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View Full Version : SCAG vs BOBCAT review by owner


supercuts
11-27-2009, 07:08 PM
i posted this before "scag vs bobcat my take" when i first bought my scag tt29efi kawi, 61" Velocity mower. i had only run/used bobcat up until that time. i love my bobcats and have had many. at first i really hated the scag and didnt know what the hype was about. now that ive completed my first season with it, here is my take with 400hrs on it.

to start, why i love the bobcat. predator pro 61" 33hp generac

bobcat pros
its very compact. much shorter than the Turf Tiger (TT) so uses much less trailer space. it has the same 16cc hydro drive pumps as the scag. feels like a sports car vs the scag which feels more like a dump truck. much less tail swing. stable on hills. great cut. easy to reach/fill fuel tanks. very easy deck height adjustments. very easy foot lift peddal to raise deck/deck feels light. fast in forward and reverse speed. great power. front deck antiscalp wheels place much better than scag and you can get much closer to objects like trees.

bobcat cons
sticks can throw belts off when they jab up under the mower. it only happens once or twice a year, but its a real pain to get the mower to the trailer to get one wheel up on the ramp to work under it adn fit your hands under..bla bla bla. spins tires easy. seat height is high

scag pros
cuts nice. throws grass better than bobcat. orginally i said the velocity deck clumped alot. it had a bagger so it had the shroud under the deck for the bagger which collected wet grass. once i had the right one on, it was great. holds hills the same as the bobcat. handled bumpy lawns better than the bobcat. the drive wheels seemed to almost have a delay unlike the bobcat which is very easy to spin the tires. low center of gravity fuel tank below the seat. very low seat compared to the bobcat-great for reaching under trees. great speed, forward and reverse.

scag cons
very difficult to adjust height compared to bobcat. deck is very heavy heavy on foot peddal. fuel fill is in a bad place and angled towards the battery( why not angle it forward so you can dump a can of gas in it without flipping the seat?). scag is very heavy and to me overbuilt. lets say the task is moving a lawn mower. a ford ranger would work. you dont need a ford superduty dually king ranch powerstoke diesel. to me, the scag is overkill like the superduty. weight may contribute, front caster yolks bend easily from curb hopping. front center deck anti-scap wheels stick out very far and you cant close to trees/bushes, etc compared to bobcat

in conclusion, i love my bobcats. the scag really grew on me to the point that it really comes down to prefference and price. the bobcats are so much cheaper, id have to buy more bobcats over scag. MSRP on the same TT is $14k, i can get the same bobcat predator pro with the 33hp for $7200, thats amost 1/2 the price. the scag has grown on me enough to where i really like using it. they guys didnt like it so i used it and now i have a hard time getting back on teh bobcat but mostly because the key and trottle is on the other side.

id love to hear comments and answer question so fire away

grassman177
11-27-2009, 07:57 PM
great, thanks

HenryB
11-27-2009, 08:01 PM
Sounds like the review on the Lawn-Advisor.com. I agree about the Scag being too long. Great review it's nice to get it from someone who owns both.

MileHigh
11-27-2009, 08:11 PM
After demoing the TT....I really don't like the machine.

Feels like a complete SLUG compared to my Lazer.

Good Review....I like what I hear about the Bobcat brand.

SNAPPER MAN
11-27-2009, 09:11 PM
Good review man. People either love or hate the scags. Me personally, I love em. I have a turf tiger and I love how big it is because it rides better and cuts incredible. To each is own. If we all liked the same thing there wouldn't be so many different mower brands.

HenryB
11-27-2009, 09:18 PM
We demoed a Turf Tiger I thought it was OK my guys hated it. The only time they ever asked me to please not buy a piece of equipment. I don't know why there soo much either. Their WB's are archaic. Their still using 1980's tech.

Hoy landscaping
11-27-2009, 09:36 PM
i love my TT. best investment i made

MONTE
11-27-2009, 10:27 PM
Bobcat Predator pro's are $9500+ around here! Still cheaper than the scag and I actually like the quickness of the bobcat a lot like a older chopper.

W.L.M.
11-28-2009, 01:33 AM
We demoed a Turf Tiger I thought it was OK my guys hated it. The only time they ever asked me to please not buy a piece of equipment. I don't know why there soo much either. Their WB's are archaic. Their still using 1980's tech.

Thats true that their designs are from the 80's, but he we are in 2010 (soon anyway) and those designs are no different to any other comparable machine. Those "archaic" (as you refer to them) designs set the industry standards back then and is what made commercial mowers what they are today. A walk behind is a walk behind and there isnt going to be much changing.

As for the original topic, I would agree with you that the TT is overbuilt but that is why you will see 10+ year old scags still out there working, I may be biased but I would be willing to bet that these cheap bobcat mowers wont be out making you any money in 10 or even 5 years from now.

Hoy landscaping
11-28-2009, 08:46 AM
i always see parts bobcats, and used scags for sale. and the scags are a little broken in, but they all cut like new.

ruffs
11-28-2009, 09:59 AM
I own both a bobcat 48 and a scag 61. both are wb . So i can compare zts but i can say this . when i bought the scag i wasnt impresed with the cut the bobcat dispursed the clipping much better and after the intital cut the bobcat lawns looked better. But if you see the scag lawn the next day or so it seems the get better ,and when I return to cut the scag lawn is even and looks cut just longer. The bobcat is stringy and uneven in comparision.

JCLawn and more
11-28-2009, 10:11 AM
As for the original topic, I would agree with you that the TT is overbuilt but that is why you will see 10+ year old scags still out there working, I may be biased but I would be willing to bet that these cheap bobcat mowers wont be out making you any money in 10 or even 5 years from now.

depends on how you take care of things. No one would guess that my toro residential zero turn that is 6 years old with a stamped deck would still be mowing, now commercially for a year. Its on its second motor which had about 700 hrs on it when it died and has about 1000hrs on the hydrogear cheapy transmission that the fluid has never been changed or checked(because you have to take it all apart to do so)(will be done this winter). The stamped deck has been welded and rewelded. Its has survived pretty well.

supercuts
11-28-2009, 10:21 AM
As for the original topic, I would agree with you that the TT is overbuilt but that is why you will see 10+ year old scags still out there working, I may be biased but I would be willing to bet that these cheap bobcat mowers wont be out making you any money in 10 or even 5 years from now.

ive had 10 year old bobcats, it had 3000+hrs and still ran fine. that was what was wrong with it, it was old. the seat was ripped, and it may have need a pulley or two. the only problem the bobcats have is the decks wear out. mine was on original pumps, engine, even the pto!

mine now are is an 05' with 1700hrs and an 06 with 1400hrs. still work great, just need baths.

ruffs
11-28-2009, 01:00 PM
dont run the blabes over pavment and suck up all the stones will make your deck last a lot longer i see ppl blowing off the road with the mower sand blastasting there decks.

W.L.M.
11-28-2009, 01:09 PM
ive had 10 year old bobcats, it had 3000+hrs and still ran fine. that was what was wrong with it, it was old. the seat was ripped, and it may have need a pulley or two. the only problem the bobcats have is the decks wear out. mine was on original pumps, engine, even the pto!

mine now are is an 05' with 1700hrs and an 06 with 1400hrs. still work great, just need baths.

I am not going to start an argument with you here but these new bobcats that they are selling at the $7000 price mark are looking cheaper and cheaper every year this year in particular. The old classic bobcats looked decent but when I saw the 09's at the dealer they looked liked they belonged at home depot. I would have serious doubts on the longevity on their new models just my $.02 Run bobcats in a large company with employees beating on them and they aren't going to last half as long as the scag. Bobcat and scag are just 2 different machines with a different purpose.

pugs
11-28-2009, 01:42 PM
I am not going to start an argument with you here but these new bobcats that they are selling at the $7000 price mark are looking cheaper and cheaper every year this year in particular. The old classic bobcats looked decent but when I saw the 09's at the dealer they looked liked they belonged at home depot. I would have serious doubts on the longevity on their new models just my $.02 Run bobcats in a large company with employees beating on them and they aren't going to last half as long as the scag. Bobcat and scag are just 2 different machines with a different purpose.

Exactly how do you come to that conclusion? Very little has changed on the Bobcats in 10+ years....

W.L.M.
11-28-2009, 02:46 PM
Exactly how do you come to that conclusion? Very little has changed on the Bobcats in 10+ years....

The only machines that I looked at in depth are the walk behinds which have gone through many changes. Like I said I dont want to argue with anyone, if you truly believe that the bobcats will last as long as the scags and still be productive there is nothing I am going to be able to do to change your mind. I just couldn't disagree more.

pugs
11-28-2009, 03:05 PM
The only machines that I looked at in depth are the walk behinds which have gone through many changes. Like I said I dont want to argue with anyone, if you truly believe that the bobcats will last as long as the scags and still be productive there is nothing I am going to be able to do to change your mind. I just couldn't disagree more.

Oh well this thread is about ZTR's. You may want to elaborate.

The last generation of their gear drive walkbehinds was great but the problem was they were too expensive and people were just going to other brands to save a few hundred bucks. I am talking about the ones with the 16" rear tires, spring loaded belt tensioners on all 3 belts. The new ones are basically back to 13" tires, single deck belt instead of seperate PTO and deck belts, no spring loaded idler on the trans belt. One thing I do like is they ditched the "fancy" operator presence system they had been using in favor of the older style. The machine is cheaper than the last version but will have no problem in the longevity department.

Look at Scag, they have a cheap walkebehind out now....now that thing is pretty junky to say the least. They stole the operator presence system from Lesco/Cub walkbehinds....and actually made it cheaper. Doesnt have the sloped front deck on it either. Only nice feature is its either a floating deck or a quick height adjust on the deck...but overall a very cheap looking machine.

JCLawn and more
11-28-2009, 03:08 PM
how would you say both companies would stack up against bad boy? I can't find a better priced company for what you get. $6500 for a 30hp brigs or $7100 for the 31hp Kawasaki 60inch cut that will do 10mph with a 14.5 gallon fuel tank, 1/4 steel deck, 2 10cc pumps, hydraulic filters on each pump, and electric lift instead of manual. Seams like a good deal. How is that compared to scag or bob cat?

supercuts
11-28-2009, 03:44 PM
I am not going to start an argument with you here but these new bobcats that they are selling at the $7000 price mark are looking cheaper and cheaper every year this year in particular. The old classic bobcats looked decent but when I saw the 09's at the dealer they looked liked they belonged at home depot. I would have serious doubts on the longevity on their new models just my $.02 Run bobcats in a large company with employees beating on them and they aren't going to last half as long as the scag. Bobcat and scag are just 2 different machines with a different purpose.

you are correct that some of their new stuff looks cheap like that new homeowner/commerical model, but the ZT seriers, now procat and predator pros have are vurtually unchanged with the exception being they fixed some of the weak links. to each their own. the new TT are $14,500mrsp, maybe around $12k from teh dealer, the bobcat predator pro lists at $11500 and most dealers sell around $9000 but ive found it at $7200. so, realistic prices, that still a $5000 difference. i really like both mowers now, but at a $5k differnence, im sticking with a bobcat simply for price over all else

supercuts
11-28-2009, 03:48 PM
one last diffence between the two is the scag hands down wins in the clean dept. i cant keep my bobcat clean to save my life. the decks get stained easily. the scag with that sloping front deck seem to really keep the "bad stuff" off the mower. that includes the small wheel wells over the rear tires as well. my bobcats throw lots of mud up and it gets all over the fuel tanks much worse than the scag

W.L.M.
11-29-2009, 12:34 AM
Oh well this thread is about ZTR's. You may want to elaborate.

The last generation of their gear drive walkbehinds was great but the problem was they were too expensive and people were just going to other brands to save a few hundred bucks. I am talking about the ones with the 16" rear tires, spring loaded belt tensioners on all 3 belts. The new ones are basically back to 13" tires, single deck belt instead of seperate PTO and deck belts, no spring loaded idler on the trans belt. One thing I do like is they ditched the "fancy" operator presence system they had been using in favor of the older style. The machine is cheaper than the last version but will have no problem in the longevity department.

Look at Scag, they have a cheap walkebehind out now....now that thing is pretty junky to say the least. They stole the operator presence system from Lesco/Cub walkbehinds....and actually made it cheaper. Doesnt have the sloped front deck on it either. Only nice feature is its either a floating deck or a quick height adjust on the deck...but overall a very cheap looking machine.

I agree that sfw scag looks terrible, the downgraded tranny and single width drive belts are enough to turn me away.

puppypaws
11-29-2009, 08:43 PM
i posted this before "scag vs bobcat my take" when i first bought my scag tt29efi kawi, 61" Velocity mower. i had only run/used bobcat up until that time. i love my bobcats and have had many. at first i really hated the scag and didnt know what the hype was about. now that ive completed my first season with it, here is my take with 400hrs on it.

to start, why i love the bobcat. predator pro 61" 33hp generac

bobcat pros
its very compact. much shorter than the Turf Tiger (TT) so uses much less trailer space. it has the same 16cc hydro drive pumps as the scag. feels like a sports car vs the scag which feels more like a dump truck. much less tail swing. stable on hills. great cut. easy to reach/fill fuel tanks. very easy deck height adjustments. very easy foot lift peddal to raise deck/deck feels light. fast in forward and reverse speed. great power. front deck antiscalp wheels place much better than scag and you can get much closer to objects like trees.

bobcat cons
sticks can throw belts off when they jab up under the mower. it only happens once or twice a year, but its a real pain to get the mower to the trailer to get one wheel up on the ramp to work under it adn fit your hands under..bla bla bla. spins tires easy. seat height is high

scag pros
cuts nice. throws grass better than bobcat. orginally i said the velocity deck clumped alot. it had a bagger so it had the shroud under the deck for the bagger which collected wet grass. once i had the right one on, it was great. holds hills the same as the bobcat. handled bumpy lawns better than the bobcat. the drive wheels seemed to almost have a delay unlike the bobcat which is very easy to spin the tires. low center of gravity fuel tank below the seat. very low seat compared to the bobcat-great for reaching under trees. great speed, forward and reverse.

scag cons
very difficult to adjust height compared to bobcat. deck is very heavy heavy on foot peddal. fuel fill is in a bad place and angled towards the battery( why not angle it forward so you can dump a can of gas in it without flipping the seat?). scag is very heavy and to me overbuilt. lets say the task is moving a lawn mower. a ford ranger would work. you dont need a ford superduty dually king ranch powerstoke diesel. to me, the scag is overkill like the superduty. weight may contribute, front caster yolks bend easily from curb hopping. front center deck anti-scap wheels stick out very far and you cant close to trees/bushes, etc compared to bobcat

in conclusion, i love my bobcats. the scag really grew on me to the point that it really comes down to prefference and price. the bobcats are so much cheaper, id have to buy more bobcats over scag. MSRP on the same TT is $14k, i can get the same bobcat predator pro with the 33hp for $7200, thats amost 1/2 the price. the scag has grown on me enough to where i really like using it. they guys didnt like it so i used it and now i have a hard time getting back on teh bobcat but mostly because the key and trottle is on the other side.

id love to hear comments and answer question so fire away

I don't think you mentioned the 33 Generac is much more powerful that the 29 DFI Kawi, nor that the 33 Generac on the Predator Pro will cut much more grass in a days time due to power, speed and maneuverability.

W.L.M.
11-29-2009, 09:31 PM
I don't think you mentioned the 33 Generac is much more powerful that the 29 DFI Kawi, nor that the 33 Generac on the Predator Pro will cut much more grass in a days time due to power, speed and maneuverability.

Well he more than likely didn't want to compare apples to oranges. Compare the 33 generac vs the 35 briggs big block on the scag and it becomes a fair comparison. The 35hp turf tigers sell for 10-11 right now. Better just have a trailer full of gas cans to keep the thing cutting for the day.

supercuts
11-30-2009, 07:23 AM
I don't think you mentioned the 33 Generac is much more powerful that the 29 DFI Kawi, nor that the 33 Generac on the Predator Pro will cut much more grass in a days time due to power, speed and maneuverability.

i didnt touch the power thing simply because you can get different engines on each and it was more about how the machine worked with features. but since you brought it up, the 33 outpowers the 29 noticably but the 29hp does its job just fine. i cant cut 8" tall turf as quick but how ofthen are you really doing that. they both use about the same fuel after a days use.

puppypaws
11-30-2009, 07:37 AM
Well he more than likely didn't want to compare apples to oranges. Compare the 33 generac vs the 35 briggs big block on the scag and it becomes a fair comparison. The 35hp turf tigers sell for 10-11 right now. Better just have a trailer full of gas cans to keep the thing cutting for the day.

All the information I've seen posted; the 35 Vanguard runs in the 1.5 to 1.6 gph range. "Tacoma" runs a 31 and 35 Vanguard on 61" TT's and that is the numbers he comes up with constantly, I've seen other's post the same.

The difference, which I honestly don't understand; is the speed on a Predator Pro. The PP with a 37 Kawi ( that is the one that drinks gas), is listed as a 12.4 mph machine, while the PP with a 33 Generac is listed at 13.5 mph.

i didnt touch the power thing simply because you can get different engines on each and it was more about how the machine worked with features. but since you brought it up, the 33 outpowers the 29 noticably but the 29hp does its job just fine. i cant cut 8" tall turf as quick but how ofthen are you really doing that. they both use about the same fuel after a days use.

Saying the 29 DFI Kawi uses about the same fuel as the 33 Generac in a days cutting is very interesting, the 33 Generac must be very good on fuel for a big block engine.

supercuts
11-30-2009, 12:42 PM
All the information I've seen posted; the 35 Vanguard runs in the 1.5 to 1.6 gph range. "Tacoma" runs a 31 and 35 Vanguard on 61" TT's and that is the numbers he comes up with constantly, I've seen other's post the same.

The difference, which I honestly don't understand; is the speed on a Predator Pro. The PP with a 37 Kawi ( that is the one that drinks gas), is listed as a 12.4 mph machine, while the PP with a 33 Generac is listed at 13.5 mph.



Saying the 29 DFI Kawi uses about the same fuel as the 33 Generac in a days cutting is very interesting, the 33 Generac must be very good on fuel for a big block engine.

my 25 kawi gets slightly better gph than the 29 efi and 33 generac. ive never tried to figure an honest gph, its simply noticed on a day to day basis filling them. the mowers run nearly identical times each day and i fill them each morning.

JCLawn and more
11-30-2009, 08:34 PM
you do know that the gph has a lot of variables than just engine size. It all depends on how hard the engine is working. If you mow at 12mph over 3inch grass over 6inch grass your gph will be very different. The gph can be effected by the size of oil pumps, oil weight, weight of machine, size of blades, high lift blades V mulch blades, blade speed, size of wheels, type of tread, ect... There is a lot that plays in. Unless you unhook the motor and run it at working rpm you really don't know the true gph.

puppypaws
11-30-2009, 09:39 PM
you do know that the gph has a lot of variables than just engine size. It all depends on how hard the engine is working. If you mow at 12mph over 3inch grass over 6inch grass your gph will be very different. The gph can be effected by the size of oil pumps, oil weight, weight of machine, size of blades, high lift blades V mulch blades, blade speed, size of wheels, type of tread, ect... There is a lot that plays in. Unless you unhook the motor and run it at working rpm you really don't know the true gph.

This is very true, there can be many variables, that is the reason when you have a professional running a 31 and 35 hp Vanguard on the same mower (61" TT) averaging the same fuel usage day in and day out mowing in different conditions, I would say that is probably accurate information. This was quoted as average day in and day out fuel usage, I feel assured there are higher periods along with lower gph fuel usage days. These are the numbers quoted by several people using big block Vanguards in this forum, maybe some of them will see this thread and give their thoughts.

When the gentleman spoke of his 33 Generac and 29 DFI Kawasaki using very close to the same amount of fuel in a days cutting, this is actually very amazing. This means the 33 Generac is getting very good fuel economy or the fuel injected Kawasaki is getting very poor fuel economy.

supercuts
12-01-2009, 06:21 AM
again, my method is simply keep track of how much fuel i put in each mower each morning. after a typical 8 hr day each mower will take about 6gals of fuel. when i fill my cans at the gas station i purposely put exactly 5gals in each can. when filling in have to guestimate how much of the 2nd 5gal can im puring in but my number shouldnt be off by much. since i got the 29 dfi i thought it was scam about the fuel saving because i really dont notice it. i also think my 25 kawi has to work extra hard to keep up thus using more fuel than say just a typical free rev and that machine has much smaller drive pumps. all mowers are a 61" cut

puppypaws
12-01-2009, 10:04 AM
again, my method is simply keep track of how much fuel i put in each mower each morning. after a typical 8 hr day each mower will take about 6gals of fuel. when i fill my cans at the gas station i purposely put exactly 5gals in each can. when filling in have to guestimate how much of the 2nd 5gal can im puring in but my number shouldnt be off by much. since i got the 29 dfi i thought it was scam about the fuel saving because i really dont notice it. i also think my 25 kawi has to work extra hard to keep up thus using more fuel than say just a typical free rev and that machine has much smaller drive pumps. all mowers are a 61" cut

I believe this makes a great deal of difference, people speak of running lower hp engines to save fuel when in all reality this can backfire. A smaller hp engine that keeps the governor activating because of heavy cutting can sometimes use more fuel than a larger engine that never calls on the governor in the same cutting conditions.

I've seen people post in this forum where their 27 hp Kohler engine was burning as much fuel as the big block Vanguard's and Generac's.

The Kawasaki big block engines (34-37 hp) use a tremendous amount of fuel, their governors are extremely sensitive. I've run a 37 hp Kawi in the same grass as a 32 Vanguard on the same mower and deck. The Vanguard never changed sounds, while the Kawasaki was constantly calling on the governor.

I spoke with Kawasaki about this problem and told them exactly what I experienced, they said Kawasaki was in the process of fuel injecting a large number of their engines. They also said there was a new "E-Choke" being installed on some of their engines, the "E-Choke" works electronically by sensing the exact amount of fuel needed for that particular load at that exact second. This would help a great deal over a mechanical governor which only knows if the engine is coming under a load (no matter heavy or light), it always throws the max amount of fuel to the engine. The "E-Choke" will sense ahead of time and only put the amount of fuel into the engine it needs to handle that particular load at that exact moment. It would appear this could make a great deal of difference in fuel economy on a carburetor type engine.

HenryB
12-01-2009, 11:39 AM
Thats good news Puppypaws, the Kawy 37 hp is an awful engine. Well over 2 gph and the governor is always activated.. Loud as well. Oil turns black after 10 hours between changes. I cannot believe Kawy put these POS out there. I've run two different 37 Kawy's for almust 600hrs. I cannot say enough good things about the Generac and Vanguard Big Bocks.

JCLawn and more
12-01-2009, 04:56 PM
personally I think a smaller engine no matter what gets good gph. My 17.5 brigs uses in the range of 0.7 gph. it can use as much a 1.2-1.4 in very high grass. That's about stalling the engine the whole time. I think this is because everything is smaller. Less cc's, less weight, and less power. This is a residential zero turn, but still. top speed of 6 mph and and 42inch deck.

supercuts
12-01-2009, 10:26 PM
personally I think a smaller engine no matter what gets good gph. My 17.5 brigs uses in the range of 0.7 gph. it can use as much a 1.2-1.4 in very high grass. That's about stalling the engine the whole time. I think this is because everything is smaller. Less cc's, less weight, and less power. This is a residential zero turn, but still. top speed of 6 mph and and 42inch deck.

well your not comparing apples to apples. the way i see what you've told me is your using a mowerthat goes half the speed of mine. so lets say, to start, that it will take you twice as long. we'll also take the average of your .7-1.4 gph, and call it 1gph. if it takes you twice as long to do the same job, your now at 2gph. then factor in my mower cuts 18" more per pass which is just under 50% more area over your mower. see where im going. if your worried about fuel consumption, youve not only taken more time to cut the same size lawn, but your also using more fuel at the same lawn then me. if you were idling next to me, you'd win. but i think were using less fuel in real world aplications

puppypaws
12-02-2009, 07:37 AM
well your not comparing apples to apples. the way i see what you've told me is your using a mowerthat goes half the speed of mine. so lets say, to start, that it will take you twice as long. we'll also take the average of your .7-1.4 gph, and call it 1gph. if it takes you twice as long to do the same job, your now at 2gph. then factor in my mower cuts 18" more per pass which is just under 50% more area over your mower. see where im going. if your worried about fuel consumption, youve not only taken more time to cut the same size lawn, but your also using more fuel at the same lawn then me. if you were idling next to me, you'd win. but i think were using less fuel in real world aplications

Those are the type things you must look at, there is another thing involved as well, once you get use to speed and power you will never go back. It would be like going from driving a new Shelby GT Mustang to a Toyota Prius.

JCLawn and more
12-02-2009, 04:30 PM
lol! Liked the last. I know the comparison was are not even close, but my point was that a smaller engine will use less gas. My profit per hour is way less and was not my point. My point was that while your mower uses around 2gph mine can use no more than 1.4gph. So at my 1.4 gph your mower would be somewhere at around 4gph. I said my engine was about stalling to get that from the load of about 4 feet of grass. My engine under normal conditions uses about .7gph. I don't use a 42inch residential mower because of fuel, shoot I want a 60inch badboy pup with 30hp. Fuel is not a issue for me.

Yater
12-02-2009, 05:09 PM
Fuel is not a issue for me.

Exactly. Plus, mowers and tractors are fun toys...just like trucks. The fact that they make you money is nice too.

JCLawn and more
12-02-2009, 05:55 PM
Like this tractor :drinkup:

supercuts
08-05-2010, 09:13 PM
was thinking about this the other day as i got stuck on the scag.....one thing i really hate on the scag is how long the tailswing is and how easy it gets hung up on things. i drove across a side walk that was sunk down a bit and the rear tires lifted off the ground and i was stuck on the back tail plate. same thing when i was going up a curb at a 90 degree angle up a hill. same thing, tires off the ground just enough not to touch.

on the flip side, the belts are easily accessable at any time on the rear. when the drive belt is thrown off by a stick on the bobcat.....you have to release the pumps, drag the thing back to the trailer, get one tire on the ramp, the other on the ground, try to reach up in there while its 200 degrees and buring your hand while lying on the ground.

the bobcat is more bumpy. the scag is very heavy. i also really like the dual tanks on the bobcat. when one take runs dry you know your at your midway point. the scag your relying on that unreadable gage with the arrow bouncing all over.

ga sportsman
08-06-2010, 12:14 AM
I've never owned either of these two in this comparison, but I have to say that the Bobcat mowers MUST be pretty good......I work in Locust Grove, Ga and the city uses Bobcat ZTR's to cut the Municipal Bldg and along side the roads and all. The way those guys treat those mowers is unbelievable. The fact that they last more than a month is amazing. And they've been using them for a few years now.

Bagit
09-23-2010, 01:01 PM
When I was in North Wilkesboro Carolina (in the mountains) on vacation, I saw ALOT of Bobcat Ztr's on trailers.

They must hold a hill pretty good.

supercuts
09-23-2010, 06:20 PM
IMO they both do....when the scag brakes free on a slope it kind of turns down the hill, the bobcat slides sideways. i think the "breakaway point" is the same on them.

SouthSide Cutter
09-23-2010, 08:46 PM
I had both this spring a 29hp TT and a 27hp Procat. Is the Bobcat built like a TT NO. Will it last longer than A TT NO. The Bobcat was a buy 5000 less than my TT. Cut great in reg and dry grass. Clumped in heavy grass and real bad in wet grass. Worked on the deck, took out the right side baffle which seemed to help. But we had to double cut everything or use the TT. Wife said it had to go, so we traded it on a TC 61"
They are a good machine for the money short coupled, fast and have a pretty good ride. Thought the controls were a bit touchie and needed stronger dampers on them.
I wont buy anything but Scag from now on dont care what the difference in price is.

supercuts
09-24-2010, 08:56 AM
Wife said it had to go, so we traded it on a TC 61"
They are a good machine for the money short coupled, fast and have a pretty good ride. Thought the controls were a bit touchie and needed stronger dampers on them.
I wont buy anything but Scag from now on dont care what the difference in price is.

after putting bobcat blades on the scag and loving it, ive also been thinking about putting scag damper on the bobcat. i might swap them to see if its worth the investment.

Bagit
09-24-2010, 05:26 PM
Need to hear from more Bobcat users. What's up with the 'wet grass' issue? Doesn't the Pro-cat have the 'versa-deck'?

Pennington Lawncare
09-24-2010, 06:18 PM
My Predator Pro has the Dura-deck and for most of the summer I had been running it with the front baffle completely removed. With the baffle removed it disperses the clippings better and the engine isn't loaded nearly as much since the grass isn't trapped in that confined space and is forced to chew the wet or heavy grass over and over.

I did have some grass clumps drop down from the deck and didn't get blown out the discharge very well. I did start using Gator blades and they helped a lot with the front baffle removed to further chop up the clippings and I was pretty happy with the result for most of the summer.

Now that the weather has dried up and the grass slowing I just put the front baffle back on and the quality of cut is better and there is next to no blowout on the front of the deck. With the baffle removed it was blowing out some but, not too annoyingly.

With the baffle in place the deck discharges a very concentrated stream of grass and throws the grass 2 widths of the deck or more away. The discharged clippings tend to cover up where you just mowed and lessens the striping. With the baffle removed, the clippings come out of the discharge chute in all different angles but, not quite as forcefully as when the baffle is installed. Heavy clippings are made less noticeable with the baffle removed and using Gator blades. Now that the grass has slowed I prefer the quality cut with the baffle installed and still using Gator blades. I don't think I'll run anything but, Gator blades from now on.

The Gator blades I started using were Oregon Part # 96-702 and they hold an edge very well and I think I'm going to try some of the even tougher G6 version # 396-702.

Bagit
09-24-2010, 07:08 PM
Thanks Pennington. How are the spindles holding up? Any issues with the Predator Pro?

Anybody using the mulch kit on the Bobcats? I'm still on the fence about the decks performance in wet grass.

Pennington Lawncare
09-24-2010, 07:18 PM
Thanks Pennington. How are the spindles holding up? Any issues with the Predator Pro?

Anybody using the mulch kit on the Bobcats? I'm still on the fence about the decks performance in wet grass.

The sealed bearing spindles have all been replaced on my deck and I only have around 300 hours. I have cut taller grass than I would have liked and at this point I think I would prefer greasable bearings for my spindles.

I don't know what else is involved for a mulch kit. I have looked under a few Scag TT decks and they didn't have that baffle / mulch kit in front of the deck that outlined the blades so that gave me the idea to remove the one on my deck.

supercuts
09-24-2010, 08:10 PM
Thanks Pennington. How are the spindles holding up? Any issues with the Predator Pro?

Anybody using the mulch kit on the Bobcats? I'm still on the fence about the decks performance in wet grass.

ive got almost 1900hrs on both bobcats, i think ive replaced one spindle on the older machine (04').

my bobcat throws the grass one pass away while my TT throws the grass 2 passes. ive never removed the baffle on the bobcat. my scag came with a bagger and i cut the "bottom" off the front baffle for a world of difference with wet grass.

Chevy z71
09-24-2010, 09:28 PM
Thats true that their designs are from the 80's, but he we are in 2010 (soon anyway) and those designs are no different to any other comparable machine. Those "archaic" (as you refer to them) designs set the industry standards back then and is what made commercial mowers what they are today. A walk behind is a walk behind and there isnt going to be much changing.

As for the original topic, I would agree with you that the TT is overbuilt but that is why you will see 10+ year old scags still out there working, I may be biased but I would be willing to bet that these cheap bobcat mowers wont be out making you any money in 10 or even 5 years from now.

scag power babby made in the usa:usflag::usflag::usflag::usflag:

pugs
09-27-2010, 05:44 PM
I have seen very few issues with Bobcat spindles. Have tons of walkbehinds out and some ZTR's. Replaced spindles on one ZTR under warranty but the customer was pressure washing it right after mowing while the spindles were hot.

Only other ones that I have replaced have been due to hitting large imovable objects and cracking the housing.

I replace far more Wright spindles than Bobcats for some reason. Seems like the bearings in the Wrights would be better but I guess not...

Johnny test
09-27-2010, 05:59 PM
Let's see Scag's definitely in the top 5 commercial mowers of all time, and Bobcat? Who are they? They make skid steers right?:rolleyes:

I love it how all the underdog's like to try and compare themselves to Scag with the hope that some of the awesome will rub off on them....Poor Scag...

mowandblow1980
09-27-2010, 06:08 PM
Id hardly call Bob-cat an underdog. They might not get a lot of attention on here but there very reliable machines. Think at the end of the day its whatever you prefer cutting with. Just because they're priced lower than scag and exmark doesnt make them cheap machines.

supercuts
09-27-2010, 09:02 PM
[QUOTE=Johnny test;3735989]Let's see Scag's definitely in the top 5 commercial mowers of all time, and Bobcat? Who are they? They make skid steers right?:rolleyes:

QUOTE]

which brand was out first? bobcat. who was it made by? Dane Scag.
who also designed the scag? Dane Scag after he sold out bobcat. obviously he took his orginal idea and improved. im not saying if the two mowers were infront of me and i had to choose i would grab the scag. but considering simply factors like price, i think ill pay the $9k for a bobcat over the $12k for a TT. 3/4 of the scag price is a huge difference. for the record, my bobcats are an 04' zt 225 and 06' predator pro and have over 1900hrs each. the 5 year mark isnt hard to acheive like WLM implied.

Johnny test
09-27-2010, 09:16 PM
I don't know why you would care to quote the words that come out of my hands... I couldn't care less about your bobcat...You include me in your convos like me and you are having some sort of discussion about bobcats...
All that gibberish in your post about some guy with the last name Scag and some $$ signs is a little more than I needed to know...I don't even know what a bobcat is....am I supposed to?

I do notice that this whole thread consists of apparent Bobcat owners.. So maybe you should turn around and post a comment to another one of your fellow bobcat worshipers and post to him about some comfortable seats or some sh*t....Go figure...

evergreen70
09-28-2010, 12:40 AM
I cut near Niagara Falls Canada and have seen both Scag and Bobcat used extensively in this area.Not a lot of dealers around but the cities and big operators seem to use a lot of the Bobcats probably due to lower initial price.The Scag is a heavy well built machine and im sure may last a little longer but probably not long enough to justify the price difference.I run a Kubota Zg227 with a 60 inch deck and its built like a tank.cuts good and the dealer treats me right,most important thing as far as i'm concerned.does anyone out there use the kubota ?I would be interested on any feedback good or bad.

supercuts
06-23-2011, 06:50 PM
its been a while since my review but I recently bought a 2nd turf tiger and thought id update since there are still a few things I hate about both.

I dont want you to think this is a scag bashing post because I did switch from bobcats to TT's

I cannot stand the blade bolts going all the way through the spindle and trying to reach around to put the nut on top.....drives me crazy. the bobcat bolts threads right into the spindle from teh bottom, simple and quick with the impact. I also cant stand the greasable front wheels on the scag. everyone I know goes through bearings like crazy. my bobcat never ever needed any wheel bearings and were sealed with no grease fittings....much nicer. I also wish the fuel tube on the scag was pointed more towards the side or front rather than towards the back near the roll bar. its hard to dump a gas can straight in without a funnel. I also dont like the roll bar and im worried to take it off since it came with it. the bobcat doesnt have one. Ive almost rolled my turf tiger about 4 times in the first week with the new one because it got caught on trees and telephone guide wires etc. I was damaging trees and bushes trying to fit under too since many of our residential lawns have mature trees and the owners dont like them limbed up. took the ROPS off after 2 weeks, couldnt take it anymore.

again, I love both machines. Ive been running the 06' TT and fell in love with it. When it came time to retire one of the bobcats out, it was a tough call. but the scag does throw grass much nicer and clumps alot less saving time without doulble cutting or blowing out clippings. I love the 35HP briggs, great engine. I did blow a hydro line with only 50hrs on the new machine though....not too happy but a quick fix. there is very little price difference between the two now as well. one of the reasons I was buying the bobcats is because they were cheaper. not so anymore with the predator pro. the 37hp DFI kawi is $10,500 and $9900 for the 33hp generac (I prefer & great engine) the scag was $10,500 with the briggs and I got a first time new scag buyer discount as well making it cheaper then the bobcat

if i think of more ill chime in again

SouthSide Cutter
06-23-2011, 07:14 PM
I like the the bolt going all the way thru. Dont have to get under the mower. And I had both mowers. Just reach under and hit with impact on top. Also took the rops off because of trees. Had to get rid of the BobCat because of the clumping issue in heavy and wet grass. If my wife can tell the difference that ought to tell you something.

puppypaws
06-23-2011, 08:51 PM
its been a while since my review but I recently bought a 2nd turf tiger and thought id update since there are still a few things I hate about both.

I dont want you to think this is a scag bashing post because I did switch from bobcats to TT's

I cannot stand the blade bolts going all the way through the spindle and trying to reach around to put the nut on top.....drives me crazy. the bobcat bolts threads right into the spindle from teh bottom, simple and quick with the impact. I also cant stand the greasable front wheels on the scag. everyone I know goes through bearings like crazy. my bobcat never ever needed any wheel bearings and were sealed with no grease fittings....much nicer. I also wish the fuel tube on the scag was pointed more towards the side or front rather than towards the back near the roll bar. its hard to dump a gas can straight in without a funnel. I also dont like the roll bar and im worried to take it off since it came with it. the bobcat doesnt have one. Ive almost rolled my turf tiger about 4 times in the first week with the new one because it got caught on trees and telephone guide wires etc. I was damaging trees and bushes trying to fit under too since many of our residential lawns have mature trees and the owners dont like them limbed up. took the ROPS off after 2 weeks, couldnt take it anymore.

again, I love both machines. Ive been running the 06' TT and fell in love with it. When it came time to retire one of the bobcats out, it was a tough call. but the scag does throw grass much nicer and clumps alot less saving time without doulble cutting or blowing out clippings. I love the 35HP briggs, great engine. I did blow a hydro line with only 50hrs on the new machine though....not too happy but a quick fix. there is very little price difference between the two now as well. one of the reasons I was buying the bobcats is because they were cheaper. not so anymore with the predator pro. the 37hp DFI kawi is $10,500 and $9900 for the 33hp generac (I prefer & great engine) the scag was $10,500 with the briggs and I got a first time new scag buyer discount as well making it cheaper then the bobcat

if i think of more ill chime in again

The 35 Vanguard and 33 Generac are the most powerful engines on the ZTR mower market today. The 37 Kawasaki just can't hang with either of these engines, it should, but for some reason will not. I've tried everything possible in all type grass to stall the 33 Generac and it will not quit.

cgm147
06-23-2011, 09:29 PM
well just to state the STT is a mower in its own class with a Drive Shaft. now with that said if you compare a wild cat to a bobcat its a little closer other than the pump cc. i owned a bobcat for three years replaced two sets of spindles two sets of belts and a engine. loved the mower didnt scalp at all held up ok but just didnt cut well in my eyes had to mow twice to get the cut i wanted. bought a Scag Wildcat last year and i love it well built and cuts better hands down... but as for the turf tiger there is no other out there for the price that will last you longer. have a customer that brought a STT in for a engine at 4500 hrs last year mower has around 5500 hrs on it now still kicking and making money!