Lowering client expectations?

[dirtandhoops]

You regulars on this forum have read recently that I am planning to offer organic treatments this year. I have read references on this forum to
"lowering client/customer expectations." Are you telling me that organically treated lawns are not going to be as green (initially)? (Please note that I deal with cool-season grasses if that makes a difference.)

[NattyLawn]

After it being drilled in my head over the years, one of my credos is "Under promise, over deliver."

That being said, if these lawns have been on synthetic programs you may see some lawns that might have some issues. If lawns haven't been soil tested, you may want to do so. You won't get the green up from 32-10-10 that you will from organic ferts. It's broken down differently and you probably already know this. It will give a longer, more sustained green. Maybe you want to look into organic based program your first year instead of going cold turkey. Nutrients Plus has a 16-2-3 product that a lot of "tweeners" like. You'll add organic matter while still giving the turf some N to balance things out.

[dirtandhoops]

Just to clarify: when I said "as green (initially)" I was referring to the first or second season of using organics. I wasn't referring to the very first application of the season.

[MaineFert]

I was going to mention the same thing. We have seen as sales reps and as end users that the 16-2-3 is ideal for just that reason. You can get about 10 weeks of N release and still provide the soil with organic matter. Especially those lawns that are "addicted" to synthetics.

Jim
Nutrients PLUS

[Kiril]

There is absolutely no reason you need to go the "all or nothing" route. Get a soil sample and build an appropriate bridge.

[bicmudpuppy]

TG used the term "crack for grass", my sales rep said "no, it is more like Heroin, it main streams faster........". Do the slow release organic application. The sooner the better. Add in some quick release ammonium sulfate. The quote I got the other day was for $400/ton in 50#'s. I ordered 4 tons. Two tons for broad cast and two tons for spray applications. I MUST have green as soon as it is physically possible to be green. That is my "market". For basic lawn care, I would not recommend that, but putting down .5-1# of actual N/m to get things started while the organics get a chance to develop "just makes sense" to me. Ammonium Sulfate is going to be a 6-8 week application at best, BUT it is going to give you time for an organic application to "get started". Slow release synthetic apps are anywhere from 12-18 weeks depending on the product choice. An organic app is going to be in that 18 week time frame. My experience would be that your going to get very little results from the organic treatment for the first 2-4 weeks. A quick source of N to "bridge" that gap would be the hurdle for turf "addicted" to synthetic programs.

[quiet]

. . . hunh?

[dirtandhoops]

Thanks for the specific answer to my question about green-up time.

OK, I have another question for you. I have access to an organic formulation with the main ingredients being: grain by-products, forage products, molasses, plant proteins, soybean oil. $12 for 50# How's that sound?



Hahaha. That is my wife's horse feed.

[dishboy]

My lawns stay greener all winter and green up as just as fast or faster than synthetic lawns. I would only expect this to take place after at least six months on a Organic program with a heavy fall fertilization. Heavy being compared to other Organic applications not heavy synthetic applications.

[Smallaxe]

Getting the nutrients below the thatch line and encouraging roots to grow deeper, below the thatch line is critical for the success of any organic program. IMO. Getting the nutrients down there and keeping them there depends on managing the particular soil and climate that one is working with.

A good winterizer that does not generate a lot of surface root growth early in the spring would be a valuable first step. As the ground thaws and the surface dries the roots are expanding in the soil below the thatch. If they have good structure in which to grow with adequate nutrients there is no reason for the continued development of thatch roots sucking up the soluable N at the surface. Mainly because the soluable N is not at the surface.

I had learned in studying 'Grassland Pastures' for beef, that generally there is enough N stored up in the soil from its winterlong rest and recuperation cycle to carry the grass through its optimum growth through a typical wet spring. This first crop - is the highest in protein - it is going to be for the rest of the year. Adding fertilizer b4 the first crop- is a waste. Take it for what it is worth.

Our extension agents emphisize to never fertilize in April, certainly not b4. Why is that??

It's time for another analogy. :)

[Smallaxe]

Watch and see what happens with spring greenup when you let it occur naturally.
Let us know the results.