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David Gretzmier
06-13-2009, 10:43 AM
I have always wanted to drive a Lexus, but I have always worried about the impression it would make if a client sees me driving it. Bids checks, simple repair or whatever, at some point a client will see me in it. Even if it is an older model, used, and I paid 5-6 grand for it, I still worry that customers will immediately think I'm a little too successful and probably overcharged them. Am I wrong about this, or do you guys agree? why is it Ok to drive a $40,000 new truck but not a used luxury car like a Mercedes, Lexus, jaguar, etc?

Lite4
06-13-2009, 03:58 PM
Why does the customer have to think you are poor if you do lighting for them? You are the professional in a "Doctor-Patient" type relationship. Who cares what you drive? I would personally feel more comfortable hiring someone who is successful who I am confident must do a good job to get to where he is rather than Leroy in the rusted out old beater that I know is going to be cheap, but am unsure if he knows what he is doing or if he will return my calls after the job. I like to drive nice vehicles and have nice equipment. If it makes me look expensive, that's ok. I always encourage my customers to get multiple bids and I also tell them I will probably be the most expensive but I am also going to be better than any one else they talk to. Fixture salesman are poor and struggling, lighting designers are successful and snobby. Ha, Ha,... not really, but you get my drift.

cudaclan
06-13-2009, 04:34 PM
The best analogy that I can use is antique/flea market finds. I find that vendors are more apt to bargain or have realistic $ expectations if you dress more “subdued”. If you wear expensive jewelry and clothing the impression is “you can afford it”, whatever the cost.

Remember, industry expectations.

NightLightingFX
06-13-2009, 05:25 PM
If you are successful you should be able to spend your money any way you want. Most of your customers probably aren't going to be too comfortable dealing with someone driving around a HOOPTIE. On the other hand if you are into the STATUS game and it is important to you that you are seen in an expensive vehicle. Some people might have the same attitude I have. Which is I am not impressed with people / contractors who need status symbols. To me it doesn't seem like a smart business choice to drive up to a work site in an overated vehicle or an underated vehicle. For me personally, I wouldn't worry about what I drove around when I wasn't working.
~Ned

Pro-Scapes
06-13-2009, 07:18 PM
Initial meetings we dress nice. We usually take the silverado. Its nice and clean looking no dents or anything.

Here is another take on it. I recently had a small concrete slab poured for our addition on the house. Only 420 sq ft. Contractor came out. Gave us a price within 100 bucks. He was driving a 3/4 ton work truck. Seemed like an honest man. His price was near the higher end of what I was willing to pay for finishing but he could get to it quick so we gave him the go.

They show up at 730 am just after I left. Spoke to my wife and told her it would be $175 more than quoted (mind you this is a small 1200 buck job). She said fine and wrote the check. I get a msg from my wife at 330 in the afternoon saying we owed the concrete man another 185. I flipped because he raised his price not once but twice claiming his price didnt increase but it took more redimix than he expected. 4 people estimate the concrete volume at 7.5 yards. He claimed it took 10. He shows up wanting his other $185 in a brand new Cadillac DTS. Not sure why but this made an impression on both my wife and I.

Meanwhile I dont see anything wrong with driving something your clients would drive but then again you dont see an 09 caddy in my driveway just yet either. I think its all in the way you present yourself and if you remain honest. Had the concrete man stuck to his price and done honest work I would not have cared less what he drives.

I make sure each and every client knows I WILL be the one completing the installation so I see nothing wrong with showing up in a lettered company truck that is clean and in good working condition. I think different people will interpret this in different ways but if your going to play on a level ball field then make sure you keep things honest because the first time some one feels cheated its going to spread like wildfire.

We are often seen at upscale establishments where our clientel are and at theatrical presentations. I see nothing wrong with that. I dont always wear a company polo but I do always have a fresh supply of cards on hand for anyone who might ask what we do.

Lux Lawn
06-13-2009, 07:44 PM
I feel if you can afford the car and want the car you should buy it. Like you said we can spend $30-$40k for a truck. I just bought a brand new Silverado Z71, I take that on estimates since it is my nicest truck. This is also my personal truck not used for landscaping, only plowing in the winter.

BCarlson
06-13-2009, 07:47 PM
I get what you are saying. Nobody should care about what you drive. They don't know that your doing landscaping and you're wife might be the CEO of Microsoft. Maybe you invested well when you were young. But on the other hand first impressions are everything, you show up in an "09 F350 King Ranch they might automatically assume you are out of their price range. Also part of your long term goals, if I need 2 trucks do you spend 80+ grand on 1-tons or if 1/2 tons would do just fine do you invest the savings over the cost of the 1 tons. But a used Lexus no one is going to care that much about. And if anyone does and says something you bought it to help save on gas.

punt66
06-13-2009, 07:56 PM
Just curious. Why do people pay 15k more for a camry with a lexus logo? I dont think mixing a high end car in the business is a good idea. I dont show up for estimates on my harley or any of my muscle cars. I go with truck and trailer in tow.

capelawncare.com
06-13-2009, 08:14 PM
Im not in the lighting business, just landscapes and lawns. I own a BMW Convertible, that I showed up to give few estimates to people a few different times. I never got one of those accts, or jobs where the people saw my car.

A few people actually commented about it. Now I wont, give an estimate without my old beater work truck.

Mike M
06-13-2009, 09:47 PM
Put that money into a loaded Tundra and pay for some custom upgrades that James does not have and post the pics here.

greendoctor
06-14-2009, 04:43 AM
My take on this is they sure can see you in a Lexus. I am not in the lighting or landscape installation side of things either. I am an LCO or a lawn doctor. If I am not driving my spray truck. I show up in a 1983 Mercedes. Yes, I have heard some comments like "I hope I can afford you". It does help weed out price shoppers, bidders and lowballers, people I do not want to do business with anyway. Funny thing is, my truck is worth much more than the Benz. However, I am not ever confused with guys in beater trucks with rust holes and faded paint(no liability insurance, DOA license, or sales tax ID #)

INTEGRA Bespoke Lighting
06-14-2009, 10:23 PM
Put that money into a loaded Tundra and pay for some custom upgrades that James does not have and post the pics here.

? Why are you referring to me here ?

I stopped worrying about what I drive a long time ago. If I had a need or use for a luxury auto, then I would feel 100% fine driving it anywhere. People are too caught up on image & status symbols. Should only the clients be entitled to have or enjoy "nice things"? I don't think so. When I started my biz. in 1998 I was driving a 1986 GMC 1/2 ton that I bought for $2K. It was the right choice for me at the time and the clients respected that. Now I generally have a nice, newer model, fully loaded Pickup on the road... never heard a comment from a client. Sometimes, like this past Friday, I had the opportunity to do some service calls from my Doral Prestancia (express cruiser) All of the clients I saw admired the boat and said things like "good for you". I think they actually like doing business with people who are successful in their career.

punt66
06-15-2009, 06:49 AM
? Why are you referring to me here ?

I stopped worrying about what I drive a long time ago. If I had a need or use for a luxury auto, then I would feel 100% fine driving it anywhere. People are too caught up on image & status symbols. Should only the clients be entitled to have or enjoy "nice things"? I don't think so. When I started my biz. in 1998 I was driving a 1986 GMC 1/2 ton that I bought for $2K. It was the right choice for me at the time and the clients respected that. Now I generally have a nice, newer model, fully loaded Pickup on the road... never heard a comment from a client. Sometimes, like this past Friday, I had the opportunity to do some service calls from my Doral Prestancia (express cruiser) All of the clients I saw admired the boat and said things like "good for you". I think they actually like doing business with people who are successful in their career.
There is nothing wrong with being succesful and having nice things. A pickup is a work vehicle. Mine is a 07 i bought new in 07 so thats a proper image. But showing up in a bmw or a hummer for an estimate is not a good idea. Too each their own.

David Gretzmier
06-15-2009, 09:59 AM
I agree it is ok to show up in a very nice truck. I believe clients want that. It show you are successful and have a very nice work truck. But you probably can't get a away with a cadillac escalade. I have an 06 ford I have had since nearly new. I believe it sets the perfect tone. I also have a 95 toyota avalon I do bids and visits on. clean, nice used car. I think I should be free to buy what I want, and I am successful, but I believe there is a message we send when we show up at client's houses in whatever we drive. Further, that message still gets out when clients see us in whatever parking lot we happen to run into them.

In so far as the comment on a Lexus being a rebadged Toyota, the ES 300 and the Landcruiser are indeed toyota based. The Lexus versions typically sell several thousand higher even in the used market. The GS, LS models as well as others share no platform or parts with any Toyota model.

JB1
06-15-2009, 10:05 AM
since when is showing up in a very nice vehicle a sign of success, most of the time it is smoke and mirrors. Just look at all the big nice homes in foreclosure, they gave everybody the impression of success and it was all a big show.

JDiepstra
06-15-2009, 10:11 AM
Go ahead and get that Lexus and enjoy it but take a work truck to do an estimate.

JoeyD
06-15-2009, 10:57 AM
I dont see whay it matters...One of the most succesful lighting guys I know shows up to every job in a decked out Hummer and sells jobs hand over fist....some poeple, especially the high end, like dealing with someone they know is succesful!

Pro-Scapes
06-15-2009, 12:31 PM
Go ahead and get that Lexus and enjoy it but take a work truck to do an estimate.

This is probably one of the simpliest and best answers yet.

Joey not everyone lives in so cal. If I showed up in a 100k hummer even my clients driving the 80k 740 bmw might raise an eyebrow. Not everyone has multimillion dollar clientel with a 300k supercar in the garage. Being on time, properly dressed and with good hygene driving a respectable vehichle should speak more volumes about you than if you care to spend 60k on a car. I offered to buy Ash a BMW x5 this past year and she declined it in favor of a loaded honda CRV. She said the BMW just wasnt her. We do sometimes take the Honda on estimates but I am tossed up if I would be comfortable pulling up to a small 30 light job in a subdivision in a 50k car. Here at least alot of people still get sticker shock. No need to rub it in.

JoeyD
06-15-2009, 12:51 PM
All I am saying is you shouldnt be afraid to be who you are and dumb your appearance down for fear of looking "too succesful".........Bottom line is you need to be comfortable with yourself to be confident selling a high end product like lighting. If that means showing up in an old Pick Up then so be it....if you feel more comfortable in a new Caddillac then roll up in your caddy and handle your buisness......

Alan B
06-15-2009, 01:59 PM
I wouldn't let a cust see the lexus. I personally wouldn't care and thinks its silly if someone does, but reality is some people will be put off. It like discussing politics, your bound to alienate some of your potential customers (whether right or wrong).

I have first hand knowledge of customers (diff industry) telling me how they didn't like a salesman from another co (and made several references about how he was driving a Jaguar). Have also had customers mention to me about my a BMW (again diff industry and back when I was in my 20's). Frankly, it didn't matter enough to me so I kept buying the cars I wanted. So to answer the question, it would be better to show up in the work truck, you may lose some accts if you show up in the lexus, but do what matters most to you.

Best of both worlds is get the Lexus but show up in the truck.

davis45
06-15-2009, 02:48 PM
I've never thought of this as an issue. One of my customers stopped and talked to me at a gas station when I was out on my motorcycle. They said "So, is this what i'm paying for every month?" I said it sure is and they just laughed and said to enjoy it. No matter what side of the Lawn and outdoor industry your in, we all work hard for our money, as do our customers. Buy what you want to and enjoy it. But, like others have said, it only makes sense to use the truck for estimates and whatnot.

punt66
06-15-2009, 02:51 PM
I've never thought of this as an issue. One of my customers stopped and talked to me at a gas station when I was out on my motorcycle. They said "So, is this what i'm paying for every month?" I said it sure is and they just laughed and said to enjoy it. No matter what side of the Lawn and outdoor industry your in, we all work hard for our money, as do our customers. Buy what you want to and enjoy it. But, like others have said, it only makes sense to use the truck for estimates and whatnot.

Having a customer seeing you outside of your job scope is entirely different. Drive a lotus in your off time if you want. What is important and which you agree is that showing up for an estimate in that vehicle isnt good for business.

davis45
06-15-2009, 02:54 PM
Having a customer seeing you outside of your job scope is entirely different. Drive a lotus in your off time if you want. What is important and which you agree is that showing up for an estimate in that vehicle isnt good for business.

Yes, we're on the same page, i didnt read through this whole thread, just skimmed it. I assumed he was worried about customers seeing him out and about on his personal time in a nice luxury vehicle, which shouldn't be an issue.

TXNSLighting
06-15-2009, 03:09 PM
All I am saying is you shouldnt be afraid to be who you are and dumb your appearance down for fear of looking "too succesful".........Bottom line is you need to be comfortable with yourself to be confident selling a high end product like lighting. If that means showing up in an old Pick Up then so be it....if you feel more comfortable in a new Caddillac then roll up in your caddy and handle your buisness......

Well said. Its up to you on what you want to drive. Our clients are wealthy and want the best most of the time.

AI Inc
06-15-2009, 03:14 PM
Just curious. Why do people pay 15k more for a camry with a lexus logo? I dont think mixing a high end car in the business is a good idea. I dont show up for estimates on my harley or any of my muscle cars. I go with truck and trailer in tow.

And thats all it is , is a Toyota in a tuxedo.

niteliters
06-16-2009, 08:47 PM
Well said. Its up to you on what you want to drive. Our clients are wealthy and want the best most of the time.

ditto, end of thread. I'm heading to canada to do service with james on his boat:canadaflag:

punt66
06-16-2009, 08:52 PM
ditto, end of thread. I'm heading to canada to do service with james on his boat:canadaflag:

I am hooking up the boat and headed up that ways as well to lake champlain.

TXNSLighting
06-16-2009, 09:27 PM
ditto, end of thread. I'm heading to canada to do service with james on his boat:canadaflag:

:cool2::cool2:

Thebottomline
07-19-2009, 07:24 PM
Many different opinions on this thread. I would think it would all depend on your clientel. I would show up in the car that would be the most client-friendly. Some clients might feel more comfortable with you showing up in a truck and others might instantly think you are in a similar click as them showing up in a luxury car. To me it is always about landing the sale and increasing your business. Manipulate the client in any way possible.

jbbarnett
07-19-2009, 08:24 PM
As a consumer I want to deal, and surround myself, with successful people. However, I must say I dont always relate success with large sums of money. Over the last couple years I have had a lot of work completed and been involved with a lot of contractors. I have only once had a bad thought concerning any of them driving a nice car or having nice trucks. However, there is one company in my area that has a fleet of about 10 3/4 ton trucks that are all 2009 model. They upgrade their fleet each year when new models come out. In this case, I was thrown off by their fleet. I couldnt help but know that I was paying for these vehicles that were completely unnecessary. I could understand if they purchased a new truck or even two every year so that their oldest truck was wither 5 or 10 yrs old depending on how they purchased. But to have all new trucks every year seemed overboard and i wasnt going to pay for that overhead. They were the highest bidder in the end as well, which is understandable with their overhead. The guy i went with was second highest and had a very nice fleet of trucks. But I thought that the trucks were meant to be reliable and present a nice professional business and not a waste of my money. Just my 2 cents. For what its worth I would get the personal car you want and enjoy it, lifes too short to not enjoy it while you can

Pro-Scapes
07-20-2009, 10:12 AM
excellent insight.

I do still get a sour feeling in my mouth every time I think of the concrete contractor raising his price twice and showing up in a brand new caddy to collect his check. I have no problem with him driving the new caddy but felt a bit ripped off when he raised his price in the middle of and after the project then shows up with his gold rings on all the fingers driving a brand spankin new 50k car. It just made me feel like I was being Milked.

I just dont get it tho David. Why you couldnt show up in a pre owned 20k lexus but I show up in our brand new 30k Honda ??? people are tpo quick to judge. Why risk it?

David Gretzmier
07-20-2009, 10:36 AM
At this point in time I have decided not to risk it. I can drive my wife's toyota Avalon, and do bids and pick up checks with no response from customers. It seems the best vehicles are ones in the middle. If a customer sees you in a beater, a very old vehicle with dents in the doors, they think you are going out of business and will not trust you. If you show up in a really nice branded car, Lexus, Mercedes, Jaguar, etc, they think you are making too much money.

I really think there are wide ranging opinions on this, but it comes down to this for me- The impression I make can get me or lose me a job. I do everything I can to make the impression to get the job, and I eliminate things that can lose it for me.

many things can lose you a job, from your outfit, your hair, your body odor, even not being able to answer a question properly from a potential customer.
and yes, not only your vehicle but is it clean, full of junk, and has graphics?

There was a time when I had tons of work and I'd just say those folks were too picky and I would move on to the next bid. I am finding the lighting business, both Christmas and Landscape, attracts the very folks that are very particular about how things look. And since the bids have pretty much dried up, everyone of them counts.

extlights
07-20-2009, 04:25 PM
If you are professional, curtious, and respectful to the customer and develop and maintain a good relationship with them then it doesn't matter one bit what you show up in. Deliver what you promise and exceed their expectations and they won't think twice about what you drive.

Heck, alot of the new trucks out there cost as much as a Lexus anyway. You're in a business that deals with high end customers, showing up in a Lexus shouldn't phase them one bit....now a Bently....maybe....lol.

Chris J
07-20-2009, 07:52 PM
I didn't read this entire thread, but I'm sure some share the same opinion. Successful people like to do business with successful people. I think my truck is pretty impressive, but if I had a Mercedes I'd have no problem driving it to do estimates or other meetings.

INTEGRA Bespoke Lighting
07-21-2009, 07:37 PM
If you are professional, curtious, and respectful to the customer and develop and maintain a good relationship with them then it doesn't matter one bit what you show up in. Deliver what you promise and exceed their expectations and they won't think twice about what you drive.

Heck, alot of the new trucks out there cost as much as a Lexus anyway. You're in a business that deals with high end customers, showing up in a Lexus shouldn't phase them one bit....now a Bently....maybe....lol.

Exactly...

Successful people like to do business with successful people. I think my truck is pretty impressive, but if I had a Mercedes I'd have no problem driving it to do estimates or other meetings.

I concur...

I show up in my boat and it doesn't throw my clients off... heck I bought it to take prospects out on the lakes at night to showcase my work. They appreciate the success that has come from hard work and talent and I would not even think about hosting a client in my work boat. Same goes for the truck... it is a darned nice truck and I get a new one regularly. Why not? As I have said more than once in the past. Is it only the client's who are allowed to own nice things?

JimLewis
07-22-2009, 05:48 PM
I didn't have time to read all the responses. I just read the first half. So forgive me if I am jumping in the middle of something. But here's my take on the initial post;

I always figure it's not really a good idea to show up to a customer's house in a nicer vehicle than they drive. Some people really aren't into status that much and it doesn't matter. But a lot of more well-to-do people ARE into status. And when the guy who is working on their landscape (lighting / landscape pretty much same thing in a customer's eyes) shows up driving a nicer car then they have, I am sorry, but it's true - some people are going to get a little jealous about that. And they're going to think to themselves, "Damn! This guy must be charging way too much if he's driving a freakin' Lexus!" I don't think that goes over real well with some people. So I would want to avoid making my client feel that way. It's not right. They should have no reason to feel jealous or upset if we are driving a nicer car. But it's just how it is. And you either want their business or you don't. I want their business. So I wouldn't show up to a customer's house in a Lexus unless they owned a Mercedes or BMW or newer Lexus or Porche or something.

Not saying don't buy one. You can certainly buy one. Just keep it for personal use. Use it on nights and weekends when you are out of uniform and in your plain clothes. And try not to run into the customer who owns the Cadillac at Red Robin. :laugh:

Now I also don't think it's wise to show up in a P.O.S. truck or car either. I think something middle of the road is generally acceptable. I drive a REALLY NICE 2001 Dodge Pickup. It's about as nice and new looking as they come. Every feature I could possibly have. And customers think I have a nice rig. But I guarantee you if I showed up in a 2010 Dodge Ram Cummings Turbo Diesel Quad Cab Long Bed with Duallies on the back, I'd turn off some people. I know landscapers around town who DO pull up in those rigs. And I hear the comments from my customers what they think about that. Those show-off guys get some large jobs. But they turn-off everyone else. I find with a modest vehicle I can still drive a nice enough vehicle to get the respect I need to land the large jobs AND not piss off the customers who aren't quite so wealthy.

Trust me. One day in the next few years I'll either own a Dodge Viper or a newer Corvette. It's in the plan. But I guarantee you I'm never going to show my face at my customer's homes driving that!

David Gretzmier
07-22-2009, 09:30 PM
Jim, I agree completely. Also, You're one of the rare folks that have been on lawnsite longer than me !

JimLewis
07-22-2009, 10:06 PM
I know. I've been on here for ages. Did they even have the internet back in 1999??? If they did, I think I was one of the only ones who was using it back then.

Incidentally, I was the first landscaper in Oregon to have their own website (and boy was it ugly!) and the first to show up on Google back when Google was still pretty young and the first one in Oregon to use PPC advertising back when that was still new (doesn't work as well now as it did several years ago). I've always kind of been ahead of the curve when it came to new technology.

David Gretzmier
07-23-2009, 12:35 AM
I remember back when I first started on lawnsite. I think there were 5 boards, and really only one- lawn cutters. probably only 50 regular posters, Ah, Eric Elm. I still miss him. I cannot even follow the lawn care threads now, like 3-5 pages of new threads a day. The landscape light and Christmas light threads are exactly my speed.

Tomwilllight
07-24-2009, 12:27 PM
I bought a Green 2002 Lexus RX300 in 2004 and sold my '99 white Subaru Outback. I got a good price because it was green - an unpopular color then.

The Lexus works for me in a number of ways:

When I left Greg Yale Associates, I decided to market myself as a "Landscape Lighting Designer." The Lexus was part of that marketing; in our culture, you are what you drive.

Most of my work is in Southern Ct - a 2.5 to 3 hour drive, one way. The comfortable ride, reasonable milage (20.3 MPG) and excellent sound system make the long drive easier.

The Lexus has a big enough hole in the back & a roof rack to carry all the ladders, tools, supplies and mock-up stuff I need. I'm getting smarter about having my orders shipped to the electricians I work with. I don't deliver anymore.

BIG PLUS: I don't get stopped by the POLICE anymore. As I'm sure you all do, I drive around residential areas late a night, stopping occasionally to get out and look. The police are interested in drivers who do that. Since I started to drive the Lexus I've not been stopped.

BIGGEST PLUS: NO CAR PAYMENTS and the service manager swears I'll get 250K miles of service.

Tom

JimLewis
07-24-2009, 12:55 PM
BIG PLUS: I don't get stopped by the POLICE anymore. As I'm sure you all do

HUH???? That's one of the more rediculous things I've read on lawnsite in a while. We all get pulled over by cops but you don't? You assume too much.

David Gretzmier
07-24-2009, 04:16 PM
yeah, once I am a Harvard professor and have a nice house the police would never assume...oh wait, they are still jerks...

Pro-Scapes
07-24-2009, 05:33 PM
I want to see a pic of a lexus with a ladder on top. This I gotta see :)

Tomwilllight
07-24-2009, 06:00 PM
BIG PLUS: I don't get stopped by the POLICE anymore. As I'm sure you all do, I drive around residential areas late a night, stopping occasionally to get out and look. The police are interested in drivers who do that. Since I started to drive the Lexus I've not been stopped.

"I don't get stopped by the POLICE anymore. (Please note period = new thought.) As I'm sure you all do, I drive around residential areas late a night, stopping occasionally to get out and look."

The point I was trying to make was "different strokes for different folks" in different neighborhoods. I was also trying to say that there are situations where a pick-up is good and other situations a pick-up is not the best choice. It depends on how you want to present yourself to your clients. Since this discussion started with a discussion of Lexus, I thought I could add something useful based on my personal experience.

I also assumed most of those who design and/or install landscape lighting go back at night to look at their work. If that is off base... well we do our jobs in the way we think is best for us and our customers.

Of course I was also thinking about the Gates incident. It's in the air...

If I offended anyone, I apologize. I certainly wasn't thinking about anybody I know in our business.

The Bottom Line: Based on my empirical evidence: Driving a 7 year old Lexus in Greenwich, CT late at night means the police will be considerably less interested in what you are doing than if you are driving a 5 year old Outback.

Billy, I'll shoot a photo of my car with a ladder strapped to the roof rack when I finish loading for the Focus and Mock-up session I'm running this weekend. Look for it in your e-mail.

Tom

JimLewis
07-24-2009, 06:18 PM
Email???

Why does just Tom get to see it? We want to see that too! :)

Tomwilllight
07-24-2009, 06:23 PM
I think I can handle that.
Tom

Pro-Scapes
07-25-2009, 01:02 PM
Maybe Tom is on to something here with the ultimate selling tool. I never tried to sell really. I dont launch into a whole deal on why people should hire me. I give them the facts... make my proposal and suggestions.

Tomwilllight
07-26-2009, 04:03 PM
Here's my car loaded for a focus job. The client asked me for additional landscape lighting so we are also loaded for a mock-up.

The home looked great when we finished; the focus and mock-up went great.

Tom*trucewhiteflag*