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DVS Hardscaper
12-10-2008, 06:39 PM
We been working on this paver driveway and motorcourt. Approx 5,800 SF.


http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y212/ScapeItWS6360CJ7/IMG_0623.jpg



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talus
12-10-2008, 07:36 PM
Holy crap!:dizzy:

mrusk
12-10-2008, 08:41 PM
Andrew I am impressed. You started laying at the road and worked up to the house RIGHT?

How wide is the driveway?

bigviclbi
12-10-2008, 08:46 PM
I'd settle for a 580 foot driveway right now. Looks like a nice long job, you guys gonna do lots of other work there or did they blow the budget on the driveway? Though a paver driveway that big they might not have a budget.

CertPro
12-10-2008, 09:32 PM
Looks like more than 5800 IMO

BrandonV
12-10-2008, 10:17 PM
looks real good, hopefully they still have the budget from some big trees/shrubs

stuvecorp
12-10-2008, 11:14 PM
Pretty cool.

Tyler7692
12-10-2008, 11:16 PM
Lots-o-pavers !

DVS Hardscaper
12-10-2008, 11:20 PM
The fun part will be the backfilling of soil and putting down erosion control blankets! Probably going to need at least 4 tandem loads. Our skid steers are rubber tire, and they're not going to make it up the hill at this time of year, and I'm not taking the skid steers over the pavers. So, I have a nice, little New Holland Utility Tractor at my residence that we'll probably use.

CertPro
12-11-2008, 10:22 AM
Any close-up pics of the pattern and cuts?

DVS Hardscaper
12-11-2008, 11:03 AM
Close ups to follow soon. The day I took this pic I was driving my personal truck, and as I was leaving I remembered "hey the camera is here", so I shot a pic as I was leaving.

The cuts are perfect, thats one thing I preach to our prospective clients.

The client purchased the pavers on his own, long before we met. They are Belgard's 4 piece Bergerac pavers that were manufactured in 2006. Meaning they were made when Belgard was having *issues*. Although the pavers are fine, only a small handfull had to be tossed to the side. I am not for certain, but I believe the owner found a dealer south of D.C. that had gone out of business and I believe he paid around $100.00, maybe $150.00 / cube, and each cube has 106 sf. The pavers can only be installed in the random running pattern, which we have running widthwise. It looks good. I would not have recommended using this paver, but he already had 56 cubes setting behind the house. Yet......on the other hand, about 4-6 years ago Belgard had a nice catalog that had a paver driveway in the same pattern.

The owner had made mention of a nice patio with kitchen, which I am envisioning multi-level. It may be a long, long, long, long, time before that happens because this house is already over budget. I don't see this happening in the next 12 months.

I doubt there will be large plantings, as mother nature already took care of the trees, it's a wooded lot!

What I am hoping to sell and what I would be most excited about is the lighting of the home. Nice, Outdoor Lighting excites me more than hardscaping :)

CertPro
12-11-2008, 12:00 PM
Can't wait to see the close ups. Nice job!

PlatinumLandCon
12-11-2008, 05:09 PM
Lighting can really set a house off. Even a dozen or so creatively placed lights can make it look great. Looks like a cool job. Was it heated? (Do you get much snow in that area?)

mrusk
12-11-2008, 07:19 PM
DVS did you follow ICPI guidelines and start from the lowest elevation and work up hill?

TSGVA
12-11-2008, 10:50 PM
DVS, I know you had the cubes stationed up hill from where you started, but did you end up using a paver cart for the job or did you just bring a few cubes down to the laying face with the SS then screed your sand?

I posted a question earlier about the functionality of paver carts. I know it depends on each site....we just haven't used one yet and we have a 6000 sf driveway coming up in January....thought I might give it a shot. Any pro's or con's?

DVS Hardscaper
12-11-2008, 11:09 PM
We do not own a paver cart and nor do I plan on getting one. With 95% of our jobs (we mostly build patios), we're able to set the cubes right in the work area. But this driveway has non-level elevations on the bulk of both sides. So where we were unable to set cubes......the pavers were moved by hand. And YES, even I carried pavers!

mrusk
12-11-2008, 11:29 PM
We do not own a paver cart and nor do I plan on getting one. With 95% of our jobs (we mostly build patios), we're able to set the cubes right in the work area. But this driveway has non-level elevations on the bulk of both sides. So where we were unable to set cubes......the pavers were moved by hand. And YES, even I carried pavers!

So where did you start laying?

Rex Mann
12-12-2008, 12:49 AM
Andrew,

Did you put a seam in on the bend to account for the running bond?

Nice job.

Peace,

Rex

http://PaversInstalled.Com

CertPro
12-12-2008, 08:53 AM
DVS it may just be the pic, but it looks as if your "shoulder" is not wide enough. Looks like it tapers away from the pavers almost instantly. Is that the case?

DVS Hardscaper
12-12-2008, 09:40 AM
Yes the bends have a few seams.

Shoulders: That is something else I preach to prospective clients. At the moment there is 12-inches of shoulder, and when the paver install is complete (compacting, polysand, etc), we'll come back and install more gravel and compact. The pic was taken from about 50 yds away, no detail is visible, and much of the shoulder is covered with bedding sand.

MRusk - after almost 13 years of installing pavers....I think we know where to start laying :)

Whats both concerning and surprising me is there is one important concern here, and NOT one person here at this forum has brought it up yet.

mrusk
12-12-2008, 10:27 AM
Whats both concerning and surprising me is there is one important concern here, and NOT one person here at this forum has brought it up yet.

That the porta potty pumper truck will have to drive on the new driveway? That stinks!

hosejockey2002
12-12-2008, 12:17 PM
How deep is the base, and how was it compacted? That had to be many,many loads of base material.

DVS Hardscaper
12-12-2008, 12:27 PM
base is over 18" and was compacted with a 14 ton roller.

CertPro
12-12-2008, 01:31 PM
Is it the steepness of the drive and the performance of the joint sand?

TSGVA
12-12-2008, 02:40 PM
18" base....well it shouldn't be going anywhere. Did you get Proctor on it? How is the soil up there...must be solid clay for an 18" base.

Dountman
12-12-2008, 06:34 PM
i'd be concerned about that water coming down that hill.

Greenboy24
12-13-2008, 12:30 AM
That looks like one fun job, I've never seen such a large paver drive on such a grade. Must have been fun lol.

I'd be concerned with the water and the corners....with a hill like that I'd think that when a car is constantly stopping and accelerating at a particular point it may apply extra pressure to those areas??????Not sure if this is remotely right, just the second thing that popped into my head.

steve5966
12-13-2008, 12:46 AM
That looks like one fun job, I've never seen such a large paver drive on such a grade. Must have been fun lol.

I'd be concerned with the water and the corners....with a hill like that I'd think that when a car is constantly stopping and accelerating at a particular point it may apply extra pressure to those areas??????Not sure if this is remotely right, just the second thing that popped into my head.

The lateral pressure from braking may affect the pavers. I've never seen any info that I can remember that would cover this. Specificaly the bottom curve.

DVS Hardscaper
12-13-2008, 10:21 AM
That looks like one fun job, I've never seen such a large paver drive on such a grade. Must have been fun lol.

I'd be concerned with the water and the corners....with a hill like that I'd think that when a car is constantly stopping and accelerating at a particular point it may apply extra pressure to those areas??????Not sure if this is remotely right, just the second thing that popped into my head.

DING DING DING!!!

WE HAVE A WINNER!!

Water isn't a big issue, as there is a swale that catches the water before it gets to the pavers, and the water that falls from the sky onto the pavers is directed off the pavers as we have a crwon on the driveway, along with special grading at the motorcourt.

Yes, the braking will apply pressure to the pavers! And I was expecting to be bombbarded with LawnSites EXPERTS pointing this out when I posted the pic.

I believe the driveway should have a concrete curbing with 32" footers at that bottom curve. But the homeowner elected not to do it due to current financial constraints. Paperwork reflects accordingly.

Dountman
12-13-2008, 01:04 PM
Very interesting point. Never even though of that.

Greenboy24
12-14-2008, 12:30 PM
DING DING DING!!!

WE HAVE A WINNER!!

Water isn't a big issue, as there is a swale that catches the water before it gets to the pavers, and the water that falls from the sky onto the pavers is directed off the pavers as we have a crwon on the driveway, along with special grading at the motorcourt.

Yes, the braking will apply pressure to the pavers! And I was expecting to be bombbarded with LawnSites EXPERTS pointing this out when I posted the pic.

I believe the driveway should have a concrete curbing with 32" footers at that bottom curve. But the homeowner elected not to do it due to current financial constraints. Paperwork reflects accordingly.

Is it on the to-do list?
If you couldn't do the 32" footers and curbing did you do anything else to try and insure that it would stay in place?

btammo
12-14-2008, 03:54 PM
Is it on the to-do list?
If you couldn't do the 32" footers and curbing did you do anything else to try and insure that it would stay in place?

something that would have had to be done prior to laying, unless you extend the driveway more or tear back some of the already laid pavers.

CertPro
12-14-2008, 04:01 PM
I think on a project of that scope, a thousand bucks or so on curbing in the turns should be a no brainer. I think you should have done a better job selling them on that, cause eventually it will fail and then it doesn't matter what you have signed. Your name will be mud

Greenboy24
12-14-2008, 05:21 PM
Do you have any pics of a drive like that with the corners done? Anyone?

Any closeups of that one?

DVS Hardscaper
12-14-2008, 05:44 PM
Some of you need to keep in mind that we're (as in us forum participants) communicating by typing at a keyboard. With trying to get this and 2 other projects done by Christmas and with familyy related holiday activities......there is only so much one can type!!

Anyone that knows me will tell you that I am a very thorough individual. One doesn't survive 12.5 years in a competitive hardscape market solely by good looks :cool2:

I spent a fair amount of time with the client going over options for re-inforcing the turn, both in person at the site, and on the phone.

The angle of the photograghy does not show the turn.

The turn is VERY gradual.

So gradual that if it were my home.....I would not do any additional re-inforcement, I would leave it as we have it. If the pavers move.....it would be very easy for us to come back with a mini excavator, excavate a footer, and have a concrete curbing poured and finished.

mrusk
12-14-2008, 05:47 PM
I the pavers were installed correctly, with a proper setting bed, base, edging, and base part the edge, I do not think there will be any issues.

EagleLandscape
12-14-2008, 06:03 PM
mrusk, lay off. i side with you, but dont get in a pissing match. it doesnt help your cause.

TSGVA
12-14-2008, 07:23 PM
We're putting a concrete grade beam in an upcoming paver driveway project in January. I'll post some progress pictures when I get a chance

The driveway's about 6000 sf but this sloped section is only about 30'....so one grade beam at the bottom between the lower motor court and driveway will help hold the pavers in place. 'I' pattern throughout....no running bond.

DVS Hardscaper
12-15-2008, 07:13 PM
A grade bean sound like an interesting idea. TSGVA, please post pics when you get to that point.

soopa
12-16-2008, 10:39 AM
wow. how much dirt did you haul away? were you able to bring trucks up the drive as you dug or did you have to carry all your dirt to the road?

DVS Hardscaper
12-16-2008, 11:17 AM
wow. how much dirt did you haul away? were you able to bring trucks up the drive as you dug or did you have to carry all your dirt to the road?

No soil was hauled away. The only thing we hauled away was paver scraps and used pallets. Compactable fill material was both imported and cut from other places on the property, which was done by the excavating company way back when the house construction initially began.

TSGVA
12-16-2008, 11:30 AM
A grade bean sound like an interesting idea. TSGVA, please post pics when you get to that point.

Will do...it will be disguised as a 2' strip of granite cobblestones, reinforced through the 24" thick concrete footer (grade beam) with vertical rebar between the cobbles, hidden with mortar.....helping with the lateral pressure.

The cobbles will obviously be flush with the top of the pavers as it delineates between the driveway and the lower motor court. I think this is overkill for this grade (only about 6% slope over 30') but the cobbles were going to be installed anyway, so why not reinforce them and have it act as a grade beam?? Cheap insurance for a $115k project.

A big concern I had with proposing this grade beam was the sight of a concrete band going across this beautiful paver driveway....welcome the cobbles.

Kind of hard to describe on here, but hopefully you get the idea.

soopa
12-16-2008, 11:39 AM
No soil was hauled away. The only thing we hauled away was paver scraps and used pallets. Compactable fill material was both imported and cut from other places on the property, which was done by the excavating company way back when the house construction initially began.
nice, good deal.

TSGVA
12-16-2008, 11:54 AM
By the way, DVS...thanks for starting the thread and posting the pic. I meant to give you a compliment on the project earlier but got carried away as everyone started chatting.

Did you do any kind of border detail/soldier course? I'd love to see more pics if you have them.

DVS Hardscaper
12-16-2008, 12:25 PM
The driveway is comprised of 2 colors - Belgard's Fossil Beige and Silex Gray. The border is a string course border and that was done in Fossil Beige.

I'll get more pictures. We finished the paver install and clean up yesterday. I wanted to take a couple pictures but I had my hands full. Had to run errands, had to fix a flat on the skid steer, had to load and haul pallets to the wood recycling company, yadda yadda yadda.

The next step is backfilling the edge and the driveway goes over a seasonal creek bed. Looks like a rip rap will be needed to keep the drieway bed from erroding.

Thanks for the compliments! The owner told me he has 3 people that want to talk to me about doing paver driveways for them. He said he wasn't going to give me their contact info until the paver install is complete, which it now is.

Again, what I'm really excited about is the LIGHTING! The owner wanted every SF of the motor court covered in pavers. I said "no, no, we're going to put in a nice landscape bed so we can get work some lighting into the scene". Although, I think it will be a long long time before he has the funds for this.

DeereHauler
12-16-2008, 11:53 PM
if someone can afford a house like that its hard to believe funds would ever be an issue! haha


that job looks great. i look forward to more pictures in the future, Merry Christmas, and happy holidays.

DVS Hardscaper
12-17-2008, 09:53 AM
DeereHauler -

with that pic next to your name....you're in the WRONG section of LawnSite!

You need be here, and be sure to post some pictures! :


http://www.lawnsite.com/showthread.php?t=10179&page=2

DeereHauler
12-17-2008, 10:41 PM
DeereHauler -

with that pic next to your name....you're in the WRONG section of LawnSite!

You need be here, and be sure to post some pictures! :


DVS,

at first i thought i was being banned from the hardscape forum! haha, i posted a couple pics, thanks for that link!