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grandview (2006)
09-07-2009, 07:12 PM
I was looking at getting in to this anyone have or used it ? Any ballpark figures on what is charged or if you heard of the going rate for a treatment ?

The EAB is now only one County over so if it sounds like a good deal I think it would be a good add on for the spring.

I did look at the charts and cost for material for one tree but don't know the going rate to charge.Don't want to be to high or low.

phasthound
09-07-2009, 07:38 PM
I was looking at getting in to this anyone have or used it ? Any ballpark figures on what is charged or if you heard of the going rate for a treatment ?

The EAB is now only one County over so if it sounds like a good deal I think it would be a good add on for the spring.

I did look at the charts and cost for material for one tree but don't know the going rate to charge.Don't want to be to high or low.

I suggest you speak with Peter Wild directly. He's a good guy.

grandview (2006)
09-07-2009, 07:41 PM
I suggest you speak with Peter Wild directly. He's a good guy.

Who's he?

Thanks

phasthound
09-07-2009, 08:12 PM
http://www.arborjet.com/profiles.htm

grandview (2006)
09-07-2009, 08:22 PM
Thanks I'm already been looking at that site but didn't see that part.

FdLLawnMan
09-07-2009, 11:25 PM
From what I have read and all the studies that I have seen Tree-Age from ArborJet is the way to go. Almost 100% effectiveness and you shouls only need to do it every other year. I have heard of prices about $10.00 dollars a caliper inch. I have an ArborJet that I use and next year will be pushing EAB treatments as they are also just one county away.

ICT Bill
09-07-2009, 11:48 PM
Peter Wilde is the DA MAN
His company is one of the best
EAB is decimating trees, unbelievable
They are the go to company for Chicago, and most of Michigan

grandview (2006)
09-08-2009, 06:30 PM
From what I have read and all the studies that I have seen Tree-Age from ArborJet is the way to go. Almost 100% effectiveness and you shouls only need to do it every other year. I have heard of prices about $10.00 dollars a caliper inch. I have an ArborJet that I use and next year will be pushing EAB treatments as they are also just one county away.

So do you get a lot of calls for it or do you have to push for sales?

FdLLawnMan
09-08-2009, 11:03 PM
So do you get a lot of calls for it or do you have to push for sales?

I received a few requests this year and really don't push it yet. Next year I will push it harder.

mngrassguy
09-09-2009, 12:55 AM
Good thread Mike. I've been wondering the same thing. EAB is 1 county away from me also. I've had a few lawn customers ask me about it so I'm looking at doing it next year. I understand Arbojet is the way to go.

CHiP's
09-13-2009, 02:05 AM
I am using mauget iminicide tree injections as a preventative. Cost i'm charging is $10 a cap, min $50. You messure the circumference of the tree and divide by 6 for the number of caps you will need.

Pythium
09-14-2009, 02:39 PM
We use it (Arbor Jet). Pretty easy to use, Had to do a few practice holes to get it right. We charge $8.50 per inch, or will do bulk pricing if they have lots of trees. Problem is..most people see the one time cost of cutting it down better than having to treat it at least once or twice. Despite all our efforts to show dollar values of their current tree vs. cutting it down and replacing it.
EAB is in our county, but not at epidemic levels, I think once it starts to get bad we may see more activity on treatments.

HayBay
10-18-2009, 09:59 AM
Peter Wild sounds like an interesting person. Great products and for sure.

His profile indicates he's very knowledgeable in organic products, yet the Arborjet products seem to be all synthetic chemicals.

IMIDACLOPRID , ACEPHATE, Emmamectin Benzoate Propiconazole, Mono-and di-potassium salts of Phosphorous

phasthound
10-18-2009, 11:46 AM
Peter Wild sounds like an interesting person. Great products and for sure.

His profile indicates he's very knowledgeable in organic products, yet the Arborjet products seem to be all synthetic chemicals.

IMIDACLOPRID , ACEPHATE, Emmamectin Benzoate Propiconazole, Mono-and di-potassium salts of Phosphorous

He uses several methods in his tree & turf care application business. Activated compost tea and pesticide injections both reduce the amount of, and exposure to pesticides while providing results.

PR Fect
10-18-2009, 07:53 PM
Mike, when do you think we can start treatments in our area next year? After leaf out? Memorial Day or so? PR

FdLLawnMan
10-18-2009, 08:37 PM
Mike, when do you think we can start treatments in our area next year? After leaf out? Memorial Day or so? PR

I have been told to start in May. Ask Dave at the JDL store in Appleton to get you in touch with the ArborJet that works for them. I have talked to him and he is very knowledgeable.

rcreech
10-18-2009, 10:12 PM
When I was with the Arborjet folks last week...they said not to start until the leaves had "hardened off".

I asked them what that meant (since I am far from a tree guy) and they said when the leaved come out they are droopy so you want to wait until they are not drooping.

Here where I live they said that would be around mid May to early June.

Then they said to quit once it get dry and not to start again until fall and go until Nov 1 or so. Of course every year will be a little different depending on the weather I am sure!

LIBERTYLANDSCAPING
10-19-2009, 12:06 AM
How intrusive to the tree is the Arborjet process? I'd like to use nutient feed on newly transplanted trees, but most are under 5".

phasthound
10-19-2009, 09:32 AM
How intrusive to the tree is the Arborjet process? I'd like to use nutient feed on newly transplanted trees, but most are under 5".

It's a needle injection as opposed to drilling. As with everything, there is some controversy about possible negative effects.
http://www.arborjet.com/

IMO, nutrient injection should not be an option for newly transplanted trees. Improve the soil with organic matter for best results.

HayBay
10-19-2009, 12:07 PM
Their (Arborjet) website indicates
http://www.arborjet.com/products/arborplug.htm
1. DRILL
2. PLUG
3. INJECT

I know that DUTCHTRIG offers a needle injection system not drilling and plugs. but its like $5000-10000. They will let you borrow the injector for a fee and then you mail it back to them.

Phasthound, I also notice your Organic supply company is selling Cavalcade (herbicide) within their fertilizer. Are you now a bridge product supplier?

They have eliminated weed and feed products here as part of the ban.

PR Fect
10-19-2009, 01:51 PM
Mike, I have talked to the guys at JDL. Also went to a half day seminar that Arborjet put on at the UW Greenbay. I agree that Arborjet is a very helpful company and nice guys to boot. But no one wants to talk allot about the negative parts in this system. One being the limited time of year that it works best. I was told the time the system (not the insecticide) works best is when the trees transpiration is at a high level. I guess a better question would be what time of year is that. rcreech, I like the way you explain it, I can work with that. Its my understanding that the level of up take in the tree can greatly increases your time treating the tree. Longer time treating, more cost less profit.Thanks both of you for the reply. PR

HayBay
10-19-2009, 03:02 PM
PR did you use a drill on the half day course. What specific model are you using?

phasthound
10-19-2009, 03:37 PM
Their (Arborjet) website indicates
http://www.arborjet.com/products/arborplug.htm
1. DRILL
2. PLUG
3. INJECT

I know that DUTCHTRIG offers a needle injection system not drilling and plugs. but its like $5000-10000. They will let you borrow the injector for a fee and then you mail it back to them.

Phasthound, I also notice your Organic supply company is selling Cavalcade (herbicide) within their fertilizer. Are you now a bridge product supplier?

They have eliminated weed and feed products here as part of the ban.

My error, I was thinking of the Wedgle http://www.arborsystems.com/direct-inject_main.html

We have always offered Nutrients PLUS w/Cavalcade. We understand that many landscapers & their clients are very concerned about weeds and we've kept this herbicide option open for those who don't feel the need to be completely organic. Also, the Fortified Line from Nutrients PLUS does contain some synthetic nutrients in addition to the composted poultry manure and biosolid bases.

We supply many other nutrient products that are fully organic, such as Nutrients PLUS 100% Natural fertilizers, the ICT Organics line, OA grain based fertilizers, worm castings, humates, fish hydrolysate, kelp, hi-cal lime w/humates and many others.

I know it's tough for you Canadians & it's getting tougher in the States. One of our goals at Tech Terra is to help landscapers take advantage of the changing demands on the industry. We are sponsoring some classes soon in NJ to provide detailed info on how to succeed in business while using less pesticides & nutrients.

HayBay
10-19-2009, 06:30 PM
That wedgle is nice and reasonable in price.
That one will be my choice.
Great info on your products, the classes sound good.

PR Fect
10-19-2009, 06:43 PM
PR did you use a drill on the half day course. What specific model are you using?

Yes, holes are drilled first. Then Arbor plugs. Then you inject threw the plug. The Quickjet is the one I tired at the training. Its good old hand powered. They do offer other models.

HayBay
10-19-2009, 08:33 PM
thanks. ...

phasthound
10-19-2009, 11:03 PM
That wedgle is nice and reasonable in price.
That one will be my choice.
Great info on your products, the classes sound good.

Is this use of pesticides allowed in Canada? I ask because I don't know what the legal definition of "cosmetic pesticide use" is.

HayBay
10-19-2009, 11:19 PM
In Ontario as a certified Landscape Exterminator we need a letter from a certified arborist to apply pesticides to trees.

Most other pesticides are banned on public or private lawns, shrubs, ornamentals,sidewalks,driveways,patios except for noxious weeds (poison ivy, wild parsnips, etc) on that we can apply glyphosate products for now.

Utility and Forestry Dept , Golf Courses, Agriculture are exempt from ban for now.

“cosmetic” means non-essential; (“esthétique”)

Here is one Ammendment to our Pesticide ACT.
http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/html/source/statutes/english/2008/elaws_src_s08011_e.htm

Barefoot James
02-19-2010, 07:04 PM
I just went through (another) round of training for herbs/pests and they say to get up to speed on this Borer as it already here in KY and all of MI is covered up with it. Hillerich & Bradsby that makes the Louisville Slugger is in panic mode to save the mountains in Western NY (white ash primary wood for BB Bats) and it is moving on down the states.

What is the rough investment in the Arbor Jet System for this and training involved? I hear the tree care product for this borer is $700 a liter and they are charging $12 per inch (diameter) to do trees here in KY. University of Kentucky (Go Big Blue) say it for sure can be prevented and that it last's 2 to 3 years and done a second time would get the ash tree protected into year 5 or 6 and it might not me needed again after that.

Any input specific to investment in the system and training would be much appreciated!

phasthound
02-19-2010, 07:40 PM
I just went through (another) round of training for herbs/pests and they say to get up to speed on this Borer as it already here in KY and all of MI is covered up with it. Hillerich & Bradsby that makes the Louisville Slugger is in panic mode to save the mountains in Western NY (white ash primary wood for BB Bats) and it is moving on down the states.

What is the rough investment in the Arbor Jet System for this and training involved? I hear the tree care product for this borer is $700 a liter and they are charging $12 per inch (diameter) to do trees here in KY. University of Kentucky (Go Big Blue) say it for sure can be prevented and that it last's 2 to 3 years and done a second time would get the ash tree protected into year 5 or 6 and it might not me needed again after that.

Any input specific to investment in the system and training would be much appreciated!

James go here http://www.arborjet.com/products/devices.htm
They offer on-line training or call 866- ARBORJT

Barefoot James
02-19-2010, 10:29 PM
Wow, thanks Barry posting pricing on line - novel approach must be good stuff, usually companies just don't do that, so I thought I would ask folks "in the know" this is awesome and will open a whole new dynamic to my business - I guess this old guy (me) will need to eat some crow and admit young rcreech does have some good forward thinking/ideas and is willing to learn new stuff. But organics still rock. My soils are black and teeming with life. Synthetics could never do this! But synthetics do have some advantages like with Emerald Ash Borer.

The other really cool thing I'm looking at hard is the rodenator - all guys like to blow stuff up and make money doing it:cool2:

rcreech
02-19-2010, 10:54 PM
Barefoot James,

I would highly recommend getting into the EAB business.

It's a great add on service and is relatively simple to do. There is an EAB "how to" up here in the Dayton area next month.

I would recommend the Quick Jet Pro kit to start off with. I used it for a year and a half and just updated to the air injection model to do higher volumes and larger trees.

The cost of the TreAge is somewhere around $500+/liter. Then you have the cost of the Arbor Plugs which are about $.50 each.

At the end of the day I charge around $9-11 /inch depending on the drive time and amount of trees the customer have.

Typically I charge $10/inch just as a rule of thumb.

There was one property last year that I did that was over $1800. :) People love their trees!

Barefoot James
02-19-2010, 11:35 PM
Thanks Rodney. Since I worked for Hillerich & Bradsby and grew up with the family I have a soft spot for their dilemma but it really hit me today when I heard about this problem - to me $$$ signs started flashing and since I already have the credentials it became a no brainer to add this to our portfolio of services. Then I remembered your ad card you did, and it all came together. I have saved your add and will have my graphic guy put together a quality piece and get it out their along with some other ad materials. Have you contacted any tree companies and/or are they already in tune to treating this? Any other promotional thoughts to let folks know I can do this service?
Plus this system can do so much more... guess I have lots more to learn.:confused: I even here that compost tea is a big part of some solutions to problems with trees and Arbor Jet is recommending those types of solutions too!

phasthound
02-20-2010, 12:22 AM
I even here that compost tea is a big part of some solutions to problems with trees and Arbor Jet is recommending those types of solutions too!

Peter Wild is the developer of Arbor Jet and owner of Boston Tree Preservation. http://www.bostontreepreservation.com/index.htm
He's been in the forefront of plant health care for years.

Barefoot James
02-22-2010, 02:43 PM
I'm assuming you can treat EAB BEFORE infestation occurs (prevention).
I really like all the blue rubber gloves and glasses, makes you look like a doctor - very cool.

I also learned you can use the higher end dose and it should last for 3 years then do it again in three years and the tree at 6 years should not need it again?? Any clarification here?

Also does tree age also kill any other insects - in the ash? The arbor jet site just says EAB.

rcreech
02-22-2010, 02:51 PM
I'm assuming you can treat EAB BEFORE infestation occurs (prevention).
I really like all the blue rubber gloves and glasses, makes you look like a doctor - very cool.

YOU WANT TO TREAT AS A PREVENTATIVE!

I also learned you can use the higher end dose and it should last for 3 years then do it again in three years and the tree at 6 years should not need it again?? Any clarification here?

THE HIGHER THE DOSE THE LONGER THE RESIDUAL. LAST MEETING I WAS AT THEY ARE VERY CONFIDENT THEY CAN GET 3 YEARS BUT I HAVE DECIDED TO GO WITH THE MID TO HIGH RATE AND GO BACK EVERY 2 FOR FULL PROTECTION

Also does tree age also kill any other insects - in the ash? The arbor jet site just says EAB.

YES

Call to Arborjet as they have some great help up there. I think the guys name is Shawn if I remember right.

Barefoot James
02-22-2010, 03:25 PM
How many clients have you picked up in the last 2 years treating EAB and what is your goal? Do you see the tree companies doing much with this or are they mostly just cutting them down. I would think maybe getting them to reffer you may be an option?

Are you treating or feeding trees too with the AJ and it looks like you bought the IV system? What percentage (in revenue) of your overall business do you see this moving towards?

I appreciate your help!:waving:

rcreech
02-22-2010, 04:08 PM
How many clients have you picked up in the last 2 years treating EAB and what is your goal? Do you see the tree companies doing much with this or are they mostly just cutting them down. I would think maybe getting them to reffer you may be an option?

I upsell my current customer and always looking to sell to new. Not real sure how many clients I have picked up as I really look at this more by gross sales. You may do 1 tree for a guy for $70 and then at the next stop treat 20 trees for $1500. It is hard to guage like lawns. Most tree companies want to take the trees down because they are looking at $$$$$ also. Why would they recommend them to us when they can make $800 and cut us out and the tree down. I tried hooking up with a few tree guys and I heard from several people that they ALWAYS recommend to cut down.

Are you treating or feeding trees too with the AJ and it looks like you bought the IV system? What percentage (in revenue) of your overall business do you see this moving towards?

I only treat for Ash Borer, but I am also set up to do deep root feeding but don't usually recommend it in conjunction with EAB. I don't have the IV system. I was using the Quick Jet and I have not gone to the Compressed Air unit. It is a new unit and is for quick/high volume. I am looking to make this a very major part of my business!

I appreciate your help!:waving:

The think I like best is in 2 years you have some guaranteed customer/revenue to come back in. If they don't treat in 2 years then they wasted their first treatment. It should be an easy re-sale!

Barefoot James
02-22-2010, 04:30 PM
Good info Rodney. I like the two year thinking mode - plus it gives you better security it knowing the tree has what it needs in that 3rd year - why take the risk!

I don't know if you are using a software program to help with billing, scheduling, etc - but I use gopher. Great price and support and it tells you where your money is generated from with hard numbers and pie charts. It has really helped me identify niches and higher profit services. Like I'm working on moving away from mowing to higher specialty services like organic treatments, seeding, mulching. I do 30% of my business mowing and it takes 70% of my time - so I make 70% of my money on the higher end niche items in 30% of the time. I'm hoping EAB alone could replace most of that 30% revenues in mowing. We dropped all non full service last year and saved 200 man hours yet made 15K more in revenues cause we could spend more time building the other niches - but we got kind of lazy and actually played more golf.:laugh: So really we got in about 30 more rounds last year than 2008.

One great thing about mowing - gives you a good customer base. I only will take on new mowing folks if I can do full service.

Thanks again for sharing!

rcreech
02-22-2010, 11:16 PM
Good info Rodney. I like the two year thinking mode - plus it gives you better security it knowing the tree has what it needs in that 3rd year - why take the risk!

I don't know if you are using a software program to help with billing, scheduling, etc - but I use gopher. Great price and support and it tells you where your money is generated from with hard numbers and pie charts. It has really helped me identify niches and higher profit services. Like I'm working on moving away from mowing to higher specialty services like organic treatments, seeding, mulching. I do 30% of my business mowing and it takes 70% of my time - so I make 70% of my money on the higher end niche items in 30% of the time. I'm hoping EAB alone could replace most of that 30% revenues in mowing. We dropped all non full service last year and saved 200 man hours yet made 15K more in revenues cause we could spend more time building the other niches - but we got kind of lazy and actually played more golf.:laugh: So really we got in about 30 more rounds last year than 2008.

One great thing about mowing - gives you a good customer base. I only will take on new mowing folks if I can do full service.

Thanks again for sharing!

PM me if you need any help!

It truly is a great add on and look at what you are doing for people and their properties!

I mean getting rid of weeds in someones lawn is great...but saving a person's tree in their lawn that their grandfather planted 20-30 years ago is much better!

I would MUCH rather do EAB then lawns any day!

Barefoot James
02-22-2010, 11:29 PM
AMEN............... Plus you get to wear those cool blue gloves!

Pythium
02-23-2010, 09:25 AM
Rodney, I have found many people up here around Cleveland would rather pay the one time charge to cut it down then to save it. Part of my sales pitch is to show dollars numbers on how the tree benefits them,and the destruction EAB causes and how our product is guaranteed to prevent tree death for 2 years. We offer a written guarantee once payment is received, but still mostly a no go to expensive. ( I am at $10.00 an inch also depending on job and drive time) I think part of it is the wrong customer for the product (price shoppers), how do you handle these people to get the sale?

BTW it is a great add on service, but I think that has been established:)

rcreech
02-23-2010, 01:33 PM
Rodney, I have found many people up here around Cleveland would rather pay the one time charge to cut it down then to save it. Part of my sales pitch is to show dollars numbers on how the tree benefits them,and the destruction EAB causes and how our product is guaranteed to prevent tree death for 2 years. We offer a written guarantee once payment is received, but still mostly a no go to expensive. ( I am at $10.00 an inch also depending on job and drive time) I think part of it is the wrong customer for the product (price shoppers), how do you handle these people to get the sale?

BTW it is a great add on service, but I think that has been established:)

It takes a little selling but not much!

Just take even a 20" tree (and that is BIG tree and above avg).

If they treat they would be looking at an average of $100/year ($200/treatment every 2 years).

If they were to have the tree cut down it may cost them $700-1000 and they still have to replace the tree with another which may cost anywhere from $50-200+. And who's to say that the tree the plant won't be getting attacked in 10-15 years by some other insect!

That means that we can treat their Ash Tree for over 10-12 years and they STILL have an awesome healthy tree providing them with shade, beauty and while adding value to their property.

And who knows...this EAB thing may be through its cycle by then! :confused:

I guess it will be a more select audience to take this service, but if they have money and like their landscape they will buy!

If a person has more then 2-3 Ash Trees I usually tell them the overall cost and if they don't want to spend that much just ask them to pick their "favorite" trees they want to save.

Usually they end up doing them all! :clapping:

Pythium
02-23-2010, 02:12 PM
You must just be a better salesman than me:). I do the EXACT same presentation. I have a little tree removal knowledge from my golf course days so I can guestimate the cost of taking it down. People up here still see that as the better option. The destruction hasn't it us hard yet, the ones I have done have been west of here, I even did a big one on Kelly's Island in Lake Erie, Hoping that generates more leads.

LIBERTYLANDSCAPING
02-23-2010, 04:28 PM
2 years ago would have been a much easier sell! Economy is awful & alot of people have other things to worry about. Cities & schools don't want any part of it, because they are cutting staff-who cares about the trees is what I am hearing! I think most people won't be too worried, or even hear about EAB until it is too late:dizzy: We'll have some really nasty looking Ash trees here this year, as EAB has been here for several years now. Maybe then people will decide to spend their unemployment check on EAB treatment:laugh:

Pythium
02-23-2010, 06:36 PM
No they won't spend unemployment on EAB, too busy buying big screen TV's, Marlboros and Busch Lite.

LIBERTYLANDSCAPING
02-23-2010, 07:11 PM
No they won't spend unemployment on EAB, too busy buying big screen TV's, Marlboros and Busch Lite.


:laugh::laugh::laugh::cry:

rcreech
02-23-2010, 09:26 PM
You must just be a better salesman than me:). I do the EXACT same presentation. I have a little tree removal knowledge from my golf course days so I can guestimate the cost of taking it down. People up here still see that as the better option. The destruction hasn't it us hard yet, the ones I have done have been west of here, I even did a big one on Kelly's Island in Lake Erie, Hoping that generates more leads.

You didn't hear me say I never got turned down.

I upsell it with my current business so usually customers call me to ask questions and it isn't that hard to sell.

Will be going out and marketing this year so maybe I will see that people are not as interested as I think! So far so good...but who knows!