View Full Version : 36"...Need a little help!

08-02-2002, 05:25 PM
Hey guys. I'm trying to talk my dad into letting me get a 36". just Anyway, I just need the advantages/disadvantages of fixed/floating decks. I want a Metro HP with a 15 Kawi, but am afraid that it will be difficult to find a used one for the price I'm willing to pay. I might be able to buy a new Metro fixed with a 15 kawi, but how easy is it to change the deck height? I know they don't scalp much, but I change my deck heigh quite a bit. Is it like a 2-3 minute thing or does it take longer? I checked the efficiency rates on Exmark's site and the efficiency is almost double compared to a 21", but my dad begs to differ. He says I won't save any time :rolleyes: I will also consider Toro as well. I'm just looking for advice since I don't know much about walkbehinds . Thanks alot for the help guys!

08-02-2002, 05:31 PM
Originally posted by Scag48
Hey guys. I'm trying to talk my dad into letting me get a 36". Anyway, I just need the advantages/disadvantages of fixed/floating decks. I want a Metro HP with a 15 Kawi, but am afraid that it will be difficult to find a used one for the price I'm willing to pay. I might be able to buy a new Metro fixed with a 15 kawi, but how easy is it to change the deck height? I know they don't scalp much, but I change my deck heigh quite a bit. Is it like a 2-3 minute thing or does it take longer? I checked the efficiency rates on Exmark's site and the efficiency is almost double compared to a 21", but my dad begs to differ. He says I won't save any time :rolleyes: I will also consider Toro as well. I'm just looking for advice since I don't know much about walkbehinds . Thanks alot for the help guys!

I won't get into your selling price on your mower.

A fixed deck mower takes about 30 seconds to change at the most. Pull a pin, lift up, add or subtract spacer, put pin back in. Pretty simple. Worst part is you get grease on your hands. Depending on the size of your properties, you will more than double productivity. If you have 500 sf properties it probably will not help much, but if you have 2000+ sf properties it will definately increase your output.

Heller Landscaping
08-02-2002, 08:30 PM
Right now all you really need to do is get a 36 or bigger w\b it will show your dad how much more money you can make all toghether.
Don't worry about floating or fixed . You just need to get a mower.
I went from a 21" to a 48" ransomes and tripled my profits per hour. Boy did were my parents shocked. Now they want me to get another one for my brother. Get a reliable used ransomes scag jd ferris toro JUST TO PROVE IT. The TOYS can come later.

Just a thought.:cool:

08-02-2002, 10:11 PM
i got my 36inch and i work 2 days less a week after school now so it freed up my fridays i got more jobs to fill in

08-02-2002, 10:12 PM
Well, I talked to about 5 dealers today and talked to one guy that Acute Cut told me about and he has a brand new Toro 36" Hydro with full floating deck for $3500, which is a steal, since it usually goes for $5,000. It's got about 30 hours he said from just running it inside and out just for display, but hasn't been mowed with. He thought it had like 10 hours or something but he said someone must have left the key on and ran up some hours. Oh yeah, it does have electric start which is nice, I suppose. I don't necessarily like pulling on cords so E-start is kinda nice. This is a deal that I should definately jump on, but I need to sell my current mower. I had a couple of dealers tell me that I could sell my mower for $4000, which really surprised me. I gotta find a homeowner to sell it to, then run to the west side of the hills and buy me up a new mower!

Heller Landscaping
08-02-2002, 10:31 PM
Hey scag48 how did you get THAT past your dad. By the way how are you hauling it. Second Thoughts how long are you going to be paying off 3500.00 . Just remember Its going to be sitting all winter doing nothing while u are making payments.

Heller Landscaping
08-02-2002, 10:40 PM
By the way who is going to pay $4,000.00 for a used 21" mower. I would not pay that much for a new one or it had better leave gold clippings.:rolleyes:

Heller Landscaping
08-02-2002, 11:24 PM


08-03-2002, 12:37 AM
Dude, chill out. I'm selling the Groundsmaster!!!! I guess I forgot to mention that :blush: . I'd planned on selling the Groundsmaster, then paying for the W/B with that so I DON'T have payments. I suppose I forgot to mention what mower I AM selling. Must be the heat and the stuff that happened yesterday. Dad lost the gas cap to the Groundsmaster when refueling. Left it on the back and took off in a hurry. I was running the Groundsmaster next to a sandy bank and it gave away because it was a little softer than I anticipated. It was just a bank that had weeds on it until I hacked them all down. No damage, I was just a little rattled. Then the ball hitch nut fell out and the trailer was hanging by the chains. Good thing we had tongue weight or it could have been ugly. I don't know who's fault that was! I apologize for the confusion on my post! Now I feel stupid....

08-03-2002, 01:02 AM
Scag48- I have the Metro 36. I either move the spacers on the casters(about 20 or 30 seconds) or sometimes I have to move the spacers on the blades (about 3 or 4 minutes).

08-03-2002, 01:18 AM
When I was 16, I played ball and tried to score some beer..

boy have times changed.

But if you really need one have your Dad demo one, then have him run the old 21''er.

Heller Landscaping
08-03-2002, 10:23 AM
I'M SORRY, I didn't realize you already had a rider. The only thing i want to remind you is that it will take you a lot longer with a 36" than with that 44" rider you have. You probably will have to raise your price on that condo group. If it took you 1hour 45 min It will now take you close to 2hours 15 min to do with that 36" walk. I'm sorry that I blew It . But your Dad is really going to prove himself and you will never never hear the last if it takes longer on even one job. Just a thought why not get a 48" hydro with velke.
I can get a 48" hydro Ferris. with velke for 3400.00.
I now that you like Exmark ask the dealer to let you demo a 36" and a 48" . When your dad sees how fast you finish with the 48".

Let me now what you get and how you like it.

08-03-2002, 12:36 PM
Heller Landscaping-That's what I'm thinking now. That Toro Hydro for $3500 is a sweet deal, but that's alot just for a 36". I don't think I can even get a 36" through my gates so I'm thinking why not go with a 48"? I won't be able to afford a hydro, unless I found a used one, but are belts really that bad? The dealers I talked to told me that the reverse on belts are useless, and that you have to assist them. As long as I'm not literally PULLING them backwards at the end of a line, I don't mind much. What I'm saying is am I going to waste alot of time turning with a belt? If I am, would a 36" hydro be more productive than a belt 48"? It sucks having no money. If I had my way, I'd go out right now and buy an Exmark Turf Tracer HP 48". I am going to demo a 36" for sure, I might be able to demo the 48" if I call the guy and tell him that's what I'm looking for. The condo complex with probably be the same speed with the 48" and a velke. I've got 4 extra inches but am not going 8 MPH, though. I'm confused and don't have a whole lot to spend. I know exactly what I want but can't afford it. Can I go with a 48" and still be productive?

08-03-2002, 01:31 PM
watch it scag 48. some enjoy finding little glitches post of othersin. which is fine if the purpose is to help. if not id hate to think a person would use his time
that way. to each his own.no real offence intended as we all human.
just my opinion.

Heller Landscaping
08-03-2002, 02:37 PM
scag48 I just bought that 48"ransomes belt used and it is awsome. I have literaly plowed through mud with that thing. The only thing is my drive belts are not smooth they have little cogs on them sort of like a cog train if you now what I mean. All other belt drives I have seen have smooth regular belts.
Maybe that is why they slip. My mower has also reverse not reverse assist it will knock you over if you don't get out of the way. I do not have any other expierience with other mowers but I certintally woudn't pay that much for a 36". I bought my mower from a Jd Dealer and he even said It was better than his Jd's. I am not an authorithy by any means But I hope this helps.
Like I said leave the gates for the 21" and get 48" for every other place.

Like I said let me know what you do decide to get.

Heller Landscaping
08-03-2002, 02:41 PM
Hey awm if you think are so smart why didn't you post a reply and try to help him out. Quit trying to tear down and help someone out today. We have too many people in this world who are doing that . Please try to help some one today. Have a great weekend guys.

08-03-2002, 02:41 PM
Scag48, The reverse on a belt drive mower is usless like your dealer said! I am not sure why they even bother putting it there! The only time when the reverse will actually do anything at all is when you are on a complety flat smooth paved surface...and even then, you have to assist it to get the machine to move. I do not even use the reverse on my walkbehinds....I just squeeze the breaks up enough to disengage the belts and pull the machine back manually. This method is much faster and easier then switching gears (considering the reverse dosnt fo anythiung anyway).

08-03-2002, 02:56 PM
Evan-Does your method of turning wear you out? Or are the machines fairly balanced and it's not too bad? I was talking to Acute Cut on the phone and he said that if you lock up one side you just put divots and I don't want that. If it is possible for me to get a 48" belt, I will. If I end up doing that, is it fairly easy to learn to turn around so you don't put divots on the lawn? I have to wait 'til tomorrow until my dad gets home from his trip before I can ask him what he thinks about the whole thing. Do you think I could trade the dealer straight up for an Exmark Metro HP 48" for my Toro Proline? I sure hope so. I have to call him and tell him to bring a 48" instead of a 36" so that I can demo it when he comes my way. I called one dealer and they wanted to sell me an Encore for like $500. Forget that, I'd rather spend the $500 more and get the best there is.
Heller Landscaping-I will let you know how I like it once I demo one.

Heller Landscaping
08-03-2002, 03:21 PM
scag 48 your dealer should take anything you want to trade. My dealer will. The only thing is he may not give you all of what you want for it. By the way guys my Ransomes does have reverse drive. I called my dealer and he confirmed it .

My Model number is xm4831
Serial number is 000551

You can create divots if you are not careful . Just grab the brake
so that the the wheel sill turns while you are turning. Don't lock up the wheel completely. I hope this helps. By the way I have seen guys with hydros lock their wheels and create divots if they are not careful. You are not completely free with a hydro.:blob3:
Hope this helps . Let me know what you think.

Heller Landscaping
08-03-2002, 03:25 PM
Evans 528 what kind of mower do you have . Remember all mowers are not created equal.:) A local Snapper Dealer told me even his w\b did not reverse. He thought mine was great. Just a thought.

08-03-2002, 04:02 PM
I own a gravely walk behind and have owned bobcat also. I have used quite a few diffrent brands of belt driven walkbehinds. None of them had a reverse thata actually moved the machine!

08-03-2002, 10:06 PM
I have a toro 36 fixed which is a 36 metro with a tbar. It has full reverse not assist but full reverse. Only gear mower i know that has it is toro with a tbar and i think the 52metro hp from a few yrs back all others have assist. I do use the reverse on occasion and it is fast. I would get a floating deck i hate that mine is fixed and vow to never again get a fixed deck. Why are you going backward in productivity from a 44 groundsmaster to a wb?

Darryl G
08-04-2002, 12:08 AM
Since no one else mentioned it, I've just got to say that I think your dealer is full of it as far as the hours on the machine go. How do you put 30 hours on a machine without ever mowing with it? You don't! I'd laugh in his face if he told me it was from bringing it in and out or they ran it for hours by accident. My guess is that it's either a demo or was returned by a customer. It may still be a good deal, but gimme a break. Did you look under the deck to see if it's been used? Shouldn't be hard to tell. From what you've written, I wouldn't trust that dealer at all.

08-04-2002, 02:13 AM
darryl-I haven't looked under it, it's 250 miles away. The key could have been left on, but even $3500 for that mower, demo or not, is a deal. I'm still leaning toward a 48", though. I've got a list going to convince the old man that the Exmark is superior to the Groundsmaster and 21":

1. Faster, on all lawns (dad thinks that I have countless hours to mow :rolleyes: )
2. I need a trailer NOW for the Groundsmaster, but I could wait 'til next year if I go with the Exmark. Never use snowmobile trailers...
3. I get to mulch all my lawns. I have to bag 2 of them because the GM only bags, but now I'll be able to mulch them all.
4. Easier to work on
5. Not AS much to go wrong with the Exmark since it's new, and I get a 3 year warranty
6. Save time from emptying the hopper and time disposing the clippings after the day is over.
7. Better on hills. I've got a few that are gnarly.
8. The Exmark is totally awesome, I think that's the best excuse of all ;) :D

I appreciate the advice/tips that I'm recieving from you guys. Keep them coming! Thanks!

08-04-2002, 07:07 AM
Originally posted by Scag48
Hey guys. I'm trying to talk my dad into letting me get a 36".

I checked the efficiency rates on Exmark's site and the efficiency is almost double compared to a 21", but my dad begs to differ. He says I won't save any time :rolleyes:

The original post was edited. But I remember saying your were going from a 21" to 36". You even speak about efficiency of 36" over a 21". Now were talking about a 44" Groundsmaster to a 36"? This thread has changed a lot since the original post.

08-04-2002, 06:30 PM
Take that damm hopper off the groundsmaster then! I bet it has the sfs deck made for discharching so why can't you mulch? Yes you need a trailer for the groundsmaster but unless you have a full size pickup you cant put a 48 in. It was a tight squeeze in my ford f250. I still dont get why you want to get rid of a rider for a wb if you dont have hills??? I don't understand this post.

08-04-2002, 08:11 PM
dlandscaping-No SFS deck on GM. I've got a full size truck for the 48".
65hoss-Ever change your mind in your life?

08-04-2002, 08:18 PM
Originally posted by Scag48
65hoss-Ever change your mind in your life?

Sure, and that's fine. But isn't this thread about productivity of a 36"? Seems like the info doesn't relate anymore. You should repost on here that you changed your mind about the original post and give the new correct info. Thats all.

New answer, if your going from the 44" to the 36" then no productivity will not increase. Probably go down considerably.

08-04-2002, 11:35 PM
i was just wondering how many customers do you have? How do you get to them?
Just Wondering

08-05-2002, 12:24 AM
If you get a 36" WB hydro - what is the reasonable expected price.

If you get a 54 or 52" WB hydro - what is the reasonable expected price?

08-05-2002, 01:33 AM
jhawk-Most of them word of mouth but some were from flyers that I put out.
flex deck-36" Hydro:$5000
52" Hydro-about $5200
I can get a 36" Toro Hydro for $3500, but that's alot for a 36".

08-05-2002, 02:50 AM
man, I paid 3100 for my exmarkmetro hp 36". Thats the suggested retail price i think. I would take a hyrdo 36" for 400 dolalrs more anyday. I think you should get a 48" Metro. or metro hp for around $3000-$3500. You wont tear the grass with a little practive even when you do its not that bad just keep that inside wheel neutral and you wont cut much more grass with a hydro vs. gear. Hydros are just alot easier to work with on hills and such

08-08-2002, 10:58 PM
OK guys - I just bought a brand new eXmark 36" hydro Viking WB - will have a Flex-Deck Trimming attachment on it in the next week, and since we have an irrigated yard in town I am going to volenteer to mow it for nothing to show what this thing will do

Paid $4009 for the mower

Flex-Deck = $1299

Total $5308 for a 15 HP - 54" deck WB that flexes with the terrain and trims everywhere - HYDRO BESIDES.

In transport position it adds 2" to the deck width - I just emailed my web page people and they should have it on the page that we fit eXmark WB's - There are also threads on my Flex-Deck sponsor forum that have pictures and more. Thanks, Brad

Come on Great Dane - I will challenge you to any type of yard and the more stuff, the better. I can contour mow and trim far more places

Thanks, Brad


08-08-2002, 11:34 PM
I bought a Metro HP 36 with a floating deck last month. Great machine, I liked everything about it except the reverse. There are some areas I cut that I must use reverse on an upslope. I had a very difficult time "pulling" the mower back up the hill in reverse. I strained my back several times, so I took it back and upgraded to a TT48 Hydro with a floating deck. I used it today for the first time...WHAT A DIFFERENCE!. This is an awesome machine, back-ups are effortless, no divots, VERY maneuverable and cut major minutes off my mowing time.

If you can do it, go with the 48" TT hydro. If you can't, go with the 36" hydro. Hydro is the only way to go....for me anyway.

Jeff W
08-18-2002, 11:10 PM
hello all i hope this works its my first time here. I was wondering if you guys think its worth it to get a walkbehind if i could only use it on a few lawns. Most of them are fenced in :( Heller landscaping, what part of the Burgh do you guys cut?

Heller Landscaping
08-19-2002, 08:25 AM
Hello Jeff W I mow in Aspinwall, Fox Chapel, Lower Burrel, and New Kensington. I live in Apollo, Pa . Where are you from and where do you Cut? It's nice to meet someone from my neck of the woods. By the way if you want to increase your productivity a w\b is the way to go. Stay away from the real small yards. Or get a 36" or 32" they will fit through most gates. Hope this helps you out. Let me know where you mow maybe we have seen each other. Have a great day. :) :D By the way it is worth it to get one even if you can only use it on a few lawns you will soon be able to take on more lawns which = more money.:blob4:

Jeff W
08-19-2002, 01:10 PM
hello heller I cut in Pittsburgh (Allegheny county), most of the yards are fenced in and relatively small, I have one field I do, which would be great for a walkbehind. My one friend uses a 48 ferris on even small yards that he can get into, and it takes like 20 minutes a yard. I work alone, which is good for less overhead, but bad for speedy cutting. I also have a fulltime job + lawns. Right now it isnt too bad with no rain, which means I havnt cut in weeks. But in the spring im pretty busy. I looked at a 32 inch exmark, but dont want to spend a 4000 and only get a foot more cutting. I really would like to get a 48 ferris DD.

Heller Landscaping
08-19-2002, 08:01 PM
Hey Jeff W just read your reply. Don't go with the dd ferris . My Ferris dealer says that they are horrible . They are constantly needing to be reajusted . My Dealer recomeneds the single hydro.
They are very heavy dependable mowers. I personaly have a 48" belt drive ransomes bobcat xm series and I love it. One thing to remember is that a w\b is very heavy . What are you going to haul it around with? Besides finishing sooner with your current lawn jobs you will be able to take on more jobs. I went from a 21" to a 48" and not only tripled my profits but also finshed my work in almost on third of the time it used to take. :D Let me know what you get and how you like it. What area of the burgh do you cut in?

Happy mowing.:)

08-19-2002, 11:17 PM
Hoopsfan - Yes, get a 36" Hydro with the Flex-Deck and have a 54" contour mowing, trimming, and get through the gates deal

Thanks, Brad

PS it works on other widths too, but get the biggest engine they offer.

08-20-2002, 12:51 AM
Jeff-When you looked at a 32", was that belt or Hydro? That's a little high for a belt, I suspect you're looking at hydro. Hydro is the way to go. I tried both and really liked the hydro. Counter-rotates when you turn so no scuffing, has instant reverse right on the levers, no shifting. The knee-shifter on the belt isn't too bad, but going into reverse is a PITA and it's only assist, not full reverse, you it has to be on FLAT ground to move, and then you've got to pull it a little. Spend the $1500 or so more, you'll be glad you did.

Jeff W
08-20-2002, 02:53 AM
the exmark I looked at was a hyro 32, im not sure about their new handles though. They seem more comfortable, but alot of people on here hate them. A few people I talked to said they would probably be harder to turn than conventional handles. If I do plan on getting a walkbehind i will need to get a trailer. Right now I am just lookin, plus I have no place to put walkbehind and trailer at the moment. Also I have a wedding next August to pay for, that ferris would make a great wedding present wouldnt it:blob1: I cut in the crafton and sheraden area, heller.

08-20-2002, 03:06 AM
Jeff-I wouldn't say that alot of people hate ECS, but people that are used to what they have been using might not want to switch. I had to opportunity to drive a hydro around the parking lot at a dealer. I know, not the same as a lawn, but you get the feel of the mower. The ECS was really nice and I like it alot. I had never used a W/B before and this was the easiest to learn and use. Spend a little more and get a Turf Tracer HP 36". The floating deck option is about $700 more here, not sure what the prices are there, but it sure is worth it. Quick height adjust and no scalping. Not like a 32 would scalp alot, but hey, there's always that chance somewhere. Good luck!

Jeff W
08-20-2002, 03:10 AM
i heard that floating decks cut uneven when you use a side bag because it starts weighing it down on one side. you reply quickly :)

08-20-2002, 03:34 PM
Jeff-I don't think that is true. I asked my dealer about that and he said that he hadn't heard about it all and said that there wasn't much of a threat of that happening.