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Buddy Buds
10-08-2008, 01:06 PM
Lady wants leaves mulched to build up her soil. When I do dust flies all over the neighbors drive, porch,window sills, camper and boat. I normally do this lawn while he's at work, but yesterday he got home before I finished. I apologized and told him I would blow when I finished. When I went around front to put my push mower back on the trailer he was blowing. I went over to apoligize again. He threw his back pack across the drive and turned around and went into his carport pulling his shirt off. What else could I do?:confused:

corey4671
10-08-2008, 01:09 PM
ummm...get as far away from this nut as possible before he explodes?:confused:

tamadrummer
10-08-2008, 01:25 PM
Maybe leave some xanax on his porch.

If he doesn't get it, oh well. The wond blows and you don't control it. If he gets too frisky, call the police.

At this point I would not step one foot on his property since he is likly to attack you if you are on his property.

Do what your client asks you to do and forget this fruity idiot!

landscaper22
10-08-2008, 01:30 PM
I hate when I unintentionally make neighbors upset. When working in dry conditions and the wind is blowing, there is not much you can do. Just explain to your customer that the neighbor is pissed and tell them what happened. Then they won't be shocked when the neighbor comes over a exaggerates the story and tries to make you look bad.

Charles
10-08-2008, 01:47 PM
Go to your customer and tell her what happened. This is between her and the neighbor. She may want you to stop mulching IF she wants to keep good relations with her neighbor. The houses must be really close to each other. I often see a cloud of dust blowing near neighbors homes during leaf season, but homes here at not that close together to make a big mess

FDuce
10-08-2008, 03:21 PM
The big question is why is a grown man wearing a back pack?:confused::laugh:

How about watering the lawn real quick before you mulch to try to keep the dust down?

Turf Commando
10-08-2008, 03:25 PM
He threw his back pack across the drive and turned around and went into his carport pulling his shirt off. :

Just be glad it was the back-pack and NOT you....:laugh:

brandtb1
10-08-2008, 05:23 PM
He sounds like a nice guy. I would ask your customer if she wants you to continue mulching and do what she says. If he has a problem, let him deal with her. I park my cars outside and dust gets on them even when noone is cutting near me. He needs to buy a house with a garage to keep his boat clean. I would also try to schedule that yard mid day when he is at work.

Richard Martin
10-08-2008, 05:47 PM
I used to have a neighbor just like this guy. He was fanatical about keeping everything clean. He even went so far as to sanitize the entire inside of his house every 6 months. And when I say the entire inside I mean the entire inside. Floors, walls and ceilings.

I used to come out in the morning and he would have gone to my truck and wrote "Please Clean Me" in the dust on the wheels. Really kinda freaky about it.

After a couple of years of this type of nonsense I decided I'd had enough. I was inside his house one day and he was telling me that my truck needed to be cleaned again. I looked at him and said that just as soon as he cleans the inside of his house I'd clean my truck. He looked at me like I had a third eye. I then took my finger and ran it over the top of the door trim leading into a hallway bath. It came down with a ton of dust on it and I showed it to him. I never heard another word again about cleaning anything.

IHusky
10-08-2008, 05:59 PM
That guy is a total jerk, he should be happy that your client is having the lawn cut. I hope he gets a neighbor one day that doesn't give a sh_t about the lawn and see how he likes an overgrown lawn full of weeds next door rather than some dust......

topsites
10-08-2008, 06:35 PM
What a load of crap, if I were in his shoes I would be PISSED too.
The apology doesn't really help, if anything that would fire me up worse.

That's just like these jerks who replaced my roof, I told them the turf was too
wet to drive a truck onto, I told that man several times it wasn't going to work.
What did they do?
Drove the truck onto the turf so they'd have easier access to the roof, and while it saved them time it also wasn't
the way things should have been done, could have and should have walked them stinking 30 feet with the supplies.
Because they got stuck getting out.
So they left deep, dual 15-20 foot long ruts getting out, not to mention spraying the whole side of my house with mud.

So let me guess, I shouldn't care because they couldn't help it so it's no big deal?

*&%^ THAT!
A thousand dollars worth of lawn care related maintenance so fresh you could still see the materials in the turf
and these guys are standing around acting like what was my problem!

How about I just take my backpack and accidentally scrape it down the side
of someone's truck, make sure it leaves deep gouges in the paint nobody can
ever wash or wax off again.

How about that?

btw, they fixed it, not bad, but had I not said something...?

KCfireman
10-08-2008, 06:36 PM
Lady wants leaves mulched to build up her soil. When I do dust flies all over the neighbors drive, porch,window sills, camper and boat. I normally do this lawn while he's at work, but yesterday he got home before I finished. I apologized and told him I would blow when I finished. When I went around front to put my push mower back on the trailer he was blowing. I went over to apoligize again. He threw his back pack across the drive and turned around and went into his carport pulling his shirt off. What else could I do?:confused:you have a concealed license right?:gunsfirin:gunsfirin

bigbutch
10-08-2008, 06:39 PM
When ever I grind stumps that are dry and dusty I let the neighbors know that when I am done I will blow there yard clean. I also ask them to move there cars if they might get hit with chips or stones. I had one person refuse to move there car or close the windows. As soon as I started they called the cops. When they came out I told them that I had asked before I started. I wrote it down on the work order and showed the cop. He told me to just finish the job and that the neighbors at always feuding with each other.

Ooomwizard
10-08-2008, 07:15 PM
Could be that it was a temporary symptom and by all means don't take it personal. Many times peeps blow up just because they got something going on in their lives that is bothering them. Maybe his wife was knocked up by another guy. Who knows?

Then again he could just be a permanent jerk. Again, don't take it personal.

SimonCX
10-08-2008, 07:46 PM
I'm with topsites, I'd be pissed if I came home and my truck was crapped up and if I knew who did it, it wouldn't be a good idea to come next to me saying sorry. I had a similar thing but with siding guys, I toke out most of the plants that I could from around the house but told them to watch out with the bigger bushes because they are worth alot of $$. The next day I come home and they have materials liening on $300 spirals almost pushing them over. I can't stand idiots and in the end made him deduct everything they screwed up, sorry doesn't cut it. If your were in his shoes and came home you would be pissed to see your things crapped up in dust.

puppypaws
10-08-2008, 08:42 PM
Lady wants leaves mulched to build up her soil. When I do dust flies all over the neighbors drive, porch,window sills, camper and boat. I normally do this lawn while he's at work, but yesterday he got home before I finished. I apologized and told him I would blow when I finished. When I went around front to put my push mower back on the trailer he was blowing. I went over to apoligize again. He threw his back pack across the drive and turned around and went into his carport pulling his shirt off. What else could I do?:confused:

Only mulch that lawn when the dew is heavy early in the morning or after a rain. I don't want to burst anyone's bubble but you cannot legally put anything on the adjoining property, no....not even dust.

4 seasons lawn&land
10-08-2008, 09:15 PM
guess he should have bought a more private house & more land...

Runner
10-08-2008, 09:17 PM
Here, that is not the case. If dust blows, it is an unavoidable act. As long as it is not being pushed over the property by force (not drifting by wind). If you are using direct force, such as pushing stuff directly up over thje curb with a blower, it is a different story...but drift that is carried by wind is like an act of nature (not exactly). The same thing when any construction is done. If a contractor is regrading a property, or digging a ditch, and dust blows over, it is unavoidable.

chesterlawn
10-08-2008, 09:36 PM
So if I'm spray painting my fence and the paint drifts over and covers my neighbors car, it's ok. Wake up.

TMlawncare
10-08-2008, 09:53 PM
So if I'm spray painting my fence and the paint drifts over and covers my neighbors car, it's ok. Wake up.



Most of us on here are awake. Paint is not a natural part of the ground. Paint does not just blow in the wind but dirt, leaves, pine needles do. They are a natural part of the landscape. Paint isn't. Even with a bagger attached the dust is unavoidable. As long as the LCO isn't intentionally blowing leaves, dust or debris onto the neighbors property, there isn't an ordinance anywhere that restricts common maintainace. Do what I do, be aware of the neighbors concerns, but don't do anything that threatens the profitability of the job. He's a PITA neighbor not the client or even a potential one.

puppypaws
10-08-2008, 10:38 PM
Most of us on here are awake. Paint is not a natural part of the ground. Paint does not just blow in the wind but dirt, leaves, pine needles do. They are a natural part of the landscape. Paint isn't. Even with a bagger attached the dust is unavoidable. As long as the LCO isn't intentionally blowing leaves, dust or debris onto the neighbors property, there isn't an ordinance anywhere that restricts common maintainace. Do what I do, be aware of the neighbors concerns, but don't do anything that threatens the profitability of the job. He's a PITA neighbor not the client or even a potential one.

I hate to burst your bubble my friend but if I lived in a subdivision, came home one afternoon and you had a dust storm boiling up on the lawn next to me.

Now, read this very closely, the wind could actually be moving the dust 180° away from my house, not effecting my property in any way shape or form. I make a couple of pictures showing you stirring up all the dust. I then say to myself, this would be a good time for my house to be professionally washed. I call a friend in this type business, he comes over and totally washes and cleans everything on my property. This could cost $500.00 normally but I tell him to charge $800.00 and make the bill read, "Pressure washed house covered by dust from work performed by lawn maintenance contractor on adjoining property".

I send you this bill and of course you tell me I'm crazy. I then take you into small claims court, show the judge or magistrate the bill and he or she looks at the wording. I then hand the pictures to them showing you with all the dust flying everywhere.

Now who do you think is going to pay for my house being washed you or me?
Not only are you going to pay for my house being washed, I am going to give my friend a $100.00 tip and put $200.00 in my pocket.

By law you cannot cause any type damage to anyone else's property around the property you are contracted to maintain. You are legally responsible for this damage, not that dust would normally cause damage, it can legally be used as such if you run into the wrong person. This is why people carry insurance, you would be surprised how certain people can and will work a situation.

lawnwizards
10-08-2008, 10:57 PM
I hate to burst your bubble my friend but if I lived in a subdivision, came home one afternoon and you had a dust storm boiling up on the lawn next to me.

Now, read this very closely, the wind could actually be moving the dust 180° away from my house, not effecting my property in any way shape or form. I make a couple of pictures showing you stirring up all the dust. I then say to myself, this would be a good time for my house to be professionally washed. I call a friend in this type business, he comes over and totally washes and cleans everything on my property. This could cost $500.00 normally but I tell him to charge $800.00 and make the bill read, "Pressure washed house covered by dust from work performed by lawn maintenance contractor on adjoining property".

I send you this bill and of course you tell me I'm crazy. I then take you into small claims court, show the judge or magistrate the bill and he or she looks at the wording. I then hand the pictures to them showing you with all the dust flying everywhere.

Now who do you think is going to pay for my house being washed you or me?
Not only are you going to pay for my house being washed, I am going to give my friend a $100.00 tip and put $200.00 in my pocket.

By law you cannot cause any type damage to anyone else's property around the property you are contracted to maintain. You are legally responsible for this damage, not that dust would normally cause damage, it can legally be used as such if you run into the wrong person. This is why people carry insurance, you would be surprised how certain people can and will work a situation.

no judge in his right mind would rule in favor of someone getting dust on their house. you've been watching too many fictional movies and its "dusted" up your mind. :laugh:

LushGreenLawn
10-08-2008, 11:03 PM
no judge in his right mind would rule in favor of someone getting dust on their house. you've been watching too many fictional movies and its "dusted" up your mind. :laugh:

Not to mention the fact that he's admitting on a public forum that he would commit fraud. What a low life.

pinto n mwr
10-08-2008, 11:13 PM
what are you guys talking about? it is what it is. you get something dusty and someone complains it is your problem not the person who just got blasted. suck it up and make things right. I once had to give out 100 free car washes to an office complex for dusting cars during fall clean up. do you guys pay for broken windows when a rock goes thru a window?

lawnwizards
10-09-2008, 10:03 AM
what are you guys talking about? it is what it is. you get something dusty and someone complains it is your problem not the person who just got blasted. suck it up and make things right. I once had to give out 100 free car washes to an office complex for dusting cars during fall clean up. do you guys pay for broken windows when a rock goes thru a window?

who twisted your arm and made you give out the car washes? if youre driving in the rain and you hit a puddle and get a car dirty, do you give them a free car wash? some things are unavoidable. it would be different if he was intentionally spraying grass all over the guys stuff.

topsites
10-09-2008, 10:21 AM
who twisted your arm and made you give out the car washes? if youre driving in the rain and you hit a puddle and get a car dirty, do you give them a free car wash? some things are unavoidable. it would be different if he was intentionally spraying grass all over the guys stuff.

What's the difference here, intention or the lack thereof makes it all right?
I thought long and hard about this problem, not this one here but the problem of a trespass, that's what this is about, and the intent.
And granted it doesn't seem as bad if they didn't mean to do it, but it's still done,
and that is why running a red light is still against the law regardless of intent.

Point blank, whether or not you meant to do it, if you run a red light...
And I ain't talking about a dark yellow, I'm talking deep red, RED red.
And a police officer sees you, whether you meant to do it or not, boy what a ticket, right?

So like I said, just let me pull up aside your rig and scrape my trailer fender all
alongside your truck and leave deep scratches and see how you feel.
Then I stop halfway through, get out, walk over, tell you I am sorry...
Return to my truck, get back in, and finish making the scratch.
No, I meant to say finish parking in my spot, the scratch couldn't be helped, see?
Sure I did it on purpose, the other guy didn't mean to, but I can act like I didn't too.
Because it's all the same thing, awareness of the situation at hand.

Or how about I just take a crap on your front porch, ooops, hey man look I'm sorry but I really had to go :p

You know, sooner or later it pisses you off, all I'm saying.

JB1
10-09-2008, 10:33 AM
Have you all not heard of "fugitive Dust" you can get a ticket for this and can be expensive.

Buddy Buds
10-09-2008, 01:07 PM
The only thing I can think to do is cut it with my 21" and use the grass catcher. My Scag does pick up a lot of dust, but so does my 21" when I do the backyard without the catcher. When I do this yard in the mornings I always go over next door and blow off everything I can. Do I cancel this customer or what. Even in the summer when cutting nothing but grass it raises dust.

puppypaws
10-09-2008, 01:25 PM
Not to mention the fact that he's admitting on a public forum that he would commit fraud. What a low life.

no judge in his right mind would rule in favor of someone getting dust on their house. you've been watching too many fictional movies and its "dusted" up your mind. :laugh:

I can see you are both extremely ignorant of property law.

When you cause any change to another persons property you are legally responsible for damages......if it can be proven, and if is a very big word. A picture or witness goes a very long way in proving who is right and who is wrong. One persons word against another persons is entirely a guess in a judgement from a court of law. Most of the time in statement against statement judgement it goes to the best liar.

I personally am going to do the right thing and treat the property owner exactly the way I would like to be treated if someone caused damage to my property.

LushGreenLawn
10-09-2008, 01:37 PM
I can see you are both extremely ignorant of property law.

When you cause any change to another persons property you are legally responsible for damages......if it can be proven, and if is a very big word. A picture or witness goes a very long way in proving who is right and who is wrong. One persons word against another persons is entirely a guess in a judgement from a court of law. Most of the time in statement against statement judgement it goes to the best liar.

I personally am going to do the right thing and treat the property owner exactly the way I would like to be treated if someone caused damage to my property.

Your going to do the right thing, by tacking on $200 to a bill for powerwashing, and taking someone to court when there is no dust on your property because the wind was blowing the other way? Thats the right thing!? Thats fraud in every sense of the word! This is the kind of thing that people who are sitting at home on welfare dream up!

puppypaws
10-09-2008, 02:04 PM
Your going to do the right thing, by tacking on $200 to a bill for powerwashing, and taking someone to court when there is no dust on your property because the wind was blowing the other way? Thats the right thing!? Thats fraud in every sense of the word! This is the kind of thing that people who are sitting at home on welfare dream up!

There is a difference in scenarios and actual happenings, but I think you are intelligent enought to figure that out. Never put anything past people, not even your own family, sometimes they can be the worst.

bigbutch
10-09-2008, 05:37 PM
There is a difference in scenarios and actual happenings, but I think you are intelligent enought to figure that out. Never put anything past people, not even your own family, sometimes they can be the worst.

I had a family member that was in the building trades. They went broke. They told me that they were going to list my work in there bank ruptcy so it would clear there books. They told me they would make it right later and would I please help them finish the rest of there jobs. Needles to say they never made it right and we don’t speak to them ever.

NC Greenscaper
10-09-2008, 05:57 PM
I think the guy was over stressed and over acting. I probadly would've taken off my own shirt and showed him my chest(LOL), unless he was much bigger. If he was bigger, I would have logged on here (lawnsite) and told everybody that's what I did.

TMlawncare
10-09-2008, 10:53 PM
I can see you are both extremely ignorant of property law.

When you cause any change to another persons property you are legally responsible for damages......if it can be proven, and if is a very big word. A picture or witness goes a very long way in proving who is right and who is wrong. One persons word against another persons is entirely a guess in a judgement from a court of law. Most of the time in statement against statement judgement it goes to the best liar.

I personally am going to do the right thing and treat the property owner exactly the way I would like to be treated if someone caused damage to my property.

Well, you are saying that if a property has leaves on it we can't bag, mulch or side discharge them to maintain the property. Are you for real. The mower when bagging or mulching contains the debris. Dust will escape, if the wind blows it onto the neighbors property it is viewed as an "act of God." The only way you could be held liable is if you were intentionally creating a dust storm and blowing the debris onto the neighbor.
Obviously you must not be full time LCO that deals with these types of people day in and day out. Trust me, there is usually a few a@#holes on every block or neighborhood. You can't let these types of complainers run your business.

puppypaws
10-09-2008, 11:34 PM
Well, you are saying that if a property has leaves on it we can't bag, mulch or side discharge them to maintain the property. Are you for real. The mower when bagging or mulching contains the debris. Dust will escape, if the wind blows it onto the neighbors property it is viewed as an "act of God." The only way you could be held liable is if you were intentionally creating a dust storm and blowing the debris onto the neighbor.
Obviously you must not be full time LCO that deals with these types of people day in and day out. Trust me, there is usually a few a@#holes on every block or neighborhood. You can't let these types of complainers run your business.

I am only making a point, the dust storm you have stirred up is not an act of God and you are responsible for what happens if it effects the adjoining property.

There could be children with severe asthma playing on the next door property. Their parents come out and one has a serious asthma attack and has to be rushed to the hosipital. These people can come after you or your insurance company as long as they are able to prove the dust you stirred up caused the attack.

I am only telling you the law is on the property owners side and if you run into the right one they can screw you to the wall.

Runner
10-10-2008, 12:11 AM
Not if it is unavoidable. This would have to be proven as negligent, and in most operations, that just isn't happening. as long as the operation was taling reasonable care, and performing under normal operational practices, they are clear. Otherwise, every store and/or house or building that is being built - the contractor(s) could be made to wash the neighbors car every day. It certainly has to exceed what is known as a "threshold of tolerance" (legal term). Now, an example of this would be something like a permanent or long term project that would cause compensable damage...such as cleaning fees and/or permanent damage.

puppypaws
10-10-2008, 12:40 AM
Not if it is unavoidable. This would have to be proven as negligent, and in most operations, that just isn't happening. as long as the operation was taling reasonable care, and performing under normal operational practices, they are clear. Otherwise, every store and/or house or building that is being built - the contractor(s) could be made to wash the neighbors car every day.

Yes, they could if it was pursued.

Lets see if you are able to understand this. I feel assured you know what a silt fence is. They are used to keep dirt from washing off the property being constructed onto the adjoining property. Yes, this can sometimes be easier to see and appears as more devastation to the normal eye, but in a court of law is no different than covering up the adjoining property with dust that move by air instead of water. You are responsible legally for either one.

This is probably a little easier for people to understand because most everyone has seen silt fences around construction sites to hold the dirt belonging to that particular property inside the property boundaries.

Now, what would you think would be the difference, you are required by law to keep anything from leaving your property and affecting the adjoining property in any way shape or form. Why do you think it is required by law to keep water on a grading site to hold dust down, because they realize this is their responsibility under law and they could be required to pay for any problems dust may cause.

It has nothing to do with negligence, it is a matter of whether you are defacing the adjoining property or not. If so it is your legal and financial responsibility to make that property exactly the way it was before you caused the problem.

A court of law will uphold this every time it is put before them. They will even put themselves in the plaintiffs position and decide they would want their property cleaned up in the same situation.

"Threshhold of Tolerance" Definition:

Quality: Maximum allowable departure from a standard or specification that a part, process, or product can have and beyond which it may suffer irreparable harm.

There is no standards set for this type situation.

Runner
10-10-2008, 01:09 AM
Key word: irreparable harm. Getting back to a bit of dust blowing over from some leaves (not being directly projected toward the other property). the silt fence is a great example of a control measure, and IS required by the cast majority of municipality codes for both public and private projects that will be ongoing for a set amount of time. These are when measures are needed for any sort of environmental nuisances (noise, dust, etc.).

S L C
10-10-2008, 02:07 AM
I hate to burst your bubble my friend but if I lived in a subdivision, came home one afternoon and you had a dust storm boiling up on the lawn next to me.

Now, read this very closely, the wind could actually be moving the dust 180° away from my house, not effecting my property in any way shape or form. I make a couple of pictures showing you stirring up all the dust. I then say to myself, this would be a good time for my house to be professionally washed. I call a friend in this type business, he comes over and totally washes and cleans everything on my property. This could cost $500.00 normally but I tell him to charge $800.00 and make the bill read, "Pressure washed house covered by dust from work performed by lawn maintenance contractor on adjoining property".

I send you this bill and of course you tell me I'm crazy. I then take you into small claims court, show the judge or magistrate the bill and he or she looks at the wording. I then hand the pictures to them showing you with all the dust flying everywhere.

Now who do you think is going to pay for my house being washed you or me?
Not only are you going to pay for my house being washed, I am going to give my friend a $100.00 tip and put $200.00 in my pocket.

By law you cannot cause any type damage to anyone else's property around the property you are contracted to maintain. You are legally responsible for this damage, not that dust would normally cause damage, it can legally be used as such if you run into the wrong person. This is why people carry insurance, you would be surprised how certain people can and will work a situation.

WOW!, After a post like that, I would NEVER hire YOU to do any work for me!!! SHAME ON YOU and your BIZZNESS POLICIES ! --->>> Shame on your mother!!!!:drinkup:

S L C
10-10-2008, 02:10 AM
who twisted your arm and made you give out the car washes? if youre driving in the rain and you hit a puddle and get a car dirty, do you give them a free car wash? some things are unavoidable. it would be different if he was intentionally spraying grass all over the guys stuff.

EXACTLY!!! 'PINTO' must me mexican and d u mb a zz!!:cry:

Runner
10-10-2008, 02:51 AM
That may have been just a LITTLE on the racist end of a remark.:nono:

LushGreenLawn
10-10-2008, 07:27 AM
WOW!, After a post like that, I would NEVER hire YOU to do any work for me!!! SHAME ON YOU and your BIZZNESS POLICIES ! --->>> Shame on your mother!!!!:drinkup:

What is the Judge going to say when the accused party brings up the fact that dust does not require powerwashing to remove, but a simple garden hose will suffice anyway? I bet he would throw it out.

granddad
10-10-2008, 07:46 AM
Maybe his wife was knocked up by another guy.

Maybe he though it was you.:rolleyes: Just kidding of course.

ALC-GregH
10-10-2008, 10:07 AM
I used to have a neighbor just like this guy. He was fanatical about keeping everything clean. He even went so far as to sanitize the entire inside of his house every 6 months. And when I say the entire inside I mean the entire inside. Floors, walls and ceilings.

I used to come out in the morning and he would have gone to my truck and wrote "Please Clean Me" in the dust on the wheels. Really kinda freaky about it.

After a couple of years of this type of nonsense I decided I'd had enough. I was inside his house one day and he was telling me that my truck needed to be cleaned again. I looked at him and said that just as soon as he cleans the inside of his house I'd clean my truck. He looked at me like I had a third eye. I then took my finger and ran it over the top of the door trim leading into a hallway bath. It came down with a ton of dust on it and I showed it to him. I never heard another word again about cleaning anything.

I didn't have a chance to finish reading all the posts in this thread and I'm going to stop at this one. I'm kind of business today and need to get going.

Anyway, Richard, I love your story. It's bitter sweet. :D I would have loved to see the look on his face when you stuck your finger out with all the dirt on it. LOL Priceless I tell ya. :laugh:

puppypaws
10-10-2008, 10:37 AM
What is the Judge going to say when the accused party brings up the fact that dust does not require powerwashing to remove, but a simple garden hose will suffice anyway? I bet he would throw it out.

The judge could care less how you clean the property as long as it is put back to the exact state it was before you caused the problem.

I don't know if you people realize this but anyone can sue anyone for anything whether it happened or not. You can be sued by anyone at anytime for anything whether you are even in the same state as the plaintiff or not.

Then you are classified as the "defendant" and must go through the legal process of clearing your name. This can be done to anyone at anytime.

You can maintain a property and one day you receive a letter from the adjoining property owners attorney stating you are being sued for damages from a trumped up charge made up totally by his client. You will defend yourself one way or the other to clear your name, or you will lose the case knowing it is all fictitious.

You say to yourself, I had nothing to do with this and the property owner and his attorney are crazy. You then forget about it, the next place you will find yourself is in front of a judge trying to prove the property owner a liar.

This is not fair or morally correct but it happens everyday and people are dragged into a fight that cost them money for no reason of their own.

The property owner may have a gash in the side of a vehicle he wants repaired knowing all the time where this happened. You are mowing the property next door, and he sees you. That night he calls and says your mower threw a rock and damaged the side of my vehicle. You were mulching and knew there was no rock thrown toward his vehicle. You will have to prove it did not happen or pay for the repair.

I am telling you things that can happen, not that they ever will but people can take you to court for anything. I have spent time trying to collect money legally owed to me from deadbeat people, some of these people I actually loaned money to get them out of a jam, and they took advantage of me. I am familiar with the games that can be played by crooked people.

lawnwizards
10-10-2008, 01:04 PM
The judge could care less how you clean the property as long as it is put back to the exact state it was before you caused the problem.

I don't know if you people realize this but anyone can sue anyone for anything whether it happened or not. You can be sued by anyone at anytime for anything whether you are even in the same state as the plaintiff or not.

Then you are classified as the "defendant" and must go through the legal process of clearing your name. This can be done to anyone at anytime.

You can maintain a property and one day you receive a letter from the adjoining property owners attorney stating you are being sued for damages from a trumped up charge made up totally by his client. You will defend yourself one way or the other to clear your name, or you will lose the case knowing it is all fictitious.

You say to yourself, I had nothing to do with this and the property owner and his attorney are crazy. You then forget about it, the next place you will find yourself is in front of a judge trying to prove the property owner a liar.

This is not fair or morally correct but it happens everyday and people are dragged into a fight that cost them money for no reason of their own.

The property owner may have a gash in the side of a vehicle he wants repaired knowing all the time where this happened. You are mowing the property next door, and he sees you. That night he calls and says your mower threw a rock and damaged the side of my vehicle. You were mulching and knew there was no rock thrown toward his vehicle. You will have to prove it did not happen or pay for the repair.

I am telling you things that can happen, not that they ever will but people can take you to court for anything. I have spent time trying to collect money legally owed to me from deadbeat people, some of these people I actually loaned money to get them out of a jam, and they took advantage of me. I am familiar with the games that can be played by crooked people.

burden of proof is on the plaintiff. unless he has pictures or a video of the rock flying into his car, he wont have a case.

LushGreenLawn
10-10-2008, 08:16 PM
burden of proof is on the plaintiff. unless he has pictures or a video of the rock flying into his car, he wont have a case.

Besides the fact that I would bring in pictures of my mower with mulch kit installed, all dirty like its been there for years.

Also, in court, if you are being sued for cost of powerwashing, then yes, the powerwashing would have to be necessary. This is common sense.

I understand that today people are sue-happy, but its pretty easy to defend yourself in court. The burden of proof is, like lawnwizards said, is on the plaintiff.

puppypaws
10-10-2008, 09:43 PM
burden of proof is on the plaintiff. unless he has pictures or a video of the rock flying into his car, he wont have a case.

That is exactly what I am talking about, the plaintiff does not have to do anything but present a bogus case, you will be required to defend. No one says the plaintiff is necessarily going to win the case but it will sure cause you a number of headaches trying to defend against his lies. If the plaintiff is a good con artist he can also win the case against you with lies, and don't believe for one second this cannot happen.

I have been there and done that and if you believe what has always been said by our judicial system (as I always have) you are innocent until proven guilty, I can promise you it is not this way. You can count yourself guilty until you prove yourself innocent. I have been involved in this type situation, so you can believe I am talking from experience, not opinion.



I understand that today people are sue-happy, but its pretty easy to defend yourself in court. The burden of proof is, like lawnwizards said, is on the plaintiff.

If you think it is easy to defend yourself in court; you have a lot to learn, and hopefully you will never need to.

44DCNF
10-11-2008, 12:28 PM
Throttle down, run with a full catcher attached to the mower, discharge toward the center of the lot, lower your deck a little, install a blade with a smaller sail-less lift, or as an alternative try to sell your customer on adding organic material in the way of compost that is already broken down and ready to feed the grass.

bakerc8
10-11-2008, 02:19 PM
tell him to **** off and tell your client that he is a wack job and he should stay away from him

mgray10
10-11-2008, 02:23 PM
If you think it is easy to defend yourself in court; you have a lot to learn, and hopefully you will never need to.


Pup,

I think that you are forgetting that small claims court is subject to state law and not federal. In assuming that your state laws apply to other forum members in other states, you are making hasty generalizations. Furthermore, judges themselves can stand in stark contrast from others, even in the same locale.

Here is Virginia, I feel simple dust would be dismissed. However, if someone were to sling mud or dirt in meaningful quantity, I think I judge could rule in favor of the plaintiff on the grounds of negligence.

harrislawncare1
10-11-2008, 02:56 PM
sounds like you did all a person could ask for, I have to blow of neighbors cars, drives,etc. tell him to get over it

TMlawncare
10-11-2008, 03:20 PM
tell him to **** off and tell your client that he is a wack job and he should stay away from him



I love this one. This one post just summed it up. Seriously, you can't make big changes to satisfy someone who is not even a customer. Changing to a low lift blade, scalping the lawn, powering down all to satisfy the neighbor. Screw him, acknowledge his concerns but go forth with business as it should be done. We have a few of these types will deal with weekly. To address the problem, I remind the employees to never talk back to him. If he has a problem call the # on the truck. One property has a very small yard that is next to a crazy lady. I remind the employees to bag or mulch the front yard on each visit. Problem solved. On another property, we have an idiot neighbor who will literally walk over to the property line and make sure we don't blow anything on his property. I remind the employees the blow the clippings for the last three passes back into our out clients property just to avoid any confusion he may have. One other neighbor we have issues with is a total wack job and so is his wife. We mow an empty lot which is next to his property. One of our employees when turning went maybe six inches into his lawn. The wife came out screaming and cursing just totally unhinged. She told my employees that they better be glad her husband wasn't home because he wouldn't be so understanding. After hearing the whole story from the employees and seeing her slam the door as she went back in the house, I told them I would mow that side after that. The next few weeks we went to the lot the crazy neighbor mowed over on our lot about 10 feet to keep us off his property. So we just mowed to where he stopped. When we were about half way done we saw the husband cussing and fighting with his truck out in the street. He then slammed the door and punched his mirror then threw it down the street. The police came and we left. We concluded the man has an anger problem. When he failed to mow before we got there I mowed the area and he came out and went ballistic. I told him I was under contract to mow the entire lot each week. He said I went onto his property. I said I didn't but you have been mowing part of mine. It went on for a while and I thought I was going to become the next object tossed down the street. I looked back at the truck and my two employees were just standing as the trailer laughing there azzes off. I finally told the guy to basically F off. Were doing the property according to our contract, we will not step a foot on your property so go back inside and leave me the hell alone. One month later he comes out of his house when I am mowing near the property line and says "can you tell me what I can use to take care of this type of weed (creeping charlie)?"
We have not had a problem with either of them since.

puppypaws
10-11-2008, 03:54 PM
Pup,

I think that you are forgetting that small claims court is subject to state law and not federal. In assuming that your state laws apply to other forum members in other states, you are making hasty generalizations. Furthermore, judges themselves can stand in stark contrast from others, even in the same locale.

Here is Virginia, I feel simple dust would be dismissed. However, if someone were to sling mud or dirt in meaningful quantity, I think I judge could rule in favor of the plaintiff on the grounds of negligence.

I am knowledgeable of state and federal law, these minor disputes always fall under state law. You would be rather ignorant to believe a federal court would accept responsibility over any case this minor in which they never have; nor never will have jurisdiction. The problem is the judge will put him or herself in the plaintiffs position and decide if it were their house they would also want it professionally cleaned if you caused it to be covered in dust, you lose!

You are 100% correct when you say it is within a judges discretion to rule as he likes. This is the reason for appellate courts if you consider the decision to be unjust. These are not hasty generalizations, these happen to be known facts, as you will read below.

From legal dictionary:

Property Damage: n. injury to real or personal property through another's negligence, willful destruction, or by some act of nature. In lawsuits for damages caused by negligence or a willful act, property damage is distinguished from personal injury. Property damage may include harm to an automobile, a fence, a tree, a home, or any other possession. The amount of recovery for property damage may be established by evidence of replacement value, cost of repairs, loss of use until repaired or replaced.

mgray10
10-11-2008, 05:39 PM
I am knowledgeable of state and federal law, these minor disputes always fall under state law. You would be rather ignorant to believe a federal court would accept responsibility over any case this minor in which they never have; nor never will have jurisdiction. The problem is the judge will put him or herself in the plaintiffs position and decide if it were their house they would also want it professionally cleaned if you caused it to be covered in dust, you lose!

You are 100% correct when you say it is within a judges discretion to rule as he likes. This is the reason for appellate courts if you consider the decision to be unjust. These are not hasty generalizations, these happen to be known facts, as you will read below.

From legal dictionary:

Property Damage: n. injury to real or personal property through another's negligence, willful destruction, or by some act of nature. In lawsuits for damages caused by negligence or a willful act, property damage is distinguished from personal injury. Property damage may include harm to an automobile, a fence, a tree, a home, or any other possession. The amount of recovery for property damage may be established by evidence of replacement value, cost of repairs, loss of use until repaired or replaced.


Whoa! Read my post, again. Perhaps you will understand that I made point of these cases being under state jurisdiction because you did and continue to be under the information that your state's laws are the same as others' in this forum.

I think you should also look up the use of semicolons and commas instead of worrying about what definitions you think I need to preview. :dancing:

puppypaws
10-11-2008, 07:53 PM
Whoa! Read my post, again. Perhaps you will understand that I made point of these cases being under state jurisdiction because you did and continue to be under the information that your state's laws are the same as others' in this forum.

I think you should also look up the use of semicolons and commas instead of worrying about what definitions you think I need to preview. :dancing:

I doubt seriously any states laws will let you damage another persons property and not be held responsible. I wouldn't think Virginia could be that far behind North Carolina, but I guess there is always that possibility.

I heard rumor that the governor's mansion burned down in Virginia, it was said it burned all the way to the wheels. The library was sitting beside the mansion, and it burned as well. It was said, all six books burned and five had not been colored in before they burned. I though it could possibly have been stretched a little out of reality, but not to far.

I am not good at all in grammar or punctuation and will admit it. These people look after my writing "WhiteSmoke\WSEnrichment.exe", I guess if you know more than professionals maybe I could hire you as a consultant.

mgray10
10-11-2008, 08:27 PM
I doubt seriously any states laws will let you damage another persons property and not be held responsible. I wouldn't think Virginia could be that far behind North Carolina, but I guess there is always that possibility.

I heard rumor that the governor's mansion burned down in Virginia, it was said it burned all the way to the wheels. The library was sitting beside the mansion, and it burned as well. It was said, all six books burned and five had not been colored in before they burned. I though it could possibly have been stretched a little out of reality, but not to far.

I am not good at all in grammar or punctuation and will admit it. These people look after my writing "WhiteSmoke\WSEnrichment.exe", I guess if you know more than professionals maybe I could hire you as a consultant.

lol! You find that you cannot continue a logical argument so you resort to ad hominem argument, claiming that I am some simpleton! That's ironic.

As far as property damage, dusting someones house is not damage nor is it even causal of damage. :hammerhead:

puppypaws
10-11-2008, 09:01 PM
lol! You find that you cannot continue a logical argument so you resort to ad hominem argument, claiming that I am some simpleton! That's ironic.

As far as property damage, dusting someones house is not damage nor is it even causal of damage. :hammerhead:

There is really no reason for you to look up words trying to impress people with your vocabulary. It is a great deal easier to get your point across using language people understand.

Let's put the shoe on the other foot, and please be honest. If you came home one afternoon and someone was working on the property adjoining yours. We are taking for granted you do own property so you can relate.
Your house, vehicles, all concrete and possibly your swimming pool is covered in dust, could be very visible red dust.

You are going to tell me and everyone else reading this you are going inside and not say anything to the person causing this problem. Now, if you do say it will not be brought to their attention, you either don't or have never owned nice property that is well kept, or you are from India.

mississippiturf
10-11-2008, 11:34 PM
This thread has me in stitches laughing!!! People have opinions. Judges have opinions. LCO's have opinions. Those opinions will often differ. No amount of sarcasm, belittling, name-calling, huge words unfamiliar to most, or arguing will convince both sides to come to an agreement. We just sometimes need to agree to disagree and move on.

LushGreenLawn
10-12-2008, 12:02 AM
There is really no reason for you to look up words trying to impress people with your vocabulary. It is a great deal easier to get your point across using language people understand.

Let's put the shoe on the other foot, and please be honest. If you came home one afternoon and someone was working on the property adjoining yours. We are taking for granted you do own property so you can relate.
Your house, vehicles, all concrete and possibly your swimming pool is covered in dust, could be very visible red dust.

You are going to tell me and everyone else reading this you are going inside and not say anything to the person causing this problem. Now, if you do say it will not be brought to their attention, you either don't or have never owned nice property that is well kept, or you are from India.


Funny you ask, because the farmer that lives down the street from me decided to turn his farm field, (Which my house sits on the edge of) into a housing development. For an entire summer my property was just as you described. Did it annoy me? YES!

Did I ask him to stop his multimillion dollar building project? NO! Why? Because he simply cannot control the dust. If there was some magic blanket on the maeket that he could have used, I would have asked him to use it, but the situation was unavoidable.

BTW, I live in a farming community, and farms sometimes produce alot of dust. Do you think all the neighbors go around sueing the farmer?

puppypaws
10-12-2008, 02:02 AM
Funny you ask, because the farmer that lives down the street from me decided to turn his farm field, (Which my house sits on the edge of) into a housing development. For an entire summer my property was just as you described. Did it annoy me? YES!

Did I ask him to stop his multimillion dollar building project? NO! Why? Because he simply cannot control the dust. If there was some magic blanket on the maeket that he could have used, I would have asked him to use it, but the situation was unavoidable.

BTW, I live in a farming community, and farms sometimes produce alot of dust. Do you think all the neighbors go around sueing the farmer?

I am a farmer and have been over 40 yrs., I spread chicken litter within 75' of my front door and dust travels from all fields I spread, the kind of dust that smells really bad to everyone except me. It has a different smell to me, kind of like new money that just came off the printing press. I always try to spread when the wind is blowing away from dwelling houses, I do this for common courtesy.

I don't know about your state but in NC your friend building the new project would be required by law to keep water trucks spraying water on all dirt being excavated at all times. The state of NC also requires any state maintained road to be kept swept and washed, in other words you do not bring anything from a new construction site onto their roads. If someone calls and reports dust or mud, there will be an expector go out (they random check anyway) and if they see a problem there is a stiff fine levied.

Now, in your situation, if the dust is causing you a problem (in NC) and the grading contractor cannot stop the change to your property from covering everything with a heavy amount (common sense dictates) of dust. The owner of the project tells the grading contractor to stop until they get enough water down to limit the dust or he is liable to you for cleanup and the state inspectors will back you 100%.

This is state law, the same one that requires silt fences to keep the project dirt from moving onto your property.

I know for a fact they do have laws in the state of Virginia. They have one law in particular which should be called "taking legal advantage of people out of state driving through Virginia." The states around Virginia have speed limits set at 70 mph on interstate highways but Virginia has their speed limit set at 65 mph. They know most people will run 8 to 9 mph over the set speed limit, and they will not stop you even in Virginia if you stay under 65. I was coming out of NC and rolled into Virginia running 78 mph when all of a sudden I see blue lights flashing up the road about a mile. I glanced in my rearview mirror and there was a state police in an unmarked car with his blue lights flashing in the grill. I had turned my radar detector off because they will confiscate them in Virginia along with a big fine. I popped the radar detector off and dropped it in the console. While he was writing the ticket another car pulled in behind me with another officer pulling him. I looked at what was going on and thought to myself, people in Virginia must not pay taxes if these cops are having to pull people in this fashion, the state must be broke.

I called an attorney in Bland, Virginia recommended to me by one of my attorneys. I told them to go into court and have the charge changed to improper equipment. I said all they are interested in is the money and the attorney told me I was right. When I told him where they were set up, he said he was very aware of this place because they made a career out of writing tickets from that ambush point. Therefore, I sent them a check for $350.00 and the game was over.

topsites
10-12-2008, 03:27 AM
Funny you ask, because the farmer that lives down the street from me decided to turn his farm field, (Which my house sits on the edge of) into a housing development. For an entire summer my property was just as you described. Did it annoy me? YES!

Did I ask him to stop his multimillion dollar building project? NO! Why? Because he simply cannot control the dust. If there was some magic blanket on the maeket that he could have used, I would have asked him to use it, but the situation was unavoidable.

BTW, I live in a farming community, and farms sometimes produce alot of dust. Do you think all the neighbors go around sueing the farmer?

And I know a fellow who has his 16 acres of farm land right smack in the middle of a residential zone and he catches it ALL the time.
His farm existed long before the neighborhoods come around and it has always been zoned agricultural but now every last plot of land
all around three sides of his development is residential and I'm talking neighborhoods with houses, and yes they can and do complain!

Because there is a BIG difference between agricultural, commercial, industrial and residential zoning areas too,
and even in farm country sooner or later you'll get someone who complains too, just because you didn't...

So we can't stop a factory from polluting out of an Industrial complex because they are allowed to pollute up to a certain amount as per the Industrial zoning and possibly other regulations they fall under, but residential zones are a whole different ballgame and I can about guarantee if the factory's pollution spreads into a residential area someone, sooner or later, is going to raise hell.

And we can call these people jerks, it doesn't matter, there exist tactful ways to handle this.

puppypaws
10-12-2008, 09:26 AM
And I know a fellow who has his 16 acres of farm land right smack in the middle of a residential zone and he catches it ALL the time.
His farm existed long before the neighborhoods come around and it has always been zoned agricultural but now every last plot of land
all around three sides of his development is residential and I'm talking neighborhoods with houses, and yes they can and do complain!

Because there is a BIG difference between agricultural, commercial, industrial and residential zoning areas too,
and even in farm country sooner or later you'll get someone who complains too, just because you didn't...

So we can't stop a factory from polluting out of an Industrial complex because they are allowed to pollute up to a certain amount as per the Industrial zoning and possibly other regulations they fall under, but residential zones are a whole different ballgame and I can about guarantee if the factory's pollution spreads into a residential area someone, sooner or later, is going to raise hell.

And we can call these people jerks, it doesn't matter, there exist tactful ways to handle this.

You are absolutely correct, more and more people are moving into rural areas for the good country life. Once they get there, they are in command and God forbid if they smell or see anything not expected from watching Green Acres.

I have personally told people if they did not like what country life had to offer, I would suggest they move back into the city. This is becoming more and more of an ongoing fight from the farmers standpoint; attempting to keep city dwellers moving into the country satisfied.

People really like the thought of eating but don't care about what it takes to get the food on their table. This is an ongoing battle which will only get tougher as people continue to migrate to the good country life.