newbie advice. gas leak

[BeeCreekLawns]

I have a 21" Toro 20036 Personal Pace Super Recycler. I got this used and when I put gas in it, the gas slowly drips from under tank. When I push the primer bulb it just feels like air. Won't start. I am a newbie and trying to learn this stuff so please anything will help. I tried googling but couldn't really find an answer. I am thinking it isn't a cracked gas tank because it would still start if it was, right. could it be the fuel filter? It worked at the end of last season without leaks. I need to learn, please help. :hammerhead:

[DT Lawn Care]

I have had two of these mowers, 6.5 hp Briggs right? Dripping from UNDER the tank could imply bad/cracked gasline. Dripping from ON the tank would imply a cracked or a hole in the gas tank. This can be fixed easily with JB Weld. But yes, the mower should still fire up. Remove the air filter and spray a shot of starting fluid or carb cleaner in, the pull the rope, it SHOULD at least give you some signs of firing. If not, you will have to go into the carburetor and check it out. These mowers are not hard to work on, it was probably the best Personal Pace model that they have ever made. Please post results, and good luck.

[BeeCreekLawns]

damn, I love this site. Don't have carb cleaner. I will get some tomorrow. Anything else you could offer about this machine would be great. I know basically nothing about maintenance, but I am trying to learn. thanks.

[BeeCreekLawns]

I don't have an owners manual, just checking to see what kind of oil you would recommend for changing on this. There should be a drain on the bottom right?

[FIXDISS]

This may help.https://lookup3.toro.com/partdex/default.cfm

[BeeCreekLawns]

Thank you very much. Now I know this is a 2002 Model and I have printed all part diagrams to start the learning process. Atleast now I should know what people are talking about when they refer to something! I will update when I get the carb cleaner today.

[dutch1]

Fuel tanks on the Briggs Quantam engines seemed to be susceptible to seam seal leaks--that is where the two halves of the tank were joined. I would have no objection to anyone repairing their own tank and I have done it myself. On the other hand, I worked in a shop envoirnment for 7 years and any mower that came in with a leaking tank either was replaced or service was rejected due to liability issues. You may want to check with a dealer to determine if the tank can be replaced under warranty. Manufacturers are often willing to replace faulty tanks to avoid lawsuits.

Dutch

[BeeCreekLawns]

Even if this is a 2002 model and I didn't purchase. I would of assumed I was out on that deal, but I am a newbie and obviously don't know. Thanks.

[dutch1]

Yes, that could be the fly in the soup. I just scanned your original post and missed the fact that you picked it up used. Most likely the dealer will ask for proof of purchase but I have seen stranger things happen.

Dutch

[BeeCreekLawns]

Okay, Having fun learning here. When I went to get the carb cleaner, the guy told me to first check the spark plug. Sorry guys, newbie 101, it looked bad so I went over with a wire brush and it fired right up. Some black smoke, but using my carb cleaner got rid of that. So, still had the gas dripping, didn't even put much in yesterday and it was still dripping. Took the top cover off and wiped the wet part of tank. Noticed when I pushed primer bulb the seam in gas tank ( you nailed it ) was where the leak was. I guess I will be getting the Jb weld or should I install new tank??

I cannot find the fuel filter. Thought it might be the silver cylinder thing (Bowl-float??)between the primer bulb and gas tank, but I took that off and guessing bowl float according to diagram. Don't see anything in diagrams about the fuel filter.

I also bought some oil for my first oil change. This turned out to be a two hour adventure with no success. I see on diagram, "plug-drain, oil", but I must be stupid. Took blade off for better view. Took the belt protector bracket thing off for even better view. Unscrewed many wrong ones, mounting bolts I guess. There is one suspicious bolt, a circle with a square in middle. I don't have a tool to even try that one. Let me guess, that's it. Can someone please help? I guessed I would need about 2 quarts to refill, anyone. Newbie, newbie. Not having much success, but I am having fun learning. I have pics but it won't let me put them on here for some reason.

[FIXDISS]

There is one suspicious bolt, a circle with a square in middle. I don't have a tool to even try that one. Let me guess, that's it. Can someone please help? I guessed I would need about 2 quarts to refill, anyone. Newbie, newbie. Not having much success, but I am having fun learning. I have pics but it won't let me put them on here for some reason.

Try using the square end of a 3/8" extension bar and ratchet to remove the oil drain plug.When refilling with oil ,pour in about 28 ounces of oil and then check oil level. Add as needed to reach proper level.(Pour slowly into fill tube and allow fill tube to clear before checking level each time.)

[BeeCreekLawns]

Thank you. I will give that a try. Do you have any suggestions about where the fuel filter might be on this machinea? Toro 20036 Personal Pace 21"

[Valk]

I'm pretty sure there is no fuel filter...at least none of my Toro PP SR21's ever had one. You could certainly put one in midline.

With a warm engine, I poured the oil out through the oil filler neck. Turn the mower on its side with the carb up. You may need to rock the whole mower a bit to get the most out - while still keeping the carb side up. Do not overfill when refilling the oil. I always used straight 30w.

[BeeCreekLawns]

Well the rachet thing didn't work. I will be turning mower on its side. I called a dealer to see about filter and they said turn on its side as well. Boy, that was a waste of time. They also said the jbweld wouldn't work for gas tank leak in seam. To buy a new one for $30. How often do yall change the belts? Do you wait til it go's out? Thinking of picking one up to have one on truck.

[Valk]

They're around $25 or $30 if memory serves. I always got at least one dedicated season out of a belt...not to say you wouldn't notice a difference if you put a new one on.

[DT Lawn Care]

How big is the seam? If isn't more than say an inch I would just JB Weld it and then quick hit it with black spray paint. You can get a JB Weld kit for like $4 and you will have tons left over for other use. I have done this several times over the years, they haven't leaked anything since.

If there is a fuel filter, it will be in the gasline running between the tank and carburetor. I don't think yours would have them, but I know that they put them in the older models. Your call, you can install one or not.

On this model, you shouldn't have to take any covers or anything off underneath the deck to get to the oil drain, but I don't know for sure. The blade brake models you HAVE to drain out the fill or rip off a lot of covers underneath. But if it's easy, I would suggest removing the drainplug and draining from there as you will get more of the old oil out. As FIXDISS said, it is a 3/8" square, I always use an rachet extension.

Any other questions on maintenance or problems, feel free to ask.

[BeeCreekLawns]

Well, I ended up getting a tank for $30 and just got done installing it. I will try the JbWeld next time. This will be my first year and I just want to be ready and hopefully no problems. I don't think this mower ever had any service done to it ( I never serviced as a homeowner either). So since I have gotten this, I have changed the oil, filter, gas tank, cleaned carb, & sharpened the blade. I bought a belt and was wondering if I should put new one on or wait. The one on there is probaly the original from 02'. Just to make sure, when you sharpen the blade, you only sharpen each side once right. (not both sides of each side if you know what I mean)

[DT Lawn Care]

You are correct on sharpening the blade, if you are planning on staying in the business you will want to get a blade balancer. It's not AS important on 21's, but if you get any commercial mower you will want to have one, as you can wreck spindles if your blades are out of whack.

As for the belt, I would not worry. I have Toro mowers from the 80's and 90's on their original belts. They don't get worn much at all, there isn't that much wear and tear on them.

Good Luck

[topsites]

If a whole tank is not too expensive I would replace it, if not do JB Weld, there's just no telling,
I've seen fuel tanks go for as little as $20 and as much as $80, I don't know what yours would
run but there's only one way to find out.

It might not have a fuel filter but I would go ahead and replace the fuel line leading from the gas tank
to the carburetor, more stuff they sell at the store, if there is a fuel filter you should find it inline of that
fuel line as you remove it, that's where they normally go.

If you do remove the fuel line and it does not have a fuel filter, if there exists a way to install one inline I would highly
recommend doing that, all in all this fuel line + filter will cost you 5 bucks or so, don't forget the small hose clamps.

Good luck.