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View Full Version : kohler 27 hp head gasket blown?


EARTH5
04-26-2010, 12:12 AM
i have a exmark laser with a kohler command sp 27 hp. the mower has a total of 350 hrs on it! i replaced the head gasket at 200 hrs ,, now its leaking again and i am ready to cash outta this toilet,I am very unhappy with the triton deck that came on it now its the motor... anyone else have this prob. or know why they are blowing?? btw i had a dealer do it so it was torqued etc...thanks, pat p.s. any one want to buy this 56'' laser w 350 hrs ?? lemme know

mowerknower
04-26-2010, 12:47 AM
It blows my mind that Kohler has not fixed there head gasket issue yet. We switched to Kawis about 8 years ago because of the Kohler head gasket problems. Then about 2 years ago started moving back to kohlers. We figured that the problem had for sure been fixed. NOPE, I bet that about 25% of the Kohlers we sell need a head gasket before they even leave the shop.

tryingtomakeit
04-26-2010, 02:00 AM
Well, Big Kaws have sticky valve guides..... It all boils down to the bean counters....

piston slapper
04-26-2010, 01:50 PM
The engine has a 2yr comm warranty. Kohler only allows us to replace the bad gasket under warranty.( we used to replace both when there was a failure ) If the head was properly resurfaced and installed, you should never have a repeat failure.

They really should add reinforcement to edges that seal the piston and the oil drainback hole (like Honda)....just my opinion...replaced enough to know.

piston slapper
04-26-2010, 02:54 PM
You may want to have your dealer check to see which flywheel is on the engine . Kohler had some issues with the flywheel timing . There are 2 different flywheels on these engines. A 22 degree, and a 16 degree . If you have a 22 degree , you need to install an offset flywheel key. This problem has been linked to many head gasket failures.

VegetiveSteam
04-27-2010, 12:38 PM
You may want to have your dealer check to see which flywheel is on the engine . Kohler had some issues with the flywheel timing . There are 2 different flywheels on these engines. A 22 degree, and a 16 degree . If you have a 22 degree , you need to install an offset flywheel key. This problem has been linked to many head gasket failures.

The offset flywheel key is for CV and CH 730s only. This 27hp has Smart Spark ignition and uses a completely different flywheel so please do not use an offset key on this engine.

piston slapper
04-27-2010, 02:03 PM
Really should have asked for a model and spec #...

VegetiveSteam is correct , CH740,s use a DSAI ign system.(No external SAM module as it is integrated into the coils)

Whats in a sticker ? I have seen a few 27 hp stickers only to find a 730 setup under the cowl, allthough this mower is probably too new for that...MY BAD..

VegetiveSteam
04-27-2010, 03:26 PM
I failed to ask EARTH5 a question. Does the engine ever run on or back fire when you shut if off?

Yep model and spec would be best. The early CH, CV740s did have an external SAM. The DSAI came out in early 2007 but they used the same flywheel as the units with DSAM. The CH,CV 730 used standard CD ignition with no spark advance and uses a completely different flywheel.

I'd also love to know where you found 730s labled as 27hp. The only mislabling I've known of was on Craftsman units and that put Kohler in the position of being named in a lawsuit that they have no guilt in.

betmr
04-27-2010, 03:51 PM
Did you re-torque the head bolts a while after the replacement?

piston slapper
04-27-2010, 03:59 PM
There are a few dealers in this part of the world (which will remain nameless) that rebuild their trade-ins with whatever parts are laying around. Add new paint and stickers and top it off with a good sales job.

CASE IN POINT
Yesterday I had a mower the shop that was blowing fuses. The mower originally came with an EFI 26 hp (XF2600 Dixie Chopper). The cowl said CV730v , The sticker below the breather assembly said 27 HP , and it had DSAI coils, (1 of the coils was installed with a flat head machine screw) The mower was purchased 6 mths ago as a rebuilt.

Good way to start the week...

VegetiveSteam
04-27-2010, 04:28 PM
There are a few dealers in this part of the world (which will remain nameless) that rebuild their trade-ins with whatever parts are laying around. Add new paint and stickers and top it off with a good sales job.

CASE IN POINT
Yesterday I had a mower the shop that was blowing fuses. The mower originally came with an EFI 26 hp (XF2600 Dixie Chopper). The cowl said CV730v , The sticker below the breather assembly said 27 HP , and it had DSAI coils, (1 of the coils was installed with a flat head machine screw) The mower was purchased 6 mths ago as a rebuilt.

Good way to start the week...


Excellent point.

EARTH5
04-28-2010, 11:26 PM
thanks for all the help..... im about to trade it for a kawi... i will re-surface heads and try one more time but this is rediculous,,,,kohler should be ashamed!!!!!!!!

piston slapper
04-29-2010, 10:06 AM
Kohler builds 1 of the most durable engines on the market, and its backed by a very good warranty... The only thing that they have to be ashamed about is not having the manpower to police the garbage that some repair shops turn out.

It only takes 1 certified tech to authorize a dealership or a repair facility, and more often than not, He's sitting behind the counter...IS YOUR TECH CERTIFIED?

MileHigh
04-29-2010, 10:55 AM
my 27hp kohler is pushing 1200 hours with no head gasket change in it's records...I've only owned it for 200 hours. It used to backfire when I shut it off, so I started to shut it off at half throttle...stopped backfiring.

mowerknower
04-29-2010, 11:40 AM
Kohler builds 1 of the most durable engines on the market, and its backed by a very good warranty... The only thing that they have to be ashamed about is not having the manpower to police the garbage that some repair shops turn out.

It only takes 1 certified tech to authorize a dealership or a repair facility, and more often than not, He's sitting behind the counter...IS YOUR TECH CERTIFIED?

First off, I am a certified Kohler Tech. Second, I have 7 blown kohler head gaskets hanging on my wall (as a reminder why a hate kohler) from this year on units that were not even sold yet. Im pretty sure that you cannot blame that on garbage shop repairs.

piston slapper
04-29-2010, 02:08 PM
I never said Kohler's didnt have any problems,however , they usually happen within the warranty period. If repaired properly, you seldom have a repeat failure. Kohler reimburses repair shops fairly well to perform these services.

When properly maintained, these engines routinely last 2500-3500 hrs (except on Walkers, they sit too low with poor ventilation)

I have replaced many head gaskets, Completely overhauled over 100 engines, and never (yes I said never) had a head gasket I installed fail. My overhauls usually last 2000-3000 hrs without a failure....I LIKE KOHLER ENGINES...THEY LIKE ME...

piston slapper
04-30-2010, 10:30 AM
First off, I am a certified Kohler Tech. Second, I have 7 blown kohler head gaskets hanging on my wall (as a reminder why a hate kohler) from this year on units that were not even sold yet. Im pretty sure that you cannot blame that on garbage shop repairs.

Kohler engines are difficult to work on, which is why they certify techs. I like my torque wrench more than my first wife, and almost as much as beer. If you hate what you're working on, you'll never be any good. As a kohler tech, you are an ambassador for the company, it is a privelidge, not a right. Your customers look to you as one of the smartest people on the planet (as far as kohler engines are concerned) If you hate the engines, I'm sure your customers will too.

PISTON SLAPPER

ricky86
04-30-2010, 10:42 PM
First off, I am a certified Kohler Tech. Second, I have 7 blown kohler head gaskets hanging on my wall (as a reminder why a hate kohler) from this year on units that were not even sold yet. Im pretty sure that you cannot blame that on garbage shop repairs.

They are blowing head gaskets and haven't been sold yet? Seven this year alone? :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::
Please.

ericg
05-01-2010, 10:23 AM
Guys, I have to say that I have had great success with Kohlers both air and liquid cooled. We have six Walkers and yes there were some issues with head gaskets in the beginning but routinely we get between five and six thousand hours out of a Kohler with no problems. Twice a day, at mid day and at night, every machine is blown down with a back pack blower. One Walker has a Kohler 25 liquid cooled with almost seven thousand hours. Only now is it starting to blow a little oil. I think that other than head gaskets, its how the operators run the machines and how the end users maintain them, in my opinion.

Eric

mowerknower
05-01-2010, 01:02 PM
If you hate what you're working on, you'll never be any good. PISTON SLAPPER[/QUOTE]

I never said I hated working on them. I don't mind working on them one bit. I just very much dislike the engines and would personally never own one.

mowerknower
05-01-2010, 01:03 PM
They are blowing head gaskets and haven't been sold yet? Seven this year alone? :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::
Please.


Added one to my wall of shame yesterday. Gravely zthd. 15 hours. Blown head gasket.

TPnTX
05-17-2010, 03:01 PM
hey can anyone help verify something for me. my kohler 27hp is using a lot of oil. After a days of use, the spark plug tip is carboned up bad. It seems to be blowing oil out of the filler cap so there is a lot of crank case pressure. Low Compression on this cylinder.

I had one mech tell me he has 3 machines in for the same thing and it's the head gasket. He was backed up up big time so I took it to a dealership. For very good reasons I am skeptical of these guys. They did a leak down and said it is not the gasket but the rings.
I am still wondering. Any advice?

piston slapper
05-18-2010, 10:03 AM
If you remove the filler cap on any engine, it will blow oil. When you remove the cap, you lose all the crankcase vacuum immediately. In the absence of crankcase vacuum, you have crankcase pressure.(blowing oil out the tube)
To check crankcase vacuum you must use a vacuum gauge the reads inches of water vacuum or a water manometer. Normal vacuum on Kohler command engines is 2-4 in.

You probably have a head gasket leaking between the cylinder and the oil drainback hole in the head.

swandrie
05-18-2010, 07:18 PM
one of my kohler has over 5000 hours on her, and yes I did have to replace the head gaskets! I think it had 700 hours when it blew the right one, replaced both. still running to this day and doesn't eat oil either.