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Barefoot James
10-31-2008, 08:26 PM
Ok. Here is the first pic. Question which yards are Barefoot's Yards?? I took this to show what neglect vs organic shows.

phasthound
10-31-2008, 08:39 PM
Ooh ooh, I know!!
It's the one with the fire hydrant.

Barefoot James
10-31-2008, 08:41 PM
Mine has the golf green the other is my neighbors - Both are Barefoot Yards and Organic. The stripes are done with a Billy Goat lawn vac (lots of leafs today) My yard was killed (again) this Aug and reseeded. Lots of tea and compost top dressings about 1000 pounds on 1500 sq ft. My neighbors was just power seeded again (also last year). We do not irregate in summer, but I watered every hour (5 mins - keep that seed moist) during day in month of Sept and each evening since (10 mis). Both are very mycorrhizael.

Barefoot James
10-31-2008, 08:44 PM
Here is the back.

Barefoot James
10-31-2008, 08:53 PM
Let's look at quality of turf. keep in mind this grass is ONLY 9 weeks old! Yes you can see a weed. but ICT Bill's new Gluten product should keep them minimized this next spring.

JustCut
10-31-2008, 08:59 PM
Very very nice....... What kind of seed and germination rate and how many pounds per 1k did you use.

Barefoot James
10-31-2008, 09:03 PM
This lawn was done 4 weeks ago - obviously lack of water - LOL. I do believe those are wild onions and not even fescue - He He. I guess this guy who lives 5 doors down should have gone Barefoot. The LCO that did this lawn must have used really bad seed cause I have seen a couple other jobs they did who watered and it is just not good. You get what you pay for. I love my competetion. BTW I used Pennington Smart Seed on my front. in the close up you can see the thin blades - those are them (4 weeks old) I wanted it thicker so I over seeded 15 pounds on 1500 sq ft and top dressed with about 500 lbs of compost 1/16 inch (about). It is thick! Love it!

Barefoot James
10-31-2008, 09:10 PM
First seed last week of Aug. I used about 8 pounds per 1000. That is it on the back - but on the front I went back and overcast 15 pounds of Pennington Smart Seed with MYCO on 1500 sq ft to thicken in up and boy is is thick and thicker everyday - then I top dressed again about 500 lbs - 1/16 inch (about). When those baby blades get going and put out 15 to 20 per seed and get a winter under them it will be really awesome.
I'm seriously considering (for sure going to) doing all jobs with the Smart Seed. It is awesome and I spent almost 10K on seed this fall. I should be able to use a little less seed but it cost more so I would have used about 15K in Smart Seed - but results and word of mouth is worth 5K to me. Oh and all TALL Fescue

Tim Wilson
11-01-2008, 11:34 AM
Nice job James.

BTW y'all I'm on holidays until Nov 5th but I'm available by email

Tim

Prolawnservice
11-01-2008, 12:00 PM
From the close up it Looks like your mower blade needs sharpening, other than that Nice Job!

Tim Wilson
11-01-2008, 12:43 PM
Nice job James.

BTW y'all I'm on holidays until Nov 5th but I'm available by email

Tim

Nov 15th . oops

Green Team Landscaping
11-01-2008, 12:59 PM
How o you keep your yard that nice without water in the summer? Any tips would be appreciated because thats one of the nicest lawns ever.

Barefoot James
11-01-2008, 10:15 PM
Compost top dressings, tea and mycorrhizae. We only watered three times this past summer in August due to lack of rain. As long as your soil has good OM counts (these yards are 3 to 4% - growing to 5%+) and tea and is mycorrhizael then 1 inch of rain every 2 to 3 weeks is plenty of water. If you don't get rain you will have to water. One good indication here in KY is if you can take a spike sprinkler and it easily pushes into the ground in drought times you have pretty great soil (ie. lots of OM). My yard you can push it in pretty easy. Compost is king (for getting good OM counts).

We got nothing (rain) in August (minimal at best) so we ran a sprinkler once per week 3 times - for about an hour.

What you see though has been seeded and irrigated heavily since - but the grass was green and not burned up when we started with only 3 waterings all summer. Mycorrhizae is key - to draught resistance.

treegal1
11-02-2008, 01:33 AM
NICE grass man , good work!!!

ICT Bill
11-02-2008, 11:47 PM
All I can say is SWEET and nice job

David W
11-03-2008, 07:30 AM
WOW....looks really nice Barefoot. I'll have to post some pics of my yard as well. I used the Smart Seed also and was really happy with the results.

growingdeeprootsorganicly
11-08-2008, 02:33 PM
james,

the grass looks awesome! the lines are really cool looking from the vac!

how much more does that seed cost per 50lbs compared to regular fescue blend?
i know you use bill's product but have you ever used a powered endo product to mix with your tea or spray apps to inoculate seed?

DUSTYCEDAR
11-08-2008, 03:08 PM
My yard is a little more dirt but i am trying:)

growingdeeprootsorganicly
11-08-2008, 03:41 PM
pj,

atleast you got the weeds under control..:)

DUSTYCEDAR
11-08-2008, 03:43 PM
yeah i did

treegal1
11-08-2008, 04:06 PM
ah the old tire tiller action, good luck.

DUSTYCEDAR
11-08-2008, 04:09 PM
i also used it as a roller

growingdeeprootsorganicly
11-08-2008, 04:16 PM
roller.... 4 ton truck on wet soil....at least compaction won't be an issue

Barefoot James
11-09-2008, 07:12 PM
Dirt looks like it could really grow some grass - LOL Nice and dark. You told me you don't even have much property - is that even your yard? - :rolleyes: - doesn't look DUSTY to me - LOL, LOL

I ALWAYS add 1 pound of ultra fine endo myco to all my tea sprays/ that I brew (200 gallons - 50 tea and 150 water). The endo I use is the highest quality stuff they sell on mycorrhizae.com - about $14/$15 a pound -about $350 for a 20 lb bag - shipped. You have to keep the jets on in the sprayer to keep it suspended or it falls out pretty fast even though it is a dust/powder. I also use ICT on some apps each year to make sure every yard is getting good diversity and it keeps us busy all day spraying as we run out of tea every 90,000 to 150,000 sq ft and have 10 to 15 more yards left so we mix up some ICT. Then the next month we work the route backwards - so we are adding lots of diverse microbes - the results pretty much speak for themselfs as we continue to grow from word of mouth and we have not had any yards burn up from heat or lack of water - so the tea and myco is working. We have many yards that have spots that always used to burn up in the heat of summer - but this year they did not - the owners were very happy.

Pennington Smart Seed is about $2.40 a pound vs high quality tall fescue @ $1.30 a pound. But the results with the Smart seed with myco innoculation are far superior and you are gauranteed myco plant innoculation (on the grass shoot/roots) because the myco is on the seed hull - so when it germinates the spores are right there - as opposed to spraying it all over the place and hoping it works itself down to the root. So I cover my bases both ways. We have decided to give our best shot EVERY time (when we seed and when we apply tea - it is going to get some myco - everytime - ICT also has myco in it) and not risk anything to chance - this mentality has really helped our business grow.

We also add some ultra fine humates to our tea a few times a year and add humates to the tea while brewing (always). We will be offering a granular Humate product for 20 lb - per 1000 sq ft/ apps once per year in 2009

growingdeeprootsorganicly
11-09-2008, 09:00 PM
. We will be offering a granular Humate product for 20 lb - per 1000 sq ft/ apps once per year in 2009

james,

hum-amend? i have used it with some nice results but it costs$$$$$ per thou...

DUSTYCEDAR
11-09-2008, 10:29 PM
So if i apply some compost tea i should have grass by x-mass?
What a mess i have going on this site. And it just got real cold.

Barefoot James
11-09-2008, 10:39 PM
Worst case $8.50 per 1000 sq ft - Best case $3. Depends on how much you get. Shipping is 75% of cost. Quality - Compost, humates, tea, worm casts and myco = quick amended soil. Results cost money and we work to make money and get results.

DUSTYCEDAR
11-09-2008, 10:41 PM
Hey james i have a coupon do i get it for a dollar?

growingdeeprootsorganicly
11-09-2008, 11:31 PM
Results cost money


thats what i keep telling my customers:dizzy:

wallzwallz
11-10-2008, 07:24 PM
Do you guys ever use the liquid humic acid? Is this the same as granular humates? All I have access to is liquid. How about liquid seaweed products? I like them also. Products that give results are expensive enough, but adding in shipping if not available locally can easily double the price. I try to work thru one local area supplier, he has decent selection, and delivers to my shop or job for $40. It's a 90 minute round trip w/out load time, so I get it deilivered.

growingdeeprootsorganicly
11-12-2008, 06:49 PM
wallz,

the granular product i ask james if he is using is just raw leonardite with soluble 10% humic acid on it. it cost too much for me to use. plus i use a small amount of liquid/powder humic/fulvic acid in my programs anyway. maybe it has some other value being in a raw form for the soil but i'm not sure?

i like the all liquid products for the simple fact of convenince/mixing but if i can get a product in powderd form i'll go with that first since i can just add my own water

wallzwallz
11-13-2008, 08:41 PM
Thanks GDRO for the explanation.

Barefoot James
01-21-2009, 04:23 PM
Wanted to bump myself - LOL - Seriously I have a bunch of clients I'm sending to the site and wanted to make this easy to find/see.

NattyLawn
01-21-2009, 04:59 PM
This is a good thread to bump....

DUSTYCEDAR
01-21-2009, 05:13 PM
Bump for the man

Kiril
01-21-2009, 10:40 PM
Wanted to bump myself - LOL - Seriously I have a bunch of clients I'm sending to the site and wanted to make this easy to find/see.

Wow, you are brave considering some of the $*#& that gets spread around here. :laugh:

http://www.lawnsite.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=132134&d=1232343110

DUSTYCEDAR
01-23-2009, 12:39 AM
Oh that smells

Grassmechanic
01-26-2009, 01:20 PM
If you're organic, why do you vacuum the leaves instead of mulching?

Barefoot James
01-26-2009, 02:07 PM
Because the grass had been mowed and I live in a wind tunnel so all my neighbors leaves tend to go on my grass. I did not want to mow again but wanted the yard looking good/with stripes. I don't use allot of leaf mulch anyways. I always mulch the grass - lots of proteins and sugars for my herd.

I also maintain 75 other properties and too much leaf mulch is not good for grass and tends to smoother it. I will much "light leaf drop" but get the heavy stuff back into the woods or under trees or bagged. We only maintain fescue yards and always mulch the grass and cut at 3.4 to 4 inches.

Grassmechanic
01-29-2009, 01:17 PM
I also maintain 75 other properties and too much leaf mulch is not good for grass and tends to smoother it. I will much "light leaf drop" but get the heavy stuff back into the woods or under trees or bagged. We only maintain fescue yards and always mulch the grass and cut at 3.4 to 4 inches.

The "too much leaf mulch is bad for the lawn" has been debunked by every University study that I've read. In fact, it's quite beneficial. Check with Mich State, Purdue, Penn State. I haven't picked up a leaf in years. They all get mulched back into the lawn.

NattyLawn
01-29-2009, 04:04 PM
The "too much leaf mulch is bad for the lawn" has been debunked by every University study that I've read. In fact, it's quite beneficial. Check with Mich State, Purdue, Penn State. I haven't picked up a leaf in years. They all get mulched back into the lawn.

You quoted what James typed, but do you understand it?

Barefoot James
01-29-2009, 08:19 PM
Good for me I don't have to rely on university studies on this topic or I would be smoothering lots of grass going into winter. Again I have 75 yards Full Service Yards. When I mulch in leaves (on heavy leaf drops) it thins them out.
They tend to not recover very well in the spring and require additional spring seeding to get as thick as they were in the fall. If I get them off the turf in the fall they stay thick and get thicker in the spring. So I vote for University of Barefoot Yards on this topic. But you do what you need to do on your lawns maybe MI is different?

JDUtah
01-29-2009, 08:29 PM
There was one tree (maybe 2) in this entire valley when it was settled. Leaves? What are those?

Tim Wilson
01-30-2009, 12:10 PM
So I vote for University of Barefoot Yards on this topic.

Oh oh! Competition for Just-A-Guy University.

Tim Wilson dHP

treegal1
01-30-2009, 12:12 PM
dont even try and push out TGU,:laugh::laugh:

Grassmechanic
01-30-2009, 12:43 PM
You quoted what James typed, but do you understand it?

What??? I was personally involved in one of those studies.

You want to be an uneducated clown, then go ahead, I don't care.

BTW we (MSU) mulched 6" of leaves 4x a season (24" total for you that don't know math). 4 years later - NO detrimental effects to the lawn. No pH change. No loss of turf. Increase OM. Increase microbe activity. Less fert. necessary.:weightlifter:

Some of you uneducated fools crack me up.:laugh:

treegal1
01-30-2009, 12:47 PM
and your alma mater is????

NattyLawn
01-30-2009, 01:04 PM
What??? I was personally involved in one of those studies.

You want to be an uneducated clown, then go ahead, I don't care.

BTW we (MSU) mulched 6" of leaves 4x a season (24" total for you that don't know math). 4 years later - NO detrimental effects to the lawn. No pH change. No loss of turf. Increase OM. Increase microbe activity. Less fert. necessary.:weightlifter:

Some of you uneducated fools crack me up.:laugh:

So, say I live on a corner property with 4 large oak trees, a maple, and a pretty consistent wind that blows neighbors leaves in the yard. The lawn is cleaned up at least 4 times in the fall. Now, your saying that if all the leaves were mulched, there would be no harm or smothering of any turf by the leaf mulch? I've seen it with my own eyes and on many other properties, but since you did a study, we're wrong? You obviously have an agenda here sir.

Please read some other threads if you think we're uneducated clowns on this forum. Most of us on here are already increasing OM and microbial activity without adding fertilizers or leaf mulch. And most of us don't mow lawns. Thanks for the info.

DUSTYCEDAR
01-30-2009, 01:18 PM
Can i mulch snow?
Each site has its own set of factors and moisture

treegal1
01-30-2009, 01:21 PM
NO and if any one else sends me a snowball we are no longer friends.:laugh::laugh::laugh:

a ficus here will kill the sod in 3 days!!!!

JDUtah
01-30-2009, 02:20 PM
Grassmechanic,

Can you post the study you are referring to? I have a couple concerns/questions with the limited data you provided.

Was the leaf mulch applied at same rate all 4 years?

Was there any fall or spring problems with smothering or disease?

dishboy
01-30-2009, 02:30 PM
With a little common sense large amounts of leaves can be mulched and turf quality, OM, worm populations can and do increase. Fertilizer, water requirements as well as thatch levels decrease . If you are supplementing synthetic fertilizer, blanket weedkiller applications, PreM's a different outcome is to be expected. I may mulch large volumes but always disperse these throughout the turf before and after mulching so turf is not buried in a blanket of leaves. If that is not sufficient I will bag the remainder for visual impact but volume actually removed is a fraction of the original volume.

NattyLawn
01-30-2009, 02:43 PM
With a little common sense large amounts of leaves can be mulched and turf quality, OM, worm populations can and do increase. Fertilizer, water requirements as well as thatch levels decrease . If you are supplementing synthetic fertilizer, blanket weedkiller applications, PreM's a different outcome is to be expected. I may mulch large volumes but always disperse these throughout the turf before and after mulching so turf is not buried in a blanket of leaves. If that is not sufficient I will bag the remainder for visual impact but volume actually removed is a fraction of the original volume.

Exactly....I think that was James' point as well.

Grassmechanic
02-02-2009, 01:31 PM
Can you post the study you are referring to? I have a couple concerns/questions with the limited data you provided.
I do have it somewhere. I'll try digging it out for you.
Was the leaf mulch applied at same rate all 4 years?
Yes. It was a 4 year study, but went on several years longer.
Was there any fall or spring problems with smothering or disease?
No smothering. Less snow mold.

Grassmechanic
02-02-2009, 01:41 PM
So, say I live on a corner property with 4 large oak trees, a maple, and a pretty consistent wind that blows neighbors leaves in the yard. The lawn is cleaned up at least 4 times in the fall. Now, your saying that if all the leaves were mulched, there would be no harm or smothering of any turf by the leaf mulch? I've seen it with my own eyes and on many other properties, but since you did a study, we're wrong? You obviously have an agenda here sir.
My only agenda is to offer education. We (MSU) gathered data from all over the country as to what a heavy leaf fall would be. 24" surpassed any leaf fall, including heavy oak forest land. You can do with the study whatever you want, including ignoring the simple fact that it can be done. There is a right and wrong way to properly mulch leaves. It looks like you've only been a witness to the wrong way. Put me on your ignore list.

NattyLawn
02-02-2009, 02:40 PM
Put me on your ignore list.[/B]

Thanks! Will do!

treegal1
02-02-2009, 04:50 PM
SHOW ME THE STUDY!!!!

yeah that was cheese, what can you do.....

phasthound
02-02-2009, 06:59 PM
So, say I live on a corner property with 4 large oak trees, a maple, and a pretty consistent wind that blows neighbors leaves in the yard. The lawn is cleaned up at least 4 times in the fall. Now, your saying that if all the leaves were mulched, there would be no harm or smothering of any turf by the leaf mulch? I've seen it with my own eyes and on many other properties, but since you did a study, we're wrong? You obviously have an agenda here sir.
My only agenda is to offer education. We (MSU) gathered data from all over the country as to what a heavy leaf fall would be. 24" surpassed any leaf fall, including heavy oak forest land. You can do with the study whatever you want, including ignoring the simple fact that it can be done. There is a right and wrong way to properly mulch leaves. It looks like you've only been a witness to the wrong way. Put me on your ignore list.

Put the attitude away. I'm interested in learning more.

Grassmechanic
02-05-2009, 02:06 PM
Put the attitude away. I'm interested in learning more.

Then look it up youself.

Google "mulching leaves into lawn".
I found Cornell, OSU, MSU and Perdue's studies in a minute.