! I'd pull my push axle up a little and make the corner then put it back down. They're not bad to drive at all once you're used to them. Plus if you don't want the drop axle they won't make you put it down unless you're loaded to the point where you need it. You are just limiting yourself VERY severely by buying a tandem.

Gravel Rat
09-04-2008, 12:43 AM
What do you care what the clients think are you that worried that you have to cover up your poor workmanship with new equipment :confused:

Around here the CVSE (DOT) wouldn't pull that Autocar over its a clean looking truck there are lots of old trucks around here working. The way things are going guys are getting rid of the newer trucks with electronic engines and going back to trucks with mechanical injection.

You guys would be fired on the spot if you said to your boss I want a prettier truck.

This would be a truck I would be looking for these old Kenworths last for ever and haul just as good as a new truck

www.hankstruckpictures.com/pix/trucks/wes_bergman/album/album4/cheam01.jpg

Scag48
09-04-2008, 01:53 AM
So the guys complaining about triaxles are thinking turning is the issue? Have you never seen steerable lift axles? Wow, there's a thought. Triaxle capacity and comparable steering from that of a tandem. Amazing. And, better yet, when you're empty you can lift the damn thing up. :dizzy::drinkup:

Gravel Rat
09-04-2008, 02:39 AM
Here you want to haul good loads buy a truck like this one its good for 97,000lb gvw

www.hankstruckpictures.com/pix/trucks/alberta_trucks/misc_calgary/june2002/ws_twin_steer2.jpg

You take the logging rigging off of a tridrive and put a 21 foot box on it the truck has a gvw of 77,000lbs and good for a 23-24 ton load.

www.hankstruckpictures.com/pix/trucks/roadtrip2005a/day09/dsc_1228.jpg

stuvecorp
09-04-2008, 10:40 AM
So the guys complaining about triaxles are thinking turning is the issue? Have you never seen steerable lift axles? Wow, there's a thought. Triaxle capacity and comparable steering from that of a tandem. Amazing. And, better yet, when you're empty you can lift the damn thing up. :dizzy::drinkup:

Exactly.:clapping:

coopers
09-07-2008, 04:56 AM
I saw this picture and it just made me think of this thread....This trailer to me looks a little over worked for a 160 size machine....but that's just me.

punt66
09-07-2008, 08:49 AM
Those old Autocars are inspection MAGNETS. Get something more presentable. You can find something better than an autocar for 15 thousand dollars.

And why on earth would get a tandem? It just doesn't make sense!


Im thinking DOT isnt as strict in other states as here in CT. Any rolling truck here in CT has a big target on it. If your in any old truck you will pay more fines than its worth from the initial purchase savings. I wouldnt buy old here no way. I have been driving tri-axles for years and have been red tagged in a new truck, old truck, and thousands in fines.

bobcat_ron
09-07-2008, 11:35 AM
I saw this picture and it just made me think of this thread....This trailer to me looks a little over worked for a 160 size machine....but that's just me.


That trailer is god for the weight, if it were a 18-20 ton, no way.

punt66
09-07-2008, 12:09 PM
Thats a 20 ton tag, the machine as a 160 isnt 20t so i dont see the problem.

CAT powered
09-07-2008, 05:43 PM
I average an inspection once every 3 or 4 months with my trucks. I only run 3 or so trucks on a regular basis.

I think the Conn. DOT is much stricter since the MLS fatality and Avon Mtn. crashes.

I know the owner of MLS and that truck was unsafe. Just plain 100% unsafe. It was an old Autocar like the thread starter here had been looking at. I don't think it had a working light on it and I believe the brakes didn't work. He is now forbidden at the Wallingford Public Works garage and gets inspected REGULARLY and he now has a mechanic on staff.

I usually get 5 or 6 hundred dollars in fines every time I get inspected. Be it for a light not working (70/each gets expensive) or an "unsecured load" consisting of a few handfuls of sand on the lip of the box on my triaxle dump.

coopers
09-07-2008, 05:58 PM
Thats a 20 ton tag, the machine as a 160 isnt 20t so i dont see the problem.

That thing is a 20 ton trailer? Wow, looks less than that...160 looks over size for it.

Dirt Digger2
09-07-2008, 06:02 PM
Thats a 20 ton tag, the machine as a 160 isnt 20t so i dont see the problem.

that machine weighs about 37,000 with track, bucket, and fuel...add another 1000ish for the thumb and you are looking at atleast 38,000 alone for the machine...add on top of that anywhere from 8000-10000 pounds for the trailer itself and you are trying to put 15 pounds of sh*t in a a 1 pound bag by putting 48,000 pounds on a 40,000 trailer

what suprises me is that trailer looks to be from right here in PA...and i know the PADOT would eat them up

Scag48
09-07-2008, 06:26 PM
Most 20 ton tags, if not all, are dubbed 20 ton by what they can haul. Their GVWR is actually somewhere around 50K, but the manufacturer subtracts the weight of the trailer and tags the trailer for what you can put on it. Trailmax, Trailking, Eager Beaver, just about every trailer MFG. in this category are that way. So, when you say 20 ton tag, you can put close to 40,000 on it. Most are right around 38,000 for their legal rated load, depending on MFG. However, the trailer in the picture coopers posted doesn't look to be a 20 ton trailer, just look at the ramps. So yes, you could actually put a 150 on a 20 ton trailer and haul it legally, it's done all the time around here. Deere's 160DLC is 39,9XX pound, what a heavy pile. Seems to me, back in the day, a 160 was right around 36-37K. I know, still the same weight class, but it seems they're getting heavier. Deere 200LC's are 44,000 pounds, new 200DLC's are 49,000 pounds. Not sure why equipment is getting heavier.

ksss
09-07-2008, 06:43 PM
Towmaster trailers are rated by what they can actually carry not what they can carry minus the weight of the trailer.

Gravel Rat
09-07-2008, 07:03 PM
Yes that tag is maxed out it is probably overloaded. That really isn't a 20 ton tag because it has the horrible little 17.5 wheels and the undersized brakes.

A 20 ton tag has low pro 22.5 tires and the fullsize brakes. Contractors here have gotten rid of tag trailers that run 17.5 tires they blow too easy. Because the tires are thick to carry the weight the heat build up in the tires cause nothing but problems.

punt66
09-07-2008, 07:11 PM
that machine weighs about 37,000 with track, bucket, and fuel...add another 1000ish for the thumb and you are looking at atleast 38,000 alone for the machine...add on top of that anywhere from 8000-10000 pounds for the trailer itself and you are trying to put 15 pounds of sh*t in a a 1 pound bag by putting 48,000 pounds on a 40,000 trailer

what suprises me is that trailer looks to be from right here in PA...and i know the PADOT would eat them up


Tag trailers are rated by load. So a 20 ton trailer is rated for a 20 ton load. Its not rated as a GVWR. Now local or state laws may have their their own rules. But here in CT that is a legal combination based on the 38,000lb load. That size machine isnt an evey day move. So i dont believe the trailer is over worked from an occasional LEGAL move. I had a 20T and a 15T trailer i used behind both my triaxles and single axles and i made occasional short moves with the tri axle, 20T tag, and Daewoo 210. Out of town moves i hired a lowbed. The 20T hauled my hitachi ex120 on a daily basis. That is a 20T trailer.

SuperDuty335
11-13-2008, 10:30 PM
Generally speaking what are the insurance costs of a tandem and/or a tri-axle?

By the way, that Auto-car isn't near as sexy as an old Peterbilt...

mastercraft
11-13-2008, 11:21 PM
Alot of variables as far as insurance cost, such as age, location, points on your license, to name a few. I pay about $60 a month for liability on my tandem dump.