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View Full Version : How to get Toro to stand behind their product?


MikeSp
05-22-2009, 01:39 PM
My ZTR is a ZMaster 589 (Kaw 29hp water-cooled, DFI engine) -- during the first 52 hours it ran perfect. Starting with the 53rd hour, it would run for a while and then start cutting out. Two different qualified and excellent dealers have worked on it and after 13 (THIRTEEN) months, it is still a failure and Toro Support is allegedly having engineers figure out the problem. 13 months of inability to mow more than a quarter of an acre at a time is frustrating (understatement). The supervisor in charge of the case is doing what she can. The warranty has now expired and the first two months of this mowing season have been a disaster as well as nearly all of last mowing season. :realmad: There are 110 hours on the mower at this time.

I have been totally cooperative, polite and patient -- all to no avail.

There are no mower lemon laws in Missouri. Any suggestions as to HOW to get Toro to fix or replace this $ 11,000 mower (I have NEVER had any kind of lack of support issue like this with JD or Kubota in 30 years of using their products.)??

MikeSp

Toy2
05-22-2009, 05:51 PM
Its time for a lawyer......hopefully you get some money for lost wages........its gonna suck to pay him, but you might end up with court costs paid and attorney fees.....

Mowingman
05-22-2009, 07:07 PM
Well, if it is a problem with the engine, then Toro has no reason to even consider fixing it. You should be dealing directly with an authorized Kawasaki engine dealer for engine problems.

Horizon Lawn
05-22-2009, 07:28 PM
Toros customer service has been horrible for me also. I have had so many issues you wouldnt beleive but they did step up and fix most of them under warranty. There quality control sucks also. I have had so many things that were not tight when i bought mine that i went over every nut and bolt on the machine and tightened them myself. Just keep pressuring them and they will eventually come thru. Be persistant with them call them email them everyday if you have too.

Restrorob
05-22-2009, 08:04 PM
You should be dealing directly with an authorized Kawasaki engine dealer for engine problems.


Bingo !

You need to drag Kawasaki in on this band wagon, Between the two these issues should have been solved long ago.....


Good Luck

ricky86
05-22-2009, 08:55 PM
Just a word of caution. Bring lawyers into it, and everything stops. They can stall for years. They have specialist in this area of law. Can you get the same? What they need are some specialist in the repair area. Find out who your "District Service Manager" is. He should be involved at this point anyway. If they can't find the problem, it's time to start throwing some parts at it. Might be a good idea to start with a harness. Damm, do something. I've have been through problems like this (at the dealers POV) But maybe they spent all their money on the one that's in our shop now. Do they even know if it's an engine problem or an electrical system problem?

MikeSp
05-22-2009, 11:30 PM
Just a word of caution. Bring lawyers into it, and everything stops. They can stall for years. They have specialist in this area of law. Can you get the same? What they need are some specialist in the repair area. Find out who your "District Service Manager" is. He should be involved at this point anyway. If they can't find the problem, it's time to start throwing some parts at it. Might be a good idea to start with a harness. Damm, do something. I've have been through problems like this (at the dealers POV) But maybe they spent all their money on the one that's in our shop now. Do they even know if it's an engine problem or an electrical system problem?

CORRECT!! The mere mention of my lawyer caused Toro to stop in their tracks and I had to retract any reference to litigation to get them to proceed. One of the problems is the pointing of fingers between Toro and Kawasaki. At this point, Toro engineers, Kawasaki, dealer and Toro district rep are all involved which appears to me to be about the same as a committee that is in no hurry at all. The only part changed so far is the swapping of the Toro fuel pump with a Kawasaki pump which was then found to be putting out too much fuel pressure and the fuel pressure was reset to factory specs. One long time Toro Master Service Center owner was absolutely gold in his ongoing efforts to find the problem. The local Toro dealer at one time was a district rep and he has no clue even though I mentioned that when the fuel return line is pinched, it ceases revving up and down and cutting out and backfiring and seems to run normal. My case manager at Toro seems to be excellent but the engineers and Kawasaki seem to be dropping the ball.

MikeSp

tomo
05-23-2009, 08:38 AM
hi ,
You make mention of pinching return line and it improves
Next it sounds like toro is guessing and changing pump ........


make sure fuel supply return lines are ok
Filter ok
Check voltage and amperage draw of fuel pump

install combined fuel flow/pressure guage
running test check flow pressure
1/ surge test fuel pump by briefly pinching return [pressure will spike high]
2/ remove and install vacumn line to pressure regulator [pressure and flow will change accordingly
3/ stop engine and observe leak down of pressure
[checks valves in pump ,injectors leaking and regulator leak down ]

If intermitant power to pump connect to battery and test machine

tomo:waving::drinkup:

QualityLawnCare4u
05-23-2009, 02:07 PM
It sux having an expensive machine that does not work properly. If you even MENTION the lawyer word you can forget them ever touching it again! I did that on a lemon Toyota Tundra several years ago and could not get ANY dealer to touch it even though I never followed through with it. Just mentioning lawyer had me blackballed in every computer in Toyota's network. To this day I hate a Toyota!! Finally just traded the thing to solve the problem. In your case about all you can do is stay on toro cs and hope they will figure it out. I know that sux but only other option is to trade it and take a beating but your problem will disappear. have you posted this in our Toro forum?