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DVS Hardscaper
09-17-2009, 09:40 AM
I noticed a UPS driver was wearing shorts the other day.

Many contractors have a cow if their guys ever dream of wearing shorts to work!

UPS is all about production and speed. And UPS is also all about professionalism. So am I. A comfortable employee is a productive employee. Many contractors use safety as an excuse for not allowing shorts. My favorite is the 1950's conservative mindset when others equate wearing shorts to going to "the beach"! One can be comfortable only at a beach???

In the 13.5 years I've been a super duper, world renowned, hardscape contractor - we never had anything happen where pants or shorts would have impacted anyone's safety.

What are your requirements and why?






In a few weeks I'll do my monthly check in at the "premier site" and someone will have copied this topic!




,

JeffY
09-17-2009, 01:54 PM
I think one of the main reasons why you see a lot of hardscapers wear pants is because they consider hardscapes to be construction. You go to any commercial construction site, you are required to wear pants. I know most construction sites will have their own regulations and they will usually include that the stricter of the two regulations, their own and OSHA's are to be followed at all times. I've read through the OSHA regulations and they only say PPE is required if there is any possibility of injury. Now granted, I can trip and fall on my way to the truck and scratch my knees. Does that mean I should wear pants when I walk to the truck from now on because of the possibility of injury? I don't think so.

That said, our own company requirements say to wear proper clothing according to where you will be working. Most of our guys wear pants, and from what I gather, it's usually out of habit. Me, I wear shorts whenever possible as they give me a lot more room such as when I'm kneeling down to do sprinkler or brick work. I, too haven't heard of any such injury come through where pants or shorts come in to play regarding the injury type.

wurkn with amish
09-17-2009, 05:23 PM
my guys and myself wear speedos! Very comfortable.


















we wear shorts, cause your right a happy employee is a working employee. I also get them cutoff work shirts.

kootoomootoo
09-17-2009, 07:08 PM
shorts 100% of the time.....I don't care how cold it is and sometimes shorts and sandals.

LB1234
09-17-2009, 07:28 PM
bright yellow bannana hammocks for us...

tthomass
09-17-2009, 10:20 PM
I wouldn't go as far as sandals but yes, shorts. I prefer hiking shoes, shorts and a t-shirt. When its cooler we're still in shorts but long sleeves and when its cold........well, we do what we can to keep warm.

Maybe I should get company shorts with the logo across the butt....

Stillwater
09-17-2009, 10:29 PM
White thongs hear

LouisianaLawnboy
09-17-2009, 10:36 PM
I wear pants but my employees can wear whatever they want. I'd rather wipe grass and debris from pants than my shin.
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PerfiCut L&L
09-18-2009, 07:27 AM
If my guys were driving all day, then short it could be. But since there out working with heavy blocks, busting conctrete, and using machinery, pants it will be.

My guys work hard at very steady pace that I am happy with.

Its not worth it to me. In my opinion.

DVS Hardscaper
09-18-2009, 05:47 PM
If my guys were driving all day, then short it could be. But since there out working with heavy blocks, busting conctrete, and using machinery, pants it will be.

My guys work hard at very steady pace that I am happy with.

Its not worth it to me. In my opinion.


Ok, "heavy blocks"? Heavy blocks pose a threat to the toes and to the back. You have your guys wearing pants in case they drop a block on their feet, but do they all wear back braces when working with heavy block?

"Busting concrete". I guess if you use a jack hammer pants may be necessary.

I'm curious as to what hardscape machinery there is that would pose a threat to one's legs?



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Stillwater
09-18-2009, 06:10 PM
I'm curious as to what hardscape machinery there is that would pose a threat to one's legs?,


Oh F-in please get real we follow standards and those standards are high try the law in some instances.

OSHA GENERAL REQUIREMENT 910.132A
Application. Protective equipment, including personal protective equipment for eyes, face, head, and extremities, protective clothing, respiratory devices, and protective shields and barriers, shall be provided, used, and maintained in a sanitary and reliable condition wherever it is necessary by reason of hazards of processes or environment, chemical hazards, radiological hazards, or mechanical irritants encountered in a manner capable of causing injury or impairment in the function of any part of the body through absorption, inhalation or physical contact.

910.132B
Employee-owned equipment. Where employees provide their own protective equipment, the employer shall be responsible to assure its adequacy, including proper maintenance, and sanitation of such equipment.

Stillwater
09-18-2009, 06:52 PM
Ahh... let me think....Just today..
how about backhoes lowering stone down to you by chain for a seawall and boat dock, Hilti drills drilling rebar, wet saws ribbon slicing over pored concrete footings, hand mixing slurry I could go on Still want your shorts on? punch out and go to the beach.

Setting down pavers on a smooth bed of sand in a back yard in shorts and sneakers with a glass of tea Aunt B just brought out on a tray for you is one thing, I have done it, but doing large hardscape in a project setting with 8 guys running around using hydraulic and gas powered equipment that can maim you in a nano second without safety equipment and wearing shorts and sneakers is not a option for me.

tthomass
09-18-2009, 07:49 PM
I would wear them more in an environment where I would be likely to scratch my legs or burn them. More importantly, when dealing with heavy objects, is steel toe shoes that 99% of us do not wear. A heavy object coming down on your leg isn't going to care if you're dressed or naked.....your leg is still f'd.

So: weed eater, cutting metal, using chainsaw, working in brush..........anything to cause damage to skin is the case that I choose to wear long pants.

As for OSHA, none of us are following all the "rules" unless we're on a big job with lots of inspectors. Who uses fall protection for a 4' wall, hard hats, steal toe boots, gloves, long sleeves + pants, ear and eye protection.....its just a matter of using your brain that hopefully includes common sense for your own sake and doing what you feel is necessary for your own safety while still following whatever company you may work for set of particular opinion manipulated rules.

DVS Hardscaper
09-18-2009, 10:07 PM
Ahh... let me think....Just today..
how about backhoes lowering stone down to you by chain for a seawall and boat dock, Hilti drills drilling rebar, wet saws ribbon slicing over pored concrete footings, hand mixing slurry I could go on Still want your shorts on? punch out and go to the beach.

Setting down pavers on a smooth bed of sand in a back yard in shorts and sneakers with a glass of tea Aunt B just brought out on a tray for you is one thing, I have done it, but doing large hardscape in a project setting with 8 guys running around using hydraulic and gas powered equipment that can maim you in a nano second without safety equipment and wearing shorts and sneakers is not a option for me.



yeah but Stillwater, look at my wording. I stated "hardscapes". SEAWALLS are not hardscapes. Thats like comparing underwater bridge welding to tree planting! But hey, congrats on the seawall building. I know a dude in FL that engineers 'em.


Patio Building. "Hydraulic Equipment". Ok, what on earth!? The average patio is excavated 8" with pavers plopped in place. What hydraulic equipment do you use that pose great threats to legs for patio installation???

zedosix
09-18-2009, 10:24 PM
If anyone shows up in running shoes or sandals they go home. Case closed. Pants over shorts any day, its another layer of protection against bruises and abrasions.

DVS Hardscaper
09-18-2009, 10:33 PM
Oh F-in please get real we follow standards and those standards are high try the law in some instances.

OSHA GENERAL REQUIREMENT 910.132A
Application. Protective equipment, including personal protective equipment for eyes, face, head, and extremities, protective clothing, respiratory devices, and protective shields and barriers, shall be provided, used, and maintained in a sanitary and reliable condition wherever it is necessary by reason of hazards of processes or environment, chemical hazards, radiological hazards, or mechanical irritants encountered in a manner capable of causing injury or impairment in the function of any part of the body through absorption, inhalation or physical contact.

910.132B
Employee-owned equipment. Where employees provide their own protective equipment, the employer shall be responsible to assure its adequacy, including proper maintenance, and sanitation of such equipment.


"Shall be provided". So being we're all OSHA geeks, I presume we're all supplying our hardscape crews with pants???

"wherever it is necessary by reason of hazards of processes.....". EXACTLY! In the 13 years we bean doing h-scapes - I haven't found any "reason of hazards of processes". Now if you/we pour concrete - then there is a "reason of hazards" because if concrete splatters on your skin, you can get concrete poisioning, thus pants would be wise.

Many folks on here post pics of work in progress. Harmless pics with people running back pack blowers. Picks of people compacting aggregate. No earplugs visible in the compacting pics. No respirators or hearing protection in pics with blowers.

But when it comes to shorts or pants - some suddenly have big concerns for "safety". LOL

Many contractors are about projecting a particular image. And disallow shorts because they feel it will reflect poorly on their company. Ta each his own. I don't agree with it. A beautiful back yard that lasts forever is a beautiful backyard that lasts forever. Communicate with your client. Be 100% honest and forthright from start to finish, do exactly as you promised, and they won't care how you or your employees dress.

My company has had it's share of eye injuries. We've had the broken toe injuries. 2 years ago one employee accidently set a 70# block on another employee's fingers, resulting in 2 broken fingers. My employees have had their share of stitches. But leg injuries? Not a one! I could see a cut off saw potentially cutting a leg if the operator is not careful when they pull away after completing a cut. Will pants make much of a difference in this case?

Self employed are kinda like police officers - meaning we're control freaks. If we're gonna site safety as a reason for requiring shorts - then we better be providing and utilizing every other safety tool imaginable. But when we site safety as a requiement for pants - yet send the guys out to do a task and not equip them with necessary safety tools - it's then a control issue.



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LouisianaLawnboy
09-18-2009, 10:36 PM
I reccomend pants because of trimming debri.
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stuvecorp
09-18-2009, 11:15 PM
I'm in shorts as soon as possible and wear them as long as possible. I don't care what someone says when it's hot out. I've done about everything wearing shorts because my legs are too pretty too hide.:)

LouisianaLawnboy
09-18-2009, 11:36 PM
I'm in shorts as soon as possible and wear them as long as possible. I don't care what someone says when it's hot out. I've done about everything wearing shorts because my legs are too pretty too hide.:)

Haaaaaaaahaaaaahaaaa

Whew
Posted via Mobile Device

DVS Hardscaper
09-19-2009, 08:59 AM
If anyone shows up in running shoes or sandals they go home. Case closed. Pants over shorts any day, its another layer of protection against bruises and abrasions.


Umm.....Zedo.....ah.....umm......ah.....you must have changed your rules since you posted this photo back in May of 2005, which I happened to save on my computer :) :) Hard to put finishing touches on a patio if we're closing cases and sending 'em home :)


162086

PlatinumLandCon
09-19-2009, 09:15 AM
Umm.....Zedo.....ah.....umm......ah.....you must have changed your rules since you posted this photo back in May of 2005, which I happened to save on my computer :) :) Hard to put finishing touches on a patio if we're closing cases and sending 'em home :)


162086

DVS, if you read what he said, you would see that shorts isn't reason to send someone home, he would just take them over pants any day. Thats a bit creepy you have his pics from 4 years ago....

zedosix
09-19-2009, 09:35 AM
DVS, if you read what he said, you would see that shorts isn't reason to send someone home, he would just take them over pants any day. Thats a bit creepy you have his pics from 4 years ago....

Thanks buddy. I wasn't going to even go there, but thanks.

Stillwater
09-19-2009, 10:15 AM
This is funny stuff, I will admit I have been seen wearing shorts like that and their may be pictures out their somewhere... Nice shorts, nice patio, great blower

wurkn with amish
09-19-2009, 12:45 PM
Maybe he has other reasons he wants his guys in shorts???????? shorter the better, right Devious?

STL Ponds and Waterfalls
09-19-2009, 01:12 PM
Maybe he has other reasons he wants his guys in shorts???????? shorter the better, right Devious?

Than they will all look like the cop on Reno 911.

zedosix
09-19-2009, 03:53 PM
Umm.....Zedo.....ah.....umm......ah.....you must have changed your rules since you posted this photo back in May of 2005, which I happened to save on my computer :) :) Hard to put finishing touches on a patio if we're closing cases and sending 'em home :)


162086

That was done in May 2008. I was not even a member in 05. Hey Andrew when did I become a member.

DVS Hardscaper
09-19-2009, 03:55 PM
...... Thats a bit creepy you have his pics from 4 years ago....


haha, platinum buddy, I save certain pictures for design and construction ideas :cool2: After all that's kinda sorta what this forum is about. Sharing as well as obtaining ideas, experiences, thoughts. Not very creepy to me at all :)



Sorry, for some odd reason last night I remembered that picture existed and I thought it was funny, as well as an excellent exhibit depicting the harmlessness of wearing shorts while creating a paver patio! I was jus tryin to find a way to post it!! HAHA!



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Stillwater
09-19-2009, 03:58 PM
That was done in May 2008. I was not even a member in 05. Hey Andrew when did I become a member.

you joined Feb 2003

DVS Hardscaper
09-19-2009, 04:03 PM
That was done in May 2008. I was not even a member in 05. Hey Andrew when did I become a member.

I'd have to click on *properties to see when the photo was saved. It's on the computer in my office. I really have no clue when it was saved, not something I sleep on, but it sounded good for the thread ratings :)


Although, as to when did you become a member, According to the stastics posted at the top of each post:

"Join Date: Feb 2003" Whew, just think - thats way back before you had hair growing in your ears! :canadaflag:



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zedosix
09-19-2009, 04:10 PM
[QUOTE
"Join Date: Feb 2003" Whew, just think - thats way back before you had hair growing in your ears! :canadaflag:

[/QUOTE]

Now that is creepy! :laugh:

kootoomootoo
09-19-2009, 09:50 PM
how bout no socks?

tturbonegro
11-19-2009, 07:01 PM
usually pants...guys can wear whatever they want...but i think shorts and boots looks a little funny

Fiano Landscapes
01-03-2010, 12:52 AM
When we first opened our doors we provided our team members with company hats and shirts. My personal philosophy always has been about having a very professional look. The only problem we had is some of our employees had different personal hygiene, and laundry situations. I wanted everyone to be dressed appropriately. We ended up starting a program with Cintas. It runs about $5 per week per employee, but it comes out of my team members pay. They dont even mind. How can you beat $5 per week to pickup, wash, press, and deliver the uniforms back to our shop. It was a no brainer. We do not allow shorts either. So far no one has died from having to wear pants while we are working. I couldnt tell you how many compliments we get on how professional our team members look while in the field. We service mostly high end customers so I think its a must, and is just another thing that sets us apart from the rest. To many contractors let their employees show up at customers houses dressed in camo, and pants all ripped to shreds. I just give our customers what I would expect from someone I would hire to work at my residence.

glaciator
01-04-2010, 05:13 PM
I wear shorts when it is hot, jeans when it is cold. ALWAYS! And, always steel toed boots per OSHA....and a hard hat when the skidsteer is running. The company hat and shirt/hoodie is mandatory.

Kustom Kutz
01-04-2010, 08:17 PM
I noticed a UPS driver was wearing shorts the other day.

Many contractors have a cow if their guys ever dream of wearing shorts to work!

UPS is all about production and speed. And UPS is also all about professionalism. So am I. A comfortable employee is a productive employee. Many contractors use safety as an excuse for not allowing shorts. My favorite is the 1950's conservative mindset when others equate wearing shorts to going to "the beach"! One can be comfortable only at a beach???

In the 13.5 years I've been a super duper, world renowned, hardscape contractor - we never had anything happen where pants or shorts would have impacted anyone's safety.

What are your requirements and why?






In a few weeks I'll do my monthly check in at the "premier site" and someone will have copied this topic!




,PANTS! I will not let anyone work for me that has a problem wearing 1. jeans or pants (have to fit) 2. workboots and a belt. 3. sunglasses 4. uniform shirt.
I know the only thing that really matters out of what I listed is boots, but It looks more professional if everyone dresses the same and like they are ready to work. Me.. I have sleeves up both arms. It can be 100 degrees in the summer and I will have on pants, boots, belt and unifirm shirt. I wear long sleeve shirts during the summer with my sleeves rolled up and tucked in.

DVS Hardscaper
01-06-2010, 12:46 PM
I think a few are not talking the same thing.

Pants vs shorts is the topic.

Tattered clothing vs clean crisp clothing is a whole other subject.

As far as myself personally, Being in the line of work I'm in - I know good, skilled, people whom perform just about every service I could every need done at my home. So if I'm hiring someone to work at my home it's most likely going to be someone whom I'm already familiar with their work and have already been impressed with their end results, along with their rates, not their dress code. Heck - I go to work during the day. If someone were workin at my place in torn clothing - I wouldn't know it, I'm not there - I'm on the road running a business :)

STL Ponds and Waterfalls
01-06-2010, 04:35 PM
You people are crazy! I'm always in nicer shorts with a uniform t-shirt in the summer and pants in the COLDER times. To be fair though we are in water a lot of times.