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MudBucket
12-16-2010, 03:57 PM
Hello Community,

I have created a lawn program that I am not sure about. I am wondering if there is a period that I cannot put down grass seed after I put down pre emergent. I live in south east Tennessee.

Please weigh in your opinions all help is greatly appreciated.

Step 1: ferti•lome For All Seasons Lawn Food Plus Crabgrass & Weed Preventer w/Prodiamine (16-0-8) Apply in January through mid April. Prevents grassy-type weeds (crabgrass and more) all season long (until fall) while it feeds your lawn.

Step 2: ferti•lome Weed-Out plus Lawn Fertilizer with Trimec® (25-0-4) Apply in late April through May. Contains three weed killers to control broadleaf weeds such as henbit, dandelion, clover, chickweed, etc., while feeding your lawn. For best results DO NOT WATER IN. If no weed control is needed, substitute with Pro-Green Lawn Tonic (16-0-0), a fertilizer specially formulated for alkaline soils.

Step 3: Natural Guard Soil Activator (Natural Soil Conditioner) Apply in spring or fall. Not a fertilizer, but this product REALLY greens up your lawn! Unlocks nutrients to improve soil structure and fertility. Enhances root development. Improves turf resistance to stress.

Step 4: ferti•lome Winterizer (25-0-6) Apply in September through October to encourage maximum growth during the peak growing season.

Step 5: ferti•lome Winterizer (25-0-6) Apply in October through December, about 30 days after your first Winterizer. Increases winter hardiness, keeps grass greener longer and promotes earlier spring green up.

Now, after seeing my program when should I put down grass seed? Do I put down seed in Fall and Spring or just Fall? And do I have to wait like 4 weeks after putting down pre emergent to put down grass seed?

Thanks!

grassman177
12-16-2010, 06:15 PM
really!!!!!???

does not sound like you have done this before, which may mean you have no license to apply chemicals. make sure you do first, it is not worth it to not and you need to learn some things......like pre emergent kills grass seed, especially prodiamine!!!

also, if you have not done this "program" on tour own lawn a few times to make sure it works then you are in for a world of hurt when something fails and someone is paying you for it!!

also, if you read the directions of a pesticide like you are supposed to do before applying it so you understand the nature of what you are using and its limitations you would know that it would tell you about seeding intervals and other useful precautions and dagers of application.

I know i sound very negative, but I am trying to help.

seeding is best done in the fall, and remember if your prodiamine pre-emergent is too strong or applied too late IT WILL interfere with seeding in the fall and still kill it.

until you are more experienced with applying i would not use the strongest of the pre emergents.

RigglePLC
12-16-2010, 09:50 PM
Grassman is right. I would skip the "Ferti-lome "Soil Activator", sounds like snake oil to me. Fertilome sounds like a consumer product--Home Depot, maybe. So you are planning to apply pesticides in two rounds. You need a pesticide spray license for that, and a pesticide business license, plus insurance. Liquid or dry its still a chemical applied for hire. Liquid weed control is far more effective than dry products--treat in spring and fall. Sow your seed in the fall, or late summer when temps come down below 85. Discuss your needs with your John Deere Landscapes dealer--he will educate you on what you need and sell you the proper professional equipment.

I wanted to apply seed for a time in fall for my program--but there were too many different types of grass.

kemco
12-17-2010, 12:22 AM
I'd wait longer than 4 weeks before seeding after using a preE, more like 8 weeks to be on the safe side. When to seed will depend on what you are seeding. I know in Memphis we are in the transition zone, im not sure Chattanooga is and I think you run a little cooler than we do. Cool season grasses (your fescues, rye, etc) are best seeded mid to late October here in Memphis, right before the growing season for the cool grasses start. For warm season grasses best time to seed is in the Spring for the same reason. Most of the warm season grasses here, at least on the vast majority of yards we cut, are the vegitative bermudas and zoysias which wont grow by seed and I wouldnt want to mix seeded varieties into the sterile vegitative ones.

Also if this program is for bermuda, St. Aug or other warm season grasses I would seriously consider rethinking your steps 4 and 5. That's a lot of nitrogen to be putting down on warm season grasses right when they are in the process of going dormant. This can open up a whole can of worms like winter kill as well as disease. If it is for cool season grasses I would have the same concern for the steps 1 and 2. Plus Im not seeing any Phosporous in your nutrient program which is very important. Your whole program is overly weighted toward nitrogen IMO which can and will stimulate lots of leaf growth but at the detriment of the root system.

Also, I am assuming you are certified and licensed for herbacide applications. State of TN requires it, big fine if you are caught applying without it. Sure you can fert without it but cant put anything down that contains any herbacide (even weed and feed products and even organic herbacide) without the license and cert. Again, you probably are licensed so forgive my rant on that.

MudBucket
12-17-2010, 09:53 AM
Thanks for the Constructive Criticism so far. I would like to clear up that I don't plan on spreading the program myself. My family has opened up a Plant Nursery this year,April being our first month in business, so I have been trying to learn as I go. My familly also owns a machine shop which is where I have spent the last 10 years of my life so that's my area of expertise.

I have just recently stepped into the role of trying to get a program in order to sell the products out of our Nursery to the public. Not that I am a Home Depot or a Lowes but I would like to sell Ferti-Lome (Hi-Yield, Natural Guard) products.

I am trying to get the program set in stone so I can stock what I want to sell but I also would like to know what I recommend is accurate.

Thanks

MudBucket
12-17-2010, 10:25 AM
Also, I tried to sit down last night and revamp the entire program. Does this look any better at all? And yes it is for fescue.

Step 1:

September

Apply Turf Fescue 5 Star which is a blend of five of the best rated dwarf turf type fescues. Example: Houndog 5, Crossfire II, Falcon II and two other top performers in the National Turf Trials. Choice components in this quality turfgrass blend give this turfgrass a dark green, deep rooted and drought tolerant lawn. University tests show that varieties offered as components of 5-Star are high in disease resistance to the brown patch fungus that occurs in hot, humid areas. 5-Star blend is an evergreen lawn year-round.

Or

Kentucky 31 Fescue which is a tall fescue used for both turf and forage. Shows better tolerance of climatic extremes than most other tall fescue varieties producing rather coarse, moderately open turf with a rapid rate of leaf elongation. Moderate tolerance of net blotch, Rhizoctonia brown patch and crown rusts.


Step 2:

October
Apply Fertilome New Lawn Starter 9-13-7 for new lawns (if you did seed in September) or Fertilome Winterizer 10-0-14 for established lawns (you did not seed in September). Fall feeding is one of the most critical feeding times. A healthy and stable plant can endure the hardship of winter better than a weak plant. Winterizer builds winter hardiness, stem strength and disease resistance in lawns, trees and shrubs. You may be tempted to put a crabgrass pre-emergent down in September but that may not be necessary (Tennessee). Remember, use pre-emergent for summer weeds around March 1 (crabgrass is a summer weed and its seeds germinate when soil temperatures are upward of 50 degrees F); for winter weeds, use pre-emergent around mid-September (if fall grass seed is not being applied).


Step 3:

Late February – Early March

Apply Fertilome For All Seasons Lawn Food 16-0-8 for Fescue grass fertilization and pre-emergent of grassy and broadleaf weeds.



Step 4:

April

Apply Turf Fescue 5 Star which is a blend of five of the best rated dwarf turf type fescues. Example: Houndog 5, Crossfire II, Falcon II and two other top performers in the National Turf Trials. Choice components in this quality turfgrass blend give this turfgrass a dark green, deep rooted and drought tolerant lawn. University tests show that varieties offered as components of 5-Star are high in disease resistance to the brown patch fungus that occurs in hot, humid areas. 5-Star blend is an evergreen lawn year-round.

Or

Kentucky 31 Fescue which is a tall fescue used for both turf and forage. Shows better tolerance of climatic extremes than most other tall fescue varieties producing rather coarse, moderately open turf with a rapid rate of leaf elongation. Moderate tolerance of net blotch, Rhizoctonia brown patch and crown rusts.



Step 5:

May - August


In May, apply Crabgrass Preventer Plus Lawn Food 20-0-3 slow release food to keep the lawn looking good all summer while giving it a second dose of crabgrass prevention. If temperature permits as grass becomes seasonally yellowish, you may want to use Fertilome Lawn Food Plus Iron 28-0-4 which will help to make your Fescue greener by adding Nitrogen, Potash and Iron to the grass. As temperatures rise during the evening, you may also want to consider a PMI program which includes F-Stop for lawn fungus or Hi-Yield Turf Ranger Insect Control Granules for control of those home lawn insects, e.g., ants, fire ants, fleas, crickets, grasshoppers, etc. or try our Fertilome Weed Free Zone for those difficult to kill specific weeds (controls over 80 of the toughest to control broadleaf weeds).

RigglePLC
12-17-2010, 02:48 PM
Mud, sounds better. But you don't really need thye phosphorus--phos has been outlawed in Michigan, Minnesota and some other states due to the contamination and weed growth in lakes. My opinion--I would recommend you customers Never buy K-31 tall fescue--its cheap and its just going to become a serious problem as a weed grass. Probably you need a separate program for irrigated lawns. They can take fert in hot weather--when everything else is brown. Also I see nothing for the worst problem on turf--GRUBS. Non-irrigated lawns will probably need seed in late summer when temps fall below 85 and at least 6 weeks before frost.

grassman177
12-17-2010, 02:57 PM
the five star fescue is a great blend, used it for years. i love it.

it does not need very much N like other varieties to stay green either. the only reason it wont be green is due to soil issues i have found.