Looking to buy a nice Diesel truck

[Rarebreedx5]

My price range for my diesel truck is going to be about 8-10k, this is going to be my first truck im buying to start my business off. The truck is just going to be hualing around my trailor of lawn equipment. I just want some insight on which truck will be the best for the job. I know I can pick up fords for nothing right now, but I hear they have a lot of problems. So let me know what you guys think, and have experienced.

thanks dave,

[Evan528]

In that price range you can pick up a late 90's or maybe even 2000 f250 with a 7.3 powerstroke or a dodge ram 2500 with a cummins. Both are great engines. I would stay away from the late 90's pre duramax chevys. They have a 6.5 liter Gm diesel wich have many problems and dont have the longevity the other diesel I mentioned do.

[Gravel Rat]

I would be looking for a OBS Ford with a 7.3 PSD if all you have to spend is 10 grand. Lots of guys are facinated with crewcabs but a good reg cab 4x4 would do good for me. A extended cab is nice to have.

Any "Superduty" body style Ford for 10 grand will be well worn out.

A 96-97 F-350 srw 4x4 with a PSD would be a nice truck.

I would stay away from the Chevy/GMC with the 6.5 turdo diesel the engines are a POS.

The Dodges are okay but they definatly not a good truck the 12 valve engine is the only decent part of the truck. A 95-97 Dodge with the 12 valve it has the good Bosch injection pump.

I'd prefer a Ford over a Dodge nicer truck and the 7.3 PSD is a good engine.

[WH401]

If you like Ford's than I would look for something that has the 7.3 Powerstroke, there the last reliable engine that Ford had. Dodge's of any year are good IMO, the 5.9 Cummins can't be beat in all around durability, reliability, stock engine performance, and mpg. If Chevy's are you thing than look for a truck with a Duramax. The 6.5 IDI's were ok, but there nothing compared to a Dmax. Watch out for the early LB7 engine, it tends to like to eat injectors, but GM issued a warranty claim on them and extended the term to I think 250k miles. Any of those trucks I've mentioned you can find for around 10k or under.

[JDiepstra]

Get a Ford 7.3 or a Dodge 5.9. Run from Ford 6.0. Stay away from GM's 6.5.

[tnmtn]

soounds like you won't be towing real heavy. with that in mind i would not look to spend all your money on purchase price and instead buy an older ford or dodge from the mechanical years. you won't be needing the power the electronic ones put out. an older ford with the idi and a 5 speed is very inexpensive to maintain and a pretty bullit proof combo. they can be picked up all day for half your budget whiich leaves plenty of money to fix up or customize to your taste. ot invest in other equipment to generate income with.
good luck,

[Rarebreedx5]

Thanks for all the info guys I really appericate it.

[lawn king]

Look at cabovers, they are the workhorse of the green industry!

[ZTR_Diesel]

Issues known on “second gen” Dodge/Cummins trucks.
12-Valve units (1994 – 1998)
· KDP or Killer Down Pin, inside timing case, can be easily tabbed to prevent it falling out and getting jammed in timing gears.
· “53” block (later years) this block can externally crack, also affected earlier years of “24-valve” units.
· Hard starting or inability to shut down due to failing shut-off solenoid.
· Fuel return and supply lines can corrode and leak air into the fuel system, making for hard or no-start condition. When they are replaced, it is typical to replace the fuel sender unit as well.
· On rare occasion, the oil pressure sender unit it the engine can act up. Simple to replace.
24-Valve units (1998.5-2002)
· Lift pump and associated VP-44 (electronic) injection pump are highly prone to failure. Lift pump fails first, and unless fuel pressure change is caught in time, the fuel cooled and lubricated VP-44 unit will fail as well, creating no-start condition. It’s $1200 for parts alone to get back on the road.
· To monitor fuel pressure, it is considered mandatory to install a fuel pressure gauge pas the lift pump (but prior to injection pump) and monitor it.
· “53” block (earlier years) this block can externally crack. This is rare, and I have not observed any actual engine failures from this condition.
Dodge 2nd gen trucks in general:
· First and foremost, the 47RE automatic used in these trucks isn’t up to the torque of the Cummins 5.9L I-6. They can be built to handle the torque, but it’s not cheap. A replacement transmission is $3-5k.
· Front brake rotors may need frequent changing, and they run over $120/each for the part alone.
· Upper & lower ball joints will need periodic changing.
· NV4500 (5-speed) trucks may have a 5-th gear nut that can back off. It’s not happened to me, however it’s one of the only failure modes of this transmission.
· Trac-Bar failure (4wd models only).
· 1998-2002 “Cost-improved” dashboards tend to crack, sometimes in several places.
· Rust at bottoms of doors, and rust in general (problem seems a bit worse with 1998 – 2002 models.)
· De-laming paint in early years (94-96, especially two-tones with silver.)

This isn’t an exhaustive list, there are other issues I am missing. Overall, having worked with several of these, I would tend to stay away from the “24-valve” years entirely. The issues on the 12-vales are much less expensive to rectify, however at this point the 12-valves are getting old enough to be pretty ragged and hard-worked. Let’s face it, people don’t buy these to baby them, they get worked fairly hard.

Overall, I would ask if you really have enough load to justify a ¾ or 1-ton purchase overall. I do like getting 19 – 24 real-world MPG out of my truck, however it costs much more to maintain overall – even just 12 quarts of 15w-40 oil and a $12 filter add up to a $60 oil change in your driveway. They are pretty easy to work on, but they are not cheap overall. I’ve owned my truck 8 years, and it’s served me well.

[Hanau]

I've always ben partial to the first gen Dodge Cummins. 89 to 93. Good looking trucks.

Build quality is... well you're going to do some wrenching on everything but the engine.

Tough to find in good shape, I've been looking for the perfect one for a few years.

They have their drawbacks, but they sure are pretty.

[Gravel Rat]

The old boxy Dodges had a little better driveline in the 4x4s with a Dana 60 that had leaf springs and real hubs. I don't think the 12 valve had the inline pump in those years thou it was the rotary.

The only thing with the old boxy Dodge is the sheet metal viberates like a harmonica with the engine idling.

[Hanau]

They have their drawbacks, but the higher trim levels look so nice. Especially that big Dodge plate across the tailgate.

I'm on the lookout for a cherry 92 or 93 350 4x4. Regular cab, long bed, single rear wheel, LE trim level, Cummins, 5 speed. Only problem is Dodge made like 10 of those and they're not for sale very often.

The hunt it part of the fun.

[ZTR_Diesel]

Yep, those old first-gens are hard to come by. Most are pretty much shot at this point. It has the VE rotary pump, (not electronic like the VP-44). Better like leaf-springs at all four corners...rides pretty rough. But it's a work truck, eh?

I saw someone put this quote in regarding a first-gen's interior, thought it was neat: "These truck had interiors designed and built by the Salvation Army..."

Ah, for simpler times again...no GPS, No Sat-Nav, just a simple basic truck you could get plenty of years' work out of. Guess that's why I hang onto my old '96.

[Hanau]

It's staggering how few of these trucks are around, I saw a nice 92 or 93 3/4 4x4 today in Lewiston. It was beautiful. Probably the first one I've seen in several months.

Dodge's sales figures at the time must have been abysmal.

Earlier this year I saw a perfect red/silver two tone up in Moscow at the rental yard. There was still snow on the ground.

For some reason I just think those first gens are pretty. The design speaks to me.

Wouldn't mind collecting a few. Keep them in a nice shop for my personal enjoyment.

I had a Dodge half ton, I think it was a 91 or 92. Didn't have it long. Decent truck, but the interior was definetely Salvation Army. Ran good, looked good, everything else was crap! Being a two wheel drive, 318 auto truck it didn't have enough redeeming features to put up with the eccentricities.

[JimMac]

Hi Rarebreedx5. Do you live near the Boston, MA area? I have a 1996 ford 7.3 liter diesel 4x4 with 9ft fisher HD snowplow for sale your price range is exactly in my asking price. The truck was listed on Craig's list for 9800.00, but there is wiggle room with the price. Truck has only 87K original miles on it, never been in accident. Have many receipts to show recent work. Has a rebuilt tranny 7 months ago, 2 sets tires, summer and winter snow tires...a perfect ruck for someone just staring out who needs a reliable, strong truck. Call me at 617.602.7262.

[WH401]

Yep, the 1st Gen Dodge's are one of a kind, but they're getting harder and harder to find in decent shape. They're a lot of things on my 92' that I like a lot better over my 06'.

[Gravel Rat]

There is a few of them around here definatly not show room condition. Well worn because Dodge bodies don't last. The sheet metal sags like a pair of old womans b**bs

[Ben's Landscape]

I am a huge fan of the old dodge cummins but i found a ford 250 7.3 on the side of the road for a really good price. So I bought it. You can find nice looking old diesels for around 2-4k. Mine was 2 and it only has 151 k on it. The pics are in my thread. Just look hard for them.

[Ben's Landscape]

I've always ben partial to the first gen Dodge Cummins. 89 to 93. Good looking trucks.

Build quality is... well you're going to do some wrenching on everything but the engine.

Tough to find in good shape, I've been looking for the perfect one for a few years.

They have their drawbacks, but they sure are pretty.

I really like your truck. Are you the origional owner?? 5 speed??

[Hanau]

Wish that was my truck. Found it on Google. Looking for one like it.

[Junior M]

I've always ben partial to the first gen Dodge Cummins. 89 to 93. Good looking trucks.

Build quality is... well you're going to do some wrenching on everything but the engine.

Tough to find in good shape, I've been looking for the perfect one for a few years.

They have their drawbacks, but they sure are pretty.
guy on here by the name of Constructo has a red version of that truck..

Now thats a truck I'd kill for!

[Junior M]

They have their drawbacks, but the higher trim levels look so nice. Especially that big Dodge plate across the tailgate.

I'm on the lookout for a cherry 92 or 93 350 4x4. Regular cab, long bed, single rear wheel, LE trim level, Cummins, 5 speed. Only problem is Dodge made like 10 of those and they're not for sale very often.

The hunt it part of the fun.

There is one around here. Havent seen it around in a while. Probably cause the kid driving it went to Iraq, he was a mechanic at Bobcat. He didnt realize the gem he had.

But dam, it was an awesome truck!

There is a gun metal gray one running around town. Does carpentry work. I've never been up close to it to see if its a 3/4 or 1ton.

It's staggering how few of these trucks are around, I saw a nice 92 or 93 3/4 4x4 today in Lewiston. It was beautiful. Probably the first one I've seen in several months.

Dodge's sales figures at the time must have been abysmal.

Earlier this year I saw a perfect red/silver two tone up in Moscow at the rental yard. There was still snow on the ground.

For some reason I just think those first gens are pretty. The design speaks to me..

never seen a crew cab in that year before. Never even knew they were made?

Either way, that first one looks dam good!

[Hanau]

The crew cab was extremely low production.

[Junior M]

The crew cab was extremely low production.
Apparently so. I wonder why they didnt carry it into the 94-03 years?

I've always been partial to this bodystyle(This is the exact truck I am looking for and would like to have by the middle of 2010)

http://i480.photobucket.com/albums/rr164/JLM88_bucket/2001-4x4.jpg

[Hanau]

Most of the crew cabs went to the USAF for SAC bases during the Cold War or to the Army Corps of Engineers. Every once in a while Gov Liquidators will release one or two. They're pretty beat. Haven't seen a nice one.

I'm guessing Dodge didn't see the popularity that the crew cab would have by the late 90's.

Ever see an old IH crew cab from the sixties?

[Junior M]

Most of the crew cabs went to the USAF for SAC bases during the Cold War or to the Army Corps of Engineers. Every once in a while Gov Liquidators will release one or two. They're pretty beat. Haven't seen a nice one.

I'm guessing Dodge didn't see the popularity that the crew cab would have by the late 90's.

Ever see an old IH crew cab from the sixties?
Oh. Never really took a big enough interest in that body style to research. Probably because they are so rare.

I wanna say yes, but I am not sure if I am thinking of the right truck.. ;)

[Hanau]

You ever look on this website Junior:

http://www.govliquidation.com/

Everything from ships, trucks, nuts, bolts, trailers, equipment. It's like Ebay for men.

[Junior M]

You ever look on this website Junior:

http://www.govliquidation.com/

Everything from ships, trucks, nuts, bolts, trailers, equipment. It's like Ebay for men.
Nope, never been there. Have to get some money so I can check it out first. This Dodge Dakota I bought as a DD is killing my wallet..

and your right about it being like Ebay, just as freakin complicated!

[TXNSLighting]

never seen a crew cab in that year before. Never even knew they were made?

Either way, that first one looks dam good!

Thats cuz they only made 6 of em. ha!

[Gravel Rat]

Dodge made some big mistakes when they went to the new body style.

The first mistake was going to the chitty front axle in the 4x4s very problematic. Second mistake using a frigging jeep suspension in a 3/4 ton truck that 4 link suspension is crap. Third mistake making the frames on the new trucks out of paper thin sheet metal.

The old boxy Dodges were tougher trucks they had the Dodge trademark of weak springs in the back. They used a Dana 60 rear axle in those truck had problems with small brakes. They also had steering box problems.

They did have a tough 205 transfer case the only drawback was the low range wasn't as low as say the BW chain drive in the Fords.

Dodge's paper thin sheet metal was another problem the guys that used those old Dodges in the resource industry had problems with the body. The rest of the truck was okay.

The old 12 valves with the rotary pumps didn't make much power they only made 160hp. Good fuel mileage thou.

[ZTR_Diesel]

True about the rotary pumps, I've worked on a 5.9L CTD that was rated at only 125 bhp (on a Case 621 Wheel loader.)

As for P-Pump models (P7100 inline pump, looks like a small I-6 engine)
--94 & 95 AT truck rated 160bhp (400 ft-lbs TQ)
--94 & 95 5-spd truck rated 185 bhp (420 ft-lbs TQ)
--96 - 98 AT truck rated 185 bhp (420 ft-lbs TQ)
--96 - 98 5-spd truck rated 215 bhp (440 ft-lbs TQ)

Interesting note; little know fact of these industrial diesels is that these ratings, unlike an automobile engine are NOT "Peak" HP & Torque. This rating is for "Constant" HP & Torque, meaning the engine was designed to operate, 24/7 for the life cycle of the engine at this rating. Life cycles varied, I believe with the 5.9L it was 5000 hours.

Automobile engines are designed to operate only at thes levels for brief periods of time at those advertised rating (like seconds or maybe a few minuites), as the vast majority of the time, they are running at far less, maybe 30% of thier rating.

This is how a old-school diesel got the reputation for being so durable, it really wasn't working that hard in a pickup. With people doing modifications and upping the HP & Torque well past the factory specs, longevity and service life will suffer.

[Gravel Rat]

The most fuel efficient truck was a 2wd boxy Dodge with the 160hp and a tall axle ratio.

The older 12 valves were not high revvers either anything past 2 grand there wasn't much there.

This was the fuel mileage truck and notice the sound is quieter on the rotary pump cummins.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=lHCRiazDnvM