Question for LCO's with CT in their programs

[mrkosar]

If UV rays kill microbes pretty quickly, then how do you schedule your CT applications?

Do you have every customer water right after applications? That would be very hard.

Do you only work during the hours of 7 A.M.-10 A.M., then in the evening? Again very difficult.

Do you soil drench while applying so most get into the soil before the UV's hit them and just accept some casualties? If so, how many gallons per K are we talking?

I can't think of other ways, but I'm finding it hard to figure out how to do this on a commercial level while still actually getting the benefits of the CT on every property.

One more question is how long does it take you to clean your spray units every day and do you experience a lot of clogging during applications? I've had trouble spraying 4 gallons of some with a regular Lesco backpack sprayer.

[Tim Wilson]

If UV rays kill microbes pretty quickly

Is there evidence that this occurrs?

[phasthound]

If UV rays kill microbes pretty quickly, then how do you schedule your CT applications?

Do you have every customer water right after applications? That would be very hard.

Do you only work during the hours of 7 A.M.-10 A.M., then in the evening? Again very difficult.

Do you soil drench while applying so most get into the soil before the UV's hit them and just accept some casualties? If so, how many gallons per K are we talking?

I can't think of other ways, but I'm finding it hard to figure out how to do this on a commercial level while still actually getting the benefits of the CT on every property.

One more question is how long does it take you to clean your spray units every day and do you experience a lot of clogging during applications? I've had trouble spraying 4 gallons of some with a regular Lesco backpack sprayer.

I've posted here before that Dr. I has updated her stance that UV rays are not as damaging as once thought. However, droplet size and amount of dilution do matter.
Applying by backpack may decrease the % of surviving microbes. Best to spray on cloudy or rainy days.

[mrkosar]

Is there evidence that this occurrs?

i know it isn't a study or research necessarily, but i read this info in the book Teaming with Microbes. it makes some sense since when applying beneficial nematodes they tell you to water after and apply during overcast or rainy days because of the UV rays. i'm sure some microbes can handle it, but there has to be some beneficials that can't take the heat.

Tim, when do you apply your CT apps or do you not do this on a commercial level? Trying to work scheduling and routing around applying CT at the right time would be a nightmare and would destroy your bottom line. I'm just trying to figure out from those who do this as part of their yearly applications how they work it.

Phasthound, what type of backpack spayer and nozzle do you suggest to apply CT?

[Tim Wilson]

I believe that Jeff (the author of Teaming With Microbes) is open to new knowledge and I think Barry knows of a study done which may refute this theory.

We use up to 1200 gallons of CT at a time through overhead sprinklers on a farm. Generally we try to apply in the early morning but apply when the CT is ready and often its in the heat of the day. I may get to do some studies this summer.

[JDUtah]

but i read this info in the book Teaming with Microbes.

That was your first problem...

That book? http://smilies.sofrayt.com/%5E/n/pukeface.gif

JMHO

Not knocking Jeff but I do not like some of the misleading blanket statements people eat up from that book. It would be nice if he published a version two...

[phasthound]

I didn't think to ask Jeff last week about UV.

I have no experience with applying CT with backpacks, I like to apply it with lots of water.

[treegal1]

If UV rays kill microbes pretty quickly, then how do you schedule your CT applications?
maybe some types, but not the vast herd, and some sun or light at brew time is helpful.........

lack of water, different story..............

[ICT Bill]

That was your first problem...

That book? http://smilies.sofrayt.com/%5E/n/pukeface.gif

JMHO

Not knocking Jeff but I do not like some of the misleading blanket statements people eat up from that book. It would be nice if he published a version two...
Get over it, don't ban the book for a couple of statements

JD you make it look very easy to blast other folks. Have you ever tried to write a book? let alone something that complicated ???

A little input would be nice, do a thread on CEC, just for me or the collective us

I had dinner with him Friday night (Barry and Bob from geotea too) in hindsight he said he would have done it differently at the time it was a new look into something very different and done in a way that you did not have to be a scientist to understand. I do believe it has done a lot of good

as an entrance into the soil food web story it is a good book, perfect ? probably not

There is indeed a book #2 in the works

Perspective is a terrible thing to waste, I should know

[NattyLawn]

Right on Bill. You can't dismiss an entire book based on a few statements that might not hold water. It's up to the reader to disseminate what you're reading and come to logical conclusions. It's common sense. It's a good intro to the soil food web. Most people move on to other materials from there. Compost tea is a "new" technology. What was written 5-10 years ago will probably change.

I like the classic JD. "Not a knock on Jeff, but his books sucks". Not a knock on JD, but I think he's a Mormon who wears magical underwear.....

Back to the original topic. I like to reserve tea apps for cloudy and light rain days. It gets me out on days that I normally can't do other things. But I will spray on sunny days if need be. I'm applying 4-6 gallons of material per minute though.

[JDUtah]

in hindsight he said he would have done it differently

There is indeed a book #2 in the works

:clapping::clapping::clapping:

[JDUtah]

Right on Bill. You can't dismiss an entire book based on a few statements that might not hold water. It's up to the reader to disseminate what you're reading and come to logical conclusions. It's common sense. It's a good intro to the soil food web. Most people move on to other materials from there. Compost tea is a "new" technology. What was written 5-10 years ago will probably change.

I like the classic JD. "Not a knock on Jeff, but his books sucks". Not a knock on JD, but I think he's a Mormon who wears magical underwear.....

Back to the original topic. I like to reserve tea apps for cloudy and light rain days. It gets me out on days that I normally can't do other things. But I will spray on sunny days if need be. I'm applying 4-6 gallons of material per minute though.

Natty,

Take it how you want... but I look forward to book #2.

[Tim Wilson]

Teaming With Microbes is an excellent introduction to understanding the nutrient cycle and natural growing. Jeff has an open mind and understands that most things are not written in stone.

[treegal1]

Teaming With Microbes is an excellent introduction to understanding the nutrient cycle and natural growing. Jeff has an open mind and understands that most things are not written in stone.

ok so i found my copy under all the other greats, and lookie here "Jeff Lowenfels and Wayne Lewis, authors" and then open it up and there is a whole list of names....... and reference...... times and technology change, heck look at testing for P and that whole mess..........

also there is no way to express in all the information that it takes in several hundred pages, or re write or edit every statement about the book, come on throw them a bone, get the old book and when it comes out the new book, and all the other books to come, why shield your eyes from the light of science???

JD how about saying what they got rite in your mind............

[Kiril]

I think we all know UV kills microbes, the question is if the intensity of UV light present is enough to significantly impact the efficacy of the application.

Not a knock on JD, but I think he's a Mormon who wears magical underwear.....

Sorry JD, you asked for it ... and I nearly choked on my breakfast laughing.

[lawncuttinfoo]

If UV rays kill microbes pretty quickly, then how do you schedule your CT applications?

Do you have every customer water right after applications? That would be very hard.

Do you only work during the hours of 7 A.M.-10 A.M., then in the evening? Again very difficult.

Do you soil drench while applying so most get into the soil before the UV's hit them and just accept some casualties? If so, how many gallons per K are we talking?

I can't think of other ways, but I'm finding it hard to figure out how to do this on a commercial level while still actually getting the benefits of the CT on every property.

One more question is how long does it take you to clean your spray units every day and do you experience a lot of clogging during applications? I've had trouble spraying 4 gallons of some with a regular Lesco backpack sprayer.

Need more information from you, what was your dilution ratio? (water to tea) How much tea per 1000 sq ft were you applying? how much diluted tea were you applying?

I did the same as you last year, backpacks, I diluted to a 3:1 (5 gallons of tea mixed with 20 gallons of water) and I sprayed out 1 gallon of tea per 2K sq ft (which is 4 gallons of diluted tea per 2K sq ft)

As for clogging, just make sure you strain it well, store it in 5 gallon pails until you are ready to spray then add it to the sprayer and keep shaking it while it is on your back. If you add the tea to the backpack then let it sit you will get settling which will cause clogging.

[JDUtah]

OK so it was a little harsh, sorry guys. And realizing most of the 'bad taste' in my mouth comes from bad encounters with organic fanatics that swear by the book... I need to remember the author isn't responsible for the readers interpretation on things. Again, sorry guys.

Natty, nice job... now if only they were magical enough to minimize farmer's tans...

[mrkosar]

Need more information from you, what was your dilution ratio? (water to tea) How much tea per 1000 sq ft were you applying? how much diluted tea were you applying?

I did the same as you last year, backpacks, I diluted to a 3:1 (5 gallons of tea mixed with 20 gallons of water) and I sprayed out 1 gallon of tea per 2K sq ft (which is 4 gallons of diluted tea per 2K sq ft)

As for clogging, just make sure you strain it well, store it in 5 gallon pails until you are ready to spray then add it to the sprayer and keep shaking it while it is on your back. If you add the tea to the backpack then let it sit you will get settling which will cause clogging.

This was with the KIS CT Brewer kit (5 gal.). I used their stuff and followed their directions to a T. I honestly don't remember what their dilution ratio was. I was thinking that it might be the nozzle because the dilution rate was around 4:1 i thought. I know this has been discussed, but give me one or two BP sprayers and nozzles that I could use for some test plots of CT.

Wouldn't shaking the BP kill lots of microbes or no? This clogging thing was really the main thing holding me back.

[treegal1]

5 gallon brewers are cool...........

[NattyLawn]

This was with the KIS CT Brewer kit (5 gal.). I used their stuff and followed their directions to a T. I honestly don't remember what their dilution ratio was. I was thinking that it might be the nozzle because the dilution rate was around 4:1 i thought. I know this has been discussed, but give me one or two BP sprayers and nozzles that I could use for some test plots of CT.

Wouldn't shaking the BP kill lots of microbes or no? This clogging thing was really the main thing holding me back.

Was it a pro kit or in the bag? Either way you have to strain it somehow with pantyhose or something like that. Even after straining you will have some silt left over. Do you have larger tips for your backpack? I have sprayed out of my Stihl backpack before with no clogs. Just remember that all microbes will not live, and you can't save every one. They eat each other anyways....I'm learning this with the worm bins. Some aren't going to make it. I don't see why shaking the backpack would kill microbes though.

[DUSTYCEDAR]

worms rock feed mine some pancakes the otherday

[mrkosar]

natty lawn, it was a regular kit with bags. they did have filter bags though. i'll try a stihl bp i guess. do you use a regular fan nozzle?

[treegal1]

worms rock feed mine some pancakes the otherdayGood man!! we larger worm farmers call that bait.LOL

guys try a paint strainer..............

[NattyLawn]

natty lawn, it was a regular kit with bags. they did have filter bags though. i'll try a stihl bp i guess. do you use a regular fan nozzle?

I don't think you need to switch backpack sprayers. I was going to link this the other night, but forgot, and I think you might have asked for help on the yahoo group as well.

http://simplici-tea.com/faq.htm

Scroll to about half way down the page.