Walkbehinds: Exmark, JD, or Toro [Archive] - LawnSite.com™ - Lawn Care & Landscaping Business Forum

FrankenScagMachines

03-08-2002, 08:48 PM

I'm 14 yrs old, starting out on a limited budget and I'm looking at 32"-36" walk behinds. Narrowed down to eXmark, Toro, and John Deere. JD and eXmark dealers are 3 miles down the road. Toro is about the same in the other direction. Not any big deals as far as that goes. I called about a eXmark and JD. The 32" eXmark Metro (12.5hp Kawi ) was quoted for $2995 and the JD place said $2549 for a 36" one. Both are gear drive. Can't afford hydro. Now here's another thing to consider: last summer i worked part time for the JD place and got a 15% discount. I could work there again this summer and get the 36" mower for $2167 or so. But then I'd be stuck makin minimum wage sweeping the floor and cleanin the toilet... half the time, the other half mowing their spacious 5 acres. (that's a full 8 hour day endeavor after moving all the equipment outta the way and trimming alot of fence and building) so here's what it's down to (not counting the Toro):

1) 12.5 hp eXmark 32" for $2995
2) 13hp JD 36" for $2549
3) or get job at JD and put in 16 hrs a week and get the 36" for $2167

right now it seems like 2 or 3 is best option and at this point maybe 3.. i don't mind minimum wage even though i can make alot more mowing, but I don't like doing cleanup work. which is only one 8 hour day a week but still... I could make a lot more mowing. so what do you think about it?
anyone had bad experiences with any of the mowers mentioned? do they both stripe good? I know they cut good but I really want it to stripe good too. Is one easier to use than the other? I know I need to test drive them but they don't have them here, both have them 45 minutes up the road though and will gladly bring it down for me but I want a second opinion first.
Thanks alot for bearing with me here.
Eric

JJOHN22042

03-08-2002, 08:57 PM

Looked at J/D, Scag and Exmark. I have been sold on Exmark due to the Service and also due to the fact they are on the Lawnsite for Questions and Help.

Passed on the J/D due to slow for parts and lack of service

Passed on Scag due to only one Dealer in the Area and Prices just too High.

johnhenry

03-08-2002, 09:12 PM

Exmark & Toro will last alot longer for you as long as you maintain it. Though I can see your reason with the deere.You might be better off now with deere but in the long run you would be alot happier with the other two Also exmark and toro are the same company

Doogiegh

03-08-2002, 09:19 PM

First off, I am just starting out myself, but am very impressed being that you say you're 14 and I'm twice your age, and I'm considering also buying a Scag, Exmark, or other brand right here in NJ, also a 32 or 36 inch mower..

I need mine to be able to fit through all the gates around here, and I know a 48 wouldn't be able to. I also, like you, can't afford or justify a Hydro, especially since I am just starting out.

Now, I would find out if there is another John Deere dealer in your area.

If there is, the American thing to do is get the JD mower for the cheap price of $2100. Work with the guy for the first 2 or 3 weeks then quit. This way you got the mower at the cheap price, and he's out a part-timer. Oh well. Now of course you won't be able to go back to him for service, but if there is another dealer in your area, no problem..

JUST KIDDING!!! ;-)

What I WOULD do is check with each dealer on their service time-tables for how quick they get parts and how well each machine is backed up by the manufacturer. I bet you're going to start out agressive and with alot of hours on the machine yearly, so get the best service and dealer behind you that you can.

You already know from the JD Dealer to some degree how he operates, if it's a legit or a "shady" shop (overcharging customers for things they don't need, etc).

Oh well, gotta go. Best of luck with it.

Gary

dlandscaping

03-08-2002, 09:40 PM

the exmark price is too high. here a 32 metro 12.5 kawi is about $2000, the 36 with 12.5kawi is $2400 with the 15 kawi twin it is $2600 which is the same price as the 48 metro with 15kawi. for ecs add $100.

when i was 14 i bought my first walkbehind and it was a toro 36 fixed which is an exmark with the tbar since i did not want the pistol grips. It has the 12.5 kawi which can be a real pain to pull compared to the new twin engines. I paid $2572 for with the $250 bag. Very solid machine only had one problem in almost 2 years and about 300hrs. The blade clutch was off but was fixed under warranty. What i can tell you is start off with a 36 unless you really have gates. That 4 inches doesnt seem like much, but the 32 machine is really smaller than the 36 in all aspects. The wheels are thinner, deck smaller etc. I work with a guy who has a toro 32 fixed and 2 exmark 32s. He got the exmarks with 9hsp briggs on them for $450 each with bag and little use (5yrs old). You might want to check used. He has had to do nothing to either of the machines and the engine handles all types of grass including wet and thick without stalling but it will clump a lil. Shop around and if you can't get used, get machine you like best after demoing. take a look at ecs or tbar.

E-man

03-08-2002, 10:48 PM

If you go with the JD why worry about the discount if you can make more mowing than working for him for minimum wage.I think you should be able to make up the four hundred rather easy, with mowing rather than having to work for him and maybe loose out on other jobs you could get, but now dont have the time to handle.

just my 2 cents

proline32

03-08-2002, 11:23 PM

I have the proline 32 deck with a T bar and it really is a very versatile machine, very durable, great cut, and I do have a sulky on it that comes off easy. the sulky works great on flat, smooth yards and the mower pulls me just fine though I do have to replace belts a little more frequently( I weigh about 230). I personally beleive the toro will hold up better than a JD, I personally don't care for JD though it could be due to the fact that they wouldn't give me 5.9% financing but toro did give me 1% financing on new mowers so you can see why I liked toro. Not to mention the quality, the nice thing about the 32 is that I can get it up in the truck without the use of a trailer.... I just need ramps.

leeslawncare

03-08-2002, 11:27 PM

well.guy. I started out with a gs 30 deere belt drive36".got it 4 yrs ago.All that haswent bad was a timeing belt"in the field" It suxed.Where i live J.D.dealers come an go ,well as i can say my belt went out last year an my dealer was gone.If you know the right places you can get ANY parts you need.Deere"s are good .I just Got a used Ex-mark52" tracer from a friend for 3k nice machine,Haven't used it much (4x's) but just in serviceing it i found they are alot of folks that carry STUFF!For it . My nearest dealer is like 50 miles away ,But to make a long story short these mowers from what i see are about the same .If you find any kind belt or bearing shop in your town ,you will find what you need .Hope this helps you You DON"T need to wrk for the dealer for your discount you will make it up in the long run ! Good luck Lee

65hoss

03-09-2002, 05:42 AM

I'm not sure what they priced you, but the price on the eXmark doesn't seem correct. That mower is not that high. We just picked up a new 36" metro with 15 Kohler about 3 weeks ago for $1999. Distributor here still has them on special. You should be able to get the 32" for much cheaper than $2900. Find out from eXmark what the suggested retail price is and then go from there. Post it on the eXmark forum.

goodbeus

03-09-2002, 07:22 AM

Originally posted by BushHogBoy
I'm 14 yrs old, starting out on a limited budget and I'm looking at 32"-36" walk behinds. Narrowed down to eXmark, Toro, and John Deere. JD and eXmark dealers are 3 miles down the road. Toro is about the same in the other direction. Not any big deals as far as that goes. I called about a eXmark and JD. The 32" eXmark Metro (12.5hp Kawi ) was quoted for $2995 and the JD place said $2549 for a 36" one. Both are gear drive. Can't afford hydro. Now here's another thing to consider: last summer i worked part time for the JD place and got a 15% discount. I could work there again this summer and get the 36" mower for $2167 or so. But then I'd be stuck makin minimum wage sweeping the floor and cleanin the toilet... half the time, the other half mowing their spacious 5 acres. (that's a full 8 hour day endeavor after moving all the equipment outta the way and trimming alot of fence and building) so here's what it's down to (not counting the Toro):

1) 12.5 hp eXmark 32" for $2995
2) 13hp JD 36" for $2549
3) or get job at JD and put in 16 hrs a week and get the 36" for $2167

right now it seems like 2 or 3 is best option and at this point maybe 3.. i don't mind minimum wage even though i can make alot more mowing, but I don't like doing cleanup work. which is only one 8 hour day a week but still... I could make a lot more mowing. so what do you think about it?
anyone had bad experiences with any of the mowers mentioned? do they both stripe good? I know they cut good but I really want it to stripe good too. Is one easier to use than the other? I know I need to test drive them but they don't have them here, both have them 45 minutes up the road though and will gladly bring it down for me but I want a second opinion first.
Thanks alot for bearing with me here.
Eric

Go with a 36" Exmark...I run Exmark and so do a lot of other people..it's hard to beat the quality of cut and the dependability...and why a 36" to a 32"...the 32" will only save a few extra minutes from a regular self-propelled 20" and it's not worth the money...for a few bucks more, the 36" will save you more time and still be able to go through gates...

GREENMANAGEMENT

03-09-2002, 09:08 AM

I HAVE AN EXMARK 36" METRO. I PAID ABOUT $1999 FOR MINE ALSO. TALK TO THE DEALER ABOUT THE PRICE. SOUNDS A LITTLE HIGH. I'VE HAD NO PROBLEMS WITH MY MACHINE. DEFINATELY GO WITH THE 36". IT WILL FIT THROUGH JUST ABOUT EVERY GATE.
ALSO, THE EXPERIENCE I'VE HAD WITH JD IS THAT THEY ARE SLOW AND NOT REALLY GEARED FOR US PROFESSIONAL LAWN MAINTENANCE FOLK. MY .02. GET YOU SOME BUSINESS AND DO A GOOD JOB AND YOU WON'T HAVE ANY PROBLEM PAYING FOR THAT MOWER.:D

lawnboy11

03-09-2002, 10:07 AM

The gs30 JD is a TANK. I've hads mine over 2 years and it rocks. NO major problems, only normal wear/tear, belts, filters, etc. The warranty is awesome too. 2 yrs. commercial and my dealer has done about 400$ worth of work under it for me like new tire (worn after 2 yrs), belts, filters, all free! He says they have sold many and they rarely come in for any service at all. I would go w the JD, but just pay for it w/o working for minimum wage. You (or maybe your folks) could finance it. I pay 94$ a month with the bagger.

Toroguy

03-09-2002, 10:16 AM

Bush hog,

I have had great results with my Exmark Metro. The striping is nice even without a striping kit.

At your stage I would probably lean to price and location. The closer the dealer the easier the service. If you continue working at the dealer all your parts for maintenance will be discounted also. You can also post your machine for sale at the dealership when its time to upgrade.

I know people who have had no problems with a Deere, Im not sure of the striping effect of the Deere deck?

FrankenScagMachines

03-09-2002, 11:55 AM

Transportation is not a worry, i've got a trailer. Location is not a worry, all dealers about same distance.
Just called Toro dealer, salesman in today (saturday) doesn't know much about it as they just became a Toro dealer last year. And he can't find his book so said call again Monday to talk to the other guy. He said they would beat JD's price if possible. There are advantages and disadvantages to workin for deere. The response seems to lean toward Toro and Exmark? Another question I have is, is what problems have you encountered with any of these machines (all three brands) within and without the warranty period?
I would buy any of them but the price will definately influence me but I'd hate to get a poor product just cause i was cheap. so "what's the cheapest best mower?" If Toro will beat or meet JD's price, i'll get it.
Is the Tbar or the pistol grip easier? Tbar?
Does fixed deck or floating deck make much difference in the cut? I'll probably cut around 2.5" to 3" average. Not the best lawns around but less than 3 years old, in a new addition. I'm not sure if i'll be able to get alot of lawns to start with, but i do have a mower to use until i get the money saved for the new one (rather not finance it if possible, just save till i have it)
what is the best season for sales? fall?
Thanks so much!
Eric

Doogiegh

03-09-2002, 01:36 PM

Originally posted by BushHogBoy
. There are advantages and disadvantages to workin for deere. The response seems to lean toward Toro and Exmark? Another question I have is, is what problems have you encountered with any of these machines (all three brands) within and without the warranty period?
I would buy any of them but the price will definately influence me but I'd hate to get a poor product just cause i was cheap. so "what's the cheapest best mower?" If Toro will beat or meet JD's price, i'll get it.
Eric

Here's what I figure has been summarized so far:

THE JD dealer will save you money initially because he'll the discount the mower for you. BUT many people on here have said that the price you got on the Exmark is way out of wack, so the "savings" you're looking at on the JD isn't really all that much, especially since the JD price should come down.

In addition, even if the JD guy saves you $400, you have to work for him at minimum wage for at least 1 day a week. If you were to buy the exmark or toro mower, you'd be able to make up the $400 in mower price easily by being able to cut that 1 day that you would of been working for the JD guy..

From the response on here so far, it seems like the Exmark is getting the most votes, there has been some talk about Toro (but being they are only been there for 1 year, etc I don't know if I trust them yet as a dealer), and there's always the JD option in which he could sell your mower for you in a couple of years, discount your parts, etc.

But I'd say go with the Exmark because on a brand new mower, under warrenty, you shouldn't have to spend any money to get it fixed if anything goes wrong with it initially, etc..

By the time the JD or Exmark is out of warrenty, you'll be 16 or 17 and into this in a very big way, or quit cutting grass and doing something entirely different.

Gary

FrankenScagMachines

03-09-2002, 02:37 PM

I neglected to mention that the Toro guy is a long time area dealer, known to have a pretty good record. He carries all sorts of stuff (DC's, Wheel Horse GT's, all Toro stuff, and Lawn Boy's, and some other stuff too) but just last year he got the Toro walk behinds.
Eric

JJOHN22042

03-09-2002, 04:16 PM

Nice Cut on the Lawn, but the Lawn looks like it could use some water.

FrankenScagMachines

03-09-2002, 06:24 PM

well that was taken a few weeks ago, grass was practically dead and it was about 38 degrees... yes it could use some H 2 0.... here is what I cut it with, another great Toro product, for homeowner use only :)
http://www.geocities.com/ecgrounds/images/torobagger1.jpg
Eric
ps. later i'll send some really nice stripes from our Wheel Horse GT.

FrankenScagMachines

03-09-2002, 07:50 PM

Cut with our family's 1992 Toro/Wheel Horse 520H / 48" deck, side discharge. This was taken last summer in my back yard.

snow

03-09-2002, 07:59 PM

Maybe it's just, me a few weeks ago you were talking about cutting lawns for $20, and loving a toro rear engine rider and now you want a $3k machine to cut like 4 lawns. I'm just wondering how you will be able to pay this machine off.

If you only have a few lawns, why do you need a new mower? why not look for a used one to start off and not have to worry about payments. A 32" machine is also harder to find than a 48", so why buy something smaller.

Just call up Stone and buy his 48" mulcher for $900 and you're set.

Bryan

TOSLC

03-09-2002, 10:42 PM

BushHogBoy, being within thirty minutes of you I can assure you that the ExMark dealer is high! I bought a 48 ExMark Turf Tracer two years ago and the JD dealer in Greensurg beat the price of the JD dealer in Columbus (corner of 9 and 46) by about $1000! How can there be that much difference? I am tickeled to death with my ExMark and would buy another one in a heartbeat. My advice would be to call the JD dealer in Greensburg and get a quote from them. If you need a contact or phone number just e-mail me. By the way I use the WB about 20 hours a week, and other than routine maintenance (Filters, plugs, oil, etc.) I haven't laid a wrench on it!

dlandscaping

03-10-2002, 07:33 PM

why don't you just use that toro rider you have. If thats a hydro drive its close to a $4000-5000 machine. Do you need a walkbehind if you have 4 yards. I used 21 inch models for years till i just had too many yards to do in the free time i had from school. A walkbehind is not necessary to establish yourself in this industry and i do remember you saying how great your tractor was a few weeks ago.
if you dont work at the deere place for minimum wage, do you have enough work lined up to make money during those hours. Since i did not have as many clients as i wanted during the summer i worked with another lco for min wage but it was easy work and i was learning about the industry. Through this guy i have learned pricing and have met 6 other companies. it is working for me and this season i am using my larger mowers on his larger yards for $25 a yard which is easy money.

stslawncare

03-10-2002, 07:46 PM

why arnt u considering other brands? it might be worth teh extra time to travel to get them for a better price? and whats wrong with the tractors?

FrankenScagMachines

03-10-2002, 08:21 PM

who said i was doin 4 lawns?
My toro rider will have to do to start with, and i am thinking about a used one, but I hope to do about 15 to 20 lawns within this year or the next and I really wanted a new machine, or if it was used, low hours, under 350 or so. Why am I only considering these brands? Because it seems that they are some of the better ones that i can get around here.
TOSLC-
you might know the eXmark dealer i mean, it's McGuire International, right beside Hendren's JD at 9 and 46.
Eric

FrankenScagMachines

03-10-2002, 08:28 PM

JJOHN22042

03-10-2002, 08:29 PM

Your only 14? Well that Lawn Looks GREAT for the mower your using. Keep up the Good work. Wish you the Best of luck..:)

little green guy

03-10-2002, 11:58 PM

Get a SCAG ;) In my opinion scag makes the best walkbehind out there. I've have 2 52" hydro's and I begining to think that there's no way to kill them, beleive me, if thiers anybody who can kill a machine it's us. I've had people drive my scag's off 5' high rock wall's, flip them upside down, run striaght into trees, everything and that just the stuff that i found out about, who knows what else they did to them that nobody wanted to tell me about. I don't care if the scags are more $ they're worth it. I think exmark makes the best riders but, Scag makes the best walk-behinds.

Also, which ever brand you go with, stay loyal to your dealer, it's one of the most important busness realionships you can have IMOP. I can't tell you how many times my dealer has hooked me up. To me the dealer is more important than the brand, ( guess i got lucky though cause my dealer has scag, exmark, wright stander, redmax, shindaia and stihl, all the stuff i like anyway) But don't just buy a michine because you can save 400.00.

hey man, your getting a good start, I started when i was like 13 or something too and now I have 2 trucks and trailers, 3 walkbehinds, a rider and a ton of other stuff, and i'm only 18. If you can try to work for another bigger landscape company too during the summer or whatever, believe me the expierence and relationships you will gian are invalubale. Whatever you do remeber your still young, have fun and don't just work all the time. WORK HARD PLAY HARD.

stslawncare

03-11-2002, 07:01 AM

good advice littlegreenguy on dealer relationships, i was wondering how long it would be till someone mentioned another brand lol

FrankenScagMachines

03-11-2002, 07:15 AM

thanks for the good advice littlegreenguy. i will remember that dealer relations stuff. Thing is, here, there's the JD dealer who only carries JD and Woods pull behind mowers and blades, and the IH dealer sells eXmark and that's all he sells, IH and eXmark. But the Toro dealer is my most likely place to 'one stop shop' so he might be better anyway. can't afford a scag even if there was a close dealer. Undecided between Deere and Toro... if Toro will match JD's price i'll get it. The thing about a used one isn't so much the warranty but they're just so high houred usually. The ones i find are at least 800 hours and they usually hold their price somewhat... i heard that the dealer don't pay $hit for them even if they're perfect used ones, but they resell high. The toro guy did not have a used one and the eXmark place didn't either. JD might have. I take good care of my stuff i'm not worried about driving it off a 5' wall into trees etc. I just want a good machine that will last and be affordable. I wanted to save until i could afford it. Used would be fine if it had less than 600 hours or less.
JJOHN22042 - The tractor on left mowed it, 1992 Wheel Horse 520H with a 48" deck. Nice tractor but if i could change 3 things, it would have a foot hydro pedals instead of hand, and it would have a JD style CC (like the newer JD and Wheel Horses have) and Power steering with tighter steering. Oh what the heck, i wanna 60" Dixie Chopper!!! But we use it to till our 1/10th acre garden too. 36" rear mount tiller. Does anyone know if you can get mulcher/gator type blades for it's 48" side discharge deck? I can't find any around here. Thanks
Eric

TOSLC

03-11-2002, 11:14 AM

BushHogBoy, you can get Gator blades for the Toro in Milroy. It's about half way between Greensburg, and Rushville. Probably about 45 minute trip for you. Greensburg just got a Prime Time grill and bar, so maybe you can talk your parents into lunch! I'm not sure if you can place the name of the dealer and his phone number on the forum, so e-mail me at toslc@hotmail.com and I'll give you the information. He is the dealer I do all my business with and will keep doing all my business with. He has a lot of used pieces of equipment. He carries Toro/Wheelhorse, Scag, Walker, Dixon, Encore, Backtold Brothers, Honda, Lawn Boy, Echo, and Johnsered. Im sure I missed a few, but that's what I can remember seeing. He also just built a new building. Let me know if your interested.