PDA

View Full Version : Truck / Trailer Combo Licensing Requirements


DVS Hardscaper
07-20-2009, 11:04 AM
I brought this topic up in another thread and I think it's better suited to have a thread of it's own.

In the hardscape business many of us find ourselves having use for somewhat large trucks and trailers. One aspect of such ownership is there seems to always be much confusion as to the proper licensing required for driving these units on public roads, streets, and highways.

Now, I'm not bringing this topic to light "one up" anyone. But because many of us do own such equipment, or many may be buying such equipment in the future - it's important to know the correct law as to which class of drivers license is required, as there was a time where I discovered the facts. I'm sharing my knowledge. I hope it helps many of you and hopefully it will save some from facing stiff fines and from having to call someone with the proper license to come drive the truck and trailer home.

In another thread I submitted a post that stated:


Check with you state's DOT laws about licensing requirements for trailers over 10,000#.

In MD and PA trailers factory rated, or registered (tagged), or weighing more than 10,000# - require a Class A Restricted license. The "restricted" means you do not have to have the air brake endorsement (unless you have air brakes). Most D.O.T. laws are the same state to state, this way someone isn't legally passing through one state and suddenly illegally passing through another state. Even if you're pulling the trailer with a mid size pick up truck.

A buddy of mine with a class B license just got nailed for pulling a 14,000# gooseneck with a pickup without a Class A.



,

DVS Hardscaper
07-20-2009, 11:05 AM
To which this response was submitted:



You can haul a trailer over 10,000# as long as your combined weight does NOT exceed 26,000#. What type of pickup was he using...gross weight??. Not actual weight, but the vehicle's max weight rating??

DVS Hardscaper
07-20-2009, 11:07 AM
Like I said, check with you local DOT laws. FOZ'S response is exactly what I used to think. Again, Most DOT laws ARE the same state to state.

Here is how I found out about this law. I have a close family member that recently retired from the State of Pennsylvania, he worked at the MVA as a supervisor and also was a CDL examiner. One day I told him I wanted a heavier trailer. He said "if you get a heavier trailer you'll need a Class A restricted". I said "no way, you're wrong as long as I don't go over 26,000# I'm fine". He said "oh no you're not, you're a combination unit".

I didn't believe him so I called the MD MVA and spoke with someone that works in their commercial licensing dept. This person told me the DOT law and it was word from word as what my family member who worked for the MVA in PA told me.

But I didn't stop there! I hung up the phone and I called one of the scale houses and spoke with a sergeant. And again, he told me exactly the same thing that the supervisor at the MD MVA told me.

The law gets confusing when you add a trailer into the factor because you then become a “combination unit”. And the Class A license classification is for combined units.

Again, most states all have the same DOT laws. However, some states are very lax about enforcing certain laws and others are very aggressive.

Hopefully this topic will shed some light to a law that most do not even know exists and hopefully will save you of aggravation and fines. It's hard enough finding employees that will show up for work on time and sober, let alone finding a reliable worker that has the proper license to drive your trucks and trailers!

I encourage folks that may be affected by this to call your local MVA Office, Scale House, or pull up your state’s DOT Laws on the internet. This ain't a new law, been around for ages!

SimonCX
07-20-2009, 10:53 PM
Best bet is to call or visit a state police barrick because they are the ones who are going to enforce it and will give you all the dot info for your state. I called state police because motor vehicle didn't have a clue.

Bru75
07-20-2009, 11:31 PM
Best bet is to call or visit a state police barrick because they are the ones who are going to enforce it and will give you all the dot info for your state. I called state police because motor vehicle didn't have a clue.

Good advice. I asked a question once about the combined weight I needed on my registration at the DMV and they said that it depends on how a particular officer interprets the law.

DVS Hardscaper
07-21-2009, 07:29 AM
Good advice. I asked a question once about the combined weight I needed on my registration at the DMV and they said that it depends on how a particular officer interprets the law.

That's kinda comical! From what I've seen, it's usualy spelled out quite clear and concise, that even a 7th grader can understand! (on another message board folks have posted excerpts from their state laws) I think they told you that because they didn't know the answer.

Bru75
07-21-2009, 03:22 PM
That's kinda comical! From what I've seen, it's usualy spelled out quite clear and concise, that even a 7th grader can understand! (on another message board folks have posted excerpts from their state laws) I think they told you that because they didn't know the answer.

That's exactly why they told me that.
I needed to know if my truck had to be registered for the weight of the trailer and truck, or just the truck and tongue weight. She said "depends on which cop pulls you over", no kidding.

Duffster
07-21-2009, 03:36 PM
pull up your state’s DOT Laws on the internet.

I suggest you do this also.

Ask three cops the same question and you will get three different answers.

I know for a fact that you don't need a class A until the combo reaches 26k with a trailer over 10k in PA. It's most likely the same way in MD.

It is supposed to be the same way in all state except CA (they are always the odd duck LOL).

Duffster
07-21-2009, 03:44 PM
For PA

CLASS A
A Class A license is issued to those persons 18 years of age or older who have demonstrated their
qualifications to operate any combination of vehicles with a gross combination weight rating of
26,001 pounds or more, provided the gross vehicle weight rating of the vehicle or vehicles being
towed is in excess of 10,000 pounds. The holder of a Class A license is qualified to operate vehicles
for which a Class B or Class C license is issued. Where required, appropriate endorsements must
be obtained.

This exerpt from

http://www.dmv.state.pa.us/pdotforms/pub_223/section_1.pdf

It says the same thing for MD

DVS Hardscaper
07-21-2009, 07:39 PM
Duffster - Wat you posted is exactly what I stated in the opening posts to this thread!

Sit back, clear your mind from the day's stresses and read the excerpt that YOU posted :)

The law is written at a level where you nearly need a college degree to know what it says. To help you out, I put key words in bold, for ya :)


"A Class A license is issued to those persons 18 years of age or older who have demonstrated their qualifications to operate any combination of vehicles with a gross combination weight rating of 26,001 pounds or more, provided the gross vehicle weight rating of the vehicle or vehicles being towed is in excess of 10,000 pounds.


KEYWORDS "OR" and "EXCESS"

That's aight 'ol buddy, the year is half way through and you been workin hard! Trust me Duffster, I'm not going to post something on the world wide web that I can't back up, or that would mis-lead others. I have better things to do with my time than to steer someone down the wrong road.


On Another Note:

One thing to be aware of: your typical patrol officer or state trooper will usually not have a clue about the D.O.T. laws. I have a buddy thats a Sergeant with the MD State Police. He couldn't tell you thing about DOT laws other than "if you get caught, you're screwed". The appropriate law enforcement officials to speak with are the ones that are specifically assigned to a Commercial Vehicle Enforcement Unit within the agency.


,

Duffster
07-21-2009, 09:44 PM
Duffster - Wat you posted is exactly what I stated in the opening posts to this thread!

Sit back, clear your mind from the day's stresses and read the excerpt that YOU posted :)

The law is written at a level where you nearly need a college degree to know what it says. To help you out, I put key words in bold, for ya :)


"A Class A license is issued to those persons 18 years of age or older who have demonstrated their qualifications to operate any combination of vehicles with a gross combination weight rating of 26,001 pounds or more, provided the gross vehicle weight rating of the vehicle or vehicles being towed is in excess of 10,000 pounds.


KEYWORDS "OR" and "EXCESS"

That's aight 'ol buddy, the year is half way through and you been workin hard! Trust me Duffster, I'm not going to post something on the world wide web that I can't back up, or that would mis-lead others. I have better things to do with my time than to steer someone down the wrong road.


On Another Note:

One thing to be aware of: your typical patrol officer or state trooper will usually not have a clue about the D.O.T. laws. I have a buddy that's a Sergeant with the MD State Police. He couldn't tell you thing about DOT laws other than "if you get caught, you're screwed". The appropriate law enforcement officials to speak with are the ones that are specifically assigned to a Commercial Vehicle Enforcement Unit within the agency.


,

Nowhere in the excerpt that I posted does it say you need a CDL just because the trailer is over 10K.

You don't need a college degree, just basic English class.

The problem is that the Troopers can't read either if they are saying you need a CDL.

When you read that excerpt you missed the most important word in the paragraph. "provided"

"A Class A license is issued to those persons 18 years of age or older who have demonstrated their qualifications to operate any combination of vehicles with a gross combination weight rating of 26,001 pounds or more, provided the gross vehicle weight rating of the vehicle or vehicles being towed is in excess of 10,000 pounds.

DVS Hardscaper
07-21-2009, 10:07 PM
LOL Duffster, lord, I hope you've been drinking all afternoon and evening, because if you haven't....then that's scarey.

You ARE correct, It DOES NOT state you need a CDL. It states to whom a Class A C.D.L. is issued.

Sometimes when my head is full of the day's activities I find it necessary to read outloud, SLOWLY, 1 to 3 times before I understand what I'm reading. You otta try doing that sometime.


,

Duffster
07-21-2009, 10:21 PM
LOL Duffster, lord, I hope you've been drinking all afternoon and evening, because if you haven't....then that's scarey.

You ARE correct, It DOES NOT state you need a CDL. It states to whom a Class A C.D.L. is issued.

Sometimes when my head is full of the day's activities I find it necessary to read outloud, SLOWLY, 1 to 3 times before I understand what I'm reading. May I suggest you do the same?


,

I will do my best to keep my patients with you but I can't make any promises.

I have read it plenty of time to understand it. The wording for PA is the same as the wording from the Fed site, which is the same as the other 20 or 30 states sites that I looked up. I have not looked up MD's but you lumped it with PA and I had that handy so I used it. The wording is the same as my home state and all my neighboring states and I don't need a CDL for a trailer just because it is over 10k.

The only way you would need a CDL class A for a 14k trailer is if it was pulled by a 13k+ truck.

You can drive a 26k truck and pull a 10k trailer (for a total of 36k) with a standard class D license.

Duffster
07-21-2009, 10:29 PM
This makes it real simple.

I realize it says Maine but it is the same for all of us except CA

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x82/andydoaki/Random/CDL.jpg

DVS Hardscaper
07-21-2009, 10:54 PM
duffster -

LOL - this is getting too funny! God, I hope you're just messin with me! Your map is proving my point, thank you for providing that exhibit for me!

The little map says this:

"Is the vehicle a combination vehicle towing a unit over 10,000 pounds GVWR OR gross weight?" Now look what the little arrow points to :)


Duffster - this is about the 4th time in 3 years that I have initiated this topic. Trust me, you're not the first. LOL, You been soo busy tryin to prove me wrong, you must have missed the part about my friend whom was recently cited! Again, thanks for the map!


I tell ya, what these forums need is a sobriety checker. In order to log in they otta make you type the squiggly letters in the box correctly.

Duffster
07-21-2009, 11:11 PM
I think you are drunk.

You have to meet the requirements of the first box in the flow chart before you move on the the next one. :rolleyes:

I will give you a hint, try following the arrow off the left side with the word "No" on top of it.

You have yet to post any info that backs up your position on this topic. The fact that your buddy got a ticket only proves that your cops are maroons.

Please prove your position.

doubleedge
07-22-2009, 12:33 AM
DVS: you wouldn't follow the yes arrow down to the next box if you were using a small truck and 14k trailer; you would follow the no arrow which goes past the box right below the top one.

DVS Hardscaper
07-22-2009, 07:32 AM
Double edge - you are correct, partially. The 2nd box asks is the vehicle or combination vehicle is towing anying over 10,000 pounds!

There are multiple scenerios. (manufacturer rating, tagged weight, gross weight) The map is limited. Also, lets not forget that you need to check with your state's laws. I've stated that, what 5 times now? Could very well be that Maine doesn't enforce the trailer law that other states do infact enforce. Maine is also the state where you do not have to renew your trailer tages annually, I have a buddy in MD that just Maine tagged a used trailer and didn't have to have it inspected!!

Duffster supplied the PA law. I easily proved HIM to be reading it wrong. So instead of him saying "hey, devious you're right, you did state check your state's laws - he then goes to another state and tried to find some vague information regarding medium duty trucks! LOL

No where on the map does it address if a TRAILER is OVER 10,000 pounds!!!

The Federal Government provides funding to states that participates in enforcing the Fed DOT laws. Another example - If the state decides to do roadside inspections over the weekend (or other days for the matter) - the Fed Gov't pays the state to do that. It's up to each state to participate / enforce as they desire.

Look guys, we can go in circles all we want. #1, as stated in the opening post (you did read the opening post, correct?) I have a family member that retired from MVA from a management position. Usually after one works somewhere for over 20 years - they know their job. And remember, someone recently was cited for such a violation! In order for the police to write a ticket - there has to be a small box for them to check off stating the specific violation, I don't think there would be a non-existant violation printed on the ticket!!!


If you own large trailers - then make some local phone calls. Get your answers. Get out and sell work. And feed your family and keep them happy. If you don't like the law - then become a law maker and change it! It is what it is!

If you don't own large trailers - then go about life and be happy!

I've brought the issue to light. It does truely exist and hopefully it will save others of aggrevation and head ache. I'm a business man, not a law maker. Everyone is now aware of the potential they may face. Next step is to find out on your own. There ain't anything more that I can say :)




,

fl-landscapes
07-22-2009, 08:02 AM
this is florida cdl law

What do the terms Class A, Class B, and Class C mean on my Florida CDL?
It refers to the type of vehicle that you may operate . . .
CLASS A . . . allows you to operate vehicles which tow trailers or other vehicles with a GVWR over 10,000 pounds. A Class "A" license also allows you to operate Class B and C vehicles.
CLASS B . . . allows you to operate single vehicles with a GVWR of 26,001 lbs or more OR a gross combination weight rating (GCWR) of 26,001 lbs. or more, towing trailers/vehicles rated at 10,000 pounds GVWR or less. A Class "B" license also allows you to operate Class C vehicles.
CLASS C . . .allows you to operate vehicles under 26,001 lbs. GVWR, that would normally not require a CDL; except when they are designed to transport 16 or more persons including the driver; or that carry 15 or less people (including the driver) transporting children to or from school and home regularly for compensation, or carry hazardous materials in amounts requiring placarding. Applicable endorsements are required.

Duffster
07-22-2009, 08:25 AM
:hammerhead:

Double edge - you are correct, partially. The 2nd box asks is the vehicle or combination vehicle is towing anying over 10,000 pounds!

What double edge. How do you honestly except anyone to take you serious when you can't even navigate a simple flow chart.

There are multiple scenerios. (manufacturer rating, tagged weight, gross weight) The map is limited.

Trailer over 10k is trailer over 10k, pretty easy. How is the map limited?

Also, lets not forget that you need to check with your state's laws. I've stated that, what 5 times now? Could very well be that Maine doesn't enforce the trailer law that other states do infact enforce.

States law regarding CDL requirements are the same as the FED's requirements.

Maine is also the state where you do not have to renew your trailer tags annually, I have a buddy in MD that just Maine tagged a used trailer and didn't have to have it inspected!!

We don't have to have trailers inspected either but that has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not you need a CDL.

Duffster supplied the PA law. I easily proved HIM to be reading it wrong.

You haven't proved nothing. I proved you to be reading it wrong, Man up and admit it.

So instead of him saying "hey, devious you're right, you did state check your state's laws - he then goes to another state and tried to find some vague information regarding medium duty trucks!

Mediumd Duty??????????? I have never mentioned such.

No where on the map does it address if a TRAILER is OVER 10,000 pounds!!!

Try the second box.....The one you tryed to claim proved your point.

The Federal Government provides funding to states that participates in enforcing the Fed DOT laws. Another example - If the state decides to do roadside inspections over the weekend (or other days for the matter) - the Fed Gov't pays the state to do that. It's up to each state to participate / enforce as they desire.

Not exactly, the states have to issue CDL's to the standard that the FEDs set, as you stated so that the requirements don't change from state to state.

Like I previously stated PA requirements are the same as my home state and every other state that I have checked. (Except CA :hammerhead:)

Look guys, we can go in circles all we want. #1, as stated in the opening post (you did read the opening post, correct?) I have a family member that retired from MVA from a management position. Usually after one works somewhere for over 20 years - they know their job. And remember, someone recently was cited for such a violation! In order for the police to write a ticket - there has to be a small box for them to check off stating the specific violation, I don't think there would be a non-existant violation printed on the ticket!!!

Cops are humans and make mistakes everyday. Just because he got a ticket doesn't prove anything.

There is a case on one of these forums where a guy (from my home state)got a ticket for driving his skidloader on the street. He got a non registration ticket. Within 5 minutes someone posted the law in writing proving that he didn't need the skidloader to be registered. He took it to court and won


If you own large trailers - then make some local phone calls. Get your answers. Get out and sell work. And feed your family and keep them happy. If you don't like the law - then become a law maker and change it! It is what it is!

If you don't own large trailers - then go about life and be happy!

I've brought the issue to light. It does truely exist and hopefully it will save others of aggrevation and head ache. I'm a business man, not a law maker. Everyone is now aware of the potential they may face. Next step is to find out on your own. There ain't anything more that I can say :)


I guess asking you to prove your position is just to much for you.:hammerhead:

Duffster
07-22-2009, 08:36 AM
this is florida cdl law

What do the terms Class A, Class B, and Class C mean on my Florida CDL?
It refers to the type of vehicle that you may operate . . .
CLASS A . . . allows you to operate vehicles which tow trailers or other vehicles with a GVWR over 10,000 pounds. A Class "A" license also allows you to operate Class B and C vehicles.
CLASS B . . . allows you to operate single vehicles with a GVWR of 26,001 lbs or more OR a gross combination weight rating (GCWR) of 26,001 lbs. or more, towing trailers/vehicles rated at 10,000 pounds GVWR or less. A Class "B" license also allows you to operate Class C vehicles.
CLASS C . . .allows you to operate vehicles under 26,001 lbs. GVWR, that would normally not require a CDL; except when they are designed to transport 16 or more persons including the driver; or that carry 15 or less people (including the driver) transporting children to or from school and home regularly for compensation, or carry hazardous materials in amounts requiring placarding. Applicable endorsements are required.

This was posted from the Florida Handbook in a previous thread here on LS, it has the same chart I posted.

http://www.lawnsite.com/showpost.php?p=2776369&postcount=19

fl-landscapes
07-22-2009, 08:39 AM
everything on this thread has been posted on this site before.....whats your point. I was just backing up your statement. Guess I should have just advised you that this has been covered more than once on this site as well:dizzy:

Duffster
07-22-2009, 08:47 AM
everything on this thread has been posted on this site before.....whats your point. I was just backing up your statement. Guess I should have just advised you that this has been covered more than once on this site as well:dizzy:

Sorry, the way that your class A definition is worded I thought you were backing up DVS.

I realize this has been covered before but obviously a least one person still don't get it and that person is giving bad advice.

Mid-Ohio Scaper
07-22-2009, 10:57 AM
Who Needs a CDL? – Ohio Revised Code, Section 4506.01 (D)

You need a CDL if you operate any of the following vehicles:

1.

Any combination of vehicles with a combined gross vehicle weight rating of twenty-six thousand one pounds or more, provided the gross vehicle weight rating of the vehicle or vehicles being towed is in excess of ten thousand pounds;
2.

Any single vehicle with a gross vehicle weight rating of twenty-six thousand one pounds or more, or any such vehicle towing a vehicle having a gross vehicle weight rating that is not in excess of ten thousand pounds;
3.

Any single vehicle or combination of vehicles that is not a class A or class B vehicle, but that either is designed to transport sixteen or more passengers including the driver;
4.

Any school bus with a gross vehicle weight rating of less than twenty-six thousand one pounds that is designed to transport fewer than sixteen passengers including the driver;
5.

Is transporting hazardous materials for which placarding is required under subpart F of 49 C.F.R. part 172;
6.

Any single vehicle or combination of vehicles that is designed to be operated and to travel on a public street or highway and is considered by the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration to be a commercial motor vehicle, including, but not limited to, a motorized crane, a vehicle whose function is to pump cement, a rig for drilling wells, and a portable crane.

Classes of CDL licenses – Ohio Revised Code, Section 4506.12 (B)

The classes of CDL and the commercial motor vehicles that they authorize the operation of are as follows:

1.

Class A – any combination of vehicles with a combined gross vehicle weight rating of twenty-six thousand one pounds or more, if the gross vehicle weight rating of the vehicle or vehicles being towed is in excess of ten thousand pounds.
2.

Class B – any single vehicle with a gross vehicle weight rating of twenty-six thousand one pounds or more or any such vehicle towing a vehicle having a gross vehicle weight rating that is not in excess of ten thousand pounds.
3.

Class C – any single vehicle, or combination of vehicles, that is not a Class A or Class B vehicle, but that is designed to transport sixteen or more passengers, including the driver, or is transporting hazardous materials in an amount requiring placarding, or any school bus with a gross vehicle weight rating of less than twenty-six thousand one pounds that is designed to transport fewer than sixteen passengers including the driver.


So let me get this straight, I drive a F350 with a GVWR of 13,000lbs and have a goose neck dump trailer with a GVWR of 14,000lbs equaling 27,000lbs (combo weight).
If I'm understanding these laws correctly, when I join these two together I do in fact need a class A because I've exceeded the 26,001lb mark?

Duffster
07-22-2009, 02:36 PM
So let me get this straight, I drive a F350 with a GVWR of 13,000lbs and have a goose neck dump trailer with a GVWR of 14,000lbs equaling 27,000lbs (combo weight).
If I'm understanding these laws correctly, when I join these two together I do in fact need a class A because I've exceeded the 26,001lb mark?

Correct

Because the combo is over 26k, not because the trailer is over 10k like the OP stated.

Mid-Ohio Scaper
07-22-2009, 02:47 PM
Correct

Because the combo is over 26k, not because the trailer is over 10k like the OP stated.

That's what I've always been told............

wurkn with amish
07-22-2009, 04:11 PM
I don't see why you even need to argue about it. If you don't believe DEVIOUS then don't believe him. If and when you get pulled over and they ticket for the very thing your aguing about, then get your CDL (class A) whatever.....
Im personally going to make a few phone calls tomorrow and see what I need- because I want to upgrade trailors.

burnthecouch
07-22-2009, 04:28 PM
We had one of our trucks get pulled over a few years ago while I was still working for another company, and they were ticketed for having a trailer over the 10,001 limit. The trailer had dual 6,000lb axle and was rated for 12,000, while not in excess of that 12,000 limit, it was over the limit for having a non CDL driver.

So it can and will happen in PA. It doesn't matter what you are pulling it with if the trailer goes over the magic limit of 10,001 you need a CDL period.

I currently have my 14,000 dump trailer de-rated and registered at 9,999 which kills me for usable payload but keeps me legal as I haven't had a chance to get my CDL yet being a one man show right now.

fl-landscapes
07-22-2009, 04:41 PM
That's what I've always been told............


This thread is being beat to death but the trailer weight can not exceed 10,000 lbs or you need a class "A" lis. I have a class B cdl so I can drive a straight truck regardless of what it weighs. now if I hook a trailer to it I am good as long as the trailer does not exceed 10,000 lbs. The combo weight can be anything. Lets say I'm driving a tri axle mack with gvw 68,000 lbs and I tow a small trailer under 10K then I am fine. If the trailer weight is 10,001 or more I am screwed without a class A lis.

Duffster
07-22-2009, 04:48 PM
We had one of our trucks get pulled over a few years ago while I was still working for another company, and they were ticketed for having a trailer over the 10,001 limit. The trailer had dual 6,000lb axle and was rated for 12,000, while not in excess of that 12,000 limit, it was over the limit for having a non CDL driver.

What where you pulling the trailer with? (GVWR)

Duffster
07-22-2009, 04:50 PM
I don't see why you even need to argue about it.

Why tell people you they need a CDL if they don't need it?

burnthecouch
07-22-2009, 04:58 PM
What where you pulling the trailer with? (GVWR)

Knew I should have added that part for you since you seem to no believe anyone else in this thread. It was a 2005 F250 nothing that would even get you close to the other magic number of 26,001 legally.

Duffster
07-22-2009, 05:04 PM
Knew I should have added that part for you since you seem to no believe anyone else in this thread. It was a 2005 F250 nothing that would even get you close to the other magic number of 26,001 legally.

No need to get wise about it.

The OP can't prove his position and I doubt you can either.

I doubt that was the first cop to misinterpret the law and probably won't be the last.

burnthecouch
07-22-2009, 05:12 PM
Maybe out in the Midwest the cops don't understand the laws but these were DOT cops brought out by local regional cops to verify the load being over the legal letter of the law. We were also told the same thing about the limits after that incident when we had our DOT audit of the entire fleet of trucks and trailers to make out DOT numbers compliant with the federal law.

The only way I've heard of people getting away with it is to register the trucks and trailers as a combination thus taking legal payload capacity off the tow vehicle and allowing for the trailer to carry more. And that still wouldn't protect you if the right person decided to pull you over at the wrong time.

I've seen them stop multiple people leaving supply yards this year for similar reasons and in many cases trailers were left sitting along the side of the road till someone could come back to legally tow it home. Also for a fact you cannot register a trailer in this state over the 10,001 limit without proof of a cdl license or a licensed cdl driver in your company hence the reason for my dump trailer being registered at 9,999lbs.

Duffster
07-22-2009, 05:40 PM
Maybe out in the Midwest the cops don't understand the laws but these were DOT cops brought out by local regional cops to verify the load being over the legal letter of the law. We were also told the same thing about the limits after that incident when we had our DOT audit of the entire fleet of trucks and trailers to make out DOT numbers compliant with the federal law.

The only way I've heard of people getting away with it is to register the trucks and trailers as a combination thus taking legal payload capacity off the tow vehicle and allowing for the trailer to carry more. And that still wouldn't protect you if the right person decided to pull you over at the wrong time.

I've seen them stop multiple people leaving supply yards this year for similar reasons and in many cases trailers were left sitting along the side of the road till someone could come back to legally tow it home. Also for a fact you cannot register a trailer in this state over the 10,001 limit without proof of a cdl license or a licensed cdl driver in your company hence the reason for my dump trailer being registered at 9,999lbs.

Burnthecouch,

I like your username LOL

I appreciate that fact you may have been told you need a CDL and I beleive you when you say that Law Enforcement told you that. That said that doesn't mean that said LE was right. They may even know that they are wrong but continue to generate income this way knowing that there is enough people like yourself that will just take it as gospel.

I know people from PA through forums like this and in person that is why I know the law is the same as here.

DVS Hardscaper
07-22-2009, 07:11 PM
Duffster - man you've spent alotta time arguing with folks here.

How can you argue with

a) that a well educated person, whom work in management for 20 years at MVA stated the law?

b) that a friend of mine recently was cited?

How can YOU sit there and say no such law exists? LOL

HOW????

Sure you may know people from here and there, I think we all do. Many folks will *speculate* that no such law exists because they NEVER inquired. But if they would call and speak with the appropriate individuals they could find out otherwise. My buddy that got nailed drove through the same scale house every day for the last 5 years, and never had an issue. If I would have told him about this law - he would have told me I'm full of crap. Then one day they flagged him to come inside.

Do you think people don't contect tickets in court? Do you think a law enforcement official would continue to write tickets that a judge would say were not legit?? Then everytime the officer had his court days for his tickets - the judge would always remeber him as the idiot that wrote tickets for laws that were non-existant! The judge would make a mockery of the officer!! No officer would let that happen.


Duffster - trust me - such laws do in fact exist. If your state doesn't have such laws - then what do you care?

You can ncontinue to argue with the moon till you're blue in the face! I seldom call people names on forums - but I must say you truely are one bonified idiot , Duffster.

DVS Hardscaper
07-22-2009, 07:20 PM
....
I currently have my 14,000 dump trailer de-rated and registered at 9,999 which kills me for usable payload but keeps me legal as I haven't had a chance to get my CDL yet being a one man show right now.


Just be careful with that. The DOT enforcement officials will go off of any of the following:

a) the weight plate that the factory put on the trailer.
b) what you registered it at assuming you registered it correctly (which you didn't)
c) the actual physical weight

Pennsylvania is another state that is a huge participant in the federal govt's funding for random, roadside inspections.


,

Duffster
07-22-2009, 08:37 PM
Duffster - trust me - such laws do in fact exist. If your state doesn't have such laws - then what do you care?

You can ncontinue to argue with the moon till you're blue in the face! I seldom call people names on forums - but I must say you truely are one bonified idiot , Duffster.

You claim to be able to back up your claims, but can't or won't.

You can't read plain english or follow a very simple flow chart.

You can't prove your point so you resort to name calling. :laugh:

DVS Hardscaper
07-22-2009, 08:52 PM
LOL

Quick, get Duffster his blood pressure pills! Poor soul has lost sleep over this law!

Can you imagine what his siginficant other must put up with?


,

doubleedge
07-22-2009, 08:58 PM
Double edge - you are correct, partially. The 2nd box asks is the vehicle or combination vehicle is towing anying over 10,000 pounds!

You would never get to the second box if you followed the yes arrow, so why mention it? According to the chart, I am 100% correct. Like Andrew Wilkow (a radio talk show host) says: I am right, you are wrong, end of story.

PS: I am not saying that the law is the same in every state; I am saying that you are misreading that chart.

Duffster
07-22-2009, 09:07 PM
LOL

Quick, get Duffster his blood pressure pills! Poor soul has lost sleep over this law!

Can you imagine what his siginficant other must put up with?


,
Wow

You come on here like you know what your talking about but don't know jack.

Why can't you back up your position?:hammerhead:

DVS Hardscaper
07-22-2009, 09:18 PM
Duffster -

I'm 110% confident of what I'm writing about. Not a shadow of a doubt in my mind. Again, you need to clear the negativity that you brought to this topic. You need to go back and read the initial posts. All disclaimers were covered in the initial posts. They're still there for your review. So, sorry you missed that :)



I will be taking trash lumber to my buddy's property this weekend. The one that was cited for pulling a 14k trailer on a class B license. He and his wife have a place at the beach and they usually go there on weekends. If he happens to be home when I dump the lumber there, I'll ask him if I can make a copy of his citation, I'll scan it, and post it.

Duffster
07-22-2009, 09:37 PM
Duffster -

I'm 110% confident of what I'm writing about. Not a shadow of a doubt in my mind.

Well that is good enough for me. :laugh::laugh::laugh:



I will be taking trash lumber to my buddy's property this weekend. The one that was cited for pulling a 14k trailer on a class B license. He and his wife have a place at the beach and they usually go there on weekends. If he happens to be home when I dump the lumber there, I'll ask him if I can make a copy of his citation, I'll scan it, and post it.

I have said it several time now......that doesn't prove anything, beside you never said what he was pulling the 14k trailer with. If it was a modern one ton he would need a Class A.

I won't be holding my breath waiting for this since you can't seem to post anything else useful.

Mid-Ohio Scaper
07-23-2009, 12:19 AM
You kids need to play nice.....:dizzy:

LB1234
07-23-2009, 04:19 PM
my plate compactor is bigger than yours...so there!!!!

Duffster
07-23-2009, 04:40 PM
my plate compactor is bigger than yours...so there!!!!

But you havn't seen mine yet! :laugh:

DVS Hardscaper
07-23-2009, 08:16 PM
Silly me posting false information!

Note to self: Make a New Years resolution to cease and desist the constant posting of inaccurate facts on the www.

But wait!

Better call the MVA, as their website (see link below) is ALL wrong too!

The lawnsite members are all wrong!

The commercial vehicle safety enforcement officials are all wrong!

The judges are all wrong!

http://www.marylandmva.com/DriverServ/Apply/licenseclass.htm


Lemme guess, even Fluffy's significant other loads the dish washer all wrong, too?



,

DVS Hardscaper
07-23-2009, 08:55 PM
Da-gone-it!

Maybe it's some sort of conspiracy? Even the State of PA is WRONG!!!

How dare they allow this website to post INACCURATE information?

Isn't there someone I can call or e-mail to complain? I AM SO MAD.

http://www.cdl-course.com/faq-pa.html

Loryd, guess I'll have to see if VA, WV, DE, and NJ are allowing such non-sense to be posted as well. I am so mad I think what I'll do is take off work tomorrow to research these 4 states.


,

Mid-Ohio Scaper
07-23-2009, 09:22 PM
Sometimes people get it wrong.............. It's not your fault, it's anybody's fault. But until someone puts the money up to get it in writing from a lawyer on what the law is in a court, I'm gonna keep on keepin' on.

DVS Hardscaper
07-23-2009, 09:38 PM
What an attorney or judge will do is they will go straight to the source. They'll review the state's statues.

I can not research all 50 states but here is MD's Transportation statues. It's broken down fairly well and once you know the classifications (Ex: Class F tractor, Class G trailer) it's pretty straight forward.

http://mlis.state.md.us/asp/web_statutes.asp?gtr&16-104


That da-gone Maryland General Assembly, how dare they be WRONG!!!



'


,

Mid-Ohio Scaper
07-23-2009, 09:52 PM
What an attorney or judge will do is they will go straight to the source. They'll review the state's statues.

I can not research all 50 states but here is MD's Transportation statues. It's broken down fairly well and once you know the classifications (Ex: Class F tractor, Class G trailer) it's pretty straight forward.

http://mlis.state.md.us/asp/web_statutes.asp?gtr&16-104


,

I understand what you're trying to get across. But the fact still remains, You're not a lawyer and you are in no position to give legal advise what so ever.
Everyone interprets the law differently, what may be enforced in Maryland, isn't in Montana. Even though it's still a federal law.

If you want someone to just tell you you're right....... Then you're right, end of conversation. This ridiculous thread can stop until someone comes to the table with it written in layman's terms by a lawyer so everyone here has no trouble understanding it.

Duffster
07-24-2009, 01:06 AM
Da-gone-it!

Maybe it's some sort of conspiracy? Even the State of PA is WRONG!!!

How dare they allow this website to post INACCURATE information?

Isn't there someone I can call or e-mail to complain? I AM SO MAD.

http://www.cdl-course.com/faq-pa.html

Loryd, guess I'll have to see if VA, WV, DE, and NJ are allowing such non-sense to be posted as well. I am so mad I think what I'll do is take off work tomorrow to research these 4 states.


,

Hmmm....Did you miss something


When do I need a Pennsylvania CDL instead of my regular Pennsylvania Drivers License?

A Pennsylvania CDL is required if you operate any of the following CMV's . . .

2. A vehicle towing a unit with a manufacturer's GVWR of more than 10,000 lbs. when the GCWR exceeds 26,000 lbs


So what is required to pull 10k+ when the GCWR doesn't exceed 26k?

Duffster
07-24-2009, 01:20 AM
Silly me posting false information!

Note to self: Make a New Years resolution to cease and desist the constant posting of inaccurate facts on the www.

But wait!

Better call the MVA, as their website (see link below) is ALL wrong too!

The lawnsite members are all wrong!

The commercial vehicle safety enforcement officials are all wrong!

The judges are all wrong!

http://www.marylandmva.com/DriverServ/Apply/licenseclass.htm


Lemme guess, even Fluffy's significant other loads the dish washer all wrong, too?



,

This link doesn't tell us anything.

Duffster
07-24-2009, 01:43 AM
What an attorney or judge will do is they will go straight to the source. They'll review the state's statues.

I can not research all 50 states but here is MD's Transportation statues. It's broken down fairly well and once you know the classifications (Ex: Class F tractor, Class G trailer) it's pretty straight forward.

http://mlis.state.md.us/asp/web_statutes.asp?gtr&16-104


That da-gone Maryland General Assembly, how dare they be WRONG!!!



'


,

You previouse link makes more sense now.

Non commercial "C"
Any non-commercial combination of motor vehicles with a GVW less than 26,001 pounds


The truck and trailer combo that we have been talking about falls under a Non commercial Class "C" based on the following definition of "CMV"


§16–803.

(c) (1) “Commercial motor vehicle (CMV)” means a motor vehicle or combination of motor vehicles used to transport passengers or property, if the motor vehicle:
(i) Has a gross combination weight rating of 26,001 or more pounds inclusive of a towed unit with a gross vehicle weight rating of more than 10,000 pounds;
(ii) Has a gross vehicle weight rating of 26,001 or more pounds;


:weightlifter::laugh:

Duffster
07-26-2009, 10:13 PM
A little update for Devious (Burnthecouch, you may find this interesting also)

I did the homework you should have done before making statements that you can't backup.

I sent a email to the PennDot asking them this question....

Subject: CDL Requirments

Message: I was wondering if I would need a CDL to drive my F250 with a
GVWR of 9200 lbs. while pulling my gooseneck trailer with a GVWR of
14,000 lbs. ( GCWR of 23,200 lbs.) ?

Thank you.

As to which this was the response from PennDot....



Thank you for contacting Driver and Vehicle Services.

You may contact your home state of residents to inquire about your
driver's license and their CDL regulations.

Our state of Pennsylvania (PA) will not require a CDL drivers license if
the gross combination weight is not over 26,001 pounds. Here is a link
that may be helpful from our website:
http://www.dmv.state.pa.us/pdotforms/fact_sheets/fs-cdl.pdf

Thank you for your inquiry,
Mark Brizuela
PA Department of Transportation
www.dmv.state.pa.us

What a coincidence, this is what I have been saying all along.:rolleyes:

Duffster
07-26-2009, 10:24 PM
Devious,

Look what I found in your homestate of MD's CDL handbook, that pesky little flow chart that you claimed was not for your state.

I realize these flow charts are above your pay grade but oh well here it is again.

(ps what would the judge think of this?)

http://www.marylandmva.com/Resources/DL-151.pdf

Duffster
07-26-2009, 10:38 PM
Last one for you

Now I typically don't like website that are not specifically DOT websites but this one that you referenced looks to be legit.

http://www.cdl-course.com/faq-pa.html

A couple minutes of searching proves that all states dicussed in this thread, my home state and all states neighboring my home state, have the same CDL requirements, the one thing that you and I agree on.

Since all states have the same requirments this little chart from my home states CDL handbook should clear up any doubt for you.

(Pay special attention to line 15 that says you could pull a 20k trailer with no CDL and a standard class "D" license):drinkup:

DeereHauler
07-30-2009, 11:21 PM
maybe i missed it in the thread, or maybe its a local thing. but its my understanding i also need a "health card" issued by my doctor to haul anything over 17,000, single, or in combination.

Duffster
07-31-2009, 04:36 PM
maybe i missed it in the thread, or maybe its a local thing. but its my understanding i also need a "health card" issued by my doctor to haul anything over 17,000, single, or in combination.

Could be.:confused:

DVS Hardscaper
07-31-2009, 05:08 PM
3 states that I'm familiar with - you need a DOT Physical for operating any commercial unit over 10,000# gvw.




Duffster -

If I wanted to search the net and find an article that states burning brush is more environmentaly friendly than grinding brush - I'll surley find such an article.

Good grief, you can devote all the time you wish in attempt to prove me wrong, I encourage it. Seriously, why argue with me, I'm not the one writing the tickets nor am I the one who holds the gabble. But I do have some friends who write tickets!

Perhaps - we shall stop and think about this. Ok, we all know it's illegal to get behind the wheel and drive drunk. We don't need a thread about drunk driving laws, because this is a known fact. I initiated the topic becase most folks are not aware that in most states a *Class A* IS required when you hook up to a trailer over 10,000# :)

I posted the anoted code that is provided by my state's General Assembly. The anoted code is the law. Anyone who is uncertain about the law for their state - another avenue is to go straight to your stated anoted codes and look it up.


Don't shoot the messenger!


,

DVS Hardscaper
07-31-2009, 06:01 PM
I don't know about other states, but the MD Dept of Transportation has a very informative website. Folks in other states should try to find if your state has a site set up like this. http://www.e-mdot.com/MMCP/FAQ.html#Q1


Last week, I went straight to our annoted codes. The codes are rather concise and clear. Calling or e-mailing a question to the MVA may steer you in the wrong direction because a) you don't know know if the respondent has 1st hand knowledge from the dept of which it pertains. 2) if there is more than 1 scenerio you don't know if the person responding is fully digesting the scene. In terms of finding the official laws (not charts or maps) I suggest you find your states annoted codes.

In MD Dept of Trans's web site it says this:

2. Where can I get information on the commercial motor vehicle laws and regulations?

Hardcopies of the Annotated Code of Maryland (Maryland Law) and Code of Maryland Administrative Regulations (COMAR) can be ordered from the Division of State Documents at 410-974-2486 or 1-800-633-9657, or www.dsd.state.md.us. The publications are also available from each county's law library.
The regulations can be access online:
The Annotated Code of Maryland (Maryland Law). In ENTER ARTICLE box, select TRANSPORTATION then click on SUBMIT QUERY. Next in ENTER SECTION box, select Title and Section from pull down menu, then click on SUBMIT QUERY.
The Code of Maryland Administrative Regulations (COMAR). Click on button number 2, then select Title 11 Department of Transportation.

Hardcopies of the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Regulations can be purchased from retail vendors, or accessed online at www.fmcsa.dot.gov.


Again, the answer is in the annoted codes. Check your state's codes.


,

mrusk
07-31-2009, 09:12 PM
I spoke to NJMVC, NJSP and even the DOT officer who does road side checks I was told I can pull my 12,000lbs trailer all day long with my 3/4ton pick up with no cdl. BUT the moment I hook that trailer up to any truck with a gvw over 14,000lbs I need a class A.

IF the people enforcing the laws tell me its okay, I guess I have no choice but to beleive them.

Duffster
07-31-2009, 10:57 PM
Duffster -

If I wanted to search the net and find an article that states burning brush is more environmentaly friendly than grinding brush - I'll surley find such an article.,

Are you A.D.D.? What does that have to do with the topic at hand?



in most states a *Class A* IS required when you hook up to a trailer over 10,000#

It won't matter how many times you say it, it still won't be true! :dizzy:

Duffster
07-31-2009, 11:18 PM
I don't know about other states, but the MD Dept of Transportation has a very informative website. Folks in other states should try to find if your state has a site set up like this. http://www.e-mdot.com/MMCP/FAQ.html#Q1


Last week, I went straight to our annoted codes. The codes are rather concise and clear. Calling or e-mailing a question to the MVA may steer you in the wrong direction because a) you don't know know if the respondent has 1st hand knowledge from the dept of which it pertains. 2) if there is more than 1 scenerio you don't know if the person responding is fully digesting the scene. In terms of finding the official laws (not charts or maps) I suggest you find your states annoted codes.

In MD Dept of Trans's web site it says this:

2. Where can I get information on the commercial motor vehicle laws and regulations?

Hardcopies of the Annotated Code of Maryland (Maryland Law) and Code of Maryland Administrative Regulations (COMAR) can be ordered from the Division of State Documents at 410-974-2486 or 1-800-633-9657, or www.dsd.state.md.us. The publications are also available from each county's law library.
The regulations can be access online:
The Annotated Code of Maryland (Maryland Law). In ENTER ARTICLE box, select TRANSPORTATION then click on SUBMIT QUERY. Next in ENTER SECTION box, select Title and Section from pull down menu, then click on SUBMIT QUERY.
The Code of Maryland Administrative Regulations (COMAR). Click on button number 2, then select Title 11 Department of Transportation.

Hardcopies of the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Regulations can be purchased from retail vendors, or accessed online at www.fmcsa.dot.gov.


Again, the answer is in the annoted codes. Check your state's codes.


,

Didn't I already copy and paste the info from these links that says the same thing as what the flow chart shows?

Since you are
110% confident of what I'm writing about.

Why don't you enlighten us with the statute number that proves your position or disproves mine.

LB1234
08-02-2009, 12:52 PM
I'm throwing my hat in the ring...

here is direct from NJMVC website. Found it through simple search on google..."do I require a commercial drivers license in the state of new jersey?"


I have copied and pasted the website (trying to atleast):


Commercial driver license (CDL)
RELATED LINKSCDL Manual If you want to be a truck driver or a bus driver, you will need to get a Commercial Driver License (CDL). But first, you must get a Basic New Jersey Driver License.

There are different CDL classes depending on the commercial vehicle that you will be driving*. Each CDL class has its own regulations.


Class A includes
Tractor trailers
Any truck and trailer combination with a gross combined weight rating (GCWR) of 26,001 or more pounds – provided that the gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR) of the vehicle being towed is more than 10,000 pounds
Any vehicle in B, C or D categories, if you have qualified for the proper extra endorsements

Class B includes
Any vehicle with a GVWR of 26,001 or more pounds
A vehicle with a GVWR of 26,001 or more pounds towing a trailer with a GVWR of less than 10,000 pounds
A bus with a GVWR of 26,001 or more pounds designed to transport 16 or more passengers (including driver)
Vehicles in Class C and D categories – provided you have qualified for the proper extra endorsements

Class C includes
Any vehicle with a GVWR of less than 26,001 pounds used to transport hazardous material (with mandatory placard)
Any bus designed to carry 16 or more passengers (including the driver) and with a GVWR of less than 26,001 pounds
School vehicles designed for 15 passengers or less (including the driver)
Any bus or vehicle used for hire and designed to transport eight to 15 passengers (including the driver)

http://www.state.nj.us/mvc/Commercial/CommercialDriver.htm

LB1234
08-02-2009, 12:54 PM
i have two pickups rated around 9200# and then a dump trailer rated (Well registered) at 12k#. According to the website I'm safe. I don't meet any of the criteria for having to obtain a CDL.

mrusk
08-02-2009, 02:51 PM
i have two pickups rated around 9200# and then a dump trailer rated (Well registered) at 12k#. According to the website I'm safe. I don't meet any of the criteria for having to obtain a CDL.




ding ding ding we have a winner.

shovelracer
08-02-2009, 05:47 PM
This goes with what I've always been told about the NJ law. Trailer over 10K go combined weight where under dont combine. IE: Class 5 truck pulling under 10K is OK. Class 5 pulling 12K is CDL. However, dont forget that if you are over 10K in any combination you still need a DOT # and drivers need a medical card.

DVS Hardscaper
08-02-2009, 08:49 PM
Why don't you enlighten us with the statute number that proves your position or disproves mine.


Duffster, you're quite a riot!

I'm not going to hold your hand, but approximately a week ago I posted either the link to the statute, or I pasted the statue in one of my posts in this thread (I don't remember which I did). If you're interested in seeing the statue, then I suggest you find my post that contains it.

You've literally devoted a vast amount of time telling me I am wrong. I know of a handfull of people that have been cited for the violation aforementioned in the opening post. Some of them appeared in court, in which the violations were found to be true.

A few participants in this forum have chimed in and said "I have been cited for this violation, such a violation does exist", and you're still are hellbent on making a point to say that no such violation exists! LOL

If in some states no such law exists, so be it!

If folks have been wrongfully ticketed, so be it!

If in some states the law does exist, so be it!

If someone is cited for such a violation and they're infact wrongfully cited, hopefully now that they've seen this topic, they'll be able to appear in court and say to the judge "hey, not so fast your honor, the officer is mis-interpreting the law".

I have a buddy whom a few years ago ticketed a guy for trespassing (partying on private property). My buddy ran into the guy's attorney at Walmart one evening. The attorney said "hey, I'm representing John Doe for a trespassing ticket you gave him, I looked up the statute and it says the land owner must 1st issue a no trespassing letter before someone can be charged with trespassing, do you mind if I bring this to the judge's attention?" My buddy replied "if thats how it is, then I have no problem with that". Same scenerio could go for the topic at hand if that's the case.




,

DVS Hardscaper
08-02-2009, 08:54 PM
However, dont forget that if you are over 10K in any combination you still need a DOT # and drivers need a medical card.


I don't know bout NJ, but you may wanna check on that.

I know in other states it doesn't matter if it's a "combination" unit or not. You need a DOT # and DOT physical if you're operating a commercial vehicle. A commercial vehicle is then defined as any vehicle with a GVW at 10,000# or more.


,

Duffster
08-02-2009, 11:14 PM
Duffster, you're quite a riot!

I'm not going to hold your hand, but approximately a week ago I posted either the link to the statute, or I pasted the statue in one of my posts in this thread (I don't remember which I did). If you're interested in seeing the statue, then I suggest you find my post that contains it.

You've literally devoted a vast amount of time telling me I am wrong. I know of a handfull of people that have been cited for the violation aforementioned in the opening post. Some of them appeared in court, in which the violations were found to be true.

A few participants in this forum have chimed in and said "I have been cited for this violation, such a violation does exist", and you're still are hellbent on making a point to say that no such violation exists! LOL

If in some states no such law exists, so be it!

If folks have been wrongfully ticketed, so be it!

If in some states the law does exist, so be it!

If someone is cited for such a violation and they're infact wrongfully cited, hopefully now that they've seen this topic, they'll be able to appear in court and say to the judge "hey, not so fast your honor, the officer is mis-interpreting the law".

I have a buddy whom a few years ago ticketed a guy for trespassing (partying on private property). My buddy ran into the guy's attorney at Walmart one evening. The attorney said "hey, I'm representing John Doe for a trespassing ticket you gave him, I looked up the statute and it says the land owner must 1st issue a no trespassing letter before someone can be charged with trespassing, do you mind if I bring this to the judge's attention?" My buddy replied "if thats how it is, then I have no problem with that". Same scenerio could go for the topic at hand if that's the case.




,

Devious, you have proven yourself to be an illiterate buffoon.

You started a thread about something of which you know nothing about and when corrected you can only berate me, yet can't even put your finger on the statute that proves your point and can only repost links to something you can/have not read.

shovelracer
08-03-2009, 06:19 PM
I don't know bout NJ, but you may wanna check on that.

I know in other states it doesn't matter if it's a "combination" unit or not. You need a DOT # and DOT physical if you're operating a commercial vehicle. A commercial vehicle is then defined as any vehicle with a GVW at 10,000# or more.


,

I think you miss read me. I intended what you posted. An F350 single requires DOT as well as a Toyota Tacoma pulling 5K. If your GVWR is over 10K whether single or in combination you need DOT. This is federal, NJ doesnt do separate DOT like some states, they just follow federal. They do enforce it though. I went and got our stuff DOT'ed a few years ago. Physical, inspections, maintenance records, fire extinguishers, etc. Although probably 19 out of 20 around here dont have it.

Bru75
08-04-2009, 12:11 AM
Click this link:
http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rules-regulations/administration/fmcsr/fmcsrruletext.aspx?chunkkey=0901633480023243

Read question #2

SimonCX
08-04-2009, 12:45 PM
I think you miss read me. I intended what you posted. An F350 single requires DOT as well as a Toyota Tacoma pulling 5K. If your GVWR is over 10K whether single or in combination you need DOT. This is federal, NJ doesnt do separate DOT like some states, they just follow federal. They do enforce it though. I went and got our stuff DOT'ed a few years ago. Physical, inspections, maintenance records, fire extinguishers, etc. Although probably 19 out of 20 around here dont have it.

Actually this is not true, as long as you don't leave nj you don't need dot #'s if your over 10k. I called the fmcsa and the local state police to get help filling online and was asked a couple questions about weight of vehicles and the main thing was, are the trucks going to leave the state or be over 26k combined. Go on the website and try to fill out the form with the help option if you check that you don't leave nj and are under 26k and no haz it won't even let you fill. That is the reason most guys don't have dot's in nj.

shovelracer
08-04-2009, 07:46 PM
You may be right. It has been a while since we got ours. Even if it did come up we still got it because we do on occasion cross over into PA or NY to get equipment or hard to find supplies.

SimonCX
08-04-2009, 08:17 PM
Yeh, we didn't get them because the work trucks never leave the state. For now nj doesn't mandate it as long as you don't cross state lines.

Duffster
08-04-2009, 10:29 PM
Click this link:
http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rules-regulations/administration/fmcsr/fmcsrruletext.aspx?chunkkey=0901633480023243

Read question #2

I think we are starting to see a pattern here. :waving:

JoeyDipetro
12-14-2011, 10:42 AM
I don't care who you are, this thread is funny!

Now, out here in CA DVS would be correct. We do need a CDL to tow a trailer with a GVWR of 10,001 or greater.

However, I think we might be the only state with that requirement. I wouldn't base my understanding of a law on a police officer's ticket. They make mistakes too and all too often when it comes to CDL issues.

DVS Hardscaper
12-14-2011, 11:24 AM
I don't care who you are, this thread is funny!

Now, out here in CA DVS would be correct. We do need a CDL to tow a trailer with a GVWR of 10,001 or greater.

However, I think we might be the only state with that requirement. I wouldn't base my understanding of a law on a police officer's ticket. They make mistakes too and all too often when it comes to CDL issues.


Very very well said. Although CA is not the only state, MD is right there with them. Many guys have heavy trailers and don't want to accept that they need a class A to pull it with their pick em up truck.

I have many police friends, and yes they do make mistakes in ticket writing, and I can list true stories as examples.

However, the DOT police in MD do not play around. My buddy did not go I court, which he could have, his company paid the fine.

I'd bet that the ticket written was legit, a scale house on a major interstate, I'm sure the trooper writes tickets for said violation multiple times per week. Surely if the trooper was wrong, a judge would have set him straight.

.
Posted via Mobile Device

Duffster
12-14-2011, 04:19 PM
Although CA is not the only state, MD is right there with them.

Wrong DA. CA is the only one.

Bru75
12-14-2011, 11:49 PM
Click this link:
http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rules-regulations/administration/fmcsr/fmcsrruletext.aspx?chunkkey=0901633480023243

Read question #2

I see my link doesn't work any more......

Duffster
12-15-2011, 07:44 AM
I see my link doesn't work any more......

Try this.

http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rules-regulations/administration/fmcsr/fmcsrruletext.aspx?reg=383.91&guidence=Y

Michael J. Donovan
12-15-2011, 10:13 AM
ok, time to put this one to rest

thanks