questions about double blade system

[ohiolawnguy]

ok, i have scoured through the posts regarding double blade systems,and still have a few questions. first off, we use bobcat 48, and 61 walk behinds, and bobcat zt 200 61 riders.12.5 to 20 hp on walk behinds, and 22-23 hp on riders. all kawasaki engines.

secondly, we currently run two gator blades, and one half moon shaped blade nearest the discharge chute.(half moon shaped blade being picture number 3 on eric elm website under double blade heading) we dont use gator on outside because it doesnt seem to throw grass out as far as a regular blade does. have been doing this for 8 or 9 years now.

1. for all essential purposes, the upper blade on a double system just mulches the grass up, and doesn't actally cut any grass. is this correct?

2. will this system work on the above mentioned machines? and if so, is there an aftermarket attachment(bracket) similar to the one pictured at eric elm website?

3. was mentioned in posts that if something is hit, the blades lose their 90 degree angle, and need to be repositioned. this could pose a problem on our riders. sometimes we cant even get blades off of riders with a compressor, and then have to resort to a block of wood, a ratchet, and cheater bar of some type to remove. usually the result of hitting something and blade tightening more. we use never seaze on blade bolts each time we service too. is their any type of tool available that could be used ot in the field if the problem were to occur, and the double blades lose their 90 degree angle?

4. also, correct me if i am wrong, but if this is done on a walk behind, wouldn't you have to resort to one of the two following options: A: using a straight blade on top because a gator blade being that close to top of deck tends to clip underneath the deck, or B: buying longer blade bolts and adding spacers(wait now that i think about it, that may not be necessary cause the upper blade will still be in same postion as originally was right?)

5. this system would also change actual cutting height by about an 1/8 inch. most people wouldn't notice it, but i would.

6. my final question, and this is for those of you who use this system to mulch leaves. we have three basic types of accounts: A:full servicee monthly, B:monthly mowing, including spring and fall leaf cleanup, and C;per cut mowing with leaf charges by the hour. for those customers who get leaf services by the hour, how would one go about charging the customer for leaves while mowing?

sorry about this post being so daggumm long. I just wanted to get some input now, so i know what to expect when we try this method once the season begins, thanks for your help and time

kevin

[David Haggerty]

Originally posted by ohiolawnguy



1. for all essential purposes, the upper blade on a double system just mulches the grass up, and doesn't actally cut any grass. is this correct?

2. will this system work on the above mentioned machines? and if so, is there an aftermarket attachment(bracket) similar to the one pictured at eric elm website?

3. was mentioned in posts that if something is hit, the blades lose their 90 degree angle, and need to be repositioned. this could pose a problem on our riders. sometimes we cant even get blades off of riders with a compressor, and then have to resort to a block of wood, a ratchet, and cheater bar of some type to remove. usually the result of hitting something and blade tightening more. we use never seaze on blade bolts each time we service too. is their any type of tool available that could be used ot in the field if the problem were to occur, and the double blades lose their 90 degree angle?

4. also, correct me if i am wrong, but if this is done on a walk behind, wouldn't you have to resort to one of the two following options: A: using a straight blade on top because a gator blade being that close to top of deck tends to clip underneath the deck, or B: buying longer blade bolts and adding spacers(wait now that i think about it, that may not be necessary cause the upper blade will still be in same postion as originally was right?)

5. this system would also change actual cutting height by about an 1/8 inch. most people wouldn't notice it, but i would.



kevin

I've been doing some experiments. Here's what I've found out. (Subject to correction by more knowledgable members):D

#1 The upper blade chops the clippings, mine got almost as dull as the bottom blade. But it doesn't cut any grass off of at the plant.

#2 Dixie chopper is the only source of these I know of. I made my own (going by Eric's picture). I used old mower blades, cut a square from the center of them on a chop saw, then welded the little wings on the sides. Because it's at the center of the blade, balancing them wasn't a big factor. I used a little cone balancer to get them close.

#3 It sounds as iff you have them torqued too tight or your cupped washer has been flattened out. You may try to get new ones here. http://www.crownscrew.com/ or from a dealer. I use the antisieze too.

#4 I had to grind down the baffeling a little to acommodate the gator blades. I figured that was better than a lot of blowout from the blades being too low.

#5 Not the way I did it. I just substituted a bracket & blade combination for one of the spacers.



I was concerned a about hitting something and over tightening the blades too. So when I added doubles to these spindles, I welded little stops to the sided of the saddles.

These are off of my Toro Groundsmaster 325-D. It has left hand turn blades. For the second mulching blade I mounted a drop center right hand turn blade upside down! I havn't tried it yet. The drop center part of the bottom blade might beat the grass too much. If it does, I'll just take them off and run the Gators.

[awm]

the customer pays less than if im bagging but exstra because the lawn is just as clean as if id bagged.my regular wklys
dont pay much . which is an incentive to be a regular.
one thing i didnt see mentioned is the added lift when u find the right blade combination. to me thats the best pt,as it gives the smootest cut. with no stragglers left.notice i said the right combination as too much lift and air goes back down an lays some grass dn. my favorite for damp conditions is mulcher and gator
for leaves. i can just about get rid of leaves in the rain with this combo.seems like each mower,is little different,so experiment.
later now an luck

[ohiolawnguy]

thanks for your comments, david, and aw marks. david, i like the picture of how you fabricated an old blade, and made a cross sector. too bad im not experienced at welding.-lol

david, in response to question number 3 i had, our riders do not have "cupped washers". they are just flat spacers the walk behinds have these cupped washers though.

thanks again!!


kevin