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View Full Version : Next Lazer 09 Looks Nice


luckylawnboy
10-23-2008, 05:54 PM
Just got done looking at the 09 Lazer on the web. Looks like a nice mower. Whats with the new blades? Look alot different, but they never really elaborated on them?? Overall it looks really nice. I have the XS 72 and it looks like the XS is not changed. 09 XS or 09 Lazer with a 72? Im not sure which one I will get next year..

jaybird24
10-23-2008, 07:03 PM
Looks like other than the gas tank color and decks Exmark and Toro have finally become the same. I wonder if they have upgraded their spindles to the Toro heavy duty ones yet.

luckylawnboy
10-23-2008, 07:37 PM
Got looking again. Im not sure if that icon is a blade now or not???

Ramairfreak98ss
10-23-2008, 07:50 PM
the new lazer has the integrated pump/wheel motor like the 08 Deeres... least as far as i can see, im not too into the exmark stuff. I saw the guy at GIE that won the 29hp 60" Laser machine though, i got there a minute too late to see em pick the drawing but oh well.

meets1
10-23-2008, 08:23 PM
If I am not correct please tell me - but aren't exmark spindles heavier?? I have all toro and I am going to go all exmark next spring. When I was at the GIE show exmark pointed it out plainly and toro guy admitted that exmark is heavier, and focused on the commercial guy where toro is going to focus is the small commercial guy, large estate owners, and the general public with the box stores.

meets1
10-23-2008, 08:24 PM
I also must ad that toro is solely in the golf course industry - no cross over coming at all from exmark. There competition is primarily jac mowers.

Runner
10-23-2008, 09:56 PM
I see they now have the EFI available with the UltraCut deck.

farmall
10-23-2008, 11:06 PM
those aren't the blades. they have the old ultracut style blades since they are the ultracut deck.

meets1
10-23-2008, 11:08 PM
Just watched there video - pretty cool!

mowerknower
10-23-2008, 11:37 PM
Saw it at expo. Im always a little leary of new mowers but this is the real deal. Just hope there are not to many updates right out of the gate

joshua
10-23-2008, 11:40 PM
looks like the ultra vac system will be dragging on the ground.

mowerknower
10-23-2008, 11:49 PM
No ultra vac available yet.

Runner
10-24-2008, 12:11 AM
man, I don't know...There are just so MANY changes,..and drastic changes at that. they have recreated a whole new mower, besically. I like the older manual type features - where nothing can go wrong, myself. It will be hard to kill the old Lazers. I know guys who have old machines from way back. A friend of mine has six of them from the first and second year they came out. They are all still running out in the field. Who knows how many thousands of hours are on them, but everything is replaceable and rebuildable.

Gruneich Lawn Care, Inc.
10-24-2008, 12:24 AM
They did make alot of changes to a already great mower, its going to be interesting to see how they do out in the field. They also added ALOT to the price of the mowers...

tacoma200
10-24-2008, 01:52 AM
They did make alot of changes to a already great mower, its going to be interesting to see how they do out in the field. They also added ALOT to the price of the mowers...

I hope they did better than John Deere on the makeover. The video looks interesting but I for one will wait a year or two. You never know for sure until they've been in the field a while, right?

TLS
10-24-2008, 08:27 AM
A lot of nice ideas. I'd really miss 14-15 gal fuel capacity.

Is there any pics of the new deck? It should be the MOST talked about feature, yet it's mysteriously missing from the website.

MOHUSTLER
10-24-2008, 09:52 AM
Are the spindol covers plastic? That looks kinda cheap. Il be anxious to see how these hold up in the field.

TLS
10-24-2008, 10:14 AM
A lot of manufacturers have switched to plastic spindle covers. All there for is to protect a person from sticking a body part in there.

The ZTR's I've used have been metal, and of good design. I've seen some poorly designed metal covers that rattle and fall off.

I would want to make sure a quick swipe with the blower tube gets all grass out. To me that is whats important. Too many manufacturers try to seal this area up. You cant. Grass gets in, you need to blow it out daily.

lazer 46
10-24-2008, 10:53 AM
I guess this means the end of the $500 suspension seat. T

greenred
10-24-2008, 12:10 PM
Are the spindol covers plastic? That looks kinda cheap. Il be anxious to see how these hold up in the field.

Yeah that really caught my eye, and not in a good way. Nothing screams "cutting the bottom line" then those cheap looking plastic covers. They make all these possibly ground breaking improvements, then put that crap on it.

The heavy duty metal covers on my exmark's deck work and hold up wonderfully.

My guess is they are going to get destroyed early in the mowers life and never get replaced by the majority of users. So your going to have a lot more guys then now running with out the covers over their belt and spindle assemblies.

But I could be totally wrong.


How are the blades different? I couldnt really find anything specific about the blades.

tacoma200
10-24-2008, 01:49 PM
Well those of us that called Exmark on that statement have some vindication. There was an obvious problem with the Triton in some area's but Exmark looked us in the eye (not literally) and told us it was all fixed and the video's and brochures continued to brag that the Triton deck was one reason to buy the Lazer. At least 75% of us or more on Lawnsite stuck to our guns and continued to stand by the Ultra Cut as the better of the two decks and even Exmark quietly stuck some on lower end Lazers.


Well the new 09 Lazer is going back to a modified Ultracut. (Taking a few things from the Triton). Sure looks like they even did away with the Triton name on the new models. Just shows how something can be obviously wrong and for sales purposes a company will pretend otherwise.

They were peeing down our backs and saying it was raining to put it nicely. No doubt we (Lawnsite members) had a hand in this change through our feedback. I can remember "HUNDREDS" of post complaining against the Triton and a few that loved it. Keep up the good work, we do seem to have an influence being the largest Lawnsite on the web.

Hopefully the new model will work out. I was Leary about the John Deere 800 series with integrated pump/motor but I went along with most against my better judgement and said it would probably be OK. Well I was wrong then and I hope Exmark learned from John Deere on this and that the 09 model works out for them. I won't be one of the first to buy one though. I'm tired of being the guinea pig/white lab rat for new models from any company. Good luck Exmark, we will see in a couple of years if they did well. The video's sure look nice but so did the ones for the 800 series John Deere. Be careful.:usflag:

zeroturner
10-24-2008, 03:09 PM
It appears from watching the video that Exmark is changing to a vertical shaft motor on the Lazers. Can anyone confirm this?

mowersower
10-24-2008, 03:31 PM
Why are some of you posting what you think is wrong with the New Lazers when most of you haven't even seen one in person let alone drive one. Do you really think that after Exmark tested this mower for 2 years and spent well over a million dollars developing it would jepordize their company by putting a crap mower on the market. Yes, John Deere screwed up but i bet it didn't put a dent in the companies bottom line. There are several differences between the John Deere hydros and the Exmarks, and the spindle covers are designed so that you can remove them without any tools and clean out your deck easier and they are not going to fall apart. This mower is the real deal and everybody should recognize that.

davidcalhoun
10-24-2008, 06:13 PM
Mowersower,

Have you ever heard the phrase "Fool me once, shame on me. Fool me twice, shame on them"?

This how some members feel. Remember all the research Exmark did with the Triton deck? Yes, they spent a lot of time and money (R&D, testing, & marketing).

So don't be naive about this subject.

kppurn
10-24-2008, 07:20 PM
Anyone know the MSRP on these new models?

I put off getting a new mower this year and kept running my 2002 Lazer. I just hope this mower doesn't turn out like the Triton deck.

Hopefully I'm not on here next spring complaining about how many problems I'm having with my new mower.:)

meets1
10-24-2008, 07:46 PM
So is the price increase in effect now for this model mower?

mowersower
10-24-2008, 07:57 PM
davidcalhoun,
Sorry that some had a bad experience with the Triton. I for one thought it was a better deck mainly because of the the Triton Spindles, it viritually eliminated any bearing issues and I didn't have any issues with the cut. But now everyone should be happy because they put the Triton spindles on the Ultracut deck.

jameson
10-24-2008, 08:18 PM
Mowersower,

Have you ever heard the phrase "Fool me once, shame on me. Fool me twice, shame on them"?

Something's lost in translation here, try. . .

Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.

Ah, better.

And a few members have allowed themselves to be fooled more than once, via the 26" Metro and in some instances, the hapless Triton deck. Caveat emptor.

farmall
10-24-2008, 09:26 PM
Mowersower is correct, there were quite a few people who had issues with the triton. but i can remember when the ultracut came out, there was a lot of issues with that as well. The triton has turned out to be more of a southern deck while the Ultracut is more of a northern area deck. THe ultracut does a nice job, but in my opinion, the triton still will cut circles around the ultracut. it is just way more sensitive to adjustments. unfortunately, exmark did a poor job of educating dealers to the importance of the adjustments. the ultracut is a lot more tolerant of being misadjusted. As for the hydros, Deere was in too much of a hurry and pushed the hydros out the door on new machines to beat the competitors to the unitized and now they are paying for it. all the issues that deere has were caught early on in development by exmark's test dept. there has been A LOT of money and time invested in testing the next lazer, from field testing for over 2 years with prototypes to almost 3 years testing in the lab on the component level up to the full machine. it appears Exmark has done about all they can to ensure the product will live up to what it is supposed to be. sure there is still the possibility that there will be some issues that show up late in the game, but if a company were to do all that is statistically needed to guarantee a flawless machine, the machine would never come to market becasue it would be years and years of testing with 1000's of prototypes. no company can afford that. I think exmark is way ahead of the competition with the quality and detail of their testing. and as for the price increases, the companies that didn't do a price increase this year will probably not be in business much longer as the price of the commodities that it takes to build a machine have more than doubled in some cases. Steel has skyrocketed in the last year, Copper (wiring harnesses) has followed suit, Oil has gone out of sight, Lead (batteries) has jumped, cost of production items such as electricity, natural gas, etc has jumped, thus increasing overhead. there are a lot of factors that would cause a finished good to increase in price. and without killing the distribution channel by forcing them to take less margin, the prices will have to increase. i would just hate to see what the price of the 08 model would have been in 09 without all the cost reductions made on the next lazer.

davidcalhoun
10-24-2008, 09:51 PM
Jameson,

Yep, I got that phrase backwards - it's that darn "part timmers" at my age. Hopefully most people knew what I meant to write.

Thanks for the memory help.

TLS
10-24-2008, 10:27 PM
I'm just concerned that I haven't heard one thing about these prototypes. I live right smack dab in the middle of the "problem grass" area, know a lot of people, read a lot on here, and haven't seen or heard boo about an eXmark NewLazer prototype out collecting hours of use in the field.

I'd give my left arm to be a prototype tester. While I don't have tons of customers, I am a solo owner operator that has a varied property portfolio of conditions.


I do like eXmark engineering, and as long as they pick up where they left off with the original Lazer, this thing should be real nice.

I'd just love to see some detailed up-close pics of the "business end".


As for the Triton....Anytime you have a front baffle throwing your trimside cutting chambers grass directly at the center spindle assembly, there is a big problem with flow.

jaybird24
10-24-2008, 10:34 PM
I'm sure money was not an issue with R&D of these mower. Exmark may not have the funds that deere has, But Toro has the money to spend and the new Exmark Lazer and Toro G3 are the exact same mower basically. As far as the pump/motors I believe Toro has been using a system like this on some of their golf equipment, I may be wrong about that, but if so they would feel it would be proven. With 2 respected companies unveiling the same mower, I'm sure they did all they could to make sure it is a quality product. There will probably be some bugs, but I would expect nothing huge has been overlooked.. As far as the decks go the way I see it is if the exmark deck is not great, I can just buy the Toro with a Turbo force deck which is proven and probably as good as the ultra cut anyways. Deere is not as vested in the lawn industry as these 2 companies are, it is where Toro and Exmark put all their resources. Deere has much bigger fish to fry, and the top brass probably have never seen the lawn production facilities.

tacoma200
10-25-2008, 12:51 AM
Why are some of you posting what you think is wrong with the New Lazers when most of you haven't even seen one in person let alone drive one. Do you really think that after Exmark tested this mower for 2 years and spent well over a million dollars developing it would jepordize their company by putting a crap mower on the market. Yes, John Deere screwed up but i bet it didn't put a dent in the companies bottom line. There are several differences between the John Deere hydros and the Exmarks, and the spindle covers are designed so that you can remove them without any tools and clean out your deck easier and they are not going to fall apart. This mower is the real deal and everybody should recognize that.

Most of the time a ZTR company makes an entirely new model or deck there are problems that arise. Most of us that have been on the site for several years and have seen all the problems (and experienced them like me) just have a wait and see attitude. The Triton and XR7 decks were supposed to be tested for years. The 26 efi Kohler and 30 hp Kohler had major issues. The John Deere 800 series was supposed to be tested. All of these had major problems and we are just being careful or at least I am. I wish Exmark the best, but it takes a couple of years in the field to really know how they are going to do. Not everyone had problems but many did.

tallimeca
10-25-2008, 01:25 AM
pretty much this is how it went.

Everyone for the most part loved the ultracut decks. Exmark, dealers, end users. Really no issues.

There were some complaints on the triton and then all the bad publicity poisoned that deck to the point guys were buying the competition because they were afraid of it, even though they were redesigned and fixed. The one complete positive was the spindle assemblies. Very good design with minimal failures that didn't involve impact.

Put the triton style spindles on the ultra cut deck...... Wham.

The rest of the machine is pretty sweet too. I think you guys are gonna love it.

There basically are two models now. The Lazer AS, and the Lazer. No more 4 different set ups. All the same frame and deck style. Size of the deck and engine options are what will change.

Some models are already being built and shipped while other won't arrive in dealers until late spring/summer. Don't forget, there are still alot of 08 product out there to flush out and the prices will be right too.

ricky86
10-25-2008, 01:52 AM
If I am not correct please tell me - but aren't exmark spindles heavier?? I have all toro and I am going to go all exmark next spring. When I was at the GIE show exmark pointed it out plainly and toro guy admitted that exmark is heavier, and focused on the commercial guy where toro is going to focus is the small commercial guy, large estate owners, and the general public with the box stores.

Where do you get your information from???????????

TLS
10-25-2008, 05:18 AM
Put the triton style spindles on the ultra cut deck...... Wham.



How about the adjustable turbo baffle of the Triton? The discharge area on the new deck looks different than the old UC. It looks Tritonish.

MOHUSTLER
10-25-2008, 10:02 AM
Anyone know the MSRP on these new models?

I put off getting a new mower this year and kept running my 2002 Lazer. I just hope this mower doesn't turn out like the Triton deck.

Hopefully I'm not on here next spring complaining about how many problems I'm having with my new mower.:)


Looking at an exmark price sheet right now. Still says TBD on alot of modles. But from what I can see, it looks pretty steep lol.

I wonder if thier frame is made from 24 ct gold?

milo
10-25-2008, 12:33 PM
well my opinon. i think the older lazer z's look way better but it seems they did do alot of things to make it easier to use and adjust things. i wonder how it drives compaired to the older model? i cannot wait to try one out

HighlandLC
10-25-2008, 05:58 PM
Very streamlined selection. Are any of the offered engines EFI ?

tacoma200
10-25-2008, 07:51 PM
Very streamlined selection. Are any of the offered engines EFI ?

You would think so, that's the way the industry is going. I wouldn't get to caught up in the suggested retail price just yet. Most of the time a ZTR can be bought for far less or at least when the new wears off this new line of Lazers.

What engines are being offered on the Lazer and AS ?

ricky86
10-25-2008, 08:12 PM
well my opinon. i think the older lazer z's look way better but it seems they did do alot of things to make it easier to use and adjust things. i wonder how it drives compaired to the older model? i cannot wait to try one out
I drove the Toro verizon. Very smooth. Just like the pump/motor setup. Fast too.

ricky86
10-25-2008, 08:15 PM
well my opinon. i think the older lazer z's look way better but it seems they did do alot of things to make it easier to use and adjust things. i wonder how it drives compaired to the older model? i cannot wait to try one out

I drove the Toro version. Very smooth. No freewheeling. Fast too.

meets1
10-25-2008, 09:11 PM
My info for mowers well......... My next door neighbors son is lead engineer for TORO. We chat a bit.

gunpowder
11-05-2008, 05:03 PM
Looks like they did away with the Big Briggs V Engine and brought back the Kawasaki although I am not sure they have a liquid cooled one. I like my 2008 LZ with Triton deck but we tend to get a new one every year.