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David Gretzmier
05-08-2009, 04:49 PM
I have never seen this fixture until today, pretty cool and was wondering if any folks have used this fixture and long term durability. I have a spot I could use 2 of these, but I'd like to get imput before I sell them to the customer. James, Copper moon has you listed as an installer for them, have you used this model of path?

INTEGRA Bespoke Lighting
05-08-2009, 07:37 PM
David. The CM700 / CM750 are not my cup of tea, and this is as much a personal style thing as much as it is a construction / design consideration.

I think the transition between the 'twisted rope' area and the smooth stem is a bit to contrived and obvious. As I recall the twisted rope does not extend all the way down to the stem, but is only a section of stem in the middle. Also, the fit and finish of these fixtures leaves a bit to be desired IMO. They make use of what some call 'plumbing parts'.

The fixture functions fine, it is just the style / details that I am not too fond of.

Regards.

David Gretzmier
05-08-2009, 08:57 PM
Thanks for the reply. I normally do not like fixtures that bring attention to themselves, especially paths. But I have an artsy lead, and they want paths in beds beside the entry way , have no plants other than annuals in those beds. so a light with some sculpture to it, but still a smooth top intrigued me. I think most of copper moon's stuff is raw copper, so I'm thinking it will start to age to that old penny look after a month or so anyway.

Any one else seen this fixture up close?

Pro-Scapes
05-09-2009, 06:34 AM
I have a sample of the fixture here. I have never installed it. I preffer to stick to the elite line if I use Dougs pathlights.

It is really a design and clients choice if the twisted rope is used. If thats the look the client likes then its fine. I know doug has 3 different finishes he can apply for you to pre patina the fixtures including an antique rust and verde finish.

The twist part looks like copper tubing wrapped around the smooth copper stem to me. After nearly 2 years of dealing with coppermoon and Doug I can tell you this. If you ever had a problem with the fixture Doug would make it right. We just installed 20 of his fixtures yesterday

David Gretzmier
05-09-2009, 02:39 PM
I'll be meeting with a copper moon rep next week and she sent me a box of sample fixtures. The twisted rope was not among them, which is odd because it truly does look different for a path. Usually when you go with art stuff on a path, it is the top- stars, leaves, stained glass, etc. For some reason the handmade looking stem and plain top appealed to me for this one particular client and situation.

I also like the brass wall washer they sent. very heavy, although not sealed at the wire exit.

Their heavy brass mr-16 unit has a different type of glass as well, like a graphic black tint, maybe for glare, but I am not sure. I may fire it up and compare with my brass bullet and see.

Pro-Scapes
05-09-2009, 04:21 PM
I'll be meeting with a copper moon rep next week and she sent me a box of sample fixtures. The twisted rope was not among them, which is odd because it truly does look different for a path. Usually when you go with art stuff on a path, it is the top- stars, leaves, stained glass, etc. For some reason the handmade looking stem and plain top appealed to me for this one particular client and situation.

I also like the brass wall washer they sent. very heavy, although not sealed at the wire exit.

Their heavy brass mr-16 unit has a different type of glass as well, like a graphic black tint, maybe for glare, but I am not sure. I may fire it up and compare with my brass bullet and see.

Im not sure how I ended up with the twisted rope fixture. I think it was given to me by Doug on a trip to destin when we went fishing 2 yrs ago. I know I have about 10 of his pathlights in my shop.

David you just brought up 2 of my go to fixtures (dont worry joey I still use alot of unique)

TRUE. Dougs brass is not sealed at the wire entry and he is working on this now if I am informed right. I squeeze a good shot of sealant in the back end and never have a problem.

On the silk screening you mention on the cm125 and cm135 brass bullets. It does help soften the lines of the lamps somewhat. It can also in a way help with a bit of glare but if glare is even a remote concearn I either louver it or look to a different fixture. I think I have been installing the coppermoon brass stuff for about 18 mo now and have 1 issue to date and that was a tractor vs lighting fixture scenario I didnt even try to get warrantied.

The wash light you mentioned is indeed a beefy unit and has served us well. I do wish the shroud was a bit taller on it but when used in the right application it has been a great performer for us. I do still use more than a couple of stellars when I need a low profile wash light too.

I really feel these are 2 of the strongest fixtures in Dougs line up. For anyone unfamiliar with them I suggest you give em a try.

S&MLL
05-10-2009, 03:38 AM
Dave have a twisted in a clients landscape for about a year. Will be going for a service call soon and take a picture for you. Coppermoon is a very VERY good company to work with. Doug/Wade ...... stand up guys

Pro-Scapes
05-10-2009, 09:26 AM
Dave have a twisted in a clients landscape for about a year. Will be going for a service call soon and take a picture for you. Coppermoon is a very VERY good company to work with. Doug/Wade ...... stand up guys

I never delt with Wade but I can agree wholeheartedly about Doug. Keep an eye out for new products soon from them. They are evolving the line.

S&MLL
05-10-2009, 01:14 PM
I know I cant wait. Have you tried the new transformer they are selling?

Pro-Scapes
05-10-2009, 04:51 PM
Yes. I installed one friday. Its made by Jefferson electric. All worked well altho the voltage fell off about the same as MDL units when under load. There is more wiring room than the MDL units which was nice as well.

They come with a stainless bracket you hang on the wall then you hang the trans on that which made for quick easy installation.

There are a few personal prefferences I didnt care for on it but all in all I did like it better than the MDL units but not nearly as much as I like the Gambino units. With the Gambinos and the way they hold the voltage it enables me to run further with more load than I am able to with a trans that bogs down.

Bottom line is I like them better than the MDL units and Doug informed me Jefferson is looking into some concearns that contractors has and they are hungry and willing to make changes. Sounds like it will be a good fit with Coppermoon.

S&MLL
05-10-2009, 07:04 PM
Glad to hear. Thanks for the update.

David Gretzmier
05-10-2009, 10:32 PM
In the literature I received, The copper moon trans in the photo's looks identical to the Volt trans I installed/reviewed a month or so back. same plug, same photo-cell plug, same switches, looks the same down to the 1 1/2 inch plastic plug in the bottom for wire exit.

S&MLL
05-11-2009, 01:26 AM
Im not sure if their catalog shows mdl or not... If it does then it is the same trans as hadco , kichler, cast and every other mdl. Granted there are some differences but its mostly the same internals.

Pro-Scapes
05-11-2009, 07:49 AM
Your right. The one in his catalog is the MDL as are the ones still listed on his website.

http://jeffersonelectric.com/cgi-bin/site.pl?3208&dwContent_contentID=62

That is a link the one I hung. There is a hinged door over the open part of it and a fuctional drip rail. I poured water on it to make sure it stayed dry inside.

Keep in mind the Pantechs look similar to MDL

worx
05-11-2009, 08:42 AM
I never delt with Wade but I can agree wholeheartedly about Doug.
I'll third the appreciation for Doug. Great guy to work with!

emby
05-11-2009, 11:42 PM
I have to agreee with the others on the Coppermoon product line. I love the path lights for there simplicity. Clear or frosted lens, sealed from moisture and bugs, adjustable top hats and so far not any problems with the lamp holder or the copper. Great light spread because of the height of the stems and after time they blend right into any landscape. Nine inch top hats are perfect for light spread.
The CM-125 is a great little bullet and once again no moisture at all and very adaptable to any degree of bulb since the shroud is not that long. Try them out they are truly well built.
The Jeffersons transformers are constructed with some pretty thick stainless and have a lot of room at the bottom to terminate. I installed a 600 Watt that was loaded up pretty good and there was no noticeable hum. Best bang for your buck in my opinion.
Looking forward to enhanced changes that are coming and I will be trying the new CM-890 area light later this week. Will keep you updated with some photos.
Just my 2 cents
Ken

Pro-Scapes
05-12-2009, 06:37 AM
Ken.

The 890 is not an area light it is the oval shaped wall wash light. It takes either a bi pin or mr 16 lamp. I was skeptical at first but I have one planted right under a drip edge more or less just to test it and I serviced the job 2 weeks ago at the 1 year mark and its been fine.

irrig8r
05-12-2009, 10:36 AM
Your right. The one in his catalog is the MDL as are the ones still listed on his website.

http://jeffersonelectric.com/cgi-bin/site.pl?3208&dwContent_contentID=62

That is a link the one I hung. There is a hinged door over the open part of it and a fuctional drip rail. I poured water on it to make sure it stayed dry inside.

Keep in mind the Pantechs look similar to MDL


The specs look reasonable and well written.

I'm curious.... does "Built in accordance with NEMA, ANSI, UL and CSA standards" mean the same thing as "UL listed"?

What does your label say Billy?

irrig8r
05-12-2009, 10:47 AM
I have to agreee with the others on the Coppermoon product line. <snip>

The CM-125 is a great little bullet and once again no moisture at all and very adaptable to any degree of bulb since the shroud is not that long. Try them out they are truly well built. <snip>

Looking forward to enhanced changes that are coming and I will be trying the new CM-890 area light later this week. Will keep you updated with some photos.

Ken

I agree on these points especially. The CM-125 will replace NS Lipinskis for me. Even though NS covers them under warranty, I've had problems with the Lipinski where the stem connects to the body.

I have a CM-875 and CM-890 to try. Played with them and looking for the perfect spot for each. I'll probably use them in place of FX RL-20s, which are kinda pricey for what they are, and not bug-proof.

worx
05-12-2009, 02:01 PM
The specs look reasonable and well written.

I'm curious.... does "Built in accordance with NEMA, ANSI, UL and CSA standards" mean the same thing as "UL listed"?

The "Spec Sheet" says it is UL1838 listed. That cord looks awful short in the spec sheet photo though.......

Pro-Scapes
05-12-2009, 03:56 PM
The "Spec Sheet" says it is UL1838 listed. That cord looks awful short in the spec sheet photo though.......

Gregg it did say cUL on the lable I think. Its definatly UL listed

The cord in the photo is obviously not a true to life picture because the cord on the unit I got was average lenght around 5 ft. I didnt measure it but it was more than adequate for reaching the outlet about 2 ft from the trans.

irrig8r
05-12-2009, 09:23 PM
The "Spec Sheet" says it is UL1838 listed. That cord looks awful short in the spec sheet photo though.......

Funny cause I thought the page that Billy posted the link to was the spec sheet, and didn't see that specific language, but therein found a link to this other page which lays it out just a little more clearly:

http://www.jeffersonelectric.com/s3/site/pdf/JE_LandscapeLighting_JE943_0701.pdf

emby
05-12-2009, 09:30 PM
Thanks Billy for the info on the CM-890. I will be trying them out next week on the armour stone pictured below. Hopefully they will provide me with the proper light.

Pro-Scapes
05-12-2009, 10:06 PM
I think you will be surprised at the output of them. Do yourself a favor and order some of the 10w lamps doug has for them now. On lighter colored objects I have been using 10w mr16 lamps but he now has a 10w large pin bipin lamp.

INTEGRA Bespoke Lighting
05-12-2009, 11:40 PM
My only beef so far with the CM890 wide flood is the socket. They are using a combination style socket that will accept both G4 and Gu5.3 (thicker pins, wider spread) lamps. Only problem is when using the G4 lamps, after servicing them once or twice the socket does not want to hold the lamp pins very well. You end up having to bend the lamp pins, and push the lamp into the socket on an angle to get a decent connnection.

Other than that the CM890 is a go-to fixture for wall washing and wide flood applications. Last year, there was talk of Doug offereing a clear glass version as well as a glare louver. He sent me a couple of glare louvers but I am not sure if these are available yet or not.

S&MLL
05-13-2009, 01:32 AM
The glare louvers are available doe the cm-890. Also they are doing away with the multi lamp socket. Just met with Wade yesterday and he informed me. Coppermoon is working hard to meet our needs. I have the cm-890s on a few gutters for a second story lighting and look/work great

Pro-Scapes
05-13-2009, 07:40 AM
In gutter applications I still go to the stellar. Its much more discreet than the 890 which is 100% pure beef.

James. The g4 lamps do wiggle loose. You HAVE to use the 5.3 lamps. If coppermoon moves away from the 5.3 lamps then you will not be able to put an MR16 into this fixture. The glare louvers are avalible but not really much of a help with the frosted lens. Wash lights are typically high glare fixtures that need care in placement anyways.

David Gretzmier
05-13-2009, 08:43 PM
met with Joy today, Doug's sister and coppermoon rep for them since late 2007.

I expressed my desire to have silicone at the wire exit on all lights, and the ability to move the knuckle or shroud on the 125 with a thumb screw rather than having to use a screwdriver. the 125 is also very hard to open ( 2 dry silicone o-rings, no water getting in that end) and adjust the glare guard, and does not come greased. no dielectric grease in the socket either. glare guard not removable. I also got a promise of a sample for the twisted rope and the 9 and 11 inch hat, along with the honeycomb glare guard for the 890 and the 125. apparently the guards are indeed available.

The 100 is being changed, the sample I got is no longer the one they are making.

she explained to really get competive pricing with other similar products from other vendors you have to get into the 1000 fixture volume range, which for me is a years supply at my current volume. Joy said they evaluate you at 6 months and see if you are hitting purchase quotas, and then they can switch you to "bulk contractor" pricing, which on paths is similar to what I am paying now at several sources. I heard offers of free shipping, But i never really nailed that down.

I'm in for the 890 right now, will use it and will just squirt silicone in the exit. I still hate the standard type screws you have to remove to get to the bulb, and these could again, be replaced by thumbscrews.

I also like the fact that with all of their taller 20 inch stems for paths ( not the elite line- which is smaller) You have OPTIONS ! you can use a 6, 9, or 11 inch hat, and I think the the 2.5 and 3.5 inch hats as well, and either get a riser/extension for more height to an existing light, or get a custom stem made altogether for a very reasonable price. I think also having an adjustable stem to change the height of the bulb, allowing some or all of the bulb to be exposed to the glass is a plus for me. I will probably buy the larger 9 and 11 inch paths from them when I need bigger paths, and stick with my current vendor for 6 inch paths for now. Hey , If you have a landscape that grows, or lights that get bent or pieces that break, copper moon paths seem to be the paths that can grow with the landscape.

I also like the big brass well light, and again, beefy, heavy . since you cannot see the brass underground, I usually like abs bottoms and a brass top, which they have also.

we talked a bit about deck lights, and I tend to use mostly hockey puck lights on posts/rails. their puck is a bit pricey, even at the bulk contractor level. theirs is nearly identical to the one I currently use, but theirs is a more polished brass and mine is a spun. both will weather to a dark copper penny finish, thiers is a g4 socket and mine is g6. I prefer g6 bulbs as I think they last longer, IMHO. pricewise nearly double what I have used for 3 years now.

She confirmed the trans has been replaced, and the one in the catalog is no longer available. she mentioned some troubles with the older units, and the new jefferson units are testing out very good, and are cheaper to boot.

the older one looks identical to the Volt I installed several weeks back, so I wonder if volt is maded by the same old company. who knows. the new one looks similar.

A good meeting, and I think Coppermoon and I will both benefit from time spent getting to know each other.

Pro-Scapes
05-13-2009, 10:09 PM
David I do not think a thumb screw would be feesible on the top of the 890. Could be really hard to get our fingers in there for thoes of us with large hands. Easy enough to use a small flat blade screwdriver. You need to keep one handy anyways for taps on the transformers.

It might be a bit premature to pass judgment on the new Jefferson transformers but so far so good. Good enough I have 3 more on my truck to go in tmrw for a reinstall.

I do agree the cm125 can sometimes be tight to open I would rather have that nice tight fit than a so so fit I have seen on other lights. The best way I have found is back the set screw out and just give a yank on the long end of the shroud.

About 2.5 yrs ago now Burt and I installed some hadco bullets in a commercial application and I can assure you we paid double what Doug is selling the same casting for.

I totally agree on sealing the wire entry point. It should be done at the factory for us and I think the finish should be standard as well.

David Gretzmier
05-13-2009, 10:35 PM
I'm not passing any judgement on the trans, They had issues with the old one and that is why they are going with the Jefferson unit. It looks like a good unit.

I'm ok with a tight fit on silicone o-rings, but the one I received I had to use a flat blade screwdriver to open.

I've seen prices all over the place for cast brass bullets, from over double what doug charges, to 1/2 of what his bulk contractor price is. Ultimately the winner in the game is the one who offers the best functioning light at a competitive price.

Pro-Scapes
05-14-2009, 07:42 AM
I'm not passing any judgement on the trans, They had issues with the old one and that is why they are going with the Jefferson unit. It looks like a good unit.

I'm ok with a tight fit on silicone o-rings, but the one I received I had to use a flat blade screwdriver to open.

I've seen prices all over the place for cast brass bullets, from over double what doug charges, to 1/2 of what his bulk contractor price is. Ultimately the winner in the game is the one who offers the best functioning light at a competitive price.

To me the service is worth a few bucks more. Once you start buying from Doug the incentives and just seeing how far he goes to keep you happy without question is definatly worth it. I have had to pry a few open like that but not latley but then again I usually get the antique finish so they have been opened already.

Yes on the old trans issues. I thought I was crazy when I put a meter on it and it read 28v at the 12v tap of one of the MDL boxes but I opened it and the common was disconnected. I have done field repairs on 3 of the last 5 MDL units I put in ranging from internal shorts inside between common 3 and 12v (sloppy strip job) to replacing the spade terminals on the common wires because someone crimped them on before the wires were inside. TO be fair I have had to replace Kichler and CAST based MDL units as well. but again always at installation and right out of the box. The ones in the field are fine.

Still loving the Gambino trans the best. Its just a dream to work with especially when using any controls.

David Gretzmier
05-16-2009, 12:36 PM
got few more samples tody from copper moon. The hex/honeycomb louver for the 890 and the 125. both apper to be hand cut from a larger piece of hex metal "fabric". . both look to work well with those 2 fixtures.

also got a hockey puck deck light, and it is heavy, nice, and would impress most clients. true cast brass, mirrored reflector inside the unit with o-ring. socket works with g4 or g6 bulbs.

got a twisted rope stem and 9, 11 inch hat. 9 inch glass was broken through shipping, even though wrapped in bubble, boxed, and in a larger box with other items that were packed well. I like the hats and twisted rope, but the stem is probably only for customers that want to bring attention to thier lights. I would use it at my house. The thumbscrew on the hats is very easy to lose, when installing a bulb, I'd just unscrew it all the way and hold it in your hand. when you just loosen it enough to remove or adjust the height of the hat, it has only 1/2 turn left before it falls out. Also, there is no metal support from stem to hat, just glass. many of you guys, and myself, feel this is a safety issue if someone falls on the lights. Finally, the lead on the twisted rope and other stems is only 3 feet. most paths I see and use have at least 6-8 feet, and many have 15 feet. 3 feet seems a little short.

It appears that I was wrong about the smaller hats fitting the larger stems. the larger stems are 1 inch diameter and only the 6, 9, and 11 inch hats fit them. the smaller stems are 3/4 inch diameter ( like most other paths) and use the smaller hats. Since I often make my own extended stems or risors out of 1 inch copper pipe and slide the 3/4 pipes into the 1, with copper moon stems you would have to use a pipe cutter, cut off the bottom, use a slide 1" coupler, or use thier risors or their custom stems.

It also appears that the max bulb on the hats is 20 watts. I have used 35's in some situations, especially when I make larger stems for elevated lights. Joy said she would check on 35's and 50's, as many pathlights will do. but they are clearly marked max bulb 20 watts, g6 base.

all in all, I continue to be impressed by copper moon as a good company that may need to address some minor issues. pricewise they are higher than some and lower than some, but the quality and materials seems to be what you pay for. I think they would be a good choice for most folks.

S&MLL
05-16-2009, 03:54 PM
Dave they will put any lead on for you. I think 25 foot is an extra 4 bucks. 50foot might be 7 bucks.

David Gretzmier
05-16-2009, 08:18 PM
They do seem to be willing to work with you on everything, but I was just pointing out what I got as the standard deal. I think 3 foot is a little short for a standard length.

Pro-Scapes
05-16-2009, 10:18 PM
got few more samples tody from copper moon. The hex/honeycomb louver for the 890 and the 125. both apper to be hand cut from a larger piece of hex metal "fabric". . both look to work well with those 2 fixtures.

also got a hockey puck deck light, and it is heavy, nice, and would impress most clients. true cast brass, mirrored reflector inside the unit with o-ring. socket works with g4 or g6 bulbs.

got a twisted rope stem and 9, 11 inch hat. 9 inch glass was broken through shipping, even though wrapped in bubble, boxed, and in a larger box with other items that were packed well. I like the hats and twisted rope, but the stem is probably only for customers that want to bring attention to thier lights. I would use it at my house. The thumbscrew on the hats is very easy to lose, when installing a bulb, I'd just unscrew it all the way and hold it in your hand. when you just loosen it enough to remove or adjust the height of the hat, it has only 1/2 turn left before it falls out. Also, there is no metal support from stem to hat, just glass. many of you guys, and myself, feel this is a safety issue if someone falls on the lights. Finally, the lead on the twisted rope and other stems is only 3 feet. most paths I see and use have at least 6-8 feet, and many have 15 feet. 3 feet seems a little short.

It appears that I was wrong about the smaller hats fitting the larger stems. the larger stems are 1 inch diameter and only the 6, 9, and 11 inch hats fit them. the smaller stems are 3/4 inch diameter ( like most other paths) and use the smaller hats. Since I often make my own extended stems or risors out of 1 inch copper pipe and slide the 3/4 pipes into the 1, with copper moon stems you would have to use a pipe cutter, cut off the bottom, use a slide 1" coupler, or use thier risors or their custom stems.

It also appears that the max bulb on the hats is 20 watts. I have used 35's in some situations, especially when I make larger stems for elevated lights. Joy said she would check on 35's and 50's, as many pathlights will do. but they are clearly marked max bulb 20 watts, g6 base.

all in all, I continue to be impressed by copper moon as a good company that may need to address some minor issues. pricewise they are higher than some and lower than some, but the quality and materials seems to be what you pay for. I think they would be a good choice for most folks.


I think the hockey puck from doug is the one fixture I have never seen of his. I use the CAST ones more or less exclusivly. They work well and look nice. I do wish someone would make a 3 inch puck light to fit nice on a 4x4 post tho.
Instead of cutting up the stems just tell them what you want and Doug will have the guys downstairs make it. I have been to the shop. I was actually there at midnight with Doug when his new machinery was being delivered. Ash and I were staying the night at his house when passing thru.

On the glass supported tops. He also has some commercial grade stuff that is metal supported.

Yes doug will add the leads. I think 25 footers will cost ya 6 bucks. It used to be 4 but I taught him a better way to do it with 2 layers of double wall adhesive lines shrink tubing. Even tho I am not using leads as much anymore I would still like to see at least 10 ft leads standard in one piece from the socket.

INTEGRA Bespoke Lighting
05-17-2009, 10:23 AM
David, the issue with lamp wattages in path lights is one of heat and listings. You might be able to install a 35W lamp in a fixture, but that does not mean that the fixture is rated for that lamp. Heat is a major concern for path lights as they can be easily touched by little hands.

This is one reason that most bi-pin based path lights use a G4 socket. You cannot get a 35W G4 lamp and as such you cannot overlamp the fixtures. Coppermoon is using the 'combo' socket (one I wish they would change!) that accomodates a G4 or Gu5.3 lamp. Although you have the ability to install a 35W lamp in the fixture, it would most certainly no longer meet it's listing requirements and could be a safety hazzard. (Also note, that once you have inserted a G 5.3 based lamp into the socket, it will no longer hold a G4 lamp properly)

Heat issues are the main reason there are not more MR16 based path lights on the market. You can build a fixture that will meet the requirements for listing using a 20W MR16, but what stops someone from coming along and installing a 50W. If you do so, the fixture would overheat and be a potential hazzard. As a result, listing agencies are hesitant to approve these types of fixtures.

David Gretzmier
05-17-2009, 05:04 PM
I agree that a 35 watt bulb in a path would be hot, but I have to wonder, how hot is a 20? I've burned my fingers plenty of times, but a 35 would probably be much hotter.

I think the charge for a custom stem is 15 bucks over the regular price. I agree if you know the length that you want and can order, That is fine for you guys.

I am used to taking a standard path with 3/4 inch copper stem, and a 1/2 inch botttom for the stake, and just taking k thickness 1 inch pipe and a 1 inch pipe to 1/2 inch male thread fitting at the bottom, and cutting whatever length I need and just putting the whole path without stake inside the 1 inch. I pay about a buck a foot for the thicker k pipe, and a buck fifty for the 1 to 1/2 fitting, and I just keep a few 10 foot sticks around to elevate paths as I need to. costwise I end up spending maybe $3-5 for a 2-4 foot stem, and I can do it onsite with a pipeutter and epoxy in 5 minutes tops. seems trivial, but this is one of those things that clients watch and are impressed at my willingness to custom make a path light fit thier exact need right on the jobsite. Something about the larger pipecutter and mixing epoxy says craftsmanship.

I also have used this same aproach to make several post lights, using a larger hat and going up to 6 feet tall, but I usually set the stake in concrete and go to 1 1/2" pipe above 4 feet. It costs closer to $2 per foot.

Alan B
05-17-2009, 09:45 PM
To me the service is worth a few bucks more. Once you start buying from Doug the incentives and just seeing how far he goes to keep you happy without question is definatly worth it.

Yes doug will add the leads. I think 25 footers will cost ya 6 bucks.

Does Coppermoon sell direct to contractors or go through distributors? I thought they went through distributors but maybe they do both. Not to de-rail (but better understand distribution in the industry), did Atom Lighting ever sell direct or only go through distribution?


Thanks,

Alan

Pro-Scapes
05-17-2009, 10:26 PM
Coppermoon for some time did a hybrid distributor ship. In some markets Doug had distribution but in other areas he chose to go direct. I have always been direct with them. Coppermoon no longer uses distribution or possibly only 1 distributor and chooses to go direct. Not only does this provide a better price point for the contractor(not having to ship the fixture multiple times plus distribution markups) but also better service. I know I can text or email Doug anytime and usually have a reply within minutes.

Unique is the only other manu I have delt with that provides this level of service. Joey is right there with the ball in play every time I have needed him even tho Unique does not sell direct.

On the MR16 pathlight. The hat does not get hot. The collar and lens under the hat do but the hat remains comfortable to the touch even at 35w (home show I had to make them brighter)

David Gretzmier
05-18-2009, 08:11 AM
my impression is they do direct to contractor.

Alan B
05-18-2009, 11:29 AM
Thank you for the info.

There will be greater shifts toward selling direct to the contractor. The primary reason I got into this business is because contractors are significantly overpaying for quality product due to inefficent distribution, but will leave that for another thread or another time -- the reality is many of the voices in the industry don't want it discussed.