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turfman33
07-23-2002, 02:01 PM
Hi,

I want to know how you get into the business of taking down tree's. I own my own Lawn care service and have been asked a couple of times wheather I take down tree's. Of cause the answer is no, but I would like to know how to get into the side of this business. what do I need to know? What courses? ETC.. Any help would be great. Are there any web sights out there on the subject?

Thanks in advance.

Steve:p

1MajorTom
07-23-2002, 02:06 PM
Try this site.

www.ArboristSite.com

Same format as Lawnsite.

agrostis palustris
07-23-2002, 02:49 PM
Taking down trees... Before you can cut, you need to learn to climb. That is however unless you plan on doing easy stuff that can either be bombed from the ground or pulled over with a truck and rope. Probably the easiest way for you to do tree work would be to simply find a climber. They will teach you as you work together. Keep in mind that you will need a dump truck, chipper, chain saws, ropes, etc. Plus landscaper insurance DOES NOT cover commercial tree work. Tree policies are a lot more expensive and harder to come by than landscaper insurance.

ipm
07-23-2002, 05:55 PM
Tree work is very dangerous http://www.benmeadows.com/
I am not saying don't try it, just respect it. Talk to some of the old timers, and hear some of their horror stories. It is a rush tough, when you top a tree. Good luck:)

Tree climbing gear is fairly expensive, bobcat(grapple), truck(cdl??)chipper will run 30k, insurance>>>>

agrostis palustris
07-23-2002, 09:19 PM
Wow IPM. That you are talkin about the semi-expensive stuff right there. Then you gotta figure in for your stump grinders (small ones are 12K) Then there is climbing and rigging gear. Between just my saddle, climbing rope, helmet, and other life support gear I figure in at probably 1,000 - 1,500. Then there are the many ropes which will run you starting at $85 and all the way up into the low hundreds for just 1. Then you have your rigging gear... blocks / PW's / GRCS' / and other important things. Then you have your chain saws which will run a MINIMUM of $250 and that's not for a good one. Top of the line climbing saw at this time is $450 - $500. Then you have your ground saws, felling saws, etc which will run to over $1500 for a single saw. Then you have your wedges, sledges, cant hooks, and other BS stuff. Just things to think about.

Pelican
07-23-2002, 11:47 PM
All of the above are why I sub out tree work that has any kind of risk to it. I'll cut up stuff that has fallen down and even drop trees where there's no chance of damage, but the tricky stuff I just sub out.

I think due to the investment you'd need to make, the tree work would have to become a full time endeavor.

PAPS
07-25-2002, 08:57 AM
We got into tree work simply becasue of the demand for it in my area. i would receive tons of calls each day for it and sub-out everything, so i finally said, time to jump into it. We bought a used 12'' brush bandit for $10K, a bunch of misc. ground saws ranging from $200-$700. We hire a climber who gets $250.00 per day in pay, and if needed a bucket truck at $500-$800 per day. As for insurance, my landscaping insurance covers tree work as long as trees do not make up more than 15% of my gross sales. in terms of pay, we try to get anywhere from $700.00-$1000.00 a day for a climber and a grounds guy. for bigger jobs that require the bucket, more crew, the rate goes up in the $1600.00 a day range....

tim cooper
08-07-2002, 12:16 AM
IMHO...Stick with downed trees........ Made 300 bucks on a 60 foot pine tree the other day.. Bought a 140 dollar Poulan chain saw.... took me less than an hour to cut up .. 1 1/2 hours to haul off...... Not too bad I think.....

agrostis palustris
08-07-2002, 02:16 AM
Tim, I hope you are aware that downed trees can be just as dangerous if not more dangerous than trees that are standing. Ones that are down via either felling or structural failure can lead to fatality or serious injury. Are you aware as to what a spring pole is and how to "safely" remove one? Also are you aware of the reactive forces of wood and of chain saws? Are you aware what causes kick-back? I ask you these things because you say you bought a poulan chain saw "wild thing" :( If I am responsible for cleaning up a large tree, I would much rather piece it out up in the air than have to drop it whole and pull pieces from the ground. The small ones are no big deal, fell and clean up.

PAPS
08-07-2002, 01:18 PM
Originally posted by agrostis palustris
Tim, I hope you are aware that downed trees can be just as dangerous if not more dangerous than trees that are standing. Ones that are down via either felling or structural failure can lead to fatality or serious injury. Are you aware as to what a spring pole is and how to "safely" remove one? Also are you aware of the reactive forces of wood and of chain saws? Are you aware what causes kick-back? I ask you these things because you say you bought a poulan chain saw "wild thing" :( If I am responsible for cleaning up a large tree, I would much rather piece it out up in the air than have to drop it whole and pull pieces from the ground. The small ones are no big deal, fell and clean up.

Its a shame, because its guys like you that are killing this web-site... this guy Tim was just making a comment about how he made a few extra bucks on a pine tree, and here u come acting like a know it all, busting out terms, and what not, why? because u have probably cut a few trees in your day? I am sure Tim is well aware of the danger when using a chainsaw, he doesnt need know it alls like you to tell him to watch out for kick backs Once again...thanks for the "tree" lesson smart guy.

agrostis palustris
08-07-2002, 07:26 PM
Bryan, no self respecting tree person would EVER buy a "Wild Thing." In addition to that, I would like to bow down to you Tim for cleaning up a 60' pine tree in 2 1/2 hrs by yourself.

PAPS
08-07-2002, 07:29 PM
Originally posted by agrostis palustris
Bryan, no self respecting tree person would EVER buy a "Wild Thing." In addition to that, I would like to bow down to you Tim for cleaning up a 60' pine tree in 2 1/2 hrs by yourself.

Exactly.... another brilliant comment.

tim cooper
08-07-2002, 11:54 PM
Love peeps jumping to conclusions....... The tree in question was in the middle of a tree line on back of property with no obstructions i/e houses, power lines etc... In my teenage years I cut and hauled pulp wood for my father ( he called it off season football training) i/e NO pto driven wood loader..... just my 2 guns for loading the stuff.. Yes, I know how to run a chain saw... Yes, I know how to fell a tree.... However, NOT in my wildest dreams would I EVER try to fell a tree next to power lines or houses or any other thing that would COST me money. Also, being a Level 1 trauma nurse ( my day job), I know the effects of chain saws kickback, I am however also open to the fact that "accidents can happen". I use precaution, steel toed boots, even bought some cutting chaps. Better safe than sorry. In addition, being as I am not bonded for such activity, I would in no way consider cutting down trees for everyday activity. Yes, I have had 2 offers, and NO I have not accepted them. Just my 2 cents worth.

P.S. Thanks Paps for support.....lol

gogetter
08-08-2002, 01:09 AM
Just for the record, Tim also never said whether his Poulan saw was a "Wild Thing" or not. I have the "Pro" model myself.

Not taking sides, 'cause I don't know squat about the tree industry. Just wanted to keep the facts straight.

On a side note, I used to look in the help wanted ads alot to see if there were ever any ads for an entry level position with a tree service, but they ALWAYS want exprienced only. Seems hard to get your foot in that door.

agrostis palustris
08-08-2002, 02:15 AM
I would like to appologize for "jumping to conclussions" With me the only 2 acceptable saws for pro use are Stihl and Husky. Stihl is of course # 1 with Husky a very close #2. I probably got all riled up because I mostly make my money off of performing tree work for people. Then there is the landscaping side of my company as well. The stuff I prefer to do is by power lines, houses, etc. Where if you mess up, you either bust something up good, or you hurt yourself REAL good. Go-getter. I think that a big reason why people in the tree care business want people with experience is because of the risks involved. Your best bet if you want to learn to do tree work is to get in with a little company and drag brush for a while. You learn a lot like that. They eventually move you up the ropes (pardon the pun). Even if all you are doing is dragging brush you can still get really seriously injured or killed by a falling tree or falling brush. I have no desire to hear about anyone getting hurt or killed while performing arborist services.

agrostis palustris
08-08-2002, 02:40 AM
Oh BTW Bryan I was looking at your web site and noticed that you have a 120 foot crane for rent I would assume? How much would you want to come up to New York for a day next week? Got a BIG elm tree to remove over a main road.

jsusisaliv
01-10-2006, 11:30 PM
Hi to all.
I could not stand it so I had to post all reply to this thread. I am going to defend poulan and the wild thing. OK poulan is a bottom line chainsaw. BUT It is a VERY GOOD bottom line chainsaw and you really get more then you paid for. For a $140.00 you get 4.0 CC with 18" bar and pleanty of power. No it will not last as long as a stihl or husky but for $140.00 what can you ask for... If you take care of it and run a really good synthetic oil in it it will give years of good service. I use a poulan wild thing at home for we heat with wood. I just finished cutting up a 21" oak and it cuts like a WILD THING! I may in the future buy a stihl or husky just because I may want a higher end chainsaw but the poulan is great for the money and you just can't talk bad about them. You got to also think for the power you get along with the 18" bar for $140.00 you would pay around $400.00 or more for a stihl or husky!! So poulan wild thing is absolutly the best chainsaw FOR THE MONEY BAR NONE!!!

ATL Lawn
01-13-2006, 02:02 AM
the "wild things" over heats WAYY to fast, and not made to be ranned for more than an hour of constant use.

mdvaden
01-13-2006, 02:32 AM
Take it on in increments.

How dangerous is it to remove a 10 foot tree?

There are videos, books, and arboristsite.com as mentioned for starters.

It's nice to be trained.

You might consider networking. How about if you advertise a bit of it, but turn it over to a climber and give hime the bigger cut. You make a commission, and while he does it, he at least shows you how to do something like how to fell a tree and determine which ones you can fell.

Even Husky and Stihl manuals come with diagrams for felling cuts.

But professionally in a neighborhood environment, it would be very nice to have some training first.

LandscapePro
01-13-2006, 08:17 PM
<----- Waves at M.D.

Nice to see ya over here...

Mike
La. Landscape Contractor #2576

sheshovel
01-13-2006, 08:26 PM
A 10' tree I take down with my hand tree saw not a problem and no kick back to worry about..takes longer but I would kill myself if I attempted to use a chain saw,I know it..heck I can barely use a pickaxe without wounding myself some how!

TurfdudeNCSU
01-13-2006, 08:51 PM
We just sub out the work to a arborist. I don't want anything to do with tree work. It will increase your workers comp. and GL insurance, and just over all not worth it to us. I can call this guy have him take down the tree, when he's done write him a check and put 10 to 20 % in our pocket and never touch a saw.

bigandy
01-14-2006, 07:05 PM
Dont let anyone scare you away from this. While it can be dangerous, and im sure it can be expensive to buy all of the equipment, no one ever said you had to jump in and become a pro who would to anything down. Know your limitations and the limitations of your equipment and use your head. If the job is too big or too dangerous because of powerlines of proximity to houses, turn it down. I have done a little tree removal for some local contractors and have gotten along just fine with a chainsaw, polesaw, rented man lift, and pickup truck to haul away brush. Im not an inexperienced chainsaw operater, just a farm boy who has cut firewood and sold cedar logs. Just down get in over your head.

hosejockey2002
01-15-2006, 12:31 AM
So poulan wild thing is absolutly the best chainsaw FOR THE MONEY BAR NONE!!!

My Poulan Wild Thing is the most worthless piece of crap I have ever owned. Even if I had paid fifty bucks for it I still would have been ripped off. It was OK for the first year I had it, although like someone else said it would overheat if you used it hard. After the first year it became very sensitive to fuel quality and I couldn't get it to idle after it warmed up. After it let me down for the last time I chucked it as far as I could throw it and bought a Stihl Mini-Boss. It's a little bit smaller saw, but it's tough and reliable. At under $200 it's still worth more than ten of those Wild Things.

Coffeecraver
01-15-2006, 04:07 PM
Hire an Certified Arborist to work for you until you get certified

cantoo
01-18-2006, 10:04 PM
Every couple of years I buy a new Poulan wild thing or whatever crap Canadian Tire has on sale. I sell the old one in the trader for $100.00 Sometimes I only use it 5 or 6 times but as soon as it is hard to start it goes in the trader. I pay $159.00 on sale for them.

Grassmechanic
01-19-2006, 09:47 AM
Every couple of years I buy a new Poulan wild thing or whatever crap Canadian Tire has on sale. I sell the old one in the trader for $100.00 Sometimes I only use it 5 or 6 times but as soon as it is hard to start it goes in the trader. I pay $159.00 on sale for them.
Buy a Stihl or Husky and never buy a saw again.payup

The Cowboy
01-19-2006, 01:31 PM
I learned to cut trees starting young and helping dad cut up downed trees. I used to take apart smaller trees no problem, taught my self everything by reading and experience. I used a little homelite and never got hurt. Last spring I became a certified arborist by my local college. I went to an equipment sale at the same time, entered my name into the raffle and won a brand new husky 350. Since then I have been doing more tree work because I feel more confident. I still do it as a side job, I don't own harnesses and chippers and all that. I take down what I can handle with one helper, and don't work near power lines.