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chevyguy$$
04-03-2010, 05:19 PM
New client says she paid 2 companies 2 stop the weeds and they keep coming back and she want mulch installed in the front and the back but the side of the house she want the mulch pulled up and grass seed down... so i went 2 the garden centers in my area and showed them the weed every center told me to do something different...what do you guys think????

jvanvliet
04-04-2010, 07:40 AM
You can mix a backpack sprayer with a 5% glyco & 2% Pendulum Aquacap solution... the "roundup" will kill the weeds, the Pendulum will act as a preemergent, you'll have to spray the entire bed, not just the weeds. The pendulum has a yellow/orange dye in it so you can check the ground coverage, this will disapear in time. I use this solution in South Florida, home of the weeds and it is effective for up to 6 or 7 months if the soil is not disturbed.

You'll need at least a limited applicators license... at least you do in FL so check the requirements where you live and work.

Think Green
04-04-2010, 09:31 AM
Chevy,
Pendulum Aqua-cap, Barricade, Preen, Snapshot, Dacthal, and Freehand will require soil contact to work. That black plastic will prevent activation!!!
After the bed heats up the products will volatilize and become ineffective quickly. So, don't sell the job on a quick fix program. Customers need to realize that nothing is weed free from one application.
Put mulch back in at 3-4 inches thick after weeding the beds out. Treat with gly for broadleaf return and if you get grassy weeds,then apply Ornamac OTT according to label.
" WHAT IS THE DIRECTION THIS CUSTOMER IS GOING WITH THESE BEDS?"

chevyguy$$
04-04-2010, 09:58 AM
i just tryed round up quick pro it says works in 24 hours and after that im going to go with a weed and grass preventer than put mulch down than apply it again on top of the new mulch i will let you kno how it come out...

kirk1701
04-04-2010, 11:13 AM
I agree with ThinkGreen, only I'd take the mulch up, get rid of the garbage bags as they are going to degrade not to mention smother out the plants thats also in the bed. Put down landscaping paper, the 15 or 25 year stuff. I have it all the way around my house and very little round up needing to be done and maintenance free for years :)

MileHigh
04-04-2010, 11:35 AM
Pick all the weeds out by hand...

Get a pesticides applicators license, or park the truck a block down the street.

Spray a chit ton of Pre-Emergent weed killer down.

Wallaa.

betmr
04-04-2010, 01:15 PM
This is what I think needs to be done there: Remove all the old mulch, It appears to have composted into a nice soil, giving those weeds a nice warm bed to grow up in. Put in 3 to 4 inches of new mulch. And put down a Pre-emergent Herbicide. Mulch is not forever. Over time it decomposes into rich soil, and needs to be replaced. Kind of Nature's way of soil regeneration.

I don't think those are garbage bags. Looks like weed fabric exposed. The reason the fabric is not working, is the weeds are actually growing out of the soil, that the old mulch has become, above it. Rip the whole thing out, weeds and all, and start fresh. The client my not like the higher labor cost, but, it's a normal expence of Landscape maintenance. That stuff is no longer mulch, it has become dirt.

Darryl G
04-05-2010, 01:42 AM
Pick all the weeds out by hand...
Wallaa.

What is wallaa? Do you mean voila? lol

grugreen
05-11-2010, 10:52 AM
The weed looks like a thistle in the picture. If Canadian Thistle, a patch of them can be hard to get rid of. Looks like Can Thistle, correct if wrong.

grugreen
05-11-2010, 10:54 AM
None of the Pre Ms are going to work if those are thistles. You will be wasting her and your money.

greens master
05-11-2010, 04:05 PM
lots of good info here. thanks guys!

White Gardens
05-11-2010, 09:26 PM
I'd just follow the advice as above.

Pull the plastic bag crap and re-mulch. Then sell the client on a bi-weekly to tri-weekly maintenance schedule. It takes up to 2-3 weeks for a glyphosate such as roundup to work properly. It says it works in 24 hours, but it's just another chemical in the round-up solution that will zap the weeds and stress them but not kill them.

Glyphs take so long to work that homeowners thought that the applications weren't working, so Monsanto decided to add something to visually make it look like it's working 24 hours later.

If that is a thistle of some sort, you are going to have to explain to your customer that there is probably 1000's of seeds still in the bed, and it might take years for them to all germinate. Even if you plant grass there, you'll eventually have thistles growing in the grass.

I've got one client right now that insists on removing all the rock from his rock beds and starting new, when he just had it renovated last year. As hard as I've tried I can't get him to realize that it's not going to stop the problem, especially when he lets morning-glories grow on his property.:hammerhead:

Marcos
05-11-2010, 09:42 PM
I'd just follow the advice as above.

Pull the plastic bag crap and re-mulch. Then sell the client on a bi-weekly to tri-weekly maintenance schedule. It takes up to 2-3 weeks for a glyphosate such as roundup to work properly. It says it works in 24 hours, but it's just another chemical in the round-up solution that will zap the weeds and stress them but not kill them.

Glyphs take so long to work that homeowners thought that the applications weren't working, so Monsanto decided to add something to visually make it look like it's working 24 hours later.

If that is a thistle of some sort, you are going to have to explain to your customer that there is probably 1000's of seeds still in the bed, and it might take years for them to all germinate. Even if you plant grass there, you'll eventually have thistles growing in the grass.

I've got one client right now that insists on removing all the rock from his rock beds and starting new, when he just had it renovated last year. As hard as I've tried I can't get him to realize that it's not going to stop the problem, especially when he lets morning-glories grow on his property.:hammerhead:

That stuff added to glyphosate in Roundup QuikPro in order to speed up the burn-down is the aquatic herbicide 'diquat'.
Diquat is OK to use around long established & otherwise healthy woodys.
But beware!
Roundup + diquat can reak serious vengeance upon adjacent annuals, perennials as well any plant that's under-established, or in a state of stress for whatever reason.

Many landscapers don't realize this, but a lot of their thistle problems in beds have their origins in weeds brought in from nurseries, carefully tucked & nailed by south-of-the-border guest workers under nice, clean brown burlap.

If you want to get a handle on thistle in beds, carefully use Casoran 4G as a granular pre-emergent, then kill any break-through thistle later with Lontrel as an over-the-top spray .5 oz / gallon.

Turf Commando
05-11-2010, 09:55 PM
Pick all the weeds out by hand...

Get a pesticides applicators license, or park the truck a block down the street.

Spray a chit ton of Pre-Emergent weed killer down.

Wallaa.

Agreed. Sometimes nothing better then pulling them out by hand and coating the surface...

White Gardens
05-11-2010, 10:08 PM
That stuff added to glyphosate in Roundup QuikPro in order to speed up the burn-down is the aquatic herbicide 'diquat'.
Diquat is OK to use around long established & otherwise healthy woodys.
But beware!



So is that what is causing the vapor drift issues that I'm seeing with the newer versions of round-up?

I'm also curious as to what other chemicals they are putting into round-up also. The "non-active" ingredients they don't label on the bottle. I know it's probably just some simple adjuvants and surfactants, but I'm still curious on the true chemical composition.

Marcos
05-17-2010, 07:07 PM
So is that what is causing the vapor drift issues that I'm seeing with the newer versions of round-up?

I'm also curious as to what other chemicals they are putting into round-up also. The "non-active" ingredients they don't label on the bottle. I know it's probably just some simple adjuvants and surfactants, but I'm still curious on the true chemical composition.

Problems with volatilization while using RU QuikPro?
No. Not from my perspective.

From my personal experiences gly+diquat has only done damage through the root zone.
I stopped using RU QuickPro in beds altogether once I realized the lateral damage it was causing to annuals, certain sensitive perennials, stressed plants, & under-established plantings.
Now I mainly use it in parking lots, etc.

FYI:
"Roundup Original"....contains no surfactants
"Roundup Pro".........does
Good luck sorting out the exact contents of everything out there that is non-Monsanto! :dizzy:

White Gardens
05-17-2010, 08:50 PM
Problems with volatilization while using RU QuikPro?
No. Not from my perspective.

From my personal experiences gly+diquat has only done damage through the root zone.


So do you think that the roundup/diquat combination is translocating in the soil and hitting other plants, or do you think its plants that might have intertwined roots with whatever weed you are spraying??

From a bigger ag perspective, there is a vapor drift issue with some forms of Roundup, and I'm not sure but it might be round-up pro.

My observation comes from my father's house and other farm houses around the area. It seemed that when the applicator's were out broadcast spraying farm fields, it seemed they were getting some sort of drift from the glyph applications.

What I've seen is that younger trees, plants, and shrubs would exhibit chemical stress or even die. My father claims that it is the newer cocktail of roundup that was volatilizing on sunny calm days after application.

There has been a big stink locally about applicators spraying in the wrong conditions and causing chemical or vapor drift onto adjacent properties. The Dept of Ag is working on creating a buffer zone around properties when applying chemicals in order to combat that issue. I'm not sure if that practice has been implemented or not though.

It makes me wonder if it's the applicators fault or not. It seems that these chemicals don't state any different application practices after they have change the solutions or chemical makeup of the pesticide. So what might have been safe conditions before might not be safe with the newer solutions.

Marcos
05-18-2010, 12:01 AM
So do you think that the roundup/diquat combination is translocating in the soil and hitting other plants, or do you think its plants that might have intertwined roots with whatever weed you are spraying??

From a bigger ag perspective, there is a vapor drift issue with some forms of Roundup, and I'm not sure but it might be round-up pro.

My observation comes from my father's house and other farm houses around the area. It seemed that when the applicator's were out broadcast spraying farm fields, it seemed they were getting some sort of drift from the glyph applications.

What I've seen is that younger trees, plants, and shrubs would exhibit chemical stress or even die. My father claims that it is the newer cocktail of roundup that was volatilizing on sunny calm days after application.

There has been a big stink locally about applicators spraying in the wrong conditions and causing chemical or vapor drift onto adjacent properties. The Dept of Ag is working on creating a buffer zone around properties when applying chemicals in order to combat that issue. I'm not sure if that practice has been implemented or not though.

It makes me wonder if it's the applicators fault or not. It seems that these chemicals don't state any different application practices after they have change the solutions or chemical makeup of the pesticide. So what might have been safe conditions before might not be safe with the newer solutions.

Given diquat's programmed feature of maintaining mobility in & around aquatic situations, I vote for the former.
But I don't know for sure.
Maybe a little bit of both is to blame.

Pesticides + surfactants haphazardly blowing around in the wind on a hot, sunny day could be compared to a scalding, popping vinegar & bacon dressing tossed into a lush, freshly-picked spinach salad.

McVey Landscape
06-07-2011, 04:53 AM
Get rid of the plastic garbage bags! This defeats the purpose of Mulch in my eyes. Till break up soil, preen/snap shot something, place mulch 3-4 inches thick. Usually works. I don't like spraying beds due to plants. You can't beat a good WEED PULLING though!