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View Full Version : Priced a turf tiger 28hp cat diesel wow!!


TONTAGE
04-24-2009, 05:58 AM
title says it all.$14,400 for the 28hp cat diesel,and $12,800
for the 31hp hohler.didnt ask about the kawi or the 35hp briggs.
kinda sticker shock

mnglocker
04-24-2009, 06:33 AM
title says it all.$14,400 for the 28hp cat diesel,and $12,800
for the 31hp hohler.didnt ask about the kawi or the 35hp briggs.
kinda sticker shock

Diesels ROCK. Longer service life and bottomless torque=highly productive machine.

TONTAGE
04-24-2009, 06:40 AM
don't you smell like diesel at the end of the day??

mnglocker
04-24-2009, 06:42 AM
don't you smell like diesel at the end of the day??

Wouldn't you smell like gasoline otherwise?

TONTAGE
04-24-2009, 07:33 AM
yeah,but i'd rather smell like gas than diesel.all i keep envisioning is it reminds me of being gehind a tractor trailer on the road,smelling all the crap.i wasnt sure if the diesel mowers would give off the same fumes.i wouldnt want to be cutting all day with a mask on.

ALC-GregH
04-24-2009, 07:47 AM
I wouldn't want to be cutting all day with a mask on.

The fumes aren't what I'd be worried about, it's all the dust and pollen getting stirred up that you'll breath in without a mask. That crap tore me up yesterday. I'll be wearing a mask today for sure. cough cough..... :cry:

MOW PRO LAWN SERVICE
04-24-2009, 08:21 AM
Way to high,i run wildcats scags are great,but the price............:cry:

edgeman2003
04-24-2009, 10:09 AM
yeah, the prices are to high. I got mine a year ago(turf tiger) for $8700 new with kohler command 27hp a/c 61" deck. I have not seen a need for more power then what I have now. maybe the DFI kaw, you you want a little better gas per hour. Thats going to be almost $1500 more in cost, which could be made at the pump if gas goes high again.

IHusky
04-24-2009, 10:14 AM
Not in the market for one but, the dealer down here had one in the show room floor, 28 Cat TT and I asked him: "How much". Almost 17k:dizzy:

TONTAGE
04-24-2009, 10:50 AM
Not in the market for one but, the dealer down here had one in the show room floor, 28 Cat TT and I asked him: "How much". Almost 17k:dizzy:

:hammerhead:

EagleGrounds
04-24-2009, 10:51 AM
But just think of it this way:

If you get it with a cat diesel engine, you get not 1, but 2 classic colors!

A classic Scag Orange mower, with a classic Cat Yellow block in the back!

That alone sells me!

TONTAGE
04-24-2009, 11:05 AM
Single-side servicing improves ease of maintenance and simplifies the servicing routine (500 hr. service intervals).

Junior M
04-24-2009, 11:10 AM
the newer diesels hardly smell, now if you turn them up so they are puffing black smoke you can smell it, but if you leave it stock, its hard to smell it, my brothers 06 cummins has no smell at all..

And why would you smell like diesel? unless you spilled it on you.. :hammerhead:

DennisF
04-24-2009, 11:54 AM
At the end of the day and the lawns have all been mowed the bottom line is, how much did it cost you to do the mowing? Did the initial investment in the mower bring an increase in profits?

Now I'm not slamming the idea of spending $14k for a diesel mower, I'm just questioning the logic behind spending that kind of money for a mower, when an $9000 gasoline model will produce the same results. If the need for a diesel can be justified and the cost difference can be recovered through a higher profit margin, then the investment would be worth it. But, if you can't mow more total square footage with a diesel in the same amount of time that you could with a gas engine, then the investment can't be justified.

All three of my ZTR's are paid for and still mow as well as they did when they were new. They have been fully depreciated... they are still in service and they will remain in service until they die. All three of them produce more profit per machine now than they did before I paid for them.

So, If you are considering spending more for a ZTR because it's a diesel, you have to consider how long it will take before you recover the difference in cost between a diesel and gas engine. Factor in the cost per gallon difference between gasoline and diesel fuel and the profit margins drop for the diesel. Remember...you can't charge more per cut just because diesel fuel costs more than gasoline...the customer doesn't care whether you use diesel or gas to mow their yard. They only care about is the price they are being charged for the end result.

These issues have to be considered before making such a big purchase.

TONTAGE
04-24-2009, 12:04 PM
At the end of the day and the lawns have all been mowed the bottom line is, how much did it cost you to do the mowing? Did the initial investment in the mower bring an increase in profits?

Now I'm not slamming the idea of spending $14k for a diesel mower, I'm just questioning the logic behind spending that kind of money for a mower, when an $9000 gasoline model will produce the same results. If the need for a diesel can be justified and the cost difference can be recovered through a higher profit margin, then the investment would be worth it. But, if you can't mow more total square footage with a diesel in the same amount of time that you could with a gas engine, then the investment can't be justified.

All three of my ZTR's are paid for and still mow as well as they did when they were new. They have been fully depreciated... they are still in service and they will remain in service until they die. All three of them produce more profit per machine now than they did before I paid for them.

So, If you are considering spending more for a ZTR because it's a diesel, you have to consider how long it will take before you recover the difference in cost between a diesel and gas engine. Factor in the cost per gallon difference between gasoline and diesel fuel and the profit margins drop for the diesel. Remember...you can't charge more per cut just because diesel fuel costs more than gasoline...the customer doesn't care whether you use diesel or gas to mow their yard. They only care about is the price they are being charged for the end result.

These issues have to be considered before making such a big purchase.

well said:)

Yater
04-24-2009, 02:00 PM
At the end of the day and the lawns have all been mowed the bottom line is, how much did it cost you to do the mowing? Did the initial investment in the mower bring an increase in profits?

Now I'm not slamming the idea of spending $14k for a diesel mower, I'm just questioning the logic behind spending that kind of money for a mower, when an $9000 gasoline model will produce the same results. If the need for a diesel can be justified and the cost difference can be recovered through a higher profit margin, then the investment would be worth it. But, if you can't mow more total square footage with a diesel in the same amount of time that you could with a gas engine, then the investment can't be justified.

All three of my ZTR's are paid for and still mow as well as they did when they were new. They have been fully depreciated... they are still in service and they will remain in service until they die. All three of them produce more profit per machine now than they did before I paid for them.

So, If you are considering spending more for a ZTR because it's a diesel, you have to consider how long it will take before you recover the difference in cost between a diesel and gas engine. Factor in the cost per gallon difference between gasoline and diesel fuel and the profit margins drop for the diesel. Remember...you can't charge more per cut just because diesel fuel costs more than gasoline...the customer doesn't care whether you use diesel or gas to mow their yard. They only care about is the price they are being charged for the end result.

These issues have to be considered before making such a big purchase.

Also consider maintenance over the life of the mower...and longevity (assuming you don't trade up every few years). If you bought the diesel to work the wheels off it, you'd probably get your money back for the purchase.

ZTR_Diesel
04-24-2009, 04:55 PM
Let me say in advance that I don't own a diesel ZTR - despite my screename.

However I can sum it up vs a gas model with two words:

Resale value.

Lehighlawnpros
04-24-2009, 06:10 PM
Granted the initial price is higher, but if you put a lot of hours on your machines and you intend
to run them for many years, I believe the diesel is worth it.

We have a Grasshopper 722D (with Kubota D902 diesel@22hp) and at .6 gallon per hour
vs. our comparable gas Grasshoppers at 1 gallon per hour I figure we're
saving $720 per year in fuel costs at current fuel prices.
We run about 900 hours per year.

Best bang for the buck is to find a relatively low-hour
(say 1,000 hours or less) used machine in good condition for 1/2 to 1/3 the cost of new.

No, you don't smell like diesel at the end of the day,
the low-sulphur diesel looks almost like gasoline and burns much cleaner than the old kind. :-)

Bob
Lehighlawnpros

Lehighlawnpros
04-24-2009, 06:21 PM
Also, consider that the liquid-cooled diesel should run great
for 7-10 thousand hours if well maintained.

You may need to replace an air-cooled engine 3-5
times in the same amount of hours.

That's a huge difference.

Bob
Lehighlawnpros

DennisF
04-24-2009, 07:07 PM
Also, consider that the liquid-cooled diesel should run great
for 7-10 thousand hours if well maintained.

You may need to replace an air-cooled engine 3-5
times in the same amount of hours.

That's a huge difference.

Bob
Lehighlawnpros

The replacement diesel engine would also cost 3-4 times as much as the same gasoline engine.

BTW...I have two Hustler Z's with 27 Kohler gas engines that have over 3000 hours each and they show no signs of quiting, Both have been maintained by the book.

tacoma200
04-24-2009, 07:12 PM
Granted the initial price is higher, but if you put a lot of hours on your machines and you intend
to run them for many years, I believe the diesel is worth it.

We have a Grasshopper 722D (with Kubota D902 diesel@22hp) and at .6 gallon per hour
vs. our comparable gas Grasshoppers at 1 gallon per hour I figure we're
saving $720 per year in fuel costs at current fuel prices.
We run about 900 hours per year.

Best bang for the buck is to find a relatively low-hour
(say 1,000 hours or less) used machine in good condition for 1/2 to 1/3 the cost of new.

No, you don't smell like diesel at the end of the day,
the low-sulphur diesel looks almost like gasoline and burns much cleaner than the old kind. :-)

Bob
Lehighlawnpros

Actually that's what some of the larger company's run here, 22 hp diesel Grasshoppers. They get the job done, but they have mostly nicer weekly lawns. A 22 hp Grasshopper is a money maker for the larger LCO's. Of course they are paying pretty low wages to the employees to run them.

supercuts
04-24-2009, 07:43 PM
over the winter i picked up a turf tiger. it was bought new in nov 06' for $12,300 with the bagger. in only paid $4000 with 990hrs. still like my bobcats better though. see my post "bobcat vs scag my take" for the reasons

David Haggerty
04-24-2009, 08:27 PM
At the end of the day and the lawns have all been mowed the bottom line is, how much did it cost you to do the mowing? Did the initial investment in the mower bring an increase in profits?

Now I'm not slamming the idea of spending $14k for a diesel mower, I'm just questioning the logic behind spending that kind of money for a mower, when an $9000 gasoline model will produce the same results. If the need for a diesel can be justified and the cost difference can be recovered through a higher profit margin, then the investment would be worth it. But, if you can't mow more total square footage with a diesel in the same amount of time that you could with a gas engine, then the investment can't be justified.

All three of my ZTR's are paid for and still mow as well as they did when they were new. They have been fully depreciated... they are still in service and they will remain in service until they die. All three of them produce more profit per machine now than they did before I paid for them.

So, If you are considering spending more for a ZTR because it's a diesel, you have to consider how long it will take before you recover the difference in cost between a diesel and gas engine. Factor in the cost per gallon difference between gasoline and diesel fuel and the profit margins drop for the diesel. Remember...you can't charge more per cut just because diesel fuel costs more than gasoline...the customer doesn't care whether you use diesel or gas to mow their yard. They only care about is the price they are being charged for the end result.

These issues have to be considered before making such a big purchase.


This is all true.....for anyone who manages mowing crews for profit.

For the solo owner/operator it's all wrong.

#1 for the owner operator, the bigger the mower, the more money you make.
Cost of equipment falls to about 5th place in priority. After comfort and ease of operation. Capability and durability.
I'm not going to run some POS machine that beats the crap out of the operator to save a few cents per hour on equipment cost.

All these discussions about gas vs diesel are more like Are you solo, or do you manage crews?
I went with diesel somewhere in the 80's and never looked back. I've even had two diesel cars. If you want something that'll be performing after the depreciation tables run out, it's got to be diesel. For the solo operator. Employees would tear up an anvil.

bob
04-24-2009, 08:41 PM
My Gravely 31hp Turbo Diesel was $14.2K with a few options.

Lehighlawnpros
04-24-2009, 11:05 PM
The replacement diesel engine would also cost 3-4 times as much as the same gasoline engine.

BTW...I have two Hustler Z's with 27 Kohler gas engines that have over 3000 hours each and they show no signs of quiting, Both have been maintained by the book.

Hi Dennis,
That's excellent service life from your Kohler's,
are you using synthetic oil?

Our Grasshopper 725 (liquid-cooled Kubota gas @25hp)
just turned 7,050 hours/10 1/2 years and runs like new, except for a small oil leak at the rear main seal. Currently using Rotella T 15w40 (non-synthetic) @100 hour oil change intervals.

Bob
Lehighlawnpros

dwost
04-25-2009, 01:05 AM
Or pay $12K and get a 35hp Cat diesel on a Bad Boy AOS 60 that will run circles around the competition. The 28 Cat will only set you back around $11.6. That engine is quite rough, you are better off with the 35. BTW, you are paying an extra $3k for the name :)

iluvscag
04-25-2009, 01:07 AM
It's not about the price, it's about if you can justify it. I say go for it, they're wil be no stopping. Have you ever heard that song- Paul Simon, You can call me AL, thats the song I would listen to while im blowing 6" inches of growth out the side of the deck after a rainstorm seeing the other lcos in town sit in the shop.

nosparkplugs
04-25-2009, 01:25 AM
First The MSRP in October of 2008 for a Scag TT with the 3 banger Cat diesel was pushing 18K, and depending on the Scag Dealer this was the selling price, and a good barometer of how big their head is too:), many demand the higher price too no haggling. So if you can snag a Scag TT with the Cat diesel for 14K thats great.

The rest is your business!!! to tell someone else that diesel is a waste of money is just SILLY:). I have run MANY gasoline ZTR's and the frames & decks were in great condition after 5 years the gasoline engine's were not holding up. So for My business it only made sense to move towards diesel as my business grew. In the last ten years Diesel powered ZTR's have come a long way, and are great sellers. I had zero trouble spending over 13K for my diesel ZTR, it was a wise business investment.


If you sit down & do the math with the Gas VS diesel ZTR, and can truly say gasoline is the better choice good for you? However this does not apply to everyone.

If your mowing lots of property, you can never have too much power/torque with a excellent burn rate & lower maintenance. Like all Diesel VS Gasoline debates' this gets to a deeper issue with some, or "mine is bigger than yours" or "I got more power". But it should be about what is the best investment for YOUR business & MONEY. In the end Lawnsite is not paying my bills

Crazy Cutter
04-25-2009, 11:03 AM
Was the price for a 61" or 72" Velocity deck? I wish my dealer was even close to 14k, he quoted me 17,800 for a new directly from Scag 09 TT 28HP CAT 72" Velocity. So now Scag is back on my wish list and I'm down the road looking at the shiny new red paint that just came to town (ExMark).
If your business model supports an invetment like that or you cut large properties and want to keep your mower for years than this package proly is the best, 14k is not a bad price at all for that machine as ridiculous as it still is for something that just cuts grass:hammerhead:!

Mike Blevins
04-25-2009, 11:08 AM
First The MSRP in October of 2008 for a Scag TT with the 3 banger Cat diesel was pushing 18K, and depending on the Scag Dealer this was the selling price, and a good barometer of how big their head is too:), many demand the higher price too no haggling. So if you can snag a Scag TT with the Cat diesel for 14K thats great.

The rest is your business!!! to tell someone else that diesel is a waste of money is just SILLY:). I have run MANY gasoline ZTR's and the frames & decks were in great condition after 5 years the gasoline engine's were not holding up. So for My business it only made sense to move towards diesel as my business grew. In the last ten years Diesel powered ZTR's have come a long way, and are great sellers. I had zero trouble spending over 13K for my diesel ZTR, it was a wise business investment.


If you sit down & do the math with the Gas VS diesel ZTR, and can truly say gasoline is the better choice good for you? However this does not apply to everyone.

If your mowing lots of property, you can never have too much power/torque with a excellent burn rate & lower maintenance. Like all Diesel VS Gasoline debates' this gets to a deeper issue with some, or "mine is bigger than yours" or "I got more power". But it should be about what is the best investment for YOUR business & MONEY. In the end Lawnsite is not paying my bills

Here we go again! First the msrp of a Scag diesel in my area is about $5500 dollars cheaper than in your area. let me say if anybody out there is paying this much money for a lawn mower then I have some ocean front property I will sell you!!!!!!! And my Scag dealer's head isn't big. His dealership however is the number one Scag dealer in Tenn. I luv how you just got to jump in on these Scag threads and give a few jabs. I just got done reading a post in another thread about the comparison of the deck lift on your badboy compared to the Scags, as if the only model to compare it to. :laugh: $18000 dollars for a mower? Come on now I can't even drink that much KOOL-AID. :dizzy::dizzy::dizzy::dizzy::dizzy::hammerhead::hammerhead:

TONTAGE
04-25-2009, 12:47 PM
Was the price for a 61" or 72" Velocity deck? I wish my dealer was even close to 14k, he quoted me 17,800 for a new directly from Scag 09 TT 28HP CAT 72" Velocity. So now Scag is back on my wish list and I'm down the road looking at the shiny new red paint that just came to town (ExMark).
If your business model supports an invetment like that or you cut large properties and want to keep your mower for years than this package proly is the best, 14k is not a bad price at all for that machine as ridiculous as it still is for something that just cuts grass:hammerhead:!

was for 61" deck

Lawnut101
04-25-2009, 01:04 PM
Someone needs to remind the mower manufacturers how many lawns you need to mow to make $15k. That is just crazy.

DennisF
04-25-2009, 02:43 PM
Hi Dennis,
That's excellent service life from your Kohler's,
are you using synthetic oil?

Our Grasshopper 725 (liquid-cooled Kubota gas @25hp)
just turned 7,050 hours/10 1/2 years and runs like new, except for a small oil leak at the rear main seal. Currently using Rotella T 15w40 (non-synthetic) @100 hour oil change intervals.

Bob
Lehighlawnpros


Yes, Mobil1 synthetic since new.

nosparkplugs
04-25-2009, 03:43 PM
Mike you need to stop cherry picking my posts, and realize someone else got quoted a 17k price for a Scag TT cat diesel. This is not isolated to memphis, but you would not be able to stomach that. Funny thing this thread was started buy some whom got a 17k quote. I use to own Scags so that's what I am comparing it too.

No where in my post in this thread did I mention BB or AOS diesel.






Here we go again! First the msrp of a Scag diesel in my area is about $5500 dollars cheaper than in your area. let me say if anybody out there is paying this much money for a lawn mower then I have some ocean front property I will sell you!!!!!!! And my Scag dealer's head isn't big. His dealership however is the number one Scag dealer in Tenn. I luv how you just got to jump in on these Scag threads and give a few jabs. I just got done reading a post in another thread about the comparison of the deck lift on your badboy compared to the Scags, as if the only model to compare it to. :laugh: $18000 dollars for a mower? Come on now I can't even drink that much KOOL-AID. :dizzy::dizzy::dizzy::dizzy::dizzy::hammerhead::hammerhead:

Cap
04-25-2009, 04:57 PM
A Scag Turf Tiger diesel is an awesome mower. If the price tag on one scares you, check out my like new unit with only 65 hours. MUCH LESS $$$ than a new one!

http://www.lawnsite.com/showthread.php?t=270025&highlight=scag+65

tacoma200
04-25-2009, 05:26 PM
A Scag Turf Tiger diesel is an awesome mower. If the price tag on one scares you, check out my like new unit with only 65 hours. MUCH LESS $$$ than a new one!

http://www.lawnsite.com/showthread.php?t=270025&highlight=scag+65

Congratulations! Nice looking ride.:usflag:

Cub Cadet YANMAR.
04-29-2009, 07:11 PM
Mike you need to stop cherry picking my posts, and realize someone else got quoted a 17k price for a Scag TT cat diesel. This is not isolated to memphis, but you would not be able to stomach that. Funny thing this thread was started buy some whom got a 17k quote. I use to own Scags so that's what I am comparing it too.

No where in my post in this thread did I mention BB or AOS diesel.

My turn to nit pick. The person that started the thread was quoted $14,400 for the 28hp cat diesel and $12,800 for the 31hp kohler, not 17k another poster was quoted that. Even though I'm not no were near to being able to afford a Scag TT with the CAT I think I might call and find out how much one is in PA. Also does the Kubota diesel still come in the scags or no?

ZTR_Diesel
04-29-2009, 08:55 PM
Those Cat-Perkins engined Ferris' are nice. I've watched them being run, however the outfit near me that has 5 of them does ZERO training with thier employees - i've seen them run into signs & trees with them (in thier first year) and worst - shut them off from full idle routinely with no cool-down or even moving the throttle lever down. Every grounds crew I've worked for stresses machine respect and enforces some sort of policy. In my case, I grew up on a farm and my father would take out a paddle to us if we treated equipment poorly. As I said, no training and NO respect for the $15k or so of machine they are running.

I guess it's a good durability test, but within the first year those machines all looked 5+ years old.

puppypaws
04-29-2009, 09:10 PM
title says it all.$14,400 for the 28hp cat diesel,and $12,800
for the 31hp hohler.didnt ask about the kawi or the 35hp briggs.
kinda sticker shock

Leave that particular diesel alone, it is a 3 cylinder that rattles, is unbelievably loud and very weak. The 31 hp Kohler will satisfy you much better power wise. I ran a 28 Cat beside a 33 hp Generac and the power difference was no comparison, big grass made the 28 Cat pull down terribly while not affecting the Generac at all.

You step up to a 35 Cat, and it is a totally different story, this is a 4 cylinder that purrs like a kitten and has the power of a Tiger, "Turf Tiger" that is. The big block Vanguard will pull the 28 Cat as well as the 31 Kohler backwards, hooked butt to butt. You can't comprehend the power of the big block Vanguards; until you experience it for yourself.

I will say in defense of the low power on the 28, this was on a 72" deck, but that was one more loud rattling engine.

J&R Landscaping
04-29-2009, 09:46 PM
don't you smell like diesel at the end of the day??

I enjoy the fumes at the begining and middle of the day as well as at the end of the day. Diesel ztr's are great machines if you have the work for them!

heather lawn sp
04-30-2009, 01:27 AM
I enjoy the fumes at the begining and middle of the day as well as at the end of the day. Diesel ztr's are great machines if you have the work for them!

2 diesel Z's 60" & 72"

150 acres a week

johnnybravo8802
04-30-2009, 09:37 AM
title says it all.$14,400 for the 28hp cat diesel,and $12,800
for the 31hp hohler.didnt ask about the kawi or the 35hp briggs.
kinda sticker shock
That's actually a good price for a diesel!!! They are over $16,000 here. I paid $12,000 for my 29 Kawi-would have bought the diesel for $14,000. You need to go with that deal.

puppypaws
04-30-2009, 10:44 AM
The replacement diesel engine would also cost 3-4 times as much as the same gasoline engine.

BTW...I have two Hustler Z's with 27 Kohler gas engines that have over 3000 hours each and they show no signs of quiting, Both have been maintained by the book.

Everyone has their own preferences and that is what makes the world go around. I personally would not want the aggravation of maintaining a liquid cooled engine on a zero turn mower, your post is an excellent example of the capability of a/c engines.

I was to be delivered a Scag TT with the 29 dfi this morning, along with a Exmark XS, Triton deck and 35 Vanguard and the new Series 6 Exmark Lazer with a 27 Kohler. I was not very concerned about the mowers being delivered today because of rain coming in for a few days.

The rep said they had a big account which just bought a new Scag TT with the 28 hp Cat diesel. The 28 Cat only had 40 hrs. and the water pump failed, this meant the 29 dfi went to them as a loaner. I told him that was no problem, the mower needed to go where the money was being made. I then said, "this is one reason I don't care for a liquid cooled engine on a mower, just something else to look after, or break down." He told me he agreed, and personally did not care for the liquid cooled engines when there was such a good track record in place for air cooled power.

Two Seasons
04-30-2009, 12:53 PM
Everyone has their own preferences and that is what makes the world go around. I personally would not want the aggravation of maintaining a liquid cooled engine on a zero turn mower, your post is an excellent example of the capability of a/c engines.

I was to be delivered a Scag TT with the 29 dfi this morning, along with a Exmark XS, Triton deck and 35 Vanguard and the new Series 6 Exmark Lazer with a 27 Kohler. I was not very concerned about the mowers being delivered today because of rain coming in for a few days.

The rep said they had a big account which just bought a new Scag TT with the 28 hp Cat diesel. The 28 Cat only had 40 hrs. and the water pump failed, this meant the 29 dfi went to them as a loaner. I told him that was no problem, the mower needed to go where the money was being made. I then said, "this is one reason I don't care for a liquid cooled engine on a mower, just something else to look after, or break down." He told me he agreed, and personally did not care for the liquid cooled engines when there was such a good track record in place for air cooled power.

Around these parts, the Scag dealers were really pushing LC when I bought my TT. I could not find a reason why we needed LC, so we bought AC and haven't been disappointed.