Want to use 1" poly for 25 gpm.

[jcom]

We are in the process of installing a system hooked to a 26 gpm pump in a river.

We are using a 1 1/2 mainline going out to 1000' for the furthest irrigated area. This all per our vendors pump pro.

We want to use 1" poly for the laterals. On a residential we would not push that much water through because of hammer and so on.

Looking for comments on using 1" for the laterals with this much flow. We know from flow tests that we can get well over 30 gpm through this size pipe. Do we need to worry about scrubbing with poly?

All opines, pro or con are appreciated.

Thanks for the assist.

John

[bicmudpuppy]

26gpm max flow SHOULD mean 13-15gpm max flow on the poly (maybe my math is wrong?) 30gpm zones through 1" valves can be done. Center feeding makes it very doable. I wouldn't like 15gpm in 1" if it was any kind of mainline, but you don't get water/air hammer on open laterals.

[Wet_Boots]

A zone valve at the end of a 1000-foot mainline can see considerable hammer. I would consider a 2-inch mainline, and slow down the water flow, especially on poly pipe.

[Tom Tom]

Looking for comments on using 1" for the laterals with this much flow. We know from flow tests that we can get well over 30 gpm through this size pipe. Do we need to worry about scrubbing with poly?

All opines, pro or con are appreciated.

Thanks for the assist.

John


Why rely on a bunch of cranky irrigation guys?

Go look up some psi loss charts.

[Mike Leary]

I've done it, we all have, but throwing more than 12 gpm through 1" is dicey.

[Waterit]

I've done it, we all have, but throwing more than 12 gpm through 1" is dicey.

We push 16 all the time - 1" class PVC.

[Mike Leary]

We push 16 all the time - 1" class PVC.

Only dorks use class. :hammerhead:

[Waterit]

Only dorks use class. :hammerhead:

Guess I'm a dork.:cry:

[CAPT Stream Rotar]

Ive pushed 18 through 1 inch..No more..
And yes the vavles did hammer off a 1 hp sub well..
Any more that that is no good..

But, with 1000 feet of pipe you have some head..I'd say you can do it but them valves will still hammer..Whats the PSI @POC?

CSR

[Mike Leary]

Center feeding makes it very doable.

I would do it, but it's not recommended at home; you're pushing the fittings and only a mechanic that's had some experience would try.

[turfman59]

[

Looking for comments on using 1" for the laterals with this much flow. We know from flow tests that we can get well over 30 gpm through this size pipe. Do we need to worry about scrubbing with poly?

Thanks for the assist.

John[/QUOTE] what is the working pressure when your pushing 30 gpm through 1" poly ( i would guess 15 psi ) Its simple to build a quality system that allows the heads to properly seat when activated you should not exceed 5 feet a second on the flow chart for any kind of pipe. I dont care if its poly or pvc the difference is splitting hairs by the time it is coming out of the sprinkler

[AI Inc]

This thread is starting to get scary.

[Wet_Boots]

I've had to run close to 50 gpm through some one-inch poly one old zone in a system I refurbished, just a 10-15 foot length running under some concrete. No issues, outside of a bit of pressure loss.

[turfman59]

so you went from a piece of 2" and nippled it down to 1" went 15 feet and called it a repair and then asked for your money?

[turfman59]

I am sorry I thought we were talking about building a new system from a set of design disciplines and principles

[Waterit]

so you went from a piece of 2" and nippled it down to 1" went 15 feet and called it a repair and then asked for your money?

Sometimes you do what you gotta do - but you always get paid for it.

[jcom]

Thanks for the input, folks.

Vendor tells me we are looking at 65 psi at the pump and would have no problems out 1000'. Pressure loss is 16 at 1000' with 25 gpm flow. So should be doable the way I see it. But looking again for opinions either way.

We are planning on using DV 100 valves and they are rated up to 40 gpm. Why would they hammer if flow is at 25?

We want to lay out 250' of 1" poly laterals with the mainline tie-in in the middle. 10 RBird 5004's with 2.5 gal nozzles.
We could reduce the nozzle size if necessary and still get adequate coverage but then we would be not close to matching the pump output. We went to the bigger pump because of the distance required based on our pump guys recommendation.

Thanks for the assist.

John

[Waterit]

Thanks for the input, folks.

Vendor tells me we are looking at 65 psi at the pump and would have no problems out 1000'. Pressure loss is 16 at 1000' with 25 gpm flow. So should be doable the way I see it. But looking again for opinions either way.

We are planning on using DV 100 valves and they are rated up to 40 gpm. Why would they hammer if flow is at 25?

We want to lay out 250' of 1" poly laterals with the mainline tie-in in the middle. 10 RBird 5004's with 2.5 gal nozzles.
We could reduce the nozzle size if necessary and still get adequate coverage but then we would be not close to matching the pump output. We went to the bigger pump because of the distance required based on our pump guys recommendation.

Thanks for the assist.

John

Sounds like you have it all figured out. Rock on.

[turfman59]

How About using a 2 Inch mainline for the first 600 feet and reduce your pressure loss I would not want to give up 16 psi just in the mainline,, dont be cheap your using your customers money ( How many zones total ) What is the budget

[Wet_Boots]

so you went from a piece of 2" and nippled it down to 1" went 15 feet and called it a repair and then asked for your money?No, this was a new install done on top of the bones of an old system. One side of the concrete walk was a raised bed they didn't want dug up. The design flow was supposed to be about 30 gpm, with 2-inch main and 1-1/2 inch zone valves, but in restoring the connection to the old main that ran through the raised bed, another zone was discovered in a remote area, and making it work properly required a flow of about 50 gpm, and that required the new work to be renozzled, so that the zones had equal flows, which, in turn, saved the poly main line from seeing excess pressures on low-flow zones. (not enough extra pressure to employ any regulation, on account of the old zone was fed by 1-1/4 poly)

Of course, the one-inch poly was teed off three ways to feed the sprinklers the 50 gpm.

[turfman59]

Is there any elevation change in this project,, You said from the river is where your pulling from How high is the pump from the water level and at what is the difference between the pump and the irrigated areas

[jcom]

There will be 21 zones total at this point.

We figure 16 psi loss at the furthest zone and less as we get closer to the pump. If the laterals remain the same throughout, we should have 40 psi at the heads or thereabouts.

John

[Waterit]

No, this was a new install done on top of the bones of an old system. One side of the concrete walk was a raised bed they didn't want dug up. The design flow was supposed to be about 30 gpm, with 2-inch main and 1-1/2 inch zone valves, but in restoring the connection to the old main that ran through the raised bed, another zone was discovered in a remote area, and making it work properly required a flow of about 50 gpm, and that required the new work to be renozzled, so that the zones had equal flows, which, in turn, saved the poly main line from seeing excess pressures on low-flow zones. (not enough extra pressure to employ any regulation, on account of the old zone was fed by 1-1/4 poly)

Of course, the one-inch poly was teed off three ways to feed the sprinklers the 50 gpm.

I think you left out a few details:laugh:

[turfman59]

[QUOTE=jcom;2571131]There will be 21 zones total at this point.

We figure 16 psi loss at the furthest zone and less as we get closer to the pump. If the laterals remain the same throughout, we should have 40 psi at the heads or thereabouts.

And what is the elevation change,,,who is reading the pump curve

[jcom]

The irrigated area is 15 feet above the pump and is completely flat. Our design mainline actually tees two directions. 400' one way and 1000' the other. The river level might fluctuate a few feet . Using a 1 1/2 hp Goulds 18LS submersible pump and will be hung from a boat dock. (We use submersibles here and have had that discussion on this forum.)

Furthest zones to be installed next year.

Thanks,

John:wall

[Wet_Boots]

I think you left out a few details:laugh:I'll try to get some photos. I think I saved a few of the brass insert fittings from the old sections. Old zone valves were made by Skinner.

I'd still use 2-inch for the entire main. Water hammer force is proportional to the length of the pipe, so a thousand feet can hammer ten times as hard as a hundred feet. A poly main might have some ability to expand, perhaps, and reduce the hammer effect.

[Water and Lights]

You should run 1 1/4" from your valves to the tee and then run 1" to all the heads, this will keep your flow rates on the chart. 25 gpm through 1" pipe is pushing it.

[turfman59]

25 gpm through 1" pipe for a sprinkler system is just foolish....here is an easy way to remember when pipe sizing without worring about friction loss

1"=12gpm
1.25" 24gpm
1.5" 36 gpm
2" 48gpm

when you double the pipe size you quadruple the amount of volume

notice the 12 gpm increments as you go up through the pipe size...If you use this formula you never have to worry about friction loss up to runs as long as 400 feet

[Water and Lights]

Exactly. Thats why I'd run 1.25 laterals. Tee or branch all your zones, 24gpm to the tee and then 12gpm each direction. This keeps you in the 24gpm range with out exceeding the 5psi. I would also run 2" main line, this will allow for expansion of the system or doubling up zones if need be.

Always plan ahead not the minimum.

[turfman59]

Exactly. Thats why I'd run 1.25 laterals. Tee or branch all your zones, 24gpm to the tee and then 12gpm each direction. This keeps you in the 24gpm range with out exceeding the 5psi. I would also run 2" main line, this will allow for expansion of the system or doubling up zones if need be.

Always plan ahead not the minimum. do you mean 5 feet a sec and how are you going to double up zones without changing the pump

[Water and Lights]

I wouldn't double it if the pump didn't allow, but I would keep that in mind when designing the system. 20+ zones is calling for alot of time, especially when its all rotor zones.

[turfman59]

I wouldn't double it if the pump didn't allow, but I would keep that in mind when designing the system. 20+ zones is calling for alot of time, especially when its all rotor zones.
How about using a bigger pump and then really do a good job of designing the system with 2" use fewer valves but larger and reducing the amount of time this thing has to run 21 valves with 2.5 Gpm nozzles Ah I think during High ET times this thing will never shut off....The pump guy knows a little bit the installer knows a little bit,, the customer knows everything...It sounds like a bunch of money being put into a poorly thought out system...or else you just havent told us everything to this point,,,,,I would use a 5 hp berkely 220 volt and throw 55-60 gpm at it and then stand back and watch it work...you can get one for around 1250.00 if your careful...this will allow you to cut back the amount of time it takes to get the job done.....you also can trench in a 2 1/2 inch mainline ,,,now I am really getting excited

[Kiril]

Mike, your falling asleep.....master

[bicmudpuppy]

I read the original post to be asking about LATERALS @ 26gpm. I would center feed as much as possible and be comfortable with LATERALS having a total zone volume of 26gpm. 1" MAINLINE for 26gpm???????WTF This is another critter of a different breed and we just went from professional to dumber than the worst HO we've ever had post here. Stagnant pressure made more sense than a 1" mainline DESIGNED for 26gpm. 1" VALVES @ 26gpm (never expect a valve to approach the manufacturer's max specs!, but 40 means less than 30 is OK) 10-12gpm for a 1" main. Yes, you can get away w/ more, but the kind of guys who DESIGN for more than that are just GOOD FOR BUSINESS!! Normal run length, I could suggest a 1.5" main, but for 1000'?? are we looping? Even then, 2" would be a much more responsible design parameter. We haven't discussed a loop, so for 1000' of main, 1.5" mainline pipe does NOT work.

Rant over
::backs out of thread::

[Mike Leary]

Hopefully someone will get the point. :dizzy:

[CAPT Stream Rotar]

Mike, your falling asleep.....master

Is that a Buckner?

[Kiril]

Is that a Buckner?

Does Mike use Buckner?

[Mike Leary]

Mike, your falling asleep...]

Am I missing something? As usual.

[CAPT Stream Rotar]

Does Mike use Buckner?

Whoops
WM

[Waterit]

I'll try to get some photos. I think I saved a few of the brass insert fittings from the old sections. Old zone valves were made by Skinner.

I'd still use 2-inch for the entire main. Water hammer force is proportional to the length of the pipe, so a thousand feet can hammer ten times as hard as a hundred feet. A poly main might have some ability to expand, perhaps, and reduce the hammer effect.

I was kidding!

And now to keep in company with the others showing good sense (bic, ML, A1), I am bailing!

[jcom]

Thanks for all the information, folks.

I presented my dimensions to my pump guy and he says the 1 1/2" mainline is just fine at 1000'. Guess his ideas are different than others here. But he will be the one I go to if it does not work. Sounds like that is the issue now and not the laterals that I first addressed.

We will center feed the laterals with 1 1/4" so that will take care of that issue. Thanks for the tip. Sometimes when we look at something for too long, the blinders come on!

John

[CAPT Stream Rotar]

post pics plz

[Wet_Boots]

Your pump guy doesn't know zip about diaphragm valves, and feel free to pass that on. Water hammer isn't read from friction loss tables.

[CAPT Stream Rotar]

Hey boots, you ever seen sever hammer effect solenoids or interior valve chambers?

[Wet_Boots]

Sure. I used to have a regular gig replacing diaphragms in some Nelson brass valves that got killed by hammer. Solenoids, no.

[CAPT Stream Rotar]

how often were you replacing them?

[Wet_Boots]

Always once a year, but they (commercial account) would pay for one replacement, then get stingy. Come winterizing time, there would always be another leaky diaphragm. Crappy design/production on Nelson's part. A plastic valve with a similar diaphragm (beaded, like the Irritrol 2400) would have a support ring, so the pressure on the diaphragm couldn't deform it.

[CAPT Stream Rotar]

are you saying that the inside plastic ring like the ir jartop 2400, used to form itself around the diaphram?

[Wet_Boots]

The inside plastic ring keeps the water pressure on the top of the diaphragm from pushing the diaphragm downward. In the old Nelson valve, the lack of a support ring allowed the water pressure to push at the diaphragm enough to tear the bead away the rest of the diaphragm.

[jcom]

OK guys, what am I unable to comprehend as to the water hammer on the valves?:confused::confused: If the valve is rated to flow at 40 gpm, and I want to push 25, why would that cause hammer?

Thanks for the time and patience.

John:confused:

[CAPT Stream Rotar]

What kind and size of valve are you using?

What I'm thinking is that you don't get is the valve might be rated for XYZ GPM...
But the supply load is going to hammer that valve cause you are exceeding your more than 5fps...Look @ the flow charts on a sprinkler cat...It tells you dont go over

I think 14 for 3/4
18 for 1 inch
24 for 1.25
and 42 for 1.5

Ill give you an example...This past year we put in a job off a 1 hp well..Well we got over 19 gpm, @ over 70 psi...

So when we ran a 1 inch supply main to the first manifold It hammered the valves.. Meaning, the water was moving to fast and Jostled the valve diaphram up and down...cause we exceeded 5 fps..

So inturn With in 5 years my guess we will be replacing those RB dv 100 diaphrams cause of the water hammer.

Not sure if that makes sense, that is just how I understand water hammer

[Waterit]

What kind and size of valve are you using?

What I'm thinking is that you don't get is the valve might be rated for XYZ GPM...
But the supply load is going to hammer that valve cause you are exceeding your more than 5fps...Look @ the flow charts on a sprinkler cat...It tells you dont go over

I think 14 for 3/4
18 for 1 inch
24 for 1.25
and 42 for 1.5

Ill give you an example...This past year we put in a job off a 1 hp well..Well we got over 19 gpm, @ over 70 psi...

So when we ran a 1 inch supply main to the first manifold It hammered the valves.. Meaning, the water was moving to fast and Jostled the valve diaphram up and down...cause we exceeded 5 fps..

So inturn With in 5 years my guess we will be replacing those RB dv 100 diaphrams cause of the water hammer.

Not sure if that makes sense, that is just how I understand water hammer

Close enough. Anytime you exceed the 5 fps rule you are asking for hammer.

The flows vary by pipe type. Consult the charts that are in the back of most RB catalogs.

[Wet_Boots]

If you find a formula for calculating water hammer, you'll see that the length of the pipeline is a factor.

Think of it this way. If someone tosses a saucepan lid at me (at a speed of five feet per second) it bounces off. Replace the lid with an eight-foot length of steel rail from the Amtrak mainline (at the same five feet per second) and I'm taking a fall.

[jcom]

WB- I follow the rail analogy.

Here is what I don't get- 5 fps second is a measure speed/time.
Gpm is a measure of volume/flow.

How do you work the two together so you know whether or not you are going to have hammer through your valve?

I follow that the length of the pipe affects hammer as well with the volume of water in the pipe creating more force when a valve closes.

So if two valves of different sizes are both capable of a certain flow, why would one cause hammer and the other not when the same amount of water is coming to a screeching halt regardless of the size of the valve as they will both close at the same speed.

In our situation, the 1 1/2 mainline is in place for the first 250' and 1" valves are in place for same. For discussion sake, will these operate ok because of the distance but we will need bigger valves (??) for the longer runs.

John and thanks for the patience. I will get it eventually!!

[Wet_Boots]

One approximation to the maximum pressure, P, produced in a water filled line (English units) is

P = 0.07VL / t + P1

Where P1 is the inlet pressure, V is the flow velocity in ft/sec, t is the valve closing time in seconds and L is the upstream pipe length in feet

http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:FBeX3X7YJLTYpM:http://www.learningresources.com/images/en_US/local/products/detail/prod6908_dt.jpg Now, let's calculate.

Push 26 gpm through a 1-1/2 inch poly pipe, and you get 4.10 fps. The valve closing time is a wild card, so let's start at five seconds, which is faster than I'd want. Let's also assume your pump is pushing the 26 gpm at 60 psi. Now we see what can happen at the end of the 1000 foot mainline.

((0.07 X 4.10 X 1000) / 5 ) plus 60psi equals 344 psi for the hammer pressure. If that valve closed in a second, the hammer could exceed 1500 psi. Now you know why they make expensive diaphragm valves with adjustable closing and opening speeds.

I think poly has some 'hidden' flex ability that can dampen the hammer pulse, but I sill might invest in some air chambers to help absorb the shock.

My preference for larger mainlines is to eliminate losses in long runs, and to make zones behave similar to each other, even with hundreds of feet of mainline. Bumping up from 1-1/2 to 2 inch gets you more than 10 psi saved at the end of the mainline, and 10 psi is usually worth investing in. That hammer is reduced is sort of a bonus. Get a zone valve that slams shut in half a second, and there may be trouble.

[jcom]

Thanks WB,

Beats me where you get all these formulas but I would like to know.

What formula did you use to find your fps using 26 gpm through a 1 1/2" pipe?

Since we have no more than 100' of 1 1/2" pipe behind our first 1" valves, do you think we are ok thus far? We will be adding the additional 800' next spring and can easily change that to 2".
And we will be using 1 1/4" and tie-in to the middle of our laterals.


Your assist is greatly appreciated.


John

[Mike Leary]

In the "old" days, we were taught to design for friction loss through all valves and fittings, that's not done so much anymore, but it does not mean we don't have to pay attention; you fail by not paying attention to the big three : psi, gpm and friction loss.

[Wet_Boots]

Many catalogs have friction loss tables, so I just opened one to the poly pipe table, and read 4.10 fps in 1-1/2 poly, with a per/100-foot loss of 1.74 psi. Are you using 1-inch valves? You might want to note their closing speed, in reference to hammer. You can upsize the extension for the mainline, without worrying about the existing one.

If you do center-feed your zones, then you only push 13 gpm through the laterals, and that's within the useful range of 1-inch poly.

[Mike Leary]

Not that I used them much, I was impressed (and frustrated) by the slow closing of Rain-Bird valves. Weather-Matic are pretty quick & I've had hammer, but the "shock-cone" in the diaphragms has given me no trouble.

[Wet_Boots]

Using the bleed screws for manual operation, nothing closed as slowly as the Toro 250 series. Minutes, not seconds, for shutdown.

[Mike Leary]

Using the bleed screws for manual operation, nothing closed as slowly as the Toro 250 series. Minutes, not seconds, for shutdown.

Those are valves that have you standing around asking yourself, "am I having a sixties flashback?"

[Mad Estonian]

Beats me where you get all these formulas but I would like to know.

Come on dude, seriously, you need to do your homework. I never would have dreamt of tackling a job like what you're doing without having some understanding of the fundamentals of hydraulics. I think it's great that you've come on here, and are open to all the information everyone's sharing with you, but this isn't exactly the only resource that's available to you. You can find plenty of stuff online (I'm pretty sure if you search for water hammer calculation formulas, you'll find something, plus flow charts etc.). Your distributor will have design-assisting materials, probably Hunter or Rainbird or whatever, biased for sure, but good for the basics. There's a few design textbooks out there; Richard Choate's Turf Irrigation Manual is what I've mainly used, but others would suggest different, I'm sure equally-worthy books (although, of course, "book-learning" will only get you so far, but it's still important). You can go through the "Getting Started" sticky at the top of the main page, or do searches on here, they're a great resource. Jess Stryker's "Irrigation Tutorials" website has good information. Isn't your distributor willing/able to provide you with some design assistance?
It's not good enough to screw up a job and blame it on the pump guy or whatever. You're doing the work, it's on your head.
And like I said, I think it's great you're on here, and willing to learn. But if you want to be any good, realize you're only at the beginning of a long process, and careful not to get in (too far) over your head. Make use of ALL the resources available to you. And no more "Beats me where you guys get this stuff from" crap:).

[Wet_Boots]

By the way, Wikipedia had the hammer formula. (bet that Kiril can find one with eleven more variables :))

[Mike Leary]

(bet that Kiril can find one with eleven more variables :))

Don't egg him on, we'll be here all day. :dizzy:

[wab1234]

http://www.pump-zone.com/valves/valves/water-hammer-part-two-causes-and-variables.html

this link hopefully works you might have to copy and paste. Its an intresting article on water hammer and a formula. i get trade magazines constantly, sometimes worth a read sometimes not. Im a plant matnence mechanic now so hydraulics are of interest to me. I used to work in irriagation and lawn installs in Rotars land. We have an irrigation system I also take care at the plant so i enjoy reading this forum.
The point he makes of pressure not being to imporant for water hammer is interesting. Assuming i read it right.

[bicmudpuppy]

::steps back into thread::at great personal peril::

Water Hammer is affected by many variables. On FLAT ground, the rule of thumb I was taught for water hammer was 4x the working pressure. So, 30psi at the head x 4 is 120psi for water hammer. A static pressure of 60psi x 4 is 240psi. It doesn't really matter, an idiot at a parts counter somewhere has said it will work. This moron has no responsibility for his advice and won't be responsible when it all goes to sh!t, but then neither will we, so.......................
Time to let him go to school and learn from his own mistakes instead of from the wisdom of others & OMG, I followed the link and if we assume only 8fps on 1000' with a closing time of 1 second (it is going to close faster than that), we are dealing with 500+psi additional pressure!

::backs back out of thread:: permanently this time::

[jcom]

Mad Estonian:

I have looked online but not in the right places. Some of the reading I have done, and I have done plenty, did not make any sense until I hear it stated in different terms. Maybe like reading an operating manual but it doesn't make much sense until put into use.

I believe I was ready to tackle this particular job after installing a couple others this season only on a smaller scale. However, I began gathering numbers and data two months before the project began. It takes some of us longer to grab concepts.

Hope you are not quite so rude to customers who may have questions that you feel are unnecessary.

[Mike Leary]

Hope you are not quite so rude to customers who may have questions that you feel are unnecessary.

Hell, most of the time we punch them in the mouth.

[Mad Estonian]

Hope you are not quite so rude to customers who may have questions that you feel are unnecessary.

I'm just trying to shatter the image of Canadians always being polite :canadaflag:.
Seriously, I hope it goes well for you (and more importantly, your customers).
I think I've said enough already. Take from it what you will.
And I always answer my customers' questions, no matter how much they irritate me (which is my own shortcoming); they're paying me to be the "expert."

[Mike Leary]

[ they're paying me to be the "expert."

Some times I punch them anyway, so they learn their lesson not to f**k with sprinkler guys. :canadaflag:

[DanaMac]

Some times I punch them anyway, so they learn their lesson not to f**k with sprinkler guys.

That's right. You mess with one, you mess with us all. Can we start our own gang?

[Mad Estonian]

Some times I punch them anyway, so they learn their lesson not to f**k with sprinkler guys.

Let's call it the "Leary Doctrine.":)

[Mad Estonian]

Can we start our own gang?

Instead of Crips, we can be the "Drips."

[Waterit]

Can we start our own gang?

Instead of Crips, we can be the "Drips."

Mmm, don't like the connotations of that.

How about "Dork Pikers"?

[hoskm01]

How about "Dork Pikers"?

Fitting....

[Wet_Boots]

Our Motto

"Sprinkler thugs have brass balls"

[Mad Estonian]

How about "Dork Pikers"?

Hmm, you're right, that's much better. Though we might run into trouble with the feared "Dork Bikers" gang.:gunsfirin

[ARGOS]

Our Motto

"Sprinkler thugs have brass balls"

Please, please, no images.

[Mike Leary]

Let's get someone working on the outfits; like the NASCAR guys have.
Kril stays in the back when the pack hits town to measure the skid marks.

[Mad Estonian]

It won't be good for business if we're always trying to keep everybody off our turf.:)

[Mike Leary]

[QUOTE=Mad Estonian;2573063]It won't be good for business if we're always trying to keep everybody off our turf.:)[/QUOTE
That's where the Boy Scouts come in: they take over when the mongolspray gang moves on; we get a percentage.

[Mad Estonian]

That's where the Boy Scouts come in: they take over when the mongolspray gang moves on; we get a percentage

I say we demand a cut on the Girl Guide cookies to boot.

[Mike Leary]

I I say we demand a cut on the Girl Guide cookies to boot.

Given the largest cash crop in B.C., I'd only take a nibble of those cookies.

[Mad Estonian]

Given the largest cash crop in B.C., I'd only take a nibble of those cookies.

I had a few too many nibbles of a co-worker's cookies when I worked in a garden centre years ago, and had to barricade myself in bales of peat moss to hide from the customers :dizzy::eek::help:

[WalkGood]

Let's get someone working on the outfits; like the NASCAR guys have.
Kril stays in the back when the pack hits town to measure the skid marks.


We talking on the ground or underwear?
;):eek:

[hoskm01]

Given the largest cash crop in B.C., I'd only take a nibble of those cookies.
Scary line. Back inside, Mike.

[Waterit]

Let's get someone working on the outfits

Mike in his "colors":

123773

[Dripit good]

I say we eliminate the Krain 13's off of their turf. :gunsfirin:gunsfirin

[AI Inc]

Mike in his "colors":

123773

Wheres that from , Deluth catalog?

[Waterit]

Wheres that from , Deluth catalog?

Hint: In The Navy.

[Kiril]

By the way, Wikipedia had the hammer formula. (bet that Kiril can find one with eleven more variables :))

Actually ..... yes, there could be many more variables, but I suppose your equation will work for an over simplified rough approximation.

ftp://ftp.win.tue.nl/pub/rana/rana06-08.pdf

http://www.ksbpak.com/pdfs/waterhammer.pdf

[Waterit]

Oh no, here we go again with these two and their equations...

[CAPT Stream Rotar]

Now don't start you 2....

[Mike Leary]

Don't egg him on, we'll be here all day. :dizzy:

I knew it.....

[Wet_Boots]

Won't happen - my DSL is down, and I won't waste bandwidth on PDFs

[Mike Leary]

Won't happen - my DSL is down, and I won't waste bandwidth on PDFs

::Wipes sweat from brow.::

[Waterit]

Won't happen - my DSL is down, and I won't waste bandwidth on PDFs

::::contacts friend at NYNEX, tries to arrange to make condition permanent::::

[Wet_Boots]

So how can I check out the Calendar Girls? Have a heart!

[Waterit]

So how can I check out the Calendar Girls? Have a heart!

We''l hook you up for porn, but install software to prevent the equation-posting. Also have a buddy at Qwest, looking for Kiril's hook-up...:laugh:

[Kiril]

Also have a buddy at Qwest, looking for Kiril's hook-up...:laugh:

heh? :confused:

[Waterit]

heh? :confused:

Refer to: http://www.lawnsite.com/showpost.php?p=2574725&postcount=95

[Kiril]

Refer to: http://www.lawnsite.com/showpost.php?p=2574725&postcount=95

My DSL ain't all that (1.5 Mb max), certainly nothing to pine after.