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View Full Version : Demoing a Pool, how hard can it be?


farmboy1285
02-08-2010, 10:31 PM
Well Im buying my first house and am planning on doing a lot of work on it. One of the first things on my list is to knock down a in ground pool that sits on the property. I considered fixing it up buying new pumps and stuff (I could have some sweet parties lol) but I think It will just be a money pit (literally) also the previous owner had no fence on the property and no ladder in the pool which scares the crap out of me. The pool is about 15'x30' and 6'-8' deep with 8" or 10" thick walls, I cant remember. It is built into the side of a hill with one side being partially exposed. My plan is to rent a breaker for our Bobcat and jack the sides down and part of the bottom so any rain water will drain, push the concrete into the hole I will leave most of the bottom in tact, put a foot or so of compacted gravel on top of the broken concrete and fill the remainder of the hole with soil. Eventually I will build a garage on or partially on where the pool sat so I want to compact the gravel and soil and leave the area alone for a while so the soil can settle. I talked to the city code officer and he said my plan sounded good. My question is will my Bobcat be able to handle a breaker and the demo work or do I need to have a dozer or a excavator brought in. Im pretty confident I can do this myself but I figured I should get some opinions first. I can post pics of the pool tomorrow, also here are the specs for my Bobcat: http://www.bobcat.com/historical_specs/skid_steer/7753_1991

DirtMerchant
02-08-2010, 10:37 PM
Rent an excavator or backhoe. Completely demo the pool. Put the demo in the ground where you want to build your garage. Only bury **** on a construction site, never on your own property. It always comes back to bite you.

Krafty
02-08-2010, 11:28 PM
We do that all the time around here and they have lasted for year and years. We knock out about 2 to 3 feet down around the edges make sure you punch some hole in the bottom. Throw all the concrete in fill the excess with 1" clean and soil a little bit of fabric and then some soil and seed. We would just use a breaker on and excavator but unless you can back a truck right too the pool you may need a skid as well.

ksss
02-09-2010, 01:29 AM
If you don't remove all the concrete make sure you at least use the breaker to knock holes in the floor so that surface water can drain through. I have done the entire job with a skid steer. Break a path via the shallow end into the pool, use the breaker to knock holes in the pool about 3 feet from the top of the pool all the way around it. Knock holes in the bottom as first mentioned, then climb out of the pool, put your dirt bucket on and push the rim of the pool into the bottom. Work your way around the perimeter of the pool pushing it in.

You might want to rent a CASE but if you have all day a BC will work.:laugh:

farmboy1285
02-09-2010, 01:44 AM
If you don't remove all the concrete make sure you at least use the breaker to knock holes in the floor so that surface water can drain through. I have done the entire job with a skid steer. Break a path via the shallow end into the pool, use the breaker to knock holes in the pool about 3 feet from the top of the pool all the way around it. Knock holes in the bottom as first mentioned, then climb out of the pool, put your dirt bucket on and push the rim of the pool into the bottom. Work your way around the perimeter of the pool pushing it in.

You might want to rent a CASE but if you have all day a BC will work.:laugh:

Thats pretty much my game plan. If those dang CASE machines wernt so expensive we might have got one, when we were looking for skid steers bobcats out numbered CASE 2:1. But hey our bobcat gets the job done, and a lot quicker than our old tractor!

ksss
02-09-2010, 02:05 AM
Thats pretty much my game plan. If those dang CASE machines wernt so expensive we might have got one, when we were looking for skid steers bobcats out numbered CASE 2:1. But hey our bobcat gets the job done, and a lot quicker than our old tractor!


Quality doesn't cost my IH brother, it pays.:cool2:

Junior M
02-09-2010, 09:32 AM
Quality doesn't cost my IH brother, it pays.:cool2:
oh god here we go again.. :dizzy:

curtisfarmer
02-09-2010, 09:47 AM
I filled a 1950s pool in with 17 triaxels....after the guy spent about $15K trying to renovate the thing. Old pools cost HUGE $ to renovate. The walls where like 10-12" thick with more rebar than I have even seen. I drilled 2" holes thru the bottom in a tight grid, filled here in, and no problems since. If you demo and bury, make sure to fill the voids between large buried chunks as it will eventually slump.

farmboy1285
02-09-2010, 01:28 PM
Quality doesn't cost my IH brother, it pays.:cool2:

lol just be glad we didnt get a Deere. last week in one of my classes the instructor was talking about cyclical loading and showed a picture of a Deere excavator that the boom had cracked in half on. It was all I could do to keep myself from making a smart ass comment lol.

farmboy1285
02-09-2010, 01:40 PM
I filled a 1950s pool in with 17 triaxels....after the guy spent about $15K trying to renovate the thing. Old pools cost HUGE $ to renovate. The walls where like 10-12" thick with more rebar than I have even seen. I drilled 2" holes thru the bottom in a tight grid, filled here in, and no problems since. If you demo and bury, make sure to fill the voids between large buried chunks as it will eventually slump.

We were told that the pool was built back in the 70's. It was dug by hand and poured using basement forms. Like I said Im concerted renovating the thing but its already got a couple cracks in it. The thing is actually holding water now, only about 1-2' in the deep end but supposedly this summer it was close to full with rain water. Besides I need the space to build a 2 stall garage so I can work on my trucks:)

curtisfarmer
02-09-2010, 03:12 PM
Lower the grade slightly (12'18" if posible) and use the pool walls as footers or knee wall foundation for garage:)

farmboy1285
02-09-2010, 03:28 PM
Lower the grade slightly (12'18" if posible) and use the pool walls as footers or knee wall foundation for garage:)

Actually because of the way it sits on the grade I could almost get away with cutting the front out, leveling the floor building a roof, and I would have a good sized single car garage. I would have 6' high concrete walls and an in ground garage lol.

farmboy1285
02-16-2010, 10:39 PM
I stopped by the rental yard today to get some specs and prices. They have a 250# breaker and and 750# breaker, Im assuming the 750# breaker is way to big for my machine. I asked about a hand held breaker and a compressor which is cheaper, its been a while since I used one of those things and from what I remember they are like trying to wrestle a bear, but that was when I was a lot smaller. Also Im guessing this thing will be a nightmare of re-bar whats the best way to deal with it? I have a Oxy Acetylene torch and an angle grinder, will that be enough or will I need to rent a chop saw.

Ozz
02-16-2010, 10:51 PM
Also Im guessing this thing will be a nightmare of re-bar whats the best way to deal with it? I have a Oxy Acetylene torch and an angle grinder, will that be enough or will I need to rent a chop saw.

A K-12 saw is the best for rebar. OA works but isn't as quick and an angle rinder would work but it would be the slowest of the 3. (A K-12 saw is a cutoff saw like a stihl cutquik)

ksss
02-17-2010, 01:59 PM
A K-12 saw is the best for rebar. OA works but isn't as quick and an angle rinder would work but it would be the slowest of the 3. (A K-12 saw is a cutoff saw like a stihl cutquik)


I would second the demo saw. If you only cutting steel, the blades are cheap. Much faster than a torch, an angle grinder is not even an option. If the pool is built to current industry standards, you can plan on a bumch of rebar. A 500 pound hammer would be ideal for your size machine. I would make sure your spin on filters are tight before you start hammering.

curtisfarmer
02-17-2010, 06:33 PM
By renting/hiring a decent size excavator, the costs savings may be better. Why bother cutting the rebar? Grab, break into big peices, smash and seperate the best you can. Rebar scrap here is $190 ton BTW.

farmboy1285
02-17-2010, 08:16 PM
I would second the demo saw. If you only cutting steel, the blades are cheap. Much faster than a torch, an angle grinder is not even an option. If the pool is built to current industry standards, you can plan on a bumch of rebar. A 500 pound hammer would be ideal for your size machine. I would make sure your spin on filters are tight before you start hammering.

Somehow Im guessing its not anywhere close to industry standards LOL, but Im planning for the worst. Is a 250# hammer to small? I assume it will get the job done but just a little slower or will it not have enough "punch"? Thanks for the tip on the filters.

By renting/hiring a decent size excavator, the costs savings may be better. Why bother cutting the rebar? Grab, break into big peices, smash and seperate the best you can. Rebar scrap here is $190 ton BTW.

The rate for the breaker is like $220 a day and weekends are 2 for 1. I figured I can at least get all the breaking done in the 2 days, so besides the diesel and cost of transporting our bobcat (and assuming I don't break anything on my machine) the only expense I will have is renting the breaker and the chop saw. Im not trying to cut corners on the project but I have a lot of other things I want to do on the house and even if I only save $100 thats $100 worth of 2x4's or drywall I can buy. Im only planning on cutting rebar so if I get the pieces small enough to move easily with the bobcat I can move them around easier.

1idejim
02-18-2010, 12:38 AM
farmboy

i didn't read all the posts but i do build pools.

steel scheduals don't vary or change much so if it was built by a builder it should have iron on 1ft center from the shallow end to the springline and the floor, 6" centers and alternates in the deep end through the break.

first thing is to bust holes in the deep end floor

i've demo'd a few and if i were you i'd measure 30" down the wall saw cut 1/2" deep all the way around the inside, break it with a hammer and fold the waste into the hole. cover it up and be done with it or fill the hole with dirt have someone build benches and a fire pit.

ksss
02-18-2010, 02:09 PM
a 250 may work. It would suck getting to the job and find that the walls were twice as thick as you thought. It may worth a try. I would insist that the hammer was recently charged up.


As far as the filter thing. Ask me how I knew to bring that little gem up for consideration.

ioilyouin
02-18-2010, 04:20 PM
As far as the filter thing. Ask me how I knew to bring that little gem up for consideration.

You mean hand tight isn't good enough?

farmboy1285
02-18-2010, 05:23 PM
farmboy

i didn't read all the posts but i do build pools.

steel scheduals don't vary or change much so if it was built by a builder it should have iron on 1ft center from the shallow end to the springline and the floor, 6" centers and alternates in the deep end through the break.

first thing is to bust holes in the deep end floor

i've demo'd a few and if i were you i'd measure 30" down the wall saw cut 1/2" deep all the way around the inside, break it with a hammer and fold the waste into the hole. cover it up and be done with it or fill the hole with dirt have someone build benches and a fire pit.

Sorry I dont speak concrete:laugh:, Im guessing that means the rebar is in a 1x1 grid in the shallow end and a 6x6 grid in the deep end.

As far as we know the pool was dug by hand and poured using forms for a basement back in the 70's, Im guessing it was just done by a general contractor not a pool builder.

a 250 may work. It would suck getting to the job and find that the walls were twice as thick as you thought. It may worth a try. I would insist that the hammer was recently charged up.


As far as the filter thing. Ask me how I knew to bring that little gem up for consideration.
yes that would really suck, I may see if there is another rental yard around that has a 500# breaker. I have a feeling there is a good story behind the filter tip, wanna share?


BTW I measured the other day pool walls 8" thick on top, and I assume its that way all the way down, till the bottom. Total dimensions, 28'x14', 3' deep with a gradual slope down to 6' deep. The pool is level with the ground at the shallow end and I would estimate sits above the grade about 3' at the deep end.

And here is a pic
http://i280.photobucket.com/albums/kk178/farmboy1285/Picture159-1.jpg

ksss
02-18-2010, 05:40 PM
You mean hand tight isn't good enough?


I had a brand new machine on a State highway job breaking out around manhole covers. When the machine was PDIed the hyd. filter must have been hand tightened, caused a bit of a mess.

farmboy1285
04-22-2010, 11:58 PM
Have any of you guys ever used or heard of flowable fill? I'm considering building a garage on top of the pool, (fill it in, and use the walls as footings). One of my roommates dad works for a power company and said that I should look into flowable fill. He described it as like a really sandy and wet/soupy concrete, and said it was just as hard a concrete, cheaper, wouldnt settle, and can break easily if/when it needs to be removed. Just curious if this is pretty true or not.

Bleed Green
04-23-2010, 12:14 AM
http://www.flowablefill.org/
not sure if this will help but i found this site about flowable fill. I have never heard of that before, sounds interesting.

1idejim
04-23-2010, 02:32 AM
Have any of you guys ever used or heard of flowable fill? I'm considering building a garage on top of the pool, (fill it in, and use the walls as footings). One of my roommates dad works for a power company and said that I should look into flowable fill. He described it as like a really sandy and wet/soupy concrete, and said it was just as hard a concrete, cheaper, wouldnt settle, and can break easily if/when it needs to be removed. Just curious if this is pretty true or not.

on the west coast they call it either slurry or lean mix, 2 1/2 - 3 sack with pea gravel or reject sand, used to cover pipes and as a filler for deep trenches. they'll use it for over excavation due to poor fill or water.
lean mix can smoke teeth on a 580.

ksss
04-23-2010, 01:21 PM
I was on a State job where flowable fill was used. Pretty sweet really. At that time it was cheap. It is not any longer at least here.

QualityLawnCare4u
04-23-2010, 02:49 PM
Pool=$$$$$ nothing but a money pit! I have one sitting in my back yard(a large above ground, less than 3 years old, liner is bad, it has a 15 year warranty but the company that put it in only lasted 6 months). I hate that thing everytime I walk out the back door, biggest waste of money I ever spent, 2300 for the pool and 500 for the fence. I'm still mad at my wife about it! I know quite a few folks here who have covered them up. You will be doing yourself a BIG favor making this thing disappear!!

farmboy1285
04-23-2010, 06:04 PM
http://www.flowablefill.org/
not sure if this will help but i found this site about flowable fill. I have never heard of that before, sounds interesting.

Thanks for the link, I checked out the site, lots of great information!

on the west coast they call it either slurry or lean mix, 2 1/2 - 3 sack with pea gravel or reject sand, used to cover pipes and as a filler for deep trenches. they'll use it for over excavation due to poor fill or water.
lean mix can smoke teeth on a 580.

Smoke the teeth? as in teeth on a bucket I assume.

Pool=$$$$$ nothing but a money pit! I have one sitting in my back yard(a large above ground, less than 3 years old, liner is bad, it has a 15 year warranty but the company that put it in only lasted 6 months). I hate that thing everytime I walk out the back door, biggest waste of money I ever spent, 2300 for the pool and 500 for the fence. I'm still mad at my wife about it! I know quite a few folks here who have covered them up. You will be doing yourself a BIG favor making this thing disappear!!

Sorry to hear that. That is exactly the situation I'm trying to avoid, the pool is at least 40 years old, if not older and is a huge liability. The pool is going this summer, I'm just trying to decide what the best way to do that.

I like the garage idea because it sorta takes care of multiple problems, but the pool doesnt sit in a great location to be a garage (its too close to the house), if was 5 feet farther away from the house it would be perfect.

1idejim
04-23-2010, 07:36 PM
Pool=$$$$$ nothing but a money pit! I have one sitting in my back yard(a large above ground, less than 3 years old, liner is bad, it has a 15 year warranty but the company that put it in only lasted 6 months). I hate that thing everytime I walk out the back door, biggest waste of money I ever spent, 2300 for the pool and 500 for the fence. I'm still mad at my wife about it! I know quite a few folks here who have covered them up. You will be doing yourself a BIG favor making this thing disappear!!

don't get me wrong as i'm not intending to be insulting but, you get what you pay for.

if you would have spent the money that is required to build a quality pool it would have easily lasted 20 + years.

i've done leak detections on pools my dad built in the 60's, just now having plumbing issues, 50 years and a little tlc might go another 50