Overseeded in Fall, can I add crabgrass preventer in spring

[sjcook5]

Hello,
To make a really long story short I bought a new home with no lawn 3 years ago. I have about 60% lawn 20% weeds, 20% bear. For the last three years I have been overseeding in the fall to try to thicken up the lawn. I did it in very late September 2008.

I want to know if I can apply the crabgrasser preventer now - meaning if the seeds did not germinate in the fall could they still germinate. The "Starter Fertlizer" with crabgrass preventer is 3 times the cost of the normal fertilizer with crabgrass preventer. I have dumped so much money in seed I don't want to shoot myself in the foot but I don't have the extra money to spend for the starter fertilizer if no more germination will happen. Also I think my lawn is in crappy shape so a fertlizer with more nitrogen will be helpful and the starter does not have much of that.

Any suggestions on this would be greatly appreciated. I live in South Easter PA so it is getting close to applying this.

Thank you.

[ktfinch2000]

I think your better of just putting dimention (19-0-6) down. This is fertilizer and pre emerge preventer. Chances are the seed is dead that did not gerninate in the fall last year will not germinate this season anyway due to the frost and freezing from snow. The dimention will thicken up the lawn on its own. This is the program I use for my customers in Rhode Island

April - 19-0-6 Fertilizer + Dimension (90 days of Crabgrass control - wears off around July 15th)
May - 19-0-6 Fertilizer + Dimension (90 MORE days of Crabgrass control)
July - 24-0-8 Fertilizer + Merit (Grub control)
August - 28-5-12 Fertilizer + Iron
September - 21-3-21 Fertilizer + Iron (winterizer)
2 apps of Dolomitic Limestone applied at 50 lbs. per 1,000 sq.ft. 1 in spring and 1 in fall.

If you decide to overseed again (no later than the 2nd week in Septemper) you can do two apps of starter. One in August then another in the first week of October. Then follow up with a winterizer mid October to finish out the season.

[mrkosar]

if that seed didn't come up in the fall it isn't coming up in the spring. put down a premergent and seed again in the fall. make sure to water properly.

20% bear in your lawn. i probably would be worried about those bears getting you rather than a poor lawn.

[LushGreenLawn]

Actually, in my neck of the woods, seeds survive the winter, and will germinate in the spring. I assume PA and OH would do the same. Freezing tempatures and Snow do not kill seeds.

.

[DA Quality Lawn & YS]

You mentioned a 'Starter Fertilizer' with crabgrass preventer. Isn't this an oxymoron??
How are you going to start anything after putting pre down?

[Ric3077]

Some of the seed may come up...but not if you put down pre-m

[AmGreen]

Some of the seed may come up...but not if you put down pre-m

Not if you use Quinclorac (Drive 75). You can put it down before, during and after seeding. Can also kill existing crabgrass by adding methylated seed oil which is it's typical use.

[AmGreen]

You mentioned a 'Starter Fertilizer' with crabgrass preventer. Isn't this an oxymoron??
How are you going to start anything after putting pre down?

It has Siduron in it, as opposed to the normal Dithiopyr (Dimension), Pendimethalin (Pre-M) or Prodiamine (Barricade) that is normally used.

[tombo82685]

Hello,
To make a really long story short I bought a new home with no lawn 3 years ago. I have about 60% lawn 20% weeds, 20% bear. For the last three years I have been overseeding in the fall to try to thicken up the lawn. I did it in very late September 2008.

I want to know if I can apply the crabgrasser preventer now - meaning if the seeds did not germinate in the fall could they still germinate. The "Starter Fertlizer" with crabgrass preventer is 3 times the cost of the normal fertilizer with crabgrass preventer. I have dumped so much money in seed I don't want to shoot myself in the foot but I don't have the extra money to spend for the starter fertilizer if no more germination will happen. Also I think my lawn is in crappy shape so a fertlizer with more nitrogen will be helpful and the starter does not have much of that.

Any suggestions on this would be greatly appreciated. I live in South Easter PA so it is getting close to applying this.

Thank you.

hey another southeast pa native. My advice for you, is dont buy a started ferilizer, their is a ton of available phosphorus in the soil around here its ridiculus. Instead of using the starter fert go with a 21-3-6 kind of fertilizer Scotts puts out a product that allows you to seed and get germination and is a crabgrass preventer also. I tried it last year it worked very well.

[FdLLawnMan]

The reason for the high price on the starter fert is the Siduron in the bag. What type of grass seed did you put down, Turf Type Tall Fescue, Kentucky Blue Grass or Perennial Rye Grass. If you had any KBG in it that will certaintly still come up this spring. I would go with a straight fertilizer with at least 50% being a slow release of some type. You only lose about 10% of any seed that did not germinate last fall. And as far as using a starter fertilizer when seeding, it is highly recommended as even though there is plenty of phosphorous in the soil, immature roots are to small to reach it in many cases. Once the grass has been cut several times the root system is mature enough to get at the P.

[Frank Fescue]

siduron eats it hard and rough. even if you do two apps with this exceedingly expensive product you're still going to have a ton of crabgrass. why a retailer would sell a siduron to a homeowner is beyond me. if you dont know much about lawncare and was sold something like tupersan that allowed you to seed and block crabgrass and get the same results most people will get with it you'd be pissed and most likely want a refund.


if your lawn is predominantly thin and crappy dont worry about the weeds this spring, they're coming whether you put down a premergent or not. seed heavily with the proper seed blends for the area in the spring and use a starter fertilizer. seed again in the fall heavily.

if your lawn is thin it doesnt matter how much preemergent you put down. your lawn is going to be ripe with undesirables.

[Taneli]

Yo can go to a local seed and fertilizer supplier and ask for the chemical Tupersan. this allows the seed to germinate but still controls crabgrass very effectivley. The chemical is kinda pricey A 20lb bag that covers 5000 sqft for new lawns and 10000 sqft on established lawns costs me 51 dollars thats at wholesale pricing. your seed you spread last fall will def. germinate. If you use another pre emergent such as dimension that will not allow the seed to germinate. Hope it helps.

A little tip you can apply tupersan your first application and then after 6 weeks when u would normally put down your second application you can use a normally pre emergent such as dimension which is much cheaper (make sure most of the seed has germinated if you try this some mixes have seed that take a long time to germinate 8-10 weeks.

[Hissing Cobra]

I think your better of just putting dimention (19-0-6) down. This is fertilizer and pre emerge preventer. Chances are the seed is dead that did not gerninate in the fall last year will not germinate this season anyway due to the frost and freezing from snow. The dimention will thicken up the lawn on its own. This is the program I use for my customers in Rhode Island

April - 19-0-6 Fertilizer + Dimension (90 days of Crabgrass control - wears off around July 15th)
May - 19-0-6 Fertilizer + Dimension (90 MORE days of Crabgrass control)
July - 24-0-8 Fertilizer + Merit (Grub control)
August - 28-5-12 Fertilizer + Iron
September - 21-3-21 Fertilizer + Iron (winterizer)
2 apps of Dolomitic Limestone applied at 50 lbs. per 1,000 sq.ft. 1 in spring and 1 in fall.

If you decide to overseed again (no later than the 2nd week in Septemper) you can do two apps of starter. One in August then another in the first week of October. Then follow up with a winterizer mid October to finish out the season.

This is a great program and I would follow it until you get to the August application. At that time, if you need to reseed, don't do the 28-5-12 application. Instead, reseed around Labor day and use Starter fertilizer at 3 week intervals until the new seed has grown into a thick, beautiful lawn. If seeding at this time, you'll also have to move the September application of 21-3-21 + Iron to a later date, possibly in late October. If you're not seeding at this time, proceed with the August and September applications as you normally would.

Good luck!

[Smallaxe]

3 failed attempts at planting seed, in as many years. Seems like you could use some help in planting seed.

Yes you can have a successful lawn this spring.

[cod8825]

I agree with small axe you might want to check and see about having a professional come look at the lawn. There might be some things that you are doing wrong. Unfortunately with all of the attention to overseeding people think that anybody can do it and unfortunately this is not the case.

[WildLake]

I think your better of just putting dimention (19-0-6) down. This is fertilizer and pre emerge preventer. Chances are the seed is dead that did not gerninate in the fall last year will not germinate this season anyway due to the frost and freezing from snow. The dimention will thicken up the lawn on its own. This is the program I use for my customers in Rhode Island

April - 19-0-6 Fertilizer + Dimension (90 days of Crabgrass control - wears off around July 15th)
May - 19-0-6 Fertilizer + Dimension (90 MORE days of Crabgrass control)
July - 24-0-8 Fertilizer + Merit (Grub control)
August - 28-5-12 Fertilizer + Iron
September - 21-3-21 Fertilizer + Iron (winterizer)
2 apps of Dolomitic Limestone applied at 50 lbs. per 1,000 sq.ft. 1 in spring and 1 in fall.



What happened to the Dec and Feb. apps? Cool season root growth takes place in the winter when grass seems dormant above the surface. Feed for deep root growth in the winter and you'll get much more summer drought tolerance.