PDA

View Full Version : 1st retaing wall install ?'s with PICS


Premier landscaping south
05-25-2009, 11:09 PM
Here are some pics to get a visual. My 1st wall install so I have a few questions.

Here are the basics:

100' x 3' tall average. I plan on using a 6 inch crusher base and #57 backfill with drain pipe.

Here is my delema: Would you backfill the whole 100'?. You can see RR ties in the pic. I plan on keeping the ties in place and building the wall in front of them. Backfill the wall in front of the ties or not? Also the junipers seem to be doing a good job of preventing water run off. I plan on removing some of the junipers to create 3 circular areas for crepe myrtle install with mulch, in the middle of hill. The only place I see water run off is to the left of RR ties. This area I suggested mulching the bare spot on slope to help control run off. I need the work and want to keep costs down, but want to do the job correctly to prevent further maintance in the future by clients or myself. Down here in the Southeast we can get some heavy rain due to tropical depressions in the fall.

Keystone compact 2 300@6.70 $2010.00
Caps 67@5.95 $399.00
adhesive 12@5.35 $65.00
pins 600@.025 $150
weed barrier 3'x100' $28.00
crusher run (footer) 3 ton $74.00
#57 stone (backfill) 18-20 ton $700.00
4" perf w/sock 100' $92.00
4' solid pipe 100' $65.00

Total $3638.00

Wall and cap will be delivered. I will pick up crusher and backfill. My trailer will haul 8,000Lbs, so I figure 3-4 trips 15 miles from supplier to job site. I will be digging footers myself with shovel in clay. I plan on having very little help with job.

I was thinking of charging 45 hours at $50 an hour.
Labor $2250
material $3638
Total $5888

Any suggestions would be very gratefully recieved.

richallseasons
05-25-2009, 11:13 PM
I think if you give away work that cheap your gonna be out of business, I also think that your material estimate for the base construction is off..

Premier landscaping south
05-25-2009, 11:23 PM
Thanks for the advise.

I failed to include the $150 freight charge and a $300 job credit was included on my materials estimate.

richallseasons
05-25-2009, 11:28 PM
If I was to price this job, and im not because I dont have enough info for me, I know that I would be at least $10,000.00

Premier landscaping south
05-25-2009, 11:40 PM
10-4. I went to my supplier, JD landscapes and talked to a guy who deals with hardscapes and he is the one who calculated the materials list. He took his time with me and I would hope the list is close. It looks like I will have value my labor more.

Thanks
pls

LB1234
05-25-2009, 11:45 PM
You are way way off. Be very careful.

Your base alone is going to be in the 7 to 8 ton range not 3. 102 foot long trench, 2 feet wide, and 8 inches deep (minimum not sure what your conditions are) is about 5 cubic yards. Utilizing 1.5 for the conversion of yards to tons you figure 8 tons of base material (not sure but we use QP, 3/4 minus, road stone...never heard of crusher...assuming its 3/4 with fines).

Your calculations alone for material seem way off which probablly indicates your labor assumption is as well. IMHO, by the time you figure equipment rentals, materials, repairing existing turf/landscaping, draiange, etc. I would be well over 12k for this job.

ppl
05-25-2009, 11:55 PM
I think your #'s are ok I came up with quanities that are close, but your labor is off. Are you planning to work fo wages? No pofit, no depreciation, no taxes.
Local, state and federal

Premier landscaping south
05-26-2009, 12:04 AM
I'm picking up what you guys are laying down. The base calculation is off for sure. I believe he calculated it for a 12" wide base @ 6". Thanks for bringing that to my attention along with other not thought of details. Thanks for your valuble time and insight. I'm going to have to learn to calculate this stuff on my own and quick to avoid getting burned.

PLS

Premier landscaping south
05-26-2009, 12:09 AM
I think your #'s are ok I came up with quanities that are close, but your labor is off. Are you planning to work fo wages? No pofit, no depreciation, no taxes.
Local, state and federal

Point well taken my friend. Thanks for the straight up critizism to help a fellow out. I thank god for this site and the people who are willing to take a few minutes to lend a helping hand.

STRINGALATION
05-26-2009, 02:21 AM
well for my 2 cents.
1. way to take some criticizem
2. check out you tube. versa-lok and rogers block have some nice videos

Premier landscaping south
05-26-2009, 01:05 PM
Thanks for the you tube heads up.* Did not think of that route.* It was worth more than 2 cents my friend.*Thanks to allPLS

GMTA
05-26-2009, 05:47 PM
I'm picking up what you guys are laying down. The base calculation is off for sure. I believe he calculated it for a 12" wide base @ 6". Thanks for bringing that to my attention along with other not thought of details. Thanks for your valuble time and insight. I'm going to have to learn to calculate this stuff on my own and quick to avoid getting burned.

PLS

Yeah you are off by half on the base quantity. Also why not just have the backfill delivered instead of making so many trips back and forth(complete waste of time/money). Your distributor could send it in one trip on a tri-axle load which I believe holds up to 26 ton per load.

Premier landscaping south
05-26-2009, 07:08 PM
The supplier did not have dump truck available at the time I went to get the materials estimate. I know it seems strange because they are a pretty large outfit. They said they were getting one soon. Maybe by the time I get this straightened out they will have one available.

The stone could not be dumped in backyard anyhow. I don't believe the customer would like that large of a truck driving across the front yard which is well maintained and has a steep grade from the road to the opening in the fence. Maybe could dump on driveway or something but again thier is a steep grade. Something to figure into my labor costs as well ehh. steep grade and wheelbarrow.

Looking to rent a small tractor to dig footer.

Any suggestions?

GMTA
05-26-2009, 07:36 PM
The supplier did not have dump truck available at the time I went to get the materials estimate. I know it seems strange because they are a pretty large outfit. They said they were getting one soon. Maybe by the time I get this straightened out they will have one available.

The stone could not be dumped in backyard anyhow. I don't believe the customer would like that large of a truck driving across the front yard which is well maintained and has a steep grade from the road to the opening in the fence. Maybe could dump on driveway or something but again thier is a steep grade. Something to figure into my labor costs as well ehh. steep grade and wheelbarrow.

Looking to rent a small tractor to dig footer.

Any suggestions?

First of all there is no way the truck driver will pull in the drive or on the lawn with that truck, especially loaded. You need to rent a skidsteer or tractor with backhoe attachment to trench the base and move the stone, which ever your more comfortable with using. Just roll the cost of the rental into the job. The company I deal with is around $175 a day for a skidsteer plus fuel (it needs to come back to them full). You might as well rent it for the week to ensure you get all the stone moved up that steep driveway and in place. You can also rent the forks to transport the wall stone pallets to the back in an ideal spot. Keep in mind if your working over nice grass/sod you should put down some cheap MDF plywood to drive over and eliminate tearing up the yard. (Pick them up at the end of the day or when not using to give the grass a break.)

GMTA
05-26-2009, 08:09 PM
OSB is the cheap stuff

STRINGALATION
05-26-2009, 09:36 PM
all jokes aside!! is your foot getting that tingling feeling. my foot is starting to tingle and it usually does that when i shoot myself in the foot.
this looks to be a load bearing wall.
liability and damage.


GET EXPERIENCED ASSISTANCE OR WALK AWAY

SORRY BUT THATS HOW ITS STRATING TO LOOK. YOU HAVE TO MANY QUESTIONS.

MAYBE MAYBE NOT IM WRONG ALL THE TIME ASK MY WIFE

riverwalklandscaping
05-27-2009, 09:47 PM
you pay 30$ a ton for stone? It's like 6 bucks here

esnipe8
05-27-2009, 09:57 PM
I think you should contact an experienced contractors who you can pay as a consultant. You might lose a couple hundred bucks off the top, but you will gain quality experience, build a quality wall and please the home owner.
IMHO

Premier landscaping south
05-27-2009, 11:33 PM
That is exactly the step I am about to take. I went to my supplier today and asked them who did a lot of retaining walls. The gave me a card of a man who does nothing but. I am going to contact him tomorrow. Maybe I can provide some free labor(or cash) in exchange for a quick education.

This is a retaining wall simply put. Yes I understand it has to be done the correct way to withstand a lifetime. I want nothing more to provide a quality service to the home owner. That is why I am taking steps like contacting more experienced pros like yourselves.

This is not to toot my own horn. Quality work is second nature to me. My living has been made in the racing industry. I have built fuel injection manifolds(kinsler fuel injection) for every kind of racing known to man.
Worked for Andy petree racing doing light fab and installing drivers seat weekly. I now work for Ronnie Hopkins building chassis for top NASCAR teams. Every job has one thing in common.....A lot of responsibility.

And that is the name of the game for a quality landscaper as well. Doing a professional job at a fare price. This responsibility is what gives us all a good name out there. Thanks for every ones input and constructive criticism. If hired I will build the wall and I will post pics so all you guys can give the new guy some more grief, because...............it's your responsibility.

PLS

PlatinumLandCon
05-28-2009, 12:23 AM
Hand dig 100' of trench in clay?? I have experience and I'm very hard working and I'd allow myself 60-70 hours for this job, plus more depending on the gravel moving situation. Also the $50/hr is cheap. I would easily charge this job at $12k+

Premier landscaping south
05-28-2009, 12:38 AM
I went up to neff today to see about rentals. Mini excavator, compactor and a georgia wagon. $1400 for a week. yes, it is included in the estimate.

I believe I will be close to 10k for the job.

I would like to gain some experience. If I bid the job to high and lose the bid then I have gained no money and no experience. I am satisfied if I gain a smaller profit and gain experience. Then go from thier. I'm just starting out I cannot expect to make top dollar.


PLS

STRINGALATION
05-28-2009, 02:28 AM
well at this point you have doubled your price

way to go