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ygim
10-19-2010, 05:30 PM
I got a call to come price out fertilizing some property. I measured it it comes to 820,000 square feet.
I have to figure out what to charge them...
Any help?

phasthound
10-19-2010, 06:43 PM
I got a call to come price out fertilizing some property. I measured it it comes to 820,000 square feet.
I have to figure out what to charge them...
Any help?

Feel free to contact me through my websiite for several options. We supply several companies with much more sq. footage than that.
A bid like this can make or break your company.
Many details are required to properly price a program for a property this size.

HayBay
10-19-2010, 07:07 PM
With organic or alternative products you might want to look at fertilizing the primary areas of usage only. The reason I mention this is 18 acres is a heck of a lot of property to fertilize.

synthetic products can be 3-5 times cheaper.

With Organic or Alternative Products You do get a nice deep green look. You are required to fertiilize more often to maintain the color.

phasthound
10-19-2010, 07:14 PM
With organic or alternative products you might want to look at fertilizing the primary areas of usage only. The reason I mention this is 18 acres is a heck of a lot of property to fertilize.

synthetic products can be 3-5 times cheaper.

With Organic or Alternative Products You do get a nice deep green look. You are required to fertiilize more often to maintain the color.

3-5 times cheaper?? I don't think so.

starry night
10-19-2010, 07:20 PM
........synthetic products can be 3-5 times cheaper.......... You are required to fertiilize more often to maintain the color.

Huh? Please explain your statements for the OP. (and the rest of us.)

treegal1
10-19-2010, 07:32 PM
With organic or alternative products you might want to look at fertilizing the primary areas of usage only. The reason I mention this is 18 acres is a heck of a lot of property to fertilize.

synthetic products can be 3-5 times cheaper.

With Organic or Alternative Products You do get a nice deep green look. You are required to fertiilize more often to maintain the color.

oh come on now , PLEASE explain this for us, I GOT TO HEAR HOW THIS WORKS OUT!!!!

oh wait JD already had some #s on N per ton of compost, never mind:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

treegal1
10-19-2010, 07:37 PM
dang I am still ROFL:laugh::laugh::laugh:

treegal1
10-19-2010, 07:42 PM
still LMAO,,,,


here NY go get your compost on !!!!!!!!!!!!

http://compost.css.cornell.edu/maps.html

starry night
10-19-2010, 07:52 PM
still LMAO,,,,


here NY go get your compost on !!!!!!!!!!!!

http://compost.css.cornell.edu/maps.html

That NY map is impressive. Ohio is way behind. Too much waste being wasted here.

phasthound
10-19-2010, 09:01 PM
still LMAO,,,,


here NY go get your compost on !!!!!!!!!!!!

http://compost.css.cornell.edu/maps.html

We have several suppliers of compost in NY and Ohio, and quite a few other States.
Oh, but we mix it and bag it, then sell it. So according to your old rasta man, it can't be any good! :)

What's he smokin' anyway? :)

HayBay
10-19-2010, 10:15 PM
Please enlighten the op and I.

Give us some prices and some fertilizer products for the 820,000 sq ft.

Are we considering Compost fertilizer here?

HayBay
10-19-2010, 10:41 PM
TreeGal, you were able to notice the OP was from NY.

Did you search beyond that info regading the OP, Did you look at his website?

He does not seem to have a DUMP TRUCK, FORK LIFT and TRACTOR, Turfco Spreader of sorts to spread this or TOPDRESS compost onto 820,000 square feet.

starry night
10-19-2010, 10:53 PM
ygim: tell us more about this property. Is it 820,000 sq ft of finished turf or are there part naturalized areas? etc.

Kiril
10-19-2010, 11:20 PM
With Organic or Alternative Products You do get a nice deep green look. You are required to fertiilize more often to maintain the color.

Still waiting for some justification for this statement.

TreeGal, you were able to notice the OP was from NY.

Did you search beyond that info regading the OP, Did you look at his website?

He does not seem to have a DUMP TRUCK, FORK LIFT and TRACTOR, Turfco Spreader of sorts to spread this or TOPDRESS compost onto 820,000 square feet.

How did you determine this from his website? What about renting the necessary equipment if he doesn't have it? What about subcontracting to someone who has the equipment?

Kiril
10-19-2010, 11:24 PM
ygim: tell us more about this property. Is it 820,000 sq ft of finished turf or are there part naturalized areas? etc.

Agreed. If it is not turf .... one might raise the question why you are fertilizing it to begin with.

HayBay
10-19-2010, 11:37 PM
Rent or sub out to do a 820,000 sq ft ORGANIC fertilizing , make a profit Lol.....

How about skip that job. Like Phasthoud said it could make or break you.

Kiril
10-19-2010, 11:52 PM
Rent or sub out to do a 820,000 sq ft ORGANIC fertilizing , make a profit Lol.....

How about skip that job. Like Phasthoud said it could make or break you.

Without knowing the details of the job or the capabilities of the OP ..... it is safe to say you are making wild assumptions and jumping to conclusions .... sound familiar?

ygim
10-20-2010, 07:22 AM
It is a very expensive horse farm. They want me to fertilize the areas where the horses are.

HayBay
10-20-2010, 07:30 AM
Kiril it is safe to assume you are the first 3 letters in assume. Sound familiar?

YGIM, what about insurance on this job. Expensive horse farms. Walk away.

Im waiting for some brilliant ideas on how to harness the power of the horse poo for the job.

ygim
10-20-2010, 07:41 AM
I was going to use Aggrand.

phasthound
10-20-2010, 08:16 AM
Using ICT Organics 1-2-3 Tea, product cost for 18 acres is roughly $540.00.

ICT Bill
10-20-2010, 08:17 AM
It is a very expensive horse farm. They want me to fertilize the areas where the horses are.

what you are talking about is more nutritious forage not fertilizing turf, there is a big difference. What you are trying to accomplish with this application is to raise brix levels and unlock micronutrients in the soil and the plant

you are on the right track with a foliar to begin with but you will need to follow up with some soil corrections long term

Barry can get you our tea for a little over $500 for the application, it will do what you need it to do. It will raise brix levels and unlock micronutrients within the plant. One thing you need to tell them is that often the horses will not eat anything else later, they tend to be very picky about it after they have had more nutritious forage.

ask them to do a soil test, you need to pull these as seperate tests from different distinct areas. you should also walk the fields to see generally what condition they are in. This should be a long term commitiment to the animals not a one shot deal, it is important to convey that to the owners

Kiril
10-20-2010, 09:18 AM
what you are talking about is more nutritious forage not fertilizing turf, there is a big difference. What you are trying to accomplish with this application is to raise brix levels and unlock micronutrients in the soil and the plant

you are on the right track with a foliar to begin with but you will need to follow up with some soil corrections long term

Barry can get you our tea for a little over $500 for the application, it will do what you need it to do. It will raise brix levels and unlock micronutrients within the plant. One thing you need to tell them is that often the horses will not eat anything else later, they tend to be very picky about it after they have had more nutritious forage.

ask them to do a soil test, you need to pull these as seperate tests from different distinct areas. you should also walk the fields to see generally what condition they are in. This should be a long term commitiment to the animals not a one shot deal, it is important to convey that to the owners

I agree there is a big difference, but why do you need to raise the sugar level of forage? Also, I am curious how a CT unlocks micronutrients within a plant?

If this is a horse farm and the area is a grazing pasture, then I personally would be looking at utilizing the horse manure .... you have to do something with it.

starry night
10-20-2010, 09:50 AM
The more I think about this, the more I would suggest avoiding the job. Horses' digestive systems are really sensitive and there are too many issues involved here.
For instance, if one were to use synthetic fert, there would have to be a good rain of about half an inch to insure all the prills were dissolved into the ground before returning the horses to graze. Foliar applications of anything? I don't know. For me, I would only bid this job if the horse farm owners would provide specifics about what was to be applied and the rate and they would also sign a contract that says you are not liable in any way.

If this is an expensive horse farm, what have they done in the past about fertilization? If they have that much pasture, I would think that the grass would do just fine without fertilization with proper pasture rotation.
If these are performance horses of any kind, they would be fed supplements without dependence on mere forage.

Kiril
10-20-2010, 10:06 AM
If they have that much pasture, I would think that the grass would do just fine without fertilization with proper pasture rotation.
If these are performance horses of any kind, they would be fed supplements without dependence on mere forage.

Agree on both points.

HayBay
10-20-2010, 12:52 PM
What are you applying products with?

Permagreen type machine would fit in your trailer real nice and cover 3 acres Zmax would be better.

I noticed in your previous threads that you were looking into buying a sprayer and were inquiring about being licensed to apply orgainc ferts.

I have also heard of a company applying products to a horse pasture/field and 3 horses died. The cause was first pointed to the applicator, but after an investigation they did find some horsetail growing within the boundaries of where the horses roam. My point is you better be insured thru the ying yang to be safe or as I stated at the beginning WALK AWAY.

If you have never tried Compost Tea or any other product for that matter. DO NOT test it on your customers properties. Make sure you know it works for you.

What is the price difference of Aggrand and syntheic price wise for 18 acres.

Tim Wilson
10-20-2010, 08:45 PM
Okay horses. Finally something I know about. I raised horses and ran a string of the finest mountain saddle horses many have seen.

This situation sounds dubious. On a small acreage like that why are they not just harrowing the horse droppings? Some may recall that we pastured our horses on 30 acres and cut hay from a mere 6 acres which produced around 17 tons using harrowed horse manure alone to fertilize. In contrast, our neighbour who had used chemical fertilizers for years but could no longer spread them due to health/finances got less than that from 80 acres in the same year (yes it was that pathetic; shows what chemical fertilizers do)

NattyLawn
10-20-2010, 08:57 PM
I would free range some chickens. Have them go through and feed on the pasture and eat the insects out of the horse manure and have their droppings fertilize the fields. Build a portable coop and eat harvest the eggs for food.

Do you have the means to spray 19 acres? I know I wouldn't want to. Even using a granular material, this would be a long day for me to get this done.

As far as pricing the job goes, we don't know your costs. Cost of materials, app time, drive time and profit are a few things you need to look into.

Tim Wilson
10-20-2010, 09:07 PM
PS. Kiril, do me a favour and delineate CT (compost tea) from ICT compost tea.

ICT Bill
10-21-2010, 07:45 AM
Tim
You have had experience with horses and forage, how did your fields work for you

pro's con's ?

Kiril
10-21-2010, 11:15 AM
PS. Kiril, do me a favour and delineate CT (compost tea) from ICT compost tea.

Good point ..... perhaps I should call it BCT.

Bill ..... do you have any answers forthcoming?

treegal1
10-21-2010, 09:03 PM
ok just some thoughts..........

first, its a horse farm. widely known that horses wont eat there own $h*t so to use there waste you need to convert it into something else. I would suggest a worm bin. then just contract the spreading of the worm casts. 2-3 apps would pay of a spreader??? and pay labor at the same time.

also for something that big, maybe your best profit is in making them self sufficient, sell them on the tools to diy??? then consult and provide labor???

also how about the soil test???????first............

Tim Wilson
10-22-2010, 08:29 PM
Tim
You have had experience with horses and forage, how did your fields work for you

pro's con's ?

Bill, I'm unsure what you are looking for. With enough fenced pasture areas horse pasture is relatively easy to manage with rotating horses from area to area and harrowing the pastures and irrigating (or sub irrigation). The horse manure pretty much sustains the grass but it is good to combine some kind of legume like red clover with grasses to provide a nutrient supply. I like red clover, alfalfa, timothy, fescue, reed canary as a mix.

ICT Bill
10-23-2010, 09:01 AM
Bill, I'm unsure what you are looking for. With enough fenced pasture areas horse pasture is relatively easy to manage with rotating horses from area to area and harrowing the pastures and irrigating (or sub irrigation). The horse manure pretty much sustains the grass but it is good to combine some kind of legume like red clover with grasses to provide a nutrient supply. I like red clover, alfalfa, timothy, fescue, reed canary as a mix.

Nice mix, I wasn't very clear. I was asking if you ever sprayed tea on your fields where the horses were, was there any good or bad points from it or anything noticable at all besides some happy soil and plants

I am told on some fields in the south that use our product that the horses won't eat anything else, they have become very picky. They will but, will sniff around trying to find the (what they think) is the more nutritious stuff

Tim Wilson
10-23-2010, 12:11 PM
Nice mix, I wasn't very clear. I was asking if you ever sprayed tea on your fields where the horses were, was there any good or bad points from it or anything noticable at all besides some happy soil and plants

I am told on some fields in the south that use our product that the horses won't eat anything else, they have become very picky. They will but, will sniff around trying to find the (what they think) is the more nutritious stuff

We did not spray ACT on the fields. The fields had sufficient organic matter to be self-sustaining and we distributed our tea through our irrigation system which did not extend to the fields.

starry night
10-23-2010, 01:32 PM
........ I like red clover, alfalfa, timothy, fescue, reed canary as a mix.

That sounds fairly typical of pasture grasses here in the Midwest USA also except for the reed canary which I have never heard of. Timothy is probably our dominant horse grass. The one here that sometimes is used in pasture mixes with the most interesting name is birdsfoot trefoil. And one of the newer ones is festulolium (I love to say it; the way it rolls off the tongue.)) It is a cross of tall fescue (festuca) and Italian ryegrass (rye=lolium.)

And I agree: separate your pastures, spread the manure, and rotate the grazing or hay-making.

Tim Wilson
10-23-2010, 08:14 PM
Reed Canarygrass; great forage - gotta cut early as hay but can get extra cuts. Grows anywhere. Must be seeded with other varities or will dominate forever.

http://www.ser.org/sernw/rcg_info.asp

http://www.livinglandscapes.bc.ca/cbasin/cb_grasses/phalaris.html

My seed dealer
http://www.qualityseeds.ca/forage/grasses/marathon-reed-canary-grass.html

http://www.extension.umn.edu/distribution/livestocksystems/DI5533.html

starry night
10-23-2010, 09:35 PM
Canary grass, I didn't know until I saw the name phalaris arundinacea.
We call a varigated form of it Ribbon grass here as an ornamental in landscapes.
It's quite attractive but very aggressive, as you alluded to, Tim.

I wonder if it really is the same as is indicated by its Latin name.

andyslawncare
10-23-2010, 11:00 PM
I got a call to come price out fertilizing some property. I measured it it comes to 820,000 square feet.
I have to figure out what to charge them...
Any help?


Is this a business or residence? Almost 19 acres = WOW

Good luck

ygim
10-27-2010, 07:46 AM
Well thanks for all your input I got the job.