Big Dilema ZTR

[MattBinford]

:blob3:
I am trying to decide between the Hustler Super z with 25hp or the Exmark Laser z with 27hp liquid cooled. I have not demoed either but will in the coming weeks. Here are the Pros and Cons so far.

Hustler Z: 25hp
Pros: Built like a tank. Good grass collection unit.
Cons: Air cooled. I would have to dump into a tarp then load onto my truck. 2 step process.


Exmark Z 27hp. Liquid cooled
Pros: More Horse power. Able to dump individual bags into truck.
Cons: Not built and robust as the Hustler.


Like I said I have not demoed either but assume both will perform well. I am leaning towards the Exmark because of the bagging and horsepower advantage.

Sharing your experience with either of these pieces of equipment would be much appreciated. By the way the price is the same for either in our neck of the woods.


Thanks...Binny

[mdb landscaping]

i have a 25hp kohler 60 inch lazer and love it. stripes great, and so far havent had one problem. im planning on getting an ultravac soon for it, and ive heard nothing but good things about it. although, i also have heard nothing but good comments about the super z. hopefully the demos will make up your mind.

[TLS]

Binny,

Dont know much about the Hustlers. Sat on and looked at a Landpride (by Hustler). They do seem very "built" and "robust". They have a few nice features, and seem very customer oriented.

However, I have to disagree about your Cons of the Lazer as NOT being "built" and "robust". Believe me, they ARE! They've been around for quite a few years. The earliest models are a bit skimpy looking (early 90's) but they are about the best built/engineered/robust mower out there. I have never heard of a commercial mowers frame failing, so maybe the "robust" looks of the Hustler are just that....for looks.

If I had a Hustler dealer nearby, I may have entertained their mowers for my last purchase, but I wanted a LC engine, and very few offer this on a ZTR.

Good Luck!

[LeoS818]

I test drove the hustler z, super z ,grasshopper, walker, JD 1600, JD 455, and 2 lazers. One lazer 60in w/23 lc and the other was a 72in diesel. Sold the 2 Dixie xw2500s weve been using. Setteled on the lazers. Bought 2 27hp lcs 72 in. One with an ultra vac, and the other with the mulching system on it. Took delivery on them on 2-27-02.

[awm]

i also would have to say that the lazer is really heavy enough to last an hold up well.
mine is tough and i sometimes ask it to be..
i would be interested in your report after demo . let us know how they compare in handeling dept.later now

[johnhenry]

Tough ? that you can only answer. I have used exmark as a loaner. Great machine one of the best. Hustler I drove one down in florida this winter its quite of bit different than a exmark. But in a good way. Either way you cant go wrong . Have fun testing:)

[longviewlawncare]

the main thing i liked about the hustler when i demoed it was that the parking brake was built into the handles so you only had to deal with one lever

[MattBinford]

Thanks for your responses. I forgot to mention this will be my first riding lawn mower. I have have been in business for 5 years and have only had wide area walk behinds (Toro's). We just landed a large commercial account. >8 acres and can finally justify a rider to the wife. I've tried before with no luck.

Just a follow up question for you hustler fans. Do you find it difficult to dump into a tarp and then load into your truck or is it not a problem? I'm just curious as I have never had to in the past.

Thanks for everyone's comments.

Binny.

[LAWNGODFATHER]

Originally posted by MattBinford
Hustler Z: 25hp
Pros: Built like a tank. Good grass collection unit.
Cons: Air cooled. I would have to dump into a tarp then load onto my truck. 2 step process.


Exmark Z 27hp. Liquid cooled
Pros: More Horse power. Able to dump individual bags into truck.
Cons: Not built and robust as the Hustler.


Like I said I have not demoed either but assume both will perform well. I am leaning towards the Exmark because of the bagging and horsepower advantage.

Air cooled is not a con!!! Plaese do a little research before you make judgements.

Dump from the seat is the best way.

Exmark not robust come on, for a mower that has had very little changes in the past 13 years, do you think that is robust or built?I have never heard of a commercial mowers frame failing.

I have it was not an Exmark, 3 of them same spot, but I can't say which brand due to LS posting guide lines.

[MattBinford]

LAWNGODFATHER,

Thanks for the response. However, you seem to not quite get the question correct. I am trying to compare not rip on any manufacture. You are aruguing both sides. Just like me. I like both, but what will be best for me. I would assume Liquid ahead of air and I would assume 27hp is better than 25. That is just the initial thought (Same price, both with collection systems). Just looking for good debate. Only then has this post be worth while.

-Binny

[RoewMow]

I agree with LGF. We did a lot of research including searches here, and demoing every unit around (at least it seems that way). We tried kubota, scag, yazoo, toro, gravely, and Exmark! Needless to say, we narrowed down on cut, dealer support, quality of reputation (what do the other lco's use), and last price in our metro area and went with the Exmark (Lazer Z 60" Kaw). The overall package just kept coming up in favor of the Exmark.

Just a little food for thought!

[crazygator]

I would like to add another thing to consider. The dealer! I am sure they are not both being sold by the same dealer, so you will have to look at each for their good and bad points as well as the equipment.

I just took delivery of a 2002 Dixie Chopper XW2600 26hp EFI. The machine is wonderful, but the dealer is even better. Anytime I have downtime and they cannot fix ASAP I get a loaner machine so I dont have to quit mowing.

Please check on the loaner deal from your dealers, this could save you one day. Also see if they will give you names and numbers of others who have bought from them. This could answer a lot of questions as well. Good luck on the new machine! :D

[MattBinford]

crazygator,
Funny thing. Both the hustler and exmark are the same dealer. He will let me demo both at the same time. The only thing is I have never purchased lawn equipment through him in the past. I have only ran Toro wide decks. He gurantees that he will always have a back up mower for me (Not sure if it is a gimick). He is also pushing me towards the Hustler. Don't know why since they are the same price.

Let the debate continue.....

Thanks Much,
Binny

[P&J Lawncare]

I have demo'd both mowers and think that they are the best two mowers out there but the hustler is better suited for my needs but I dont think you can go wrong with either brand. Well here is my 2 cents worth


hustler exmark
speed 10 8 the hustler is FAST
cut 8 10 exmark throws better
frame 9 8 hustler built solid
hydros 10 8 hydro oil cooler
motors 8 8 both have plenty power
service 10 10 both are pretty accesible
commercial cutting 10 8 speed means money
total 65 60


as for baggers I would rather dump a couple of times from the seat and then throw it in the truck. Stopping every time it is full takes alot of time on a 8 acre account.

[P&J Lawncare]

just so every body understands my post above it was seperated untill i submitted it. it should be

speed hustler 10 exmark 8 hustler is fast
cut hustler 8 exmark 10 exmark throws better
frame hustler 9 exmark 8 hustler is built solid
hydros hustler 10 exmark 8 hustler has hydro coolers
motors hustler 8 exmark 8 both have plenty of power
service hustler 10 exmark 10 both are pretty accesible
commercial cutting hustler 10 exmark 8 hustler speed equals money
total hustler 65 exmark 60

[TJLC]

My dealer carries both Hustler and Exmark ztr's. The Hustler is about 1000.00 higher than the comparable Lazer (at his place). He could have sold me the higher priced Hustler but he pushed me toward the Exmark and I'm glad he did. I admit all I did was sit on the super z (didn't actually demo it) and it seemed like a very solid well built unit. I would guess you couldn't go wrong with either machine but for me I've always been an Exmark fan, so I bought the 52" Lazer hp. Good luck.

[John Gamba]

Hi Binny
I Have All Exmark mowers And Love them But The excel Will trim Better. It has a 6" Offset deck And The bagger Is Not as Wide as exmark's. but It Hold's less. I Ran the Old 2500 Mower That's It's Bagger it come's Off with two Pin's and when You Tilt It back it go's on wheel's so You Can Roll It Up On The trailer. The Ultrvac You Need Two people to handel. And thoses Baggs Do get heavy. If You Dump on ground You Can put container's under the bagger to Make Puting in truck easeyer. The Deck On The Lazer Is 5.5" Deep Better Wet Grass Handeling And You will Mow (FASTER) With A Better Cut. If Hustler would Put a 5.5" Deep Deck I Would go Wiyh Hustler. If you Could Please Let Me Know How You Liked How The Mower's trimmed I Would Like that. Hope this help's.
Johnny G. Lawn1one Ct.:cool: :cool:

[LAWNGODFATHER]

Originally posted by P&J Lawncare
cut hustler 8 /exmark 10 /exmark throws better


There is your answer. That is what's going to make you money in the peek season.


Now I have to debate these ratings.

"hydros hustler 10 exmark 8 hustler has hydro coolers"

The hydro cooler means nothing, as eXmark uses only Mobil 1 15w-50 synthetic oil in it ONLY. Not regular oil, so the oil cooler is not needed like the Hustler has.

Speed equals money, but how much faster can you cut past 10mph? Hustler even recomends that 15mph is it's transport speed.

Peco vac, dump from the seat on a Lazer also. Takes up less space on the back side of a mower. I am not a fan of belt driven vac's, as I like pony motors.

Binny my answer is below in ever post I make that has the eXmark logo in my signature line.

I will also add the Kohler 26hp EFI, take a look at the Lazer EPS.

[MattBinford]

Thanks for all the replies.

Just a follow up question:

How do each of the rank on a slope? My planned demo will be on a 5 acre sub. that has some pretty steep Berms. How well the unit perform on a slope will have a major impact on my purchase.

Thanks again,
Binny

[P&J Lawncare]

both mowers cut very good and I didn't have to double cut with either mower it just seemed to me that the exmark threw the grass a little higher spreading it out a little bit better but not enough to sway me from a hustler. The stripping seemed to be the same on both mowers. As for hydro coolers it does make a difference you can feel the heat blowing out the fan and you can also run synthetic oil in the hustler so you get the best of both worlds. As for speed I can gurantee you that its transport speed and cutting speed are just about equal. I have ran both mowers and on a thirty acre job the hustler is just the better mower for large commercial properties. Lawngodfather have you ever demo'd the hustler (a full day) if not I would because until I demo'd the hustler I also thought that exmark was the best. I do like exmark mowers and believe they are the best mowers for residential accounts but the hustler is better on large accounts.

[P&J Lawncare]

binny, the hustler is like a billy goat on hills it handled every steep hill great

[Dave]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by LAWNGODFATHER
[B]



The hydro cooler means nothing, as eXmark uses only Mobil 1 15w-50 synthetic oil in it ONLY. Not regular oil, so the oil cooler is not needed like the Hustler has.



Give me a break:The hydro cooler means alot .I don't care what kind of oil you use,the cooler the better,Hummm I wonder why big trucks have tran & engine coolers ,they use sythetic oil for them to,towing packages in pickups uses bolt on coolers, Da because it keeps the system cooler ,so tell me what the cooler does again ??I think it will be more than nothing

[LAWNGODFATHER]

Originally posted by P&J Lawncare
As for hydro coolers it does make a difference you can feel the heat blowing out the fan and you can also run synthetic oil in the hustler so you get the best of both worlds. As for speed I can gurantee you that its transport speed and cutting speed are just about equal. I have ran both mowers and on a thirty acre job the hustler is just the better mower for large commercial properties. Lawngodfather have you ever demo'd the hustler (a full day) if not I would because until I demo'd the hustler I also thought that exmark was the best. I do like exmark mowers and believe they are the best mowers for residential accounts but the hustler is better on large accounts.

You are correct about best of both worlds but it is overkill if they just started with Mobil 1 in the first place.

I am not putting the Hustler down in any way. Just pointing out that all but the top speed of the mower may be the only differance I can really see between the 2.


Now for hill abillity, they look like they will be equil.
Oh yes I like the parking brake interlock on the Hustler, but the black seat I don't like.

No I have not demoed a Hustler yet for a full day, but if my plans go accordingly I will be demoing one for an extened period of time.

I am truely impressed with the Super Z, but untill I can put it through it's paces I can't answer any performance questions about it , or recomend it.

We'll see about cutting large acrege, I have many places smooth enough to run it as fast as it will go.

[LAWNGODFATHER]

My proof I demoed one for a bit.

[mowerconsultant]

I think it is time for me to chime in here on this one...........

The Hustler Z has a identical hydro system as the Exmarks.....
But we run 10W40 oil in them and a synthetic additive.
No hydro coolers on the Hustler Z

The Hustler Super Z that P&J is speaking of, has a hyrdo system that the Exmark does not. It is a different system. It utilizes larger pumps and smaller displacement wheel motors, to gain the higher ground speeds.
Thus it creates more heat, that is why we run hydro coolers and electric fan on the Hustler Super Z.
You need to run a Super Z to see how much more productive the higher ground speeds are, it makes a big difference.

Later
Pj

[johnhenry]

You know come to think of it I dont like the black seat either.And from a distance they look like a blazer from howard price. But all kidding aside Hustler is a great machine

[LAWNGODFATHER]

.

[kerr lawn]

i have a toro z master 26 hp efi i love it.
i will run circles around anyone and anything out there.
keep maintence, blades, grease, oil, and a good look at it every mourning and night you will be flying.
with the toro z you get that stand that makes it so then the deck comes off the ground for 5-10 min blade changing, also the gas tank tops are bigger so it is harder to miss. Early mournings or late nights at the gas station when you meant be paying attention as swiftly as you should.
exmark and toro are almost identical but these few things made me buy the toro.
my .02
peace
bryan:blob3:

[MattBinford]

Back to the Motor question. Like I mentioned before I have only ran Toro Air Cooled walk behinds. I have a 17hp kaw. Hydro 44" and 2 37" 14hp kohlers (belt drives).

Given the Hustler Super Z 25hp Kaw. air cooled is priced the same as the Lazer Z with 27hp. Kaw Liquid cooled I am temped towards the Liquid.

I am just getting Giddy thinking about either one. I can finally have a real mans mower. But hill side stability will definately play a role. Cann't wait to demo in a week.

-Binny

[BobbyBcuttin]

Matt were do i start i have never used the 25 hp. engine your talking about but i do have the 27 lc i've used it for one season with no complaints at all well maybe one and that would be 44 doller air filter. I know knothing about the exmarks but have tried the super z it was defintley awsome . My dealer also was there for the demo we both agreed it had the smothest fill to the contols of any mower we both had ever drove. one other note i've talked to pj at 2 diferent shows in the last year if he ever gets a dealer in the evansville area i will put one on the trailer.

[crazygator]

MATT,
Quick get a bag and breathe in it. I think you are about to hyperventalate!.......:D

[sheppard]

Dear Matt,

I tested both of these units. The only thing that differentiated them in my mind was 1. the weight, the Exmark was much heavier. Depending on the type of soil compaction you have in Iowa this might be a factor. In Tallahassee FL it is a big issue. There are yards all over this town that have huge ruts in them (primarily from big Scags).

2. You'll burn more gasoline pulling that liquid cooled system.

3. If you are on a slope and this things shifts and/or flips on you... boy or boy will there ever be a big, slick human grease spot.

4. If it ever gets stuck you will need a very big winch.


5. The Hustler was simple and I did not have to think to much about it when I was mowing. Sometimes mower are more intuitive that other re: operator friendliness. Hustler was the easiest to operate and just mow.

If I was set on buying a seated ZTR it would have been Hustler hands down.

For a number of other factors the Wright Stander was more suited to me so I picked mine up Yesterday (52"). Got it for $5999.00

[TLS]

If your comparing a LC'ed mower to an air cooled mower, its not apples to apples. Just too many differences. But he can get them for around the same price, thats why hes comparing them.

The Hustler uses a vertical shaft air cooled engine, and in 60" configuration weighs 1190 lbs.

The LC'ed Lazer uses a horizontal shaft LC'ed engine, and in 60" configuration weighs 1213 lbs.

I'd say that if you can feel 23 lbs then your pretty good! The Lazer has three stacked plates of 3 each under the floor pan to offset the LC'ed engines weight. I have removed 2 of the 3 plates and it makes it a totally different mower. BTW, each of these 3 plates weighs at least 30 lbs!! So now I'm down to around 1150 lbs or so with a better weight transfer to the rear tires.

As for the automatic parking brake, well its a little on the gimmicky side, sure it may be convienient, but it would never make or break my decision on a ZTR.

Buy what floats your boat!

[sheppard]

I sit corrected- thanks for the clarification.

Cordially,
Sheppard

[quality]

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