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mlc
06-16-2002, 09:30 PM
Anyone out there use Vanquish herbicide by Syngenta? I believe that the active ingredient is dicamba. Anyways, I was looking for a herbicide which is effective in rainy weather (been more rainy days than sunny ones lately in the Northeast). From reading the label it seems that this material works throught the roots and may work well during rainy periods? What herbicides work well during rainy periods? Currently I've been using Confront with a sticker called Bond manufactered by Loveland Corp. and marketed through UHS. Works "OK", but just wanted to see what others are using. Thanks Steve.

Tordonista
06-18-2002, 09:29 AM
Vanquish isn't Dicamba (it would have said Dicamba on the label if it was), but is one of those "one molecule difference" things. It's a contact herbicide, it needs to translocate through the plants to the root. I like it real well. I've used it interchangebly with Banvel. (Less health risk.)
Confront is still the best all-around T&O herbicide.
Vanquish is a little better in regard to rainfastness. Confront will control a wider range of weeds, and is more selective than Vanquish or Banvel.
On the things that confront will not control, woody plants, waxy and hard-leaved plants, Vanquish is a good choice.

mlc
06-18-2002, 09:17 PM
Thanks for the information. The Vanquish label says that it can be tank mixed with Confront (Apply 1/5 - 1/2 pint per acre with 1-2 pints of Confront). Have you experimented with this mixture? I know that TGCL in my area uses this mix. I thought maybe the Vanquish made it rainfast because there always out there during rainy days still making treatments. The few times that I've tried this - often not by choice- my weed control results weren't to good. Do you recall what a 2.5 gal of Vanquish costs? Thanks Steve.

Tordonista
06-18-2002, 09:55 PM
What kind of results are the guys you watched spraying in the rain getting? Keep your eyes open, you're liable to see just about anything. A contact herbicide has to be taken up by th foliage of the plant and translocated throughout the plant. it's how they work. If it can't sit on the plant long enough to be absorbed, it won't be effective.
I know, at least around here, the big outfits are smoke and mirrors. Do a sloppy job in whatever conditions happen to fit their schedule, then tell you how good they are. Lots of radio ads. Keep pumping the fertilizer! Those weeds? They germinated since we were there. Better sign up for another treatment. Move too fast with that double trigger to see what they are walking over. Count on the customer's ignorance.
When I was using Vanquish, residential and T and O were a pretty minor part of what I was doing. It was a lot more ag and roadside. I mostly mixed it with 24D. I wouldn't hesitate to mix with Confront. I've fallen so in love with HiDep that I don't buy much dicamba-like product. any more. I've been using Redeem (Ag Confront) and Banvel on my pasture, and it's doing a good job.
I expect Vanguish is in the 75-100 $ per gallon range still. The low rates make it pretty economical.
Read the labels, talk with the supplier.

Tordonista
06-18-2002, 10:07 PM
This is the part I like best---I'd be off the label using Redeem on the lawns. I'd be off the label using confront on the pasture. They're exactly the same thing. Same jug. The only difference is glued to the outside of the jug. The Confront that I buy in bulk is $115/gal. The redeem I buy by the single jug for my own use costs me $70/gal.
(HiDep is under 30)

Plant Wizard
03-21-2008, 02:00 PM
In Agriculture, 8 oz per acre of "dicamba" will knock down many weeds.
Vanquish is a low drift formula of dicamba.
Trimec or 3 way herbicides contain some dicamba, and apply around 2 oz per acre.
Spiking your 3 way herbicide will improve knock down and yield possible residual.
Use 2 to 4 oz per acre as a spike.

hmartin
03-21-2008, 03:38 PM
Vanquish isn't Dicamba (it would have said Dicamba on the label if it was), but is one of those "one molecule difference" things. It's a contact herbicide, it needs to translocate through the plants to the root. I like it real well. I've used it interchangebly with Banvel. (Less health risk.)
Confront is still the best all-around T&O herbicide.
Vanquish is a little better in regard to rainfastness. Confront will control a wider range of weeds, and is more selective than Vanquish or Banvel.
On the things that confront will not control, woody plants, waxy and hard-leaved plants, Vanquish is a good choice.

From http://www.ext.nodak.edu/county/ramsey/agalerts/issues/2007/isue6.htm
3. Systemic herbicides like glyphosate, dicamba and other growth regulators, ALS inhibitors (Accent, Raptor, etc) and ACCase inhibitors (Assure, Poast, etc.) are a greater concern than contact herbicides because systemic herbicides damage the growing point.

Also,

Dicamba is the. only active ingredient (41.8%) in the herbicide Vanquish.
www.wsdot.wa.gov/maintenance/pdf/dicamba.pdf

Plant Wizard
03-21-2008, 05:07 PM
Nothing gets past you now does it.
When the molecule was introduce at Sandoz, I was in the audience.
Yes it is called diglycloamine, not dicamba. Symantics.
But had you heard the story you would know that Sandoz had been looking at heavier molecules of the "dicamba" compound. This new compound weighs in at over 12 lbs per gallon. Small droplets have less chance of floating around when they're that heavy. Also isn't it amazing how active the molecule is? Just a few droplets floating onto an un suspecting plant can cause symptoms. They also where looking at another "similar" compound that would release its active ingredient like a slow release nitrogen. Soil applied, it might have been dropped from research. Also dicamba was originaly tested for grass control at higher rates in corn.
From http://www.ext.nodak.edu/county/ramsey/agalerts/issues/2007/isue6.htm
3. Systemic herbicides like glyphosate, dicamba and other growth regulators, ALS inhibitors (Accent, Raptor, etc) and ACCase inhibitors (Assure, Poast, etc.) are a greater concern than contact herbicides because systemic herbicides damage the growing point.

Also,

Dicamba is the. only active ingredient (41.8%) in the herbicide Vanquish.
www.wsdot.wa.gov/maintenance/pdf/dicamba.pdf

Plant Wizard
03-21-2008, 05:13 PM
As for being a contact herbicide, see also residual. In corn a pint of either product per acre will give you clean fields season long.

greendoctor
03-22-2008, 12:35 PM
It will also wipe out trees at rates over 1Qt per acre. I like it for the fact that it works like Tordon without staying in the soil for 1-5 years. There are many lawns that I have treated with Banvel + 2,4-D or Banvel + simazine for broadleaf weeds. Never had a problem with it damaging off target vegetation. Until I allowed an unlicensed applicator under my supervision to use some. The idiot did not apply 8 oz per acre, instead he did the usual Hawaii "so many ounces per gallon and spot spray weeds". He killed some trees, good thing they were small and not valuable. I figured out he mixed a load that is similar to what is prescribed on the label for clearing fencelines or pastures. An ounce per gallon spot-sprayed will kill trees.

hmartin
03-22-2008, 04:05 PM
This was a great post except for the first sentence. Everybody has the right to point out errors or state facts that they believe wholeheatedly to be true. I felt the previous info was inaccurate and I politely said so. :)

Nothing gets past you now does it.
When the molecule was introduce at Sandoz, I was in the audience.
Yes it is called diglycloamine, not dicamba. Symantics.
But had you heard the story you would know that Sandoz had been looking at heavier molecules of the "dicamba" compound. This new compound weighs in at over 12 lbs per gallon. Small droplets have less chance of floating around when they're that heavy. Also isn't it amazing how active the molecule is? Just a few droplets floating onto an un suspecting plant can cause symptoms. They also where looking at another "similar" compound that would release its active ingredient like a slow release nitrogen. Soil applied, it might have been dropped from research. Also dicamba was originaly tested for grass control at higher rates in corn.

Plant Wizard
03-22-2008, 06:25 PM
Dicamba or Diglycloamine? If your a broad leaf plant, your in trouble.
Sorry I upset you.:cry:
I guess we believe what we want to believe. Even at the expense of upsetting others.
Some say organic fertilizer must not be changed from its original form to be considered organic.
Some consider urea formaldehyde to be an organic fertilizer because it contains carbon.
Diglycloamine is "not" dicamba, just look at the spelling.
Compare weeds controlled and mode of action....