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View Full Version : Nonstop problems with Toro Grandstand


kinggregi
06-20-2009, 07:35 PM
Is anyone else experiencing major problems with their grandstands? Mine is back in for service for the 8th time with only 54 hours. I've attempted to contact Toro "customer care" 3 times now and received only one response back, which was "good news sir, your mower will be fixed under warranty." Apparently weeks of lost productivity, hundreds of miles for transporting, headache and frustration means nothing to Toro.

The following is problems I've experienced:
Throttle control cable does not function when engine reaches operating temperature.
Engine misfires after 1 hour of operation (19 hp kaw, one ignition coil found faulty, a week later problem reoccurs).
Hydro drive will not move unit up steep hill in reverse.
Hydro drive max speed is only 6.5mph (spec sheet states 8mph)
Parking brake requires weekly tightening; else it will drag on tires.
Parking brake hardware vibrated loose and required me to replace it.
Hydro reservoir tank hardware fell out, and required me to replace it.
Deck drive belts slip when cutting in heavy conditions.
Illustrated parts list was not on Toro's database when filters were needed.

Just wondering if these were common problems to this new model?

dishboy
06-20-2009, 08:40 PM
Dang!, sounds like Toro brought the Exmark Metro 26 team over on this project.

Mowingman
06-20-2009, 08:44 PM
That is great!!:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

Dang!, sounds like Toro brought the Exmark Metro 26 team over on this project.

traman
06-20-2009, 08:48 PM
Dang!, sounds like Toro brought the Exmark Metro 26 team over on this project.

honestly,I'd figured that toro would have a few bugs to work out ,but not a complete fumigation . sorry to here this. hope your state has a lemon law ,this is just unacceptable

tacoma200
06-20-2009, 09:29 PM
I take it your not going to endorse them to fellow Lawnsite members? That's a shame to have that much trouble.I hope something gets worked out for you.
Posted via Mobile Device

ed2hess
06-20-2009, 09:32 PM
I feel your pain ...learned my lesson on a Wright stander buying it way way too early in the manufacturing cycle. It took about a year to work out the problems some of which are the same as you are having. And both of these two new standup machines look like they are a lot more complicated than the Wright machine.

johnnybravo8802
06-20-2009, 10:02 PM
I was a guinea pig for Hustler and Ferris on new products except Hustler stood by their product and Ferris didn't. I wanted to purchase a GS but with my track record, I felt I should hold off. I still say it's the bomb and will be the best thing out in 1-2 years.

LawnScapers of Dayton
06-20-2009, 10:11 PM
I only have 9 hours on mine but it has been flawless....23hp, 52in

kinggregi
06-21-2009, 10:38 AM
I take it your not going to endorse them to fellow Lawnsite members? That's a shame to have that much trouble.I hope something gets worked out for you.
Posted via Mobile Device

That's right, at this point I cannot recommend this mower. The majority of my problems, which keep me from being productive are with the engine. So, perhaps the 23 horse doesn't have these ignition problems I've experienced. Overall, the mower operates well, cuts excellent, and the tires are big enough to hold on some very steep terrain (steeper than recommended in the manual). The walk-behind feature is almost useless as there's not enough weight on the drive tires for any good traction. I'm very disappointed that Toro released a product with these obvious problems and so far, hasn't been helpful to me.

jameson
06-21-2009, 10:57 AM
Is anyone else experiencing major problems with their grandstands? Mine is back in for service for the 8th time with only 54 hours. I've attempted to contact Toro "customer care" 3 times now and received only one response back, which was "good news sir, your mower will be fixed under warranty." Apparently weeks of lost productivity, hundreds of miles for transporting, headache and frustration means nothing to Toro.

The following is problems I've experienced:
Throttle control cable does not function when engine reaches operating temperature.
Engine misfires after 1 hour of operation (19 hp kaw, one ignition coil found faulty, a week later problem reoccurs).
Hydro drive will not move unit up steep hill in reverse.
Hydro drive max speed is only 6.5mph (spec sheet states 8mph)
Parking brake requires weekly tightening; else it will drag on tires.
Parking brake hardware vibrated loose and required me to replace it.
Hydro reservoir tank hardware fell out, and required me to replace it.
Deck drive belts slip when cutting in heavy conditions.
Illustrated parts list was not on Toro's database when filters were needed.

Just wondering if these were common problems to this new model?

Post this in the Toro Forum (http://www.lawnsite.com/forumdisplay.php?f=244), they need this type of feedback, especially on a new model release. (Plus, in a couple of years, if I decide to purchase one, all these bugs will be worked out)

:)

DLCS
06-21-2009, 11:40 AM
Did they hire the 800 series design team from John Deere? Sounds like the same Bozos that work for Deere are now designing for Toro. Seriously, this is the wave of the future, design something and let the public work the bugs out during the first year. John Deere did most of their testing on the 800 series with sensors and computers. I wonder if that was the case with the toro Grandstand?

kinggregi
06-25-2009, 09:51 PM
I wanted to post an update to my nightmare of a situation with my Toro Grandstand. The mower has a problem with the hydro drive actuator "backing off" which will not allow the unit to achieve maximum ground speed. This was fixed 2 times by the dealer with a zip tie, but the heat is too extreme at that location and they break within an hour of use. Also, the loss of throttle control at the operator's panel has been rectified with a heavy duty spring assiting the motion of the cable (I came up with).

I've now made 4 trips to the dealer this week alone (total 12) for a grand tally of nearly 300 miles transporting my problematic machine to and from the dealer! It has cost me more than 14 hours of my personal time and over 24 hours of lost productivity.

Toro still has not responded to my communications with their customer service from 2 weeks ago. At this point, I completely regret ever purchasing this machine. I did not purchase this product to be used a prove out for Toro!

Mowingman
06-25-2009, 09:54 PM
Is there a "Lermon Law' in Ohio? If so, use it to your advantage.

fireman1000
06-25-2009, 10:00 PM
I had major problems with a new Toro Z-master and posted in the Toro forum on this web site and got results. I also helped another poster out who was getting the runaround from Toro, by having him do the same and he also got quick results. They must not want any negative comments posted, especially there. Also, make a point to make it known that you are also posting here.
Good Luck!!

BCL Services
06-25-2009, 10:00 PM
yep, i'll keep my Wright :)

johnnybravo8802
06-25-2009, 10:17 PM
I wanted to post an update to my nightmare of a situation with my Toro Grandstand. The mower has a problem with the hydro drive actuator "backing off" which will not allow the unit to achieve maximum ground speed. This was fixed 2 times by the dealer with a zip tie, but the heat is too extreme at that location and they break within an hour of use. Also, the loss of throttle control at the operator's panel has been rectified with a heavy duty spring assiting the motion of the cable (I came up with).

I've now made 4 trips to the dealer this week alone (total 12) for a grand tally of nearly 300 miles transporting my problematic machine to and from the dealer! It has cost me more than 14 hours of my personal time and over 24 hours of lost productivity.

Toro still has not responded to my communications with their customer service from 2 weeks ago. At this point, I completely regret ever purchasing this machine. I did not purchase this product to be used a prove out for Toro!
That sounds like my stent with Ferris. The funny thing is, they made me out to be the "Bad guy" and all I wanted was a mower that didn't break once a week.

tallimeca
06-27-2009, 03:37 PM
offf. Sounds annoying. Hope they get it fixed for you.

The Toro Company
06-29-2009, 05:58 PM
Hi Kinggregi,

Jameson and Fireman 1000 provided excellent advice by recommending that you post your thread on the Toro Forum. Forum sponsors receive an email alert every time a post is made to their Forum, whereas they don’t receive notification when a post is made to the Commercial Mowing section of Lawnsite.com. This is understandable since there can be literally hundreds of different threads/posts per day. Toro’s goal is to field and then respond to customer questions and issues in a timely fashion, and the Lawnsite Forum has allowed us to do both.

We’re sorry to learn about the problems you’ve experienced with your Toro GrandStand. Most of the issues you’ve identified, loose parts and groundspeed, are issues we have been made aware of and have already corrected in production. For units built before corrective action occurred, replacement hardware and adjustment procedures have been provided to Toro Commercial Dealers for field updates. We’ve been contacted by several customers stating that these updates have solved all previous problems, so hopefully your Toro Commercial Dealer has implemented these updates?

Regarding your Kawasaki engine issues, we cannot say with certainty what is causing the throttle cable issue, but we have received similar reports from other customers complaining about loss of groundspeed. We are investigating whether it is variability in the resistance on this throttle control plate that is causing some customers to experience the issue, while others are not. Kawasaki has a spring on the back side of the throttle plate to prevent the engine from backing off from full throttle. The spring goes "over center" at about 80% of throttle travel. If the throttle control is moved to the fast position very slowly, the spring tension has the potential of not allowing the throttle to be moved fully. The problem can generally be overcome by moving the throttle control in a brisk, steady motion to push through the resistance. As for Kawasaki 19hp coil issues and backfiring, this has not been an issue brought to our attention, but we’ll check with Kawasaki to understand if there’s an issue we need to be aware of. The Kawasaki 19hp has been a very reliable engine used in many applications across the landscape industry, and when problems arise Kawasaki has a good reputation for standing behind their product.

As stated at the beginning of this email, our goal is to field and respond to customer questions and issues in a timely fashion. We appreciate your GrandStand purchase and stand committed to you and our product. We will attempt to contact you tomorrow. Thanks for your patience.

david shumaker
06-29-2009, 06:19 PM
I had an issue with my 40" Toro Rider at about 200 hours. The dealer and Toro handled the problem promptly under warranty. I had to wait about a week to get the mower back because parts had to be ordered. I have a backup walkbehind, but after using the ZTR, I hate to use the walkbehind all day.

MileHigh
06-29-2009, 06:25 PM
I'm sure these problems will get worked out by the next season or two, and then this mower will be beastly.

fireman1000
06-29-2009, 06:33 PM
I'm actually impressed by Toro's actions. They took care of my problem once I brought it to their attention by posting in the Toro forum on this site. I hope your problem is quickly resolved to your satisfaction!

johnnybravo8802
06-29-2009, 09:54 PM
I had a GS for about 3 days and was blown away with it. Read my extensive review. However, I didn't use it long enough to experience any problems. With that being said, it was the most versatile and compact machine I've ever been on-It's groundbreaking!!! I will have to get a second mower by next spring and the GS is still certainly in the running. It's going to take the industry by storm when the kinks are worked out.

jbell36
06-29-2009, 10:03 PM
we have had many problems with our grandstand's (23hp 52in) but they have been small problems and not enough to turn me away from the machine...the most annoying one though is the blades keep turning off on one of our machines slowing us down, but not stopping us...it's a great machine all in all but definitely some small problems

loose hardware
throttle cable doesn't completely work
groundspeed off (especially in reverse) and hydros don't match up
brake came loose
deck height adjustment got twice as heavy on one machine?
lost a few covers that weren't glued down on the brake handle and deck height adjustment (was a recall)
gas tank (recall)
blades turn off randomly (prob loose cable)
among others...

i'm definitely not happy with those problems but for the most part they are small problems and i love the machine, will buy a 36 next year if they for sure come out with one...

delphied
06-29-2009, 10:15 PM
Im having great luck with my new Grandstand but it only has 7 hours. It replaced a TTHP. That has a floating deck and this Grandstand doesnt and I have had no problems with scalping. With the TTHP I did so dont believe everything you read about scalping issues with the fixed deck.

dishboy
06-29-2009, 10:40 PM
Im having great luck with my new Grandstand but it only has 7 hours. It replaced a TTHP. That has a floating deck and this Grandstand doesnt and I have had no problems with scalping. With the TTHP I did so dont believe everything you read about scalping issues with the fixed deck.

Most so called floating decks are really just hanging decks. IMO a true floating design is Walker or Walker clone Navigator

lifetree
06-29-2009, 10:45 PM
dang!, sounds like toro brought the exmark metro 26 team over on this project.

lmao ... !!

seascapes
07-05-2009, 05:58 PM
Our GS has had a couple minor issues but have been taken well care of by the dealer. I think the machine has about 100 hours on it. We just recently ran into the throttle issue. When it is put into idle you have to push it up very fast to get it to full speed. We had one spindle problem but it took dealer about 30 min to fix and we were on the road. The biggest problem we have found is with the brake and controls. They get loose about once a week. This time we are taking it in to dealer for them to adjust and hopefully fix! All and all this machine is the bomb! Nice cut, fast, responsive, and my guys fight to get on it. If they are happy I am happy, keeps them wanting to work and doing a better job!

lwelve
07-05-2009, 08:35 PM
I`ve had similar problems also, lost hardware from parking brake and hydro resevoir.
Have had a consistent problem with engine flooding out and stopping, I have to take off air cleaner and wipe gas out of intake area for carb., dealer has ordered a new needle jet for it and is going to replace, had to replace fuel filter twice and only 110 hours on unit. My right side hydro is very weak, will not back up in reverse, dealer says he can adjust. I believe overall it`s a good machine, but to many little things going wrong, wish I had waited until the 'bugs" were worked out before buying.

johnnybravo8802
07-05-2009, 09:01 PM
I`ve had similar problems also, lost hardware from parking brake and hydro resevoir.
Have had a consistent problem with engine flooding out and stopping, I have to take off air cleaner and wipe gas out of intake area for carb., dealer has ordered a new needle jet for it and is going to replace, had to replace fuel filter twice and only 110 hours on unit. My right side hydro is very weak, will not back up in reverse, dealer says he can adjust. I believe overall it`s a good machine, but to many little things going wrong, wish I had waited until the 'bugs" were worked out before buying.
That's why I'm riding it out through the winter and looking at one in the spring.

dwr
07-20-2009, 01:07 PM
Men, The Wright Stander is the Rite Stander !!!

4.3mudder
07-20-2009, 01:23 PM
What you have is a lemon for sure. That's a big issue when manufacturers come out with new products such as the Grandstand. After a few couple years they should finally get all the bugs worked out. Just like fuel injection on vehicles, it took years for them to finally perfect it. I always give a couple years when something new comes out so they work out the problems along the way.

snnoopy
07-13-2011, 03:57 PM
Is anyone else experiencing major problems with their grandstands? Mine is back in for service for the 8th time with only 54 hours. I've attempted to contact Toro "customer care" 3 times now and received only one response back, which was "good news sir, your mower will be fixed under warranty." Apparently weeks of lost productivity, hundreds of miles for transporting, headache and frustration means nothing to Toro.

The following is problems I've experienced:
Throttle control cable does not function when engine reaches operating temperature.
Engine misfires after 1 hour of operation (19 hp kaw, one ignition coil found faulty, a week later problem reoccurs).
Hydro drive will not move unit up steep hill in reverse.
Hydro drive max speed is only 6.5mph (spec sheet states 8mph)
Parking brake requires weekly tightening; else it will drag on tires.
Parking brake hardware vibrated loose and required me to replace it.
Hydro reservoir tank hardware fell out, and required me to replace it.
Deck drive belts slip when cutting in heavy conditions.
Illustrated parts list was not on Toro's database when filters were needed.

Just wondering if these were common problems to this new model?

******************************
I have the same mower. I have been having the same trouble with the engine misfiring and slow max speed. Did you ever get this resolved? Please respond if you would. You may contact me at snnoopy555@gmail.com as well. Thanks. I'm very frustrated.

outlaw1960
07-14-2011, 02:17 PM
Congrats to Toro for responding to the post! A proactive company is awesome, Tested a few Grandstands and loved them! I will look closer at them next year, the ride is awesome.

The Toro Company
07-14-2011, 03:14 PM
Congrats to Toro for responding to the post! A proactive company is awesome, Tested a few Grandstands and loved them! I will look closer at them next year, the ride is awesome.

Thank you for your continued business.
The Toro Company
Libby Snyder

The Toro Company
07-14-2011, 03:16 PM
******************************
I have the same mower. I have been having the same trouble with the engine misfiring and slow max speed. Did you ever get this resolved? Please respond if you would. You may contact me at snnoopy555@gmail.com as well. Thanks. I'm very frustrated.

If you are having any problems with your machine can you please provide the following information:
model and serial number of the unit, dealer you are working with and your name and contact information. Customer care would be glad to help you with these issues.
The Toro Company
Libby Snyder

snnoopy
07-26-2011, 04:20 PM
My Toro Grandstand started losing power over a year ago. To no avail could I figure out the problem, nor could the dealership. Eventually, the warranty wore out don't you know. It was the COIL, hahahahahahahahahaha.

snnoopy
07-26-2011, 04:33 PM
Toro Grandstand, WARNNING! WARNING! WARNING! DON'T BUY IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I have had this mower for 2 years and it has had one problem after another. No power, dealership can't troubleshoot it. I can't troubleshoot it. Finally, I see this forum and I said, check the coil. Sure enough, coil is bad. The mower has had one month of down time this year................what a joke!!! Of course Kawasaki wont cover it now. Isn't that great????

Dodge Boys
07-26-2011, 06:17 PM
Wait till your frame let's go at the welds in front of the muffler, or your muffler breaks off due to being not supported.... I have two of them, 48" deck units... They haven't been right since day one, and never will be... 450 hrs later the problems are still there.... They are high maintenance units..... Added some equipment to the fleet this year, went green... No problems as of yet!!! 150hrs on the Quik Trax's and so far so good!!!:canadaflag:

ed2hess
07-26-2011, 10:13 PM
Toro Grandstand, WARNNING! WARNING! WARNING! DON'T BUY IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I have had this mower for 2 years and it has had one problem after another. No power, dealership can't troubleshoot it. I can't troubleshoot it. Finally, I see this forum and I said, check the coil. Sure enough, coil is bad. The mower has had one month of down time this year................what a joke!!! Of course Kawasaki wont cover it now. Isn't that great????

Kaw has junk coil....I just had two go out about a month apart and yes one month after 2 year warranty was out.....$100

The Toro Company
07-27-2011, 04:58 PM
Toro Grandstand, WARNNING! WARNING! WARNING! DON'T BUY IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I have had this mower for 2 years and it has had one problem after another. No power, dealership can't troubleshoot it. I can't troubleshoot it. Finally, I see this forum and I said, check the coil. Sure enough, coil is bad. The mower has had one month of down time this year................what a joke!!! Of course Kawasaki wont cover it now. Isn't that great????

Snnoopy,
Sounds like you have a 2009 GrandStand. We suspect the issue you have with misfiring and slow max speed are related to the throttle lever. We have a fix for this issue and communicated it with our dealers back on October 7, 2009. If you have not had the throttle lever replaced, we suggest you get the mower to you dealer for this update.

The Toro Company

The Toro Company
07-27-2011, 04:59 PM
Wait till your frame let's go at the welds in front of the muffler, or your muffler breaks off due to being not supported.... I have two of them, 48" deck units... They haven't been right since day one, and never will be... 450 hrs later the problems are still there.... They are high maintenance units..... Added some equipment to the fleet this year, went green... No problems as of yet!!! 150hrs on the Quik Trax's and so far so good!!!:canadaflag:

We are sorry to hear of the issues with your GrandStand. Based on the information supplied, we suspect you have a 2009 product. We have addressed the issue with frame breaks and muffler mounting hardware. If you have not had these two items addressed by an Authorized Toro Dealer, we would suggest you bring the machine in for updates.
The Toro Company

FastMan
08-28-2011, 11:21 PM
Kind of goes to show you can save yourself some headaches by not jumping into new models the first year. Give the company a couple seasons to sort out the issues.

Toro spokesperson, perhaps more extensive testing before releasing a new product into the marketplace would allow you to catch most of these problems before you saddle your customers with having to deal with them? I'm sure there are a number of guys here on lawnsite who would be more than willing to conduct those testing services for you, in real world conditions.

The Toro Company
08-29-2011, 01:43 PM
FastMan,

Thank you for your thoughts. We are disappointed with any product issue that creates hardship for our customers and appreciate the community's willingness to provide feedback on new equipment. Our development process includes product test time at our test facilities and time with landscape professionals in the field. We are committed to improving the performance of our test and development processes to minimize any customer dissatisfaction.
The Toro Company