PDA

View Full Version : I applied Pendimethlyn on new sod-should i worry?


centraltxturf
02-22-2009, 02:51 PM
Well, I re-read the label this weekend for Barricade. It says specifically NOT to apply to new sod. Well, I missed that before I had done so on two occasions this spring.

On one lawn, I applied 0-0-7 w/ Pendy on a newly sodded (last fall) Bermuda lawn. I was using my new permagreen, and discovered I went pretty heavy. I'm worried about the repercussions.

Another lawn I applied Barricade in a liquid form to a brand new zoysia lawn. I applied at the 1lb per acre rate (low rate).

Can anyone tell me with experience what I should expect? I have a feeling it's not good- I'm wondering how bad it's going to be.

I try not to be a dumbarse but I'll admit I really feel like one now. Especially if I ruined these people's new turf.

humble1
02-22-2009, 03:08 PM
Well, I re-read the label this weekend for Barricade. It says specifically NOT to apply to new sod. Well, I missed that before I had done so on two occasions this spring.

On one lawn, I applied 0-0-7 w/ Pendy on a newly sodded (last fall) Bermuda lawn. I was using my new permagreen, and discovered I went pretty heavy. I'm worried about the repercussions.

Another lawn I applied Barricade in a liquid form to a brand new zoysia lawn. I applied at the 1lb per acre rate (low rate).

Can anyone tell me with experience what I should expect? I have a feeling it's not good- I'm wondering how bad it's going to be.

I try not to be a dumbarse but I'll admit I really feel like one now. Especially if I ruined these people's new turf.

If it was sodded last fall, I would think you would be okay now,

tlg
02-22-2009, 05:26 PM
If the lawns were established you will more than likely be ok. As long as the grass was rooted well. You could get some stunting of growth but I doubt you will have permanent damage if you over applied though.

mngrassguy
02-22-2009, 06:44 PM
New sod shouldn't need a pre. So you applied then read the label? Oh, oh. Bet you won't do THAT again. Are you licensed? Sorry, just had to ask.

scweedman
02-22-2009, 07:15 PM
What makes you think new sod doesn't need pre-emergent.

VARMIT COMMISSION
02-22-2009, 07:33 PM
Out where I live houses are built on top of pasture ground. The new dormant sod is almost unseen with winter weeds growing in between the rolls.. In fact some of it is being lifted by weeds. Every new yard out here gets a pre-m. My favorite is Musk thisle stalk's the size of your wrist and my hose unable to bend them over. I have to go around them like they are tree's. They would probably tip my PG over if I hit it.

mngrassguy
02-22-2009, 10:41 PM
What makes you think new sod doesn't need pre-emergent.

Experience. Maybe the shorter growing season makes a difference here. I might see some break through in between sod rolls but that's very seldom.

greendoctor
02-22-2009, 10:55 PM
Out where I live houses are built on top of pasture ground. The new dormant sod is almost unseen with winter weeds growing in between the rolls.. In fact some of it is being lifted by weeds. Every new yard out here gets a pre-m. My favorite is Musk thisle stalk's the size of your wrist and my hose unable to bend them over. I have to go around them like they are tree's. They would probably tip my PG over if I hit it.

What kind of pre-m do you prefer around newly laid sod. I get to deal with new sod and weeds 12 months out of the year. I like a simazine/Banvel mix around new grass. No root pruning or growth ******ant effects, but broad spectrum control of most weeds. I see another horror here. Purple nutsedge poking through new sod. It sometimes comes up as thick as a lawn. I wait until the sod has grabbed the ground underneath and go at it with Certainty.

quiet
02-22-2009, 11:00 PM
Experience. Maybe the shorter growing season makes a difference here. I might see some break through in between sod rolls but that's very seldom.

It's not the longer growing season, it's the dormant period that leads to weed invasion here in the south. In our average winter, we don't get any snow, and only occasional freezing temps here in Austin, TX. But rhe turf is dormant from Dec 1 to March 1. Meanwhile temps are on a roller coaster - anywhere from 85 to 20 degrees, with wide daily temp swings of 40 and even 50 degrees. If a lawn was sodded in the fall, it's not gonna grow and compete with weeds until spring. As Varmint Commission noted, those gaps between sod rows have no competition during the winter. Add some rain, and those winter weeds can get to biblical proportions!

But that being said, I'm still very leery of putting any pre-m - particularly pendi - on new sod. That sure isn't gonna help it get rooted and established. I think the better option in sod 1st year is to treat post-m and let the customer know the downside, but why you're taking the "long term" approach. Once zoysia gets established it fights weeds off real well without a preemergent.

quiet
02-22-2009, 11:14 PM
What kind of pre-m do you prefer around newly laid sod. I get to deal with new sod and weeds 12 months out of the year. I like a simazine/Banvel mix around new grass. No root pruning or growth ******ant effects, but broad spectrum control of most weeds. I see another horror here. Purple nutsedge poking through new sod. It sometimes comes up as thick as a lawn. I wait until the sod has grabbed the ground underneath and go at it with Certainty.

Interesting! But as you state, you have a 12 month growing season. I don't like using simazine on hybrid bermuda; I just don't like the stunting and the ******ing of green-up I've seen.

As a side note, I do work in an age-restricted community. You should see those retirees water the crap out of new sod, and then the nutsedge just goes absolutely crazy!

greendoctor
02-22-2009, 11:59 PM
I keep simazine at no more than 1 lb per acre on adequately fertilized bermuda and have no problems. I also avoid usage on any grass that is partially dormant due to cold or lack of sun. My soil is probably different as well. It is very heavy clay and sometimes acidic. Simazine is a different animal on sandy, alkaline soils. If I were dealing with a lawn emerging from spring green-up, I would actually hit weeds with a postemerge and wait on the simazine, using it a little later to keep a lawn clean over the summer.

I have no choice on the watering. My worst lawns have been the ones that were kept deserts by the previous occupants of the property. New owners come in, have sod put down and if you do not water sod here, it dies. I probably give the most difficult to follow instructions to someone who is faced with a nutgrass lawn. I tell them to wait a couple of weeks more until the sod had rooted. Then at that time, I destroy the nutgrass. Note that I have probably applied a 20-20-20 prior to or at the same time I am telling the owner I will be back to kill the weeds.

VARMIT COMMISSION
02-23-2009, 07:57 AM
greendoctor


What kind of pre-m do you prefer around newly laid sod. I get to deal with new sod and weeds 12 months out of the year. I like a simazine/Banvel mix around new grass. No root pruning or growth ******ant effects, but broad spectrum control of most weeds. I see another horror here. Purple nutsedge poking through new sod. It sometimes comes up as thick as a lawn. I wait until the sod has grabbed the ground underneath and go at it with Certainty.

Greendoctor,
I like simazine on new lawns. I think it's root pruning abilities are very limited here. It is the shortest lived pre-m that I use. I like its post activity. I only apply it in cold weather. I always throw a starter fert. when I spray the simazine. It works for me.

greendoctor
02-24-2009, 01:29 AM
The first thing I spray on a newly sodded lawn(within 14 days) is a Banvel, simazine, 20-20-20, Essential Plus, micronutrients and 28-0-0 SRN cocktail. There are far fewer weeds, the grass grabs fast and the client's lawn looks good. No stunting or yellowing, not even on hybrid dwarf bermuda. Bermuda sod here is usually Tif 419, Tif 328, or Tifdwarf. I know, old school golf course varieties. But as I mentioned before, homeowners here do not like 3" tall grass.

tombo82685
02-24-2009, 06:57 AM
I would wait till the turf is established, for bermudagrass it should establish very quickly, then apply your pre emergence and or post emergence. Like others said it would restrict root growth and establishment, thus stunting the new turf. In terms of the nutsedge problem, up north we have yellow nutsedge. I imagine they are related and we use confront or sedge hammer to control it. Check to make sure warm season grasses have no side effects. If you go with confront make sure you mix it very well it can get hot if its not mixed enough.

ted putnam
02-24-2009, 08:52 AM
It's not the longer growing season, it's the dormant period that leads to weed invasion here in the south. In our average winter, we don't get any snow, and only occasional freezing temps here in Austin, TX. But rhe turf is dormant from Dec 1 to March 1. Meanwhile temps are on a roller coaster - anywhere from 85 to 20 degrees, with wide daily temp swings of 40 and even 50 degrees. If a lawn was sodded in the fall, it's not gonna grow and compete with weeds until spring. As Varmint Commission noted, those gaps between sod rows have no competition during the winter. Add some rain, and those winter weeds can get to biblical proportions!

But that being said, I'm still very leery of putting any pre-m - particularly pendi - on new sod. That sure isn't gonna help it get rooted and established. I think the better option in sod 1st year is to treat post-m and let the customer know the downside, but why you're taking the "long term" approach. Once zoysia gets established it fights weeds off real well without a preemergent.

Well said, same in this area. I'd also like to point out that the sod farms have gotten cheap around here. They do just enough to get it out of the field. I see new sod all the time with buttonweed nutgrass and lespedeza in the freshly laid pieces.

tombo82685
02-24-2009, 09:20 AM
It's not the longer growing season, it's the dormant period that leads to weed invasion here in the south. In our average winter, we don't get any snow, and only occasional freezing temps here in Austin, TX. But rhe turf is dormant from Dec 1 to March 1. Meanwhile temps are on a roller coaster - anywhere from 85 to 20 degrees, with wide daily temp swings of 40 and even 50 degrees. If a lawn was sodded in the fall, it's not gonna grow and compete with weeds until spring. As Varmint Commission noted, those gaps between sod rows have no competition during the winter. Add some rain, and those winter weeds can get to biblical proportions!

But that being said, I'm still very leery of putting any pre-m - particularly pendi - on new sod. That sure isn't gonna help it get rooted and established. I think the better option in sod 1st year is to treat post-m and let the customer know the downside, but why you're taking the "long term" approach. Once zoysia gets established it fights weeds off real well without a preemergent.

do you overseed with p. rye?, this would atleast help compete with the weed species.