Do I need two systems for AE and coal tar?

[nitro121]

Hey guys,

I have a lawn biz and 600+ foot driveway. So I'm going to get in to seal coating...first my customers and then advertise more.

But I want the option to spray emulsion, coal tar, and acrylic (although I doubt I'll get many calls for acrylic....just want it on my biz cards/ad).

I want to be able to take care of any sealing the customer wants.

I bought a trash pump and in the middle of setting up a little system for AE for my own driveway.

Maybe I should have bought the diaphragm pump system first. But anyway.....do I need two tanks?

Can you mix AE in a tank that had coal tar in it...or vice versa??

Just wondering if I need two separate systems...that's how I was going to set it up on my trailer (using small tanks of course since I only plan on doing residential drives for a while).

Thanks

[AdvSeasonal]

You don't need two different systems. But you do need to decide what product you want to spray or apply. Not all AE’s are the same as well as coal tar. The ceramics’ you are talking about are very expensive and good luck trying to get the money you need to make it worth your while.
As far as mixing the different sealers, it’s not a good idea. Coal tar and AE have different chemical make ups and blending them don't work, manufacturers are trying. The truth is, pick one product or the other and stick with it. Do the research on your product and find out what kind of manufactures support you can get if you are buying there product.

Hope this helps

Dave
ASI
www.asinnovations.com

[nitro121]

That's exactly what I was wondering. If I could use the same tank....then switch between the trash pump or diaphragm pump.

I would stick w/ one or the other....but for some reason here in Central Va. companies use both. ??? I've called a few and most use AE....but then I look at friends/neighbors/lawn customer driveways and they have used coal tar.

So I was planning on being able to spray both when the customer asks.

Yeah, the acrylic is for card/advertising only. I doubt anyone would pay for the extra....or want their driveway a different color (not in this economy).

Thanks for the help.

[AdvSeasonal]

Consider two things when deciding which sealer to use. First you mentioned that many of the guys in your area use both. Question, is it cost and availability or something else? I find it strange that a contractor would use both and not stay consistent with their product application, if for nothing more then their own warranty. Second, consider where the industry is as a whole and where it is going. Type in coal tar warnings or coal tar bans in your search bar and start reading. You may find out that the future of one product might be where you want to start leaning. I know there is all the talk about junk science and all that, but the truth is, anything that burns from chemical exposure (burns around the eyes, nose and back of the neck etc.) and smells like that can't be good. If you are new to this or relatively anyway, look at the green opportunity whether it be real or perceived and exploit it to your business advantage. Just my 2 cents.

Good Luck

Dave
ASI
www.asinnovations.com

[nitro121]

So I sent you an email. Reply when you get the chance.

V/r
Gary

[BIGBOY2008]

I think its real shallow how ill informed "do-gooder" types will notice something simply "doesnt quite smell right" and then assume just because it doesnt smell all nice and pretty that its going to either mutate or kill off every lower level life form within a hundred mile radius.

There have been multiples of ill informed and inconclusive studies conducted by individuals within the environmental activism community who were attempting to make a name for themselves. Not one of these studies offer proper proof that coal tar sealers are as dangerous to the degree the claimants are suggesting.

If i wanted to be rich and didnt care how i got rich you know what i would do. I would fund the research and development of a new asphalt sealer and label it as a quote "environmentally safe alternative to coal tar sealers".
And then i would sit back and demonize coal tar sealers via mass circulation of ill informed and falsely contrived information. I would also do some rabid lobbying to encourage all coal tar sealers to be completely outlawed and then when they were finally outlawed i would use my "safe alternative" to fill the big black hole market demand resulting from the absence of coal tar sealers.

Truth is there are no asphalt sealers presently out there on the market that can effectively replace the performance of a commercial brand coal tar sealer. Nor will there be for multiple decades to come. Where coal tar sealers score a easy 10 based upon performance all the others would do well to score a meager 5 concerning asphalt preservation and protection capabilities.

[AdvSeasonal]

I'm not going to get into a huge debate. Its clear you have your mind up. However I pose this question. You said their is no AE product out their that can compare to coal tar. Does that mean you have tried them all or have tested them all? Didn't think so. End of debate.

[AdvSeasonal]

Gary,

Can you email me at dave@asinnovations.com directly. I can't respond via this system for some reason.

Thanks
Dave

[BIGBOY2008]

I will tell you straight up the only selaers i have ever worked with are the Coal Tar Sealers. Honestly ive never purchased or applied any of the Asphalt Emulsion Sealers so i will honestly say i have not personally "hands on" tested one type of sealer against the other.

Before i started doing asphalt sealing i talked to individuals who were involved in the pavement industry trade groups. They affirmed that the Coal Tar Sealers clearly out performed the Asphalt Emulsion Sealers two hundred fold. The trade group representatives then adviced me to meet with various contractors who owned paving companies. I met with two of these contractors in person and the third contractor via telephone. All three affirmed that if they paved a residential driveway or a commercial parking area where half of it was sealed with Asphalt Emulsion and half was sealed with Coal Tar Emulsion the section with the Coal Tar application would clearly be in much better condition fifteen to twenty years down the road.

I also talked face to face with an individual who sold Asphalt Emulsion sealers. I asked him what would happen if i were to lay down a section of Asphalt Emulsion sealer next to a section of Coal Tar Sealer and soak two seperate rags in gas and oil everday and lay those two rags down on the seperate sealed surfaces. Which one would offer the most effective resistance to the gas and oil.
He wouldnt directly answer my question but rather addressed the issues of the higher cost of the Coal Tar and the fumes and the skin irritations. Then i asked him if i were to prepare two surfaces one of each sealer and place a freshly oiled rag on them everyday would he come out and look at the results. His reply was he was a busy man and his time was money and he wasnt sure he could find time to come out and look at it.

So all the above information is the reason why i defend and promote Coal Tar Sealers as being superior to Asphalt Emulsion Sealers and experience tells me i have to follow the advice of the professionals in this particular area.

And yes i am being rather blunt with what i have to say but we all know the economy is not good right now.

In the late nineties everybody and their brother had the idea in their head to start sealing driveways and they absolutely raped the sealing trade by watering down and doctoring up their sealers. Now ninety nine out of a hundred of those guys are no where to be found and about all they accomplished was put a major hurt on the sealing professionals.

Those of us who apply Coal Tar Sealers have fought hard to promote the product we use and to promote the idea that it should be applied to manufacturers specs and that we should give our customers $110.00 worth of service for every $100.00 they write to us.

The industry doesnt need individuals distributing information demonizing Coal Tar Sealers as if they are some type of biohazzard bomb. Yes you can use it improperly and get a skin burn from it but ive had sunburns that were more severe than any of the Coat Tar irritations or burns that i know of. Because of this im under the impression a person is in more danger from sun exposure than from Coat Tar exposure.
Ive never heard of a report of an individual working in a Coal Tar production plant developing skin cancer or a chronic lung condition as a result of being exposed to the product. As i said before i could be wrong and if there are any documented medical cases of a person being hurt in this manner i will have to retract my statements and change my opinion in agreement with the medical diagnosis.

[AdvSeasonal]

Again I'm not going to get into a long debate. Coal tar without latex additives gives you no more protection than AE, period. As a manufacturer and experience with both I can tell you this first hand. Be careful how you defend something that you yourself have no first hand experience of with. Secondly your experience is just that. AE products have come along way over the years and just because one manufacturer doesn't have a good AE formula or a another applicator may of tried a AE product correctly or incorrectly in which you wouldn't know, doesn‘t mean theirs not a better one out there. We have been developing this formula and applying it for eight seasons in Michigan weather and know what it can do. Remember its only in the East North East where coal tar is used. Out West the primary sealer is AE. As far as the components of coal tar, when you have such chemicals as benzene, which is on the human carcinogens list, you know coal tar can‘t be good. Type in benzene in your Google search bar once and read on you will figure it out. I understand the whole defense of the coal tar industry thing. But you as a business person must understand the potential liability of the choices you make and how they can effect your business. You can defend smoking, lead based paint and asbestos. The fact remains those products have real problems and we didn't figure it out until it was too late. Don't wait until its to late. Be the leader not the follower. Please do your own research, type in coal tar bans, coal tar lawsuits etc. and start reading.

Good luck.


Dave
ASI
www.asinnovations.com

[BIGBOY2008]

Again I'm not going to get into a long debate. Coal tar without latex additives gives you no more protection than AE, period. As a manufacturer and experience with both I can tell you this first hand. Be careful how you defend something that you yourself have no first hand experience of with. Secondly your experience is just that. AE products have come along way over the years and just because one manufacturer doesn't have a good AE formula or a another applicator may of tried a AE product correctly or incorrectly in which you wouldn't know, doesn‘t mean theirs not a better one out there. We have been developing this formula and applying it for eight seasons in Michigan weather and know what it can do. Remember its only in the East North East where coal tar is used. Out West the primary sealer is AE. As far as the components of coal tar, when you have such chemicals as benzene, which is on the human carcinogens list, you know coal tar can‘t be good. Type in benzene in your Google search bar once and read on you will figure it out. I understand the whole defense of the coal tar industry thing. But you as a business person must understand the potential liability of the choices you make and how they can effect your business. You can defend smoking, lead based paint and asbestos. The fact remains those products have real problems and we didn't figure it out until it was too late. Don't wait until its to late. Be the leader not the follower. Please do your own research, type in coal tar bans, coal tar lawsuits etc. and start reading.

Good luck.


Dave
ASI
www.asinnovations.com

Did i actually post the following:
"Before i started doing asphalt sealing i talked to individuals who were involved in the pavement industry trade groups.
They affirmed that the Coal Tar Sealers clearly out performed the Asphalt Emulsion Sealers two hundred fold. The trade group representatives then adviced me to meet with various contractors who owned paving companies."

For those who do not know what a industry trade group is it is a group of professionals who are dedicated to advancing the professional status of a particular trade and or industry. They are the individuals who keep a constant finger on the pulse and vitals of the industry they are dedicated to represent and protect. They provide the lobbyists and political clout to defend their industry against rougue forces who would make it difficult if not impossible to conduct business that is in favor of their industry they represent. In short they are the ones you listen to if you dont want your industry to go broke and you dont want to go broke as an individual buisness entity.
So if a pavement industry trade group gives me advice on the practicality and use of a particular pavement related product then you bet your bottom dollar im going to listen to them and heed their advice. I would be a foolish mistake not to do so.


Remember its only in the East North East where coal tar is used.

Well i sure didnt know that it is the East North East where coal tar is used. And i if thats the only place it is used or allowed to be used then someone is paying some pretty unnecessary shipping costs considering it is being manufactured in other places. Or maybe you reckon these guys might actually be selling it to local contractors in their areas? Surely not.

Pavement Coatings, Inc.
Evansville, IN
Phone: 812-424-3400 / 800-422-9554
http://www.pavecoat.com

McConnell & Assoc. Corp.- K.C. MO
Kansas City, MO
Phone: 816-842-6066 / 800-779-6066
http://www.mcconnellassociates.org

McConnell & Assoc. Corp.-Pevely
Pevely, MO
Phone: 636-475-7733
http://www.mcconnellassociates.org

McConnell & Assoc. Corp.- STL
St. Louis, MO
Phone: 314-962-1920
http://www.mcconnellassociates.org

Sasco Pavement Coatings, Inc.
Springfield, MO
Phone: 417-862-7237 / 800-798-0160

Star-Seal of Tennessee
Nashville, TN
Phone: 615-242-7325 / 877-251-7827
http://www.pavecoat.com

Hercules Sealcoat Manufacturing, Inc.
Doraville, GA
Phone: 770-455-6551
http://www.herculessealcoat.com

Southern Star Materials
N. Little Rock, AR
Phone: 501-771-0111
http://www.southernstarmaterials.com

Star-Seal of Florida, Inc.
Fort Lauderdale, FL
Phone: 954-484-8402 / 800-432-8402
http://www.starsealfl.com

Lonestar Sealcoat Supply, Inc.
Houston, TX
Phone: 281-442-0050
http://www.lonestarsealcoat.com

As far as the components of coal tar, when you have such chemicals as benzene, which is on the human carcinogens list, you know coal tar can‘t be good.

And are you aware that certain FDA approved (and required by law) childhood vaccines contain the element MERCURY which is speculated to cause neurotoxicity in humans?
I dont know about you but im a lot more confortable with the thought of having coal tar sealer on my driveway than knowing it is a mandatory requirement for a child to be injected with something containing mercury.

[nitro121]

sent you an email a couple weeks ago. I have some questions about the safe-seal.

Thanks

[AdvSeasonal]

Sorry but I didn't receive your email. Please resend your questions to dave@asinnovations.com

Thanks
Dave