Z Master Hydros SHOT!

[zMaster225]

I have a 2006 Toro Z Master 60" with about 600 hours on it. The hydros started acting up so I took it to the dealer where I bought it. They used a magnet and found metal filings and shavings in the hydro pumps. Basically they are screwed and need to be replaced. Ofcourse I am 6 months beyond my warranty.

Anyone have a problem similar to this? I don't believe this could happen because the mower is still so new... I have another Zmaster with 1300 hours with the original hydros and I do the exact same servicing on both.

Should I try calling Toro directly, or am I just going to have to bite the bullet on this one? Any advice?

Thanks

[mowermankevin]

Only 600 hours on a '06? Something ain't right, did it act up on you? (pumps squealing,hydro oil level change, trouble on slopes? How did you first figure out you had a problem?) It's not something that is unheard of but I've NEVER ran across 2 going down at the same time..... If you are the original buyer/owner, and you are sure you didn't starve the pumps for oil, wait for a few more posts on here, than call Toro, make sure you have not screwed up the pumps, think back ,was there a time, I had a problem and this is what I did,if a situation comes to mind, P.M. one of the posters on this thread, cause Toro will look for every reason to deny the claim, I just can't believe such a low hour machine would have this problem, except for (excuse me) some type of operator error.

[ricky86]

Do you mean they found filing in the oil tank or they took both pumps apart ? Usually there is no cross contamination. And 6 months out of a two year warranty, it's up to you dealer to go to bat for you. If it was a defect, TORO will cover it. It's up to the dealer to determine that. We would do it when there are special circumstances, such as relatively low hours

[zMaster225]

Thanks for the replies. It was the right pump that was acting up on me... I first noticed it when I had my bagging system on and i was going down a small hill and it basically didn't stop when I tried. The squealing never really was a problem and I always made sure there was the correct oil level. At first I figured it was just a little less responsive because of the extra weight from the bagger system... not to mention I drive much much slower and easier with it on as well. So I took it off and it was still a problem.

It would be hard to believe that I somehow accidentally caused this... I guess anything is possible, but I've been servicing my mowers for years and I'm always careful - never had any prior problems.

The dealer didn't take the pumps apart completely, just enough to get the magnet in there and find the filings. The mower is pretty new and hydros generally outlast everything else. I told them I wasn't spending over 3 grand to fix a $8K mower thats this new so I went to pick it up.

I appreciate the advice. I'll see what else I can find out and go from there. Luckily this happened in December and not 3 months ago!

[ricky86]

If your dealer is a Master Service Dealer, he has some working room. Both pumps don't have to be replaced because on side failed. The r/h should come out for inspection. Wheel motor can be flushed. I am employed at a dealer, and it's extremely annoying to hear dealers make snap judgement. It brings their competency into question (not to mention honestly).

[Horizon Lawn]

I have two newer toro mowers one is a diesel 52 and the other is a diesel 60 and i have had the pumps replaced on them. Not to mention drive motors and alot of other things this year. The 52 has been in the shop 8 times this year and it is an 06 model just got it back day before yesterday with a cracked frame. The dealer I originally bought it from welded the frame and i told them that i would not except that i wanted a new fram put under it and they said that there mechanic couldnt do that and probably would mess something else up when he did. So i called toro and they wouldnt even talk to me personally because i didnt have a case number. finally got intouch with local sales rep and fussed with him for about a week and they did replace it. I am a die hard toro man but with the trouble i have had this year with them i wont be buying any more toro stuff because of there service.

[ricky86]

Horizon, First: Your dealer doesn't have a mechanic- he's a f--king hack.(Frame replacement is relatively a simple repair). Second: The people at customer service at the factory assign the numbers, so there is something wrong there. The frame is warrantied for 5 years, depending on purchase date. I would be lying if I said we haven't been having "issues" with HydroGear pumps. Toro has stood behind every one I have warrantied. Mostly thrust brg and input brgs. Both are manufactured in China. If they fail they can wipe out a wheel motor. AND, your diesels might have HydroGear wheel motors which have been a problem with output shaft leakage.

[Horizon Lawn]

yeah I know that they dont have a mechanic. It was a catapiller dealer that was selling lawn mowers and all they wanted to work on was bobcats and excavaters. I could have fixed all this myself as me and my partner do all our maintenece our self but it was the point of it. And as far as the pumps, The ones on the diesels are stacked on each other and they were leaking in between them and for the drive motors they have a little keyway that is on the shaft to hold the hub on and with as much torque that these diesels have it was shearing them and when it done that it would junk the drive motors and the hubs. It was a poor design from toro. I have also had a drive motor fall off and they said that i needed to check all bolts on the mowers daily. I told them if they couldnt build them any better than that then i would not be purchasing any more from them. I just spent around 50,000 with toro last year alone. I finally found a good repair dealer around me that would help me with the warranty stuff. Needless to say the other dealer dont carry toro mowers anymore. Actually there isnt a toro dealer within 50 miles off me now that sells them. Just a few that work on them.

[ricky86]

Horizon, just so you know, oil leak is a known problem. Tell them want the OIL COOLER UPDATE. That will fix the leak which was more than just a leak.. The wheel motor and hub is a sporadic known problem.Wheel motors loosen in frame is a known problem.Tell them you want the FRAME UPDATE KIT. Mount Bolts have to be torqued.You don't have to check them every day. There are service bulletins on all except hubs, again,very sporadic. Once installed correctly, all you problems will be gone, and all should be warranty. Don't accept anything else. You are entitled to it. If the problems would have been dealt with correctly, you wouldn't have such a bad taste in your mouth. I feel that diesel is the best midmount on the market. We are a Master Service dealer and have seen and rectified all of your complaint. PM me if I can be any help (with inside info so you don't get screwed). I f--king hate the amount of dealer incompetency in this industry.

[Horizon Lawn]

Thanks a bunch so far all the problems have been fixed. And with the wheel motors toro themselves told me that they hadnt had any problems with the wheel motors coming loose but 2 weeks later i found out that they had a fix kit for the problem. I asked the toro rep if they just made the fix kit for my mowers or what and he told me that they had a few others that had the problems. I told him this was something they knew about and that i wasnt happy about them lieing to me about it. On the update for them they put some kind of square nut on the bolts and they came loose too so we fixed the problem with putting polly locking nuts on it. I use these for everything when i take something apart on one of the mowers. They dont work back loose so i dont have to worry about them anymore. Toro does have some quality issues that they are aware of and just dont wont to spend the money to fix them. I love the quality of cut i get from the toros but i told them if i was haviing to put my mowers in the shop on a weekly basis to fix problems that should have been fixed at the plant where they make them then i wouldnt be purchasing any more toro equipment. There is also a update for the blade clutch that they will not tell you about unless you have to have a new one put on under warranty. I also have a question for you since you are a service place. I paid for one of the wheel motors that the key way broke on and they paid for one what is the warranty for these if you know.

[tomo]

hello , as i read this does concern me !!!
Yes toro service is a little poor
Exmark by comparison is good

Although i have not suffered hrdraulic problems yet if it does happen dealing ewith toro will be a painfull experience ouch ..

It would appear if communication is lacking in the toro company
I have had many issuses which were solved eventually but it would appear at the very least that toro is now such a large company that the personal touch and care has long since dissapeared from customer service :hammerhead:

tomo:waving:

[ricky86]

The hub loosening could be warranty. It is suppose to be checked at 500 hrs as per maintenance schedule. The dealer will have to check with his district service manager since the repair has been done already. Maybe they can get at least the part cost. To answer your question - 1 year. And the clutch is not that big a deal. Estimated life is still about 500-700 hrs. The clutch warranty is 2 years from purchase date.

[mowermankevin]

Z-Master, so what's the latest? I hope your back up and running by now, It's getting pretty darn chilly to be crawling 'round wheel motors, 'less you have a heated shop, thought it was interesting how this thread evolved with some of the other issues that came to light, wheel motors coming loose, (use Phlanged Nuts), never come loose again, hubs leaking/breaking, just never know what your going to cause by asking a question.Keep us posted, Merry Christmas & try to stay warm

[Green Finger]

How much would that hydro job cost.

[mowerknower]

Depending on your model you are looking at about $4-6 hundred for you pump and about the same for the motor(if you need 1) at a couple hours of labor to that to install and flush the system. Also gotta add a few qts of mobil 1 at about $8 a qt and a new hydro filter.

[Horizon Lawn]

It cost me 1300 to get it fixed and i am dealing with them over it right now and trying to get my money back on this.