Sorry, you may not be a good candidate for organics

[Smallaxe]

I have put the advertisement out for specifically organic lawncare.
Now... What jobs to accept - or - pass on...

Overwatering kills soil structure and continual harvest, robs the building blocks of structure. So I will pass on those 2 scenarios.

Are there any other types of situations to avoid when dealing with organic lawns?

[starry night]

There is a glitch that concerns me. How do you advertise the details of organic lawn care without making yourself look bad if you still offer synthetics.
Or aren't you doing both?

[ICT Bill]

There is a glitch that concerns me. How do you advertise the details of organic lawn care without making yourself look bad if you still offer synthetics.
Or aren't you doing both?

I am not sure he does both but it is very common for companies to offer a laundry list of capabilites and plans

[starry night]

I can see laundry lists of services but I personally find it hard selling details of the advantages of organic lawn care while still admitting to using synthetics. Looks like
"Show me the money and I'll do whatever you want."

[phasthound]

The way I approach it is that we are an organic based application business.
Our foundation is feeding the soil and encouraging sound cultural practices; best seed choice, proper mowing & irrigation, etc. By doing, this many problems are reduced. When problems arise, we do our best to work on the cause, not just the symptom. Some solutions may require the use of products that are approved for organic agriculture, but are still EPA Registered pesticides. And there are times when the best sound approach is to use a chemical pesticide to tackle a difficult pest and then rebuild organically. The last two approaches are not done without first speaking with the client. Pesticides are never a routine part of our programs, but we leave the option open.

I do not believe in absolutes as far as lawn & tree care are concerned. I do believe the green industry has a long way to go in understanding and implementing plant health care. Too much emphasis is on quick results that have long term consequences.

[turf hokie]

The way I approach it is that we are an organic based application business.
Our foundation is feeding the soil and encouraging sound cultural practices; best seed choice, proper mowing & irrigation, etc. By doing, this many problems are reduced. When problems arise, we do our best to work on the cause, not just the symptom. Some solutions may require the use of products that are approved for organic agriculture, but are still EPA Registered pesticides. And there are times when the best sound approach is to use a chemical pesticide to tackle a difficult pest and then rebuild organically. The last two approaches are not done without first speaking with the client. Pesticides are never a routine part of our programs, but we leave the option open.

I do not believe in absolutes as far as lawn & tree care are concerned. I do believe the green industry has a long way to go in understanding and implementing plant health care. Too much emphasis is on quick results that have long term consequences.

I hate it when level heads prevail. That is what we are working towards.
Organic in our base, using organic first, then least toxic, etc...

It is just a matter of educating our customer base.

Unfortunately, most of our customers dont want to see weeds and we have not found a good method to get rid of them without a synthetic. Before anybody says my left hand or my right hand. Our customer base is too big and my staff too small for that to be viable right now.

[ICT Bill]

I hate it when level heads prevail. That is what we are working towards.
Organic in our base, using organic first, then least toxic, etc...

It is just a matter of educating our customer base.

Unfortunately, most of our customers dont want to see weeds and we have not found a good method to get rid of them without a synthetic. Before anybody says my left hand or my right hand. Our customer base is too big and my staff too small for that to be viable right now.

In meetings with counties or cities that have banned pesticides, we tell them to take the pesticide budget and move it to seed.

I have met with many companies like yours, the easiest thing to begin with is to keep your weed and feed program in the spring and move to better sustainable practices thru the rest of the year

BTW, Barry's state, New Jersey, has passed some very forward thinking legislation. IPM practices, if you cannot prove the site needs it, you can't apply it. In my book very smart, not an all out ban of this or that, you still have all of the tools at your disposal, you just can't blanket (isn't that Michael Jackson's son) every site anymore

[turf hokie]

In meetings with counties or cities that have banned pesticides, we tell them to take the pesticide budget and move it to seed.

I have met with many companies like yours, the easiest thing to begin with is to keep your weed and feed program in the spring and move to better sustainable practices thru the rest of the year

BTW, Barry's state, New Jersey, has passed some very forward thinking legislation. IPM practices, if you cannot prove the site needs it, you can't apply it. In my book very smart, not an all out ban of this or that, you still have all of the tools at your disposal, you just can't blanket (isn't that Michael Jackson's son) every site anymore

I wish NY was that smart. We just like to ban everything and give the pro an empty toolbox.

[phasthound]

Just to clarify, the NJ program Bill is referring to is the School IPM program and only applies to public schools kindergarten to high school, not residential or commercial lawn & tree care programs.

[phasthound]

I wish NY was that smart. We just like to ban everything and give the pro an empty toolbox.

NY has been tough for many years. Just be glad you don't service Long Island. :)

[JDUtah]

I have put the advertisement out for specifically organic lawncare.
Now... What jobs to accept - or - pass on...

Overwatering kills soil structure and continual harvest, robs the building blocks of structure. So I will pass on those 2 scenarios.

Are there any other types of situations to avoid when dealing with organic lawns?

Under or irregular watering. Not being able to sharpen mower blades. Wants the grass cut too short. Too many weeds (especially grassy) to begin with. Doesn't follow the 1/3 rule when mowing. And most importantly.. not willing to pay a premium.

[NattyLawn]

I can see laundry lists of services but I personally find it hard selling details of the advantages of organic lawn care while still admitting to using synthetics. Looks like
"Show me the money and I'll do whatever you want."

Customers are going to call you for a variety of reasons, not just for 100% organic lawn care. Some just want a nice lawn (because you do good work :usflag:), or maybe their neighbor made a referral and they called you. You will have the people that want organic lawn care, but that might only be 50% of your business. Some might want organic ferts/soil amendments with a weed spot treatment in the spring or fall. It depends. Some people can offer strict organic lawn care. It's a tough sell here.

As far as turning down customers for various mowing or watering issues, I tend not to do that. I'd say 75% of our customers don't mow their own lawns. I can tell (and give handouts) the customers about proper cultural practices and some listen, some don't. We don't deal with a lot of customers with irrigation, but once we get them on a good schedule, they're fine. It does take a little extra work at first though.

[Smallaxe]

Under or irregular watering. Not being able to sharpen mower blades. Wants the grass cut too short. Too many weeds (especially grassy) to begin with. Doesn't follow the 1/3 rule when mowing. And most importantly.. not willing to pay a premium.

I appreciate all the feedback, from everyone. :)

Grass too short is definately a problem. Good point.

Too many weeds - will depend on the person and their ultimate goals. It would be fun to have a lawn in which the grass is given a chance to overtake the weeds to some extent and see how well it fills in naturally.

Little or no irrigation is not an issue for me at all. Many lawns are without, whether organic or not.

As far as the premium goes... I promise it is inexpensive [compared to 6 app TG] so the Milorganite once in the fall may be all some of them get.

[Smallaxe]

There is a glitch that concerns me. How do you advertise the details of organic lawn care without making yourself look bad if you still offer synthetics.
Or aren't you doing both?

I am advertising for organic lawncare. No details about it in the ad.
I will try to meet with every call in person. Walk the lawn with them, plugging samples as we go. Once I see what their soil is like, what the HO is like, what kind of a hurry they are in, etc.
Then I will decide to take on the lawn or not.

Why would I make myself "look bad" by continuing to offer synthetics?

I sub out all the pesticide applications and I use synthetic ferts for large areas where gras shouldn't really be growing just to keep it from dying out.

[ICT Bill]

I am advertising for organic lawncare. No details about it in the ad.
I will try to meet with every call in person. Walk the lawn with them, plugging samples as we go. Once I see what their soil is like, what the HO is like, what kind of a hurry they are in, etc.
Then I will decide to take on the lawn or not.

Why would I make myself "look bad" by continuing to offer synthetics?

I sub out all the pesticide applications and I use synthetic ferts for large areas where gras shouldn't really be growing just to keep it from dying out.

One company we sell to that is pretty large always says to me " we do not associate ourselves with failure, we want the customer to get to NO as quickly as possible so we don't waste each others time!"

[Smallaxe]

One company we sell to that is pretty large always says to me " we do not associate ourselves with failure, we want the customer to get to NO as quickly as possible so we don't waste each others time!"

That is exactly why I don't want to even start with some people. No association with failure.
I don't want to get to 'no' too quickly because I would like to be able to discuss soil structure with them for a while. Usually good PR is not a waste of time.

[Daner]

If they want a great green ,weed free lawn quick
If they want a good price:rolleyes:
If they want to do cutting
If they want to tell you when to cut there lawn:hammerhead:
If they say I really don't need the lawn cut every week....:)

[Grandview]

BTW, Barry's state, New Jersey, has passed some very forward thinking legislation. IPM practices, if you cannot prove the site needs it, you can't apply it. In my book very smart, not an all out ban of this or that, you still have all of the tools at your disposal, you just can't blanket (isn't that Michael Jackson's son) every site anymore

Just curious, to whom do you have to show proof. I think this is more nannyism than forward thinking.

[Smallaxe]

If they want a great green ,weed free lawn quick
If they want a good price:rolleyes:
If they want to do cutting
If they want to tell you when to cut there lawn:hammerhead:
If they say I really don't need the lawn cut every week....:)

Good idea, about whether this is a client who expects it all NOW - or - has a clue about what I'm saying, as we discuss what should/could be done.

I can basically give a good price... compared to TGCL, anyways.

No time for mowing. I run a solo operation and don't really need more work. Most organic clients will see me two or three times a year. Of course I can upsell on regular standard practices such as fall/spring cleanups, aeration, overseeding, topdressing, and the like.

Which just made me think of another problem to keep in mind... If they do not do prompt cleanups and leave the fall debris until spring!!! Some people do that and magically want a wonderful lawn. :hammerhead: