PDA

View Full Version : Patio over inground pool


Mike Fronczak
03-26-2010, 02:50 PM
I have a customer with a a 20 year old inground pool, they no longer use. They want to fill it & install a patio. The pool fill in is eay part, not quite shure what to use as fill so it won't settle (41/2 ft deep). Obviously we will have to compact in lifts 3-6" at a time. Thinking it may be best to use 2" crusher run (driveway base), for complete fill in. Any ideas & imput would be appreciated, this is a new one for me.

JeffY
03-26-2010, 03:51 PM
You will want to break the floor and remove it before filling it up with rock. If you don't, that area will always hold moisture that will never go away. Personally, I would just demo out the concrete since you really aren't saving that much material by leaving it in. Then I would put in base material and compact it in lifts to ensure minimal settling.

Rex Mann
03-26-2010, 04:04 PM
use # 2 or #1 rock most of the way up. Stuff is 95% compacted when dumped.

Then use your crusher run. I'd go 6-inches. As for the floor, if not going to bust it out at least drill 2-inch diameter holes thru the floor into the solid fill with pea gravel and put a piece of geotextile over it.

Peace,

Rex

http://ArizonaPavers.Com

DVS Hardscaper
03-26-2010, 05:18 PM
We do quite a bit of pool demo. So much so that we currently have a website under construction dedicated solely to pool demo.

This is a big undertaking if you've never done it before. It's not rocket science, but you will either make a pile of money - or you'll lose a pile of money.

Yes, you'll want to break up the floor into 8" pieces. Based on my experience - you should also break the top 18-24" off the pool's sides. There are reasons why I recommend this.

The concrete may remain in the hole. Pack the concrete in tight with the bucket of a 8000# excavator. Cover the concrete with filter fabric (geo-textile).

I do not recommend filling the pool with any gravel as Rex advised. The voids will allow water to collect in the hole. It's my opinion that you do not want water collecting to a concentrated spot such as this. Also, drilling 2" holes in the bottom is something we have tried in our rookie pool demo days - It does not work too well, we don't do it anymore. Not to mention, the bottom of most pool's are slimey, meaning someone could very easily slip and break they neck walking around on the pool's floor. I cringe at the thought of my guys walking on the bottom, and we try to avoid doing so all at costs. Also, and I realize this may sound extreme - but some pool's have bottoms with concrete 12-24-inches thick, trust me - they're out there.

The goal is to have the water sheeting away. Plus gravel is expensive in comparison to free fill soil.

Sometimes you can compact the fill with a roller. Sometimes you can not. It all depends on the size of the pool and how much concrete is goin in the hole. I give the client the option to compact or not compact because compacting does cost substantially more. If they decide to have us NOT compact - there is a clause in the contract stating stuff relating to the fact.

Frankly - when people tell me they want to put a patio over the hole: I tell them to wait 18-24 months. I'd hate to build a beautiful patio only to have it sink 8-inches. All that concrete down there equates to alotta voids. Think of a gumball machine and all the voids between the gumballs. From a C.Y.A standpoint - you gotta give it time to settle, even if you compacted. If they don't want to wait - the other option is to completely remove all the concrete from the hole, haul it away, backfill with suitable soil, and compact in lifts, and now they're well over $28k.........

DVS Hardscaper
03-26-2010, 05:37 PM
Also! you forgot to state what the pool is made of!

Concrete, gunite, vinyl, fiberglass?


,

Mike Fronczak
03-26-2010, 07:46 PM
I believe it is vinal line over concrete not sure meeting with him Sunday. I have 2 Bobcats & a Dingo with a hyd. hammer so if I have break it up, I don't care. My concern was with putting the patio on immediatly due to settling. He's a good maintence client & ussally good for on large extra job, last year a 48" dia oak blew over, we got $ 1500, to cut & haul, 15 + face cord of red oak (7 dump trailer loads), heated 2 houses most of the winter with it. So I want to do it right.

DVS Hardscaper
03-26-2010, 11:13 PM
[QUOTE=Mike Fronczak;3490143]I believe it is vinal line over concrete not sure meeting with him Sunday. I have 2 Bobcats & a Dingo with a hyd. hammer so if I have break it up, I don't care. My concern was with putting the patio on immediatly due to settling. He's a good maintence client & ussally good for on large extra job, last year a 48" dia oak blew over, we got $ 1500, to cut & haul, 15 + face cord of red oak (7 dump trailer loads), heated 2 houses most of the winter with it. So I want to do it right.[/QUOTE


Typically the only concrete used with vinyl pools is the concrete decking around the outside of the pool. A vinyl pool's bottom is typically a sand base. Many will have galvanized metal sheeting at the bottom.

A dingo for breaking pool concrete will take forever.

If it's vinyl and they wanna do a patio over the hole - you'll wanna remove ALL the vinyl and ALL the steel from the hole. We use an acetylene torch for cutting the metal. You can use a cut off saw but you're gonna eat up at least one blade and use whole lotta gasoline.

Not to sound arrogant, but based on your wording - if this is a client you respect and value - your best avenue with them is honesty. Based on the low level of experience you have I recommend that you remove the vinyl and steel as I stated, fill the hole in, and talk the client into waiting at least a year before doing a patio. Otherwise it could come back to haunt you in about 2-3 years. There is an extensive amount of litigation on the records deriving from pools not properly removed......

Paver Gangster
03-27-2010, 02:07 AM
I'd leave and bid on another job.

FLCthes4:11-12
03-28-2010, 08:19 PM
I agree with DVS atleast wait a season. But go for the demo. If you never do your first then you will never get any expirence. Just remember education is every where and it always costs.