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View Full Version : first round all pre no fert??


mole cricket
01-27-2009, 06:13 PM
thinking of going with all pre M first round and no fert but will there be problems down the road??

wiseguyslawn
01-27-2009, 07:45 PM
i would say it depends what your last app was and the timing

mole cricket
01-27-2009, 08:47 PM
I used 26-5-9 with 40% poly. I think with the price of fert is it realy worth it to pound the N first round as long as your winter app was good

FdLLawnMan
01-27-2009, 11:31 PM
I am north of you so I am unsure when you apply your pre-m but for me I make sure I apply my winterizer late enough. Out university also recommends no nitrogen before May 15 which I have followed the past 4 years with excellent results. So to answer your question I apply only either a granular or liquid pre-m. That way on many of my lawns where crabgrass is only a problem along edges I can apply the liquid.

grassman177
01-28-2009, 12:20 AM
i have considered this too, but not done it. i always use a low N in spring anyway to not promote fungus. never use high N in wet periods. bad practice there.

the problem is that the pre em only in granular is more $. not cool and we like granular better especially converting to all zsprays for apps.

mnturfmaster
01-28-2009, 10:10 AM
I am north of you so I am unsure when you apply your pre-m but for me I make sure I apply my winterizer late enough. Out university also recommends no nitrogen before May 15 which I have followed the past 4 years with excellent results. So to answer your question I apply only either a granular or liquid pre-m. That way on many of my lawns where crabgrass is only a problem along edges I can apply the liquid.

I agree. We have always done only Pre-M in the spring with no fert. We never fertilize before may 15th. Last year with the late spring, i don't think we applied first round of fert. until about june 1st.

ant
01-28-2009, 10:21 PM
something like a 0-0-7 with pre m like dimension will work for the first round if done early enough.

DUSTYCEDAR
01-29-2009, 10:17 AM
Ant i know you want to be like james bond but 007
what you have a license to kill

sclawndr
01-29-2009, 10:57 AM
We're all for low N to avoid disease problems but at the same time, it helps to have a little N in the mix to give the yard a little pop. At the end of the day I think most customers want to see a quick green-up. We start in March and it would be hard to justify waiting until mid to late May before applying any N.

rcreech
01-29-2009, 11:06 AM
We're all for low N to avoid disease problems but at the same time, it helps to have a little N in the mix to give the yard a little pop. At the end of the day I think most customers want to see a quick green-up. We start in March and it would be hard to justify waiting until mid to late May before applying any N.

I would have to say I am with you on this one!

It doens't take much...but I would hate the thought of putting NONE down early!

Probably works both ways...but I don't think I will ever try it!

AmGreen
01-29-2009, 08:10 PM
Applying N to our warm season bermuda, zoysia, or centipede as early as our pre's you get spring dead spot like crazy. I'm sure that doesn't help you any since most of the people posting in here have been north of us, but on my fescue lawns I will be applying N with my pre.

FdLLawnMan
01-30-2009, 07:33 AM
We're all for low N to avoid disease problems but at the same time, it helps to have a little N in the mix to give the yard a little pop. At the end of the day I think most customers want to see a quick green-up. We start in March and it would be hard to justify waiting until mid to late May before applying any N.

The reason I don't use N is if the correct amount of nitrogen was applied at the right time in the fall the green-up will come from that. Adding nitrogen in the spring will only give a bunch more growth. Green-Up in the spring naturally occurs from mineralization process that occurs in the spring. With the price of nitrogen and ways to lower my cost without screwing the customer I have found this has worked well. The lawns look good and the customer isn't complaining about having to cut the lawn all the time.

grassman177
01-30-2009, 10:40 AM
currently we use a 15-3-5 30% scu. it is not much , i tried to get lowest N we could wouthout being 0. we mow all that we treat so we try to bal reen and the growth. it can be hell in srping once the rains come to keep up with extra growth. i am currently pricing some 007 with barricade to see if i can oafford that option before i consider it. we get back with round 2 with a 25-5-11+Fe at 2lbs in april withthe weed control so it isnot too long before reapp with N. this is why i am considering the no N option for round 1

cod8825
01-30-2009, 01:03 PM
Grassman we are also going with a 007 this spring we are in the same boat as you in so much as we mow all that we treat. Have you every thought of applying any Fe in the first app I know that I have heard of that.

grassman177
01-30-2009, 02:33 PM
no, i think the temps are too cold for it to be assimilated, so useless since we start at late feb early march. we do hit it in round 2 though . wehn we used our tank skids we used a liquid organic P K Fe humic and fulvic acids and Mg. i miss not using that, but i wont trade my zsprays for anything. just cant spray such a thick liquid at such a low app rate, at least i think. the product is really thick and i think it would clog the screens and nozzles. never tried, but dont want to. that product really gave some awesome results. we added in liquid 70% slow N to that mix and really loved it.

cod8825
01-30-2009, 02:53 PM
What was that product I still have a 200 gal talk sprayer and might look at that. I am still looking into doing a combo organic/synthetic program this year.

group501
01-30-2009, 04:21 PM
We're all for low N to avoid disease problems but at the same time, it helps to have a little N in the mix to give the yard a little pop. At the end of the day I think most customers want to see a quick green-up. We start in March and it would be hard to justify waiting until mid to late May before applying any N.

Also, If going into the summer months you don't have enough N you end up with other problems caused by N deficiency like Dollar Spot.

sevenbarefootlawns
01-31-2009, 12:06 AM
In my opinion N in the fall is optimal but who can really put down 2/3 of thier N in the fall. Also