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joed
12-19-2010, 10:59 PM
I do lawncare part-time during the spring/summer/fall. I don't do any snowplowing. I'm looking to get a new truck this winter. Would a 2WD with a locking differential or limited slip be o.k. for my use? Does a locking differential work well in snow. We usually get 4-6" each snowstorm. The extra cost to go to a 4X4 for most manufacturers is $4K or so. Thanks.

Gravel Rat
12-20-2010, 12:04 AM
Are you looking at brand new ? what size of pick up ?

You live in Eastern Canada and have snow/winter for 4 months of the year I wouldn't fool around with a 2wd pickup truck. If your going with a 450/550 you can get away with 2wd but a regular 1/2 ton or 3/4 ton buy a 4x4.

Pick up trucks are so light on the azz end you can get stuck on anything.

STIHL GUY
12-21-2010, 02:51 PM
if you dont do much driving in the snow it should be fine...just make sure you have good tires and plenty of weight in the bed ex. sand bags or something to give you more weight and traction

bradseabridge
12-21-2010, 02:57 PM
I have a 2wd long bed f150 I just put 10 50 pound sandbags in the contractor box and put it at the back of the truck and then move the regular toolbox back butted up against that. I also air down the tires as well. We just for 5 inches and I had no problems and I'm driving a 5-speed. As long as you are confortable in snow and know what you are doing you'll be fine. It's the idiots that lose their minds when they see snow that cause the problems. I was driving all over the place in the last snow storm, driving past idiots with 4wd that were stuck. I just laugh and wave at them.

GreenI.A.
12-21-2010, 09:20 PM
it really comes down to a pretty simple question if your not plowing -

Can other people drive 2wd rear wheel drive trucks, vans, or cars in your erea?

I'm asuming yes. I think I used to keep only 300 lbs of sand bags in the back of the 04 chevy 1500 i used to have, my drive way a the time was 300 feet long, never plowed or snowblowed and about 100ft of it was going up at around 30% slope. The truck did it no problem with 6" of fresh snow. It got a little tricky once the snow was packed down and iced over.

4 wheel drive will come in handy if you have to pull your truck up in a muddy area to load or unload brush and stuff like that

Jpocket
12-26-2010, 07:23 PM
You are fooling yourself. 4wd doesnt cost that much more, and if you live in an area that recieves regular snow in winter, I wouldn't be without it. If you are on here asking if you 'really' need it then you should probably have it.

bradseabridge
12-26-2010, 08:02 PM
It snows like 3-4 times where I live and I drive my 2wd everywhere when 4wd idiots are getting stuck.. Do I need it?

MDLawn
12-28-2010, 04:35 PM
I do lawncare part-time during the spring/summer/fall. I don't do any snowplowing. I'm looking to get a new truck this winter. Would a 2WD with a locking differential or limited slip be o.k. for my use? Does a locking differential work well in snow. We usually get 4-6" each snowstorm. The extra cost to go to a 4X4 for most manufacturers is $4K or so. Thanks.


I think there are a few ways to look at this. Most maufacturers offer garbage limited slip systems, at least my Ford does. Some are now offering electronic locking differerntials for an extra cost($300-500), but you may have to order this in a 2wd pickup. The next and maybe the most important part in the winter traction situation is tires. 2wd's are not coming with with anything more than a street tire. So now you invest in better tires, lets say just the rears ($300-500). If you pick up a truck without a good limited slip you will have to buy one and pay a shop to do it. Depending on the locking differential you are looking at $700-1000 for the part and installation. Also fully locking (not limited slip) differentials are really bad in icy conditions and actually cause more slipping at speed. So for $1500 or more you can upgrade a 2wd. So now you may get closer to that 4k figure, would have been better just to buy 4wd. I know there is someone who will say that you dont need a 4wd and that a 2wd can go anywhere a 4x4 can. I live in a snowy area and I think I use my 4wd more in the summer months at the landscape dump as that place is a mess. But when a foot of snow falls the 4wd will shine when you need to go up a slight snow filled incline. The 2wd....spinning tires and slipping sideways, I know I had one. How many times are you in that situation????

The other consideration, do you NEED a brand new truck? I bought a 2006 in 2008, saved a bundle. Semi loaded truck at nearly half the price of new. Now you can get some creature and capability comforts. Your choice. I think I would sacrifice buying a used truck that is more capable than a new one with less for the same price. But only you know what you need. If you are only doing lawn care and never venture off the road 2wd will serve the business end of that fine. I'd still buy used because the truck wont lose a ton of value when you buy it. That way if the 2wd isnt working for you the chance of being able to sell it is better. I know this because my trucks value right now is way above what I owe on it. Just put all your pros and cons together and make your decision.

Again just my thoughts

joed
12-28-2010, 06:55 PM
I think there are a few ways to look at this. Most maufacturers offer garbage limited slip systems, at least my Ford does. Some are now offering electronic locking differerntials for an extra cost($300-500), but you may have to order this in a 2wd pickup. The next and maybe the most important part in the winter traction situation is tires. 2wd's are not coming with with anything more than a street tire. So now you invest in better tires, lets say just the rears ($300-500). If you pick up a truck without a good limited slip you will have to buy one and pay a shop to do it. Depending on the locking differential you are looking at $700-1000 for the part and installation. Also fully locking (not limited slip) differentials are really bad in icy conditions and actually cause more slipping at speed. So for $1500 or more you can upgrade a 2wd. So now you may get closer to that 4k figure, would have been better just to buy 4wd. I know there is someone who will say that you dont need a 4wd and that a 2wd can go anywhere a 4x4 can. I live in a snowy area and I think I use my 4wd more in the summer months at the landscape dump as that place is a mess. But when a foot of snow falls the 4wd will shine when you need to go up a slight snow filled incline. The 2wd....spinning tires and slipping sideways, I know I had one. How many times are you in that situation????

The other consideration, do you NEED a brand new truck? I bought a 2006 in 2008, saved a bundle. Semi loaded truck at nearly half the price of new. Now you can get some creature and capability comforts. Your choice. I think I would sacrifice buying a used truck that is more capable than a new one with less for the same price. But only you know what you need. If you are only doing lawn care and never venture off the road 2wd will serve the business end of that fine. I'd still buy used because the truck wont lose a ton of value when you buy it. That way if the 2wd isnt working for you the chance of being able to sell it is better. I know this because my trucks value right now is way above what I owe on it. Just put all your pros and cons together and make your decision.

Again just my thoughts

Thanks for the advice. It's very good and I appreciate it. I think I'll go with the 4X4. As for used, I have no problems going with a used. It's just that all three, Dodge, GM, Ford have such big rebates up here that the cost of a good used truck is not that much less than a brand new one. That's why I was considering new. I guess the next question would be whether to go GM, Ford, or Dodge. I like all 3. They are also pretty much priced the same. I'd like to get the truck that's the most fuel efficient. That would leave me looking at GM's 5.3L/6 speed auto, Dodge's 5.7L Hemi/5 speed auto, or Ford's 3.7L or 3.5L ecoboost. If I were to go used, I'd pretty look at Ford's 4.6L/6 speed combo from 2009 and 2010. Any thoughts on any of these combinations?

MDLawn
12-28-2010, 08:58 PM
Thanks for the advice. It's very good and I appreciate it. I think I'll go with the 4X4. As for used, I have no problems going with a used. It's just that all three, Dodge, GM, Ford have such big rebates up here that the cost of a good used truck is not that much less than a brand new one. That's why I was considering new. I guess the next question would be whether to go GM, Ford, or Dodge. I like all 3. They are also pretty much priced the same. I'd like to get the truck that's the most fuel efficient. That would leave me looking at GM's 5.3L/6 speed auto, Dodge's 5.7L Hemi/5 speed auto, or Ford's 3.7L or 3.5L ecoboost. If I were to go used, I'd pretty look at Ford's 4.6L/6 speed combo from 2009 and 2010. Any thoughts on any of these combinations?


I think the debate between trucks depends on what you like. Ford people are pro Ford, Chevy people, pro Chevy, etc.... With the half tons I know that the 05 F150 I had drove like a dream. I've driven Fords all my life and probably will continue to. Understandable if the rebates are too good to pass by for buying new. Trucks, fuel effieciency, and capability really don't go hand in hand but a 2wd 1/2 ton should get you good mileage. With the extended cab 4x4 150 I used to own I averaged 15mpg with the 5.4. Make sure that the engine/truck combo will be adequate enough to pull the trailer and your equipment. With only lawn mowing you should be fine, but make sure. If you ever expanded into larger stuff you'll need the capacity of a larger and more powerful truck. I'm glad I upgraded to the 3/4ton but I do more landscaping and haul a heavy trailer. But I only drive the truck during business and a car otherwise so I am not dealing with the 8-11mpgs all the time.

Gravel Rat
12-29-2010, 02:13 PM
For a pickup truck either Ford or a Chev I wouldn't consider a Dodge with a Hemi, know a few people with them they like the power just don't like the fuel mileage.

Good to see you decided to go with a 4x4, I own a 2wd F-450 but I would NEVER own a 2wd pickup, driven many 2wd pickups and they are a pain you can get stuck on a banana peal. A pick up is so light on the back end there is no traction.

MDLawn
12-29-2010, 02:38 PM
For a pickup truck either Ford or a Chev I wouldn't consider a Dodge with a Hemi, know a few people with them they like the power just don't like the fuel mileage.

Good to see you decided to go with a 4x4, I own a 2wd F-450 but I would NEVER own a 2wd pickup, driven many 2wd pickups and they are a pain you can get stuck on a banana peal. A pick up is so light on the back end there is no traction.


This is the truth!! I'm assuming the 450 does better because of a dump bed or service body?

GreenI.A.
12-29-2010, 02:39 PM
I think I have to take back what I said about a 2wd being enough if you are not going to be plowing or driving in harsh weather. This weekend the North East was hit with a blizzard, sunday Sunday night with aboout 10" of fresh snow in my driveway I passed out in my basement and hit my head from severe dehydration. Obviously my girlfriends awd car wasn't getting out of the driveway and my 2wd pick up would be no help either. But she was able to get my SUV out of the driveway and me to the ER with no problem even though many of the streets hadnt been plowed in ours with 4+ of snow since the plows last past

Gravel Rat
12-29-2010, 09:35 PM
This is the truth!! I'm assuming the 450 does better because of a dump bed or service body?

Dual wheels and weight of the body helps with the traction, in snow you need to chain up. F-450/550 trucks are so heavy empty start spinning wheels in soft ground you sink faster than you can say oh chit.

360ci
01-02-2011, 09:44 PM
If you drive tons of miles throughout the year the 2wd is the more economical choice. Less fuel, less maintenance, and yes, less traction in inclement weather.

For the amount I really need 4wd on the street a 2wd would suit me here in Ontario. I had an old 1990 C1500 GMC 5.0L and it did fine in the winter; with the right tires. Cheap out on tires, and you'll find yourself without traction when accelerating, especially up hills where you do not want to veer sideways. Newer vehicles with proper traction control that limit power, etc, prevent mishaps but it can be a slower process even with no traffic on the roads in a 2wd. If that extra 10 seconds it takes to get across town makes a difference to your schedule in the winter, then go 4wd.

4wd for me is mostly for trail use, and at the time I got a great deal on my Durango R/T which has full time 4wd. I test drove a part time system truck and they're on par with a decent 2wd truck in the winter anyway, as you can't lock the axles together unless the entire road is snow covered or turn the wheel too much and you'll risk binding the axles.

Older GM trucks had a full time 4wd (auto) system which was great. Newer HD's to my knowledge from Ford at least don't offer this.

I have a car for winter driving use as well as my Durango, but I don't purposely drive the Durango here and there just because it snowed out when the car is more economical. My car can't tow more than 1K on a good day but for transferring light things in my smaller trailer it does the job fine. No, I don't trailer in winter. I used my car more in the winter when I had my old 2wd GMC because again, it was more economical and yes, provided better traction being front wheel drive.

I will agree for heavier trucks (dually), 2wd is plenty. The heavier base weight is more than plenty to plow through most weather conditions. If it's any consolation I have a 3500 Sprinter in another fleet with a reefer box on it (14') and with Transforce A/T tires all around, it is quite remarkable in bad weather conditions. The traction control rarely comes on unless there's ice under the snow and I give it more than 25% throttle on take off.

joed
01-02-2011, 09:51 PM
360ci,
Thanks for the great advice. I'm leaning toward the 4X4. I'm looking at new or used:
New
I'm looking at the Ford with the 3.7L for fuel economy. Can only get an XL ext. cab in 4X4 mode with this engine.
Also looking at GM with the 4.8/4 speed combo or 5.3/6 speed combo. The 5.3 is a $2K Canadian option. I test drove the 5.3 and found the 6 speed to be quirky. Never seems to know what gear to be in. The 4.8 and 4 speed were very peppy and smooth. On paper the 5.3 is supposed to be better for gas over the 4.8. Do you have any experience with either engine?

Used
Probably looking at the Ford F150 in a 2010 model with the 4.6L. Any experience with that this combo?

Always been a GM guy but the Ford seems to have surpassed the GM which looks like a dated truck to me.

360ci
01-02-2011, 10:45 PM
360ci,
Thanks for the great advice. I'm leaning toward the 4X4. I'm looking at new or used:
New
I'm looking at the Ford with the 3.7L for fuel economy. Can only get an XL ext. cab in 4X4 mode with this engine.
Also looking at GM with the 4.8/4 speed combo or 5.3/6 speed combo. The 5.3 is a $2K Canadian option. I test drove the 5.3 and found the 6 speed to be quirky. Never seems to know what gear to be in. The 4.8 and 4 speed were very peppy and smooth. On paper the 5.3 is supposed to be better for gas over the 4.8. Do you have any experience with either engine?

Used
Probably looking at the Ford F150 in a 2010 model with the 4.6L. Any experience with that this combo?

Always been a GM guy but the Ford seems to have surpassed the GM which looks like a dated truck to me.

We're always raped for prices up here in Canada. I think the 4.8/4 speed will work, but I wouldn't use either to plow - you will want a 2500. A 1500 GM HD is more for the extra towing capacity, not necessarily front end payload to support a snow plow. Again, check your weights before you buy. If you want a V plow, you'll need a 2500, straight blade at 7 feet (steel commercial grade) with mount and you'll look at a good 850-900lbs with hydraulics.

The 5.3 V8 is a good engine. If I went with the 4.8/4 speed, I'd make sure to get the 3.73 gears, as the 3.08 can only tow about 5K and consistently shifts on the highway in and out of overdrive even for slight hills. When towing, 3.73 gears will net you better fuel economy in the long run instead of running consistently with the lower rear axle ratio and overdrive shut off.

A friend of mine bought a 2010 5.3/6 speed more as a novelty. I went with him on a couple trips to bike shows (more coming up in a week!) and he said he can get 18mpg easily on the highway (he has 3.42 axle by the way) when using cruise control as it keeps the cylinder deactivation running longer, or V4 mode. I believe it's due to better computer programming whereas not using cruise the vehicle anticipates the need for more power use more often even if it's not called for by the driver, so it's less often running in V4 mode with the cruise not in use.

Obviously your mileage will vary. I'm not too familiar with the newer Ford axles, but would imagine that a 3.55 is standard fare with the 3.7L V6. I think with a reg cab as you had mentioned, would be fair with running 4wd. It should be on par with the GM 4.8/4 speed in terms of performance and mileage. If it's anything like my older Taurus, Ford knowingly has perfected the gear ratios, as I think it's one of their engineering highlights. The 3.7L should also be priced lower than a comparable GM V8 with tow package which is an added bonus!!

GM trucks are getting dated, but overall they generally do get the better mileage as GM's have always weighed less than the competition while offering similar gearing and power. GM's interiors haven't had a major redesign since the early 2000's. They've been tweaked here and there, but the design is still plenty functional.

joed
01-03-2011, 07:31 AM
We're always raped for prices up here in Canada. I think the 4.8/4 speed will work, but I wouldn't use either to plow - you will want a 2500. A 1500 GM HD is more for the extra towing capacity, not necessarily front end payload to support a snow plow. Again, check your weights before you buy. If you want a V plow, you'll need a 2500, straight blade at 7 feet (steel commercial grade) with mount and you'll look at a good 850-900lbs with hydraulics.

The 5.3 V8 is a good engine. If I went with the 4.8/4 speed, I'd make sure to get the 3.73 gears, as the 3.08 can only tow about 5K and consistently shifts on the highway in and out of overdrive even for slight hills. When towing, 3.73 gears will net you better fuel economy in the long run instead of running consistently with the lower rear axle ratio and overdrive shut off.

A friend of mine bought a 2010 5.3/6 speed more as a novelty. I went with him on a couple trips to bike shows (more coming up in a week!) and he said he can get 18mpg easily on the highway (he has 3.42 axle by the way) when using cruise control as it keeps the cylinder deactivation running longer, or V4 mode. I believe it's due to better computer programming whereas not using cruise the vehicle anticipates the need for more power use more often even if it's not called for by the driver, so it's less often running in V4 mode with the cruise not in use.

Obviously your mileage will vary. I'm not too familiar with the newer Ford axles, but would imagine that a 3.55 is standard fare with the 3.7L V6. I think with a reg cab as you had mentioned, would be fair with running 4wd. It should be on par with the GM 4.8/4 speed in terms of performance and mileage. If it's anything like my older Taurus, Ford knowingly has perfected the gear ratios, as I think it's one of their engineering highlights. The 3.7L should also be priced lower than a comparable GM V8 with tow package which is an added bonus!!

GM trucks are getting dated, but overall they generally do get the better mileage as GM's have always weighed less than the competition while offering similar gearing and power. GM's interiors haven't had a major redesign since the early 2000's. They've been tweaked here and there, but the design is still plenty functional.

Thanks for the input. I'm stuck on which truck to get. Number one priority is fuel economy. I like GM trucks but I don't feel good about dropping $30-35K on a new truck even with rebates because the GM truck is outdated. The 4.8 would be fine for me but the 4 speed auto. is outdated too. The 5.3 is nice but spending $2K more doesn't make sense. I'd be fine with the 3.7 V6 on the Ford but you can only get it in XL trim, which has nothing in it. I also don't like the fact that the Ford is so high up off the ground. I even saw a used duramax diesel for sale. 2009 model with 32K on it. The owner used it to pull a 16 foot enclosed trailer. I imagine fuel economy should be good but maintenance must be very expensive. What to do?

360ci
01-03-2011, 10:18 AM
Thanks for the input. I'm stuck on which truck to get. Number one priority is fuel economy. I like GM trucks but I don't feel good about dropping $30-35K on a new truck even with rebates because the GM truck is outdated. The 4.8 would be fine for me but the 4 speed auto. is outdated too. The 5.3 is nice but spending $2K more doesn't make sense. I'd be fine with the 3.7 V6 on the Ford but you can only get it in XL trim, which has nothing in it. I also don't like the fact that the Ford is so high up off the ground. I even saw a used duramax diesel for sale. 2009 model with 32K on it. The owner used it to pull a 16 foot enclosed trailer. I imagine fuel economy should be good but maintenance must be very expensive. What to do?

I find with buying used is that you really don't know the history. I can sell my Durango and tell you that all it's towed is the ski-doo a few times a year. Meanwhile, I've hooked up dump trailers hauling mulch and garden supplies every weekend not to mention a float trailer and small bobcat once....

Diesels are meant to do more work but if the owner cannot provide maintenance history from new, back away. Normally, personal trucks are better maintained than fleet vehicles.

A one to two year old GM is $12-20K off depending on model trim. If the miles are low it might be a worthwhile buy. I picked up my Durango at an out of town auction that a cousin of mine told me about (car salesman, ha). Needless to say it rained that day and I got it for nearly $7K under list on the used market. It went for $4K less than a similar, older, Tahoe with same miles and the 5.3L 4 speed combo.

I hate to say Toyota, as the 5.7L V8 was extensively tested in the field for abuse handling but, the Toy's have a terribly low payload capacity, and they're rather expensive. Similar traits with Nissan and their Titan, who also had some recalls over the years pertaining to drive line problems (axles, gears, etc).

If fuel economy is the priority a used (1 year old) GM might be up your alley for $10K off the list price and a few miles on it. I lucked out with my '99 Taurus as it was kept over at the dealer as a demo model before I picked it up. A year old with only 46kms (only 44, no 0's!) and I got it for $6K off as it was a 'demo', meaning people sat it in, but it stayed in the showroom for the most part. $6K off... stored inside... can't go wrong other than seeing a few finger prints here and there around the interior.

I tend to be overly cautious when going used, mostly because owners lie 95% of the time about things just to get their vehicle gone, and to have your money in their hand. A thorough test drive is of course required!

joed
01-03-2011, 08:48 PM
I find with buying used is that you really don't know the history. I can sell my Durango and tell you that all it's towed is the ski-doo a few times a year. Meanwhile, I've hooked up dump trailers hauling mulch and garden supplies every weekend not to mention a float trailer and small bobcat once....

Diesels are meant to do more work but if the owner cannot provide maintenance history from new, back away. Normally, personal trucks are better maintained than fleet vehicles.

A one to two year old GM is $12-20K off depending on model trim. If the miles are low it might be a worthwhile buy. I picked up my Durango at an out of town auction that a cousin of mine told me about (car salesman, ha). Needless to say it rained that day and I got it for nearly $7K under list on the used market. It went for $4K less than a similar, older, Tahoe with same miles and the 5.3L 4 speed combo.

I hate to say Toyota, as the 5.7L V8 was extensively tested in the field for abuse handling but, the Toy's have a terribly low payload capacity, and they're rather expensive. Similar traits with Nissan and their Titan, who also had some recalls over the years pertaining to drive line problems (axles, gears, etc).

If fuel economy is the priority a used (1 year old) GM might be up your alley for $10K off the list price and a few miles on it. I lucked out with my '99 Taurus as it was kept over at the dealer as a demo model before I picked it up. A year old with only 46kms (only 44, no 0's!) and I got it for $6K off as it was a 'demo', meaning people sat it in, but it stayed in the showroom for the most part. $6K off... stored inside... can't go wrong other than seeing a few finger prints here and there around the interior.

I tend to be overly cautious when going used, mostly because owners lie 95% of the time about things just to get their vehicle gone, and to have your money in their hand. A thorough test drive is of course required!

Thanks for the advice. I guess I'll have to choose from one of:
4.8 and 4 speed GM
5.3 and 6 speed GM
4.6 and 6 speed Ford
3.7 and 6 speed Ford
I wonder if the 4 speed won't hurt the resale value of the truck some 10 years from now when no one will be driving a 4 speed auto. Tough choice as neither truck has all that I want. I don't get why GM wouldn't offer the 6 speed on the 4.8. I'm guessing it might improve fuel economy by 3-5%. I understand GM is coming out with a new truck in 2013. I wonder if it would be worth the wait?

360ci
01-03-2011, 09:03 PM
Thanks for the advice. I guess I'll have to choose from one of:
4.8 and 4 speed GM
5.3 and 6 speed GM
4.6 and 6 speed Ford
3.7 and 6 speed Ford
I wonder if the 4 speed won't hurt the resale value of the truck some 10 years from now when no one will be driving a 4 speed auto. Tough choice as neither truck has all that I want. I don't get why GM wouldn't offer the 6 speed on the 4.8. I'm guessing it might improve fuel economy by 3-5%. I understand GM is coming out with a new truck in 2013. I wonder if it would be worth the wait?

Well, older GM's are going down in resale. It's not a matter of being able to sell it, but a matter of if it'll be worth while to sell after you abuse it.... The plus side, 4 speeds are EVERYWHERE and a lot less money to replace down the road. In five years or so I bet 6 speed autos will still be a hard to get item, as most manufacturers are struggling to make capacity for their new trucks, never mind spares. However, as the auto industry changes as fast as the weather, who knows what will become of things in the next half decade!

I think the 6 speed on the 4.8L would increase mileage better than a few percentage points. It depends on the axle ratio, etc. It weighs about 80lbs less than the 5.3L block which ads to usable payload capacity. Also, as I mentioned above, GM first only had enough 6 speeds to produce them for the Cadillac trucks/SUVs. The factory has increased capacity to cover the 5.3 and 6.0L models now, but I can't see it being enough to cover the 4.8L as well, not to mention GM would have to spend a million or two to engineer certain parts for it to mate up properly.

The solid reason why I don't think GM at least offers the 6 speed with the 4.8L is primarily for profit, or lack thereof. The 5.3L and 6 speed is a $2K option in Ontario here, and how much does that really cost GM? Not even half. I 'think' the other reasoning is to keep the base V8 and 4 speed auto lower cost for the 'working man'. You can get the 4.8L and 3.08 axle ratio if you want mileage, and I have yet to become a fan of cylinder deactivation. It's one of those techs that lead me to want to lease and trade it in every few years rather than work it until it's past being worthless without sinking too much cash into it to keep it on the road. No, I won't get into the lease/finance argument. It's always best to pay cash - more incentives that way if you have it lying around.

If a new truck does come out, you'll have two years to get a good deal on a current model if you don't like the new one, but be warned, as when the new model is advertised with a release date, 'like fall 2013', you won't be able to order a current model past spring 2013 before production changes to the new model.

If I wasn't after a plow truck, I'd snatch up a 4.8L 4 speed as a new ride. I have the money for a honkin huge diesel, but I don't need it and it's not economical. I didn't enlarge my savings by getting a vehicle that I not only don't need, but know I'll never use it to it's full capability.

My 1990 GMC C1500 served me well. It was a bare bones 2wd work truck. People wonder why the economy is going under: Just point to you're neighbours $100K lux truck parked in their driveway that'll be lucky to see rain. New 2011 GMC Denali HD.... why? To compete with the Ford King Ranch trim of course, which is a fine waste of money, but a waste of money nonetheless. Businesses stay in business buy not buying more than what they need. If you can get by on a more economical V6 truck, then hey why not? Canada again is terrible for offering mid level trims with larger engines that are unnecessary for most owners. Besides, few folks even drive their vehicles beyond 1/10th of what they're capable of. It's downright sad.

Gravel Rat
01-03-2011, 11:56 PM
Most dealers have these big expensive trucks on their lots and people buy them. Who needs a frigging King Ranch that costs you 75,000 for a freaking diesel pickup truck.

360ci
01-04-2011, 12:11 AM
Most dealers have these big expensive trucks on their lots and people buy them. Who needs a frigging King Ranch that costs you 75,000 for a freaking diesel pickup truck.

Exactly. What people, even if they wish to spend foolishly, don't realize is that this tells automakers that there is a 'market' for super high fancy trim level TRUCKS, and that's what they build tons of because they make their money on the options/extra goodies. Then these are the same people who later lose clients that they were depending on to pay their $2K a month truck payment. Or, they complain about the price of fuel when they use it more as a daily driver than a work TRUCK. I should've finished my doctorate and found a cure for stupid. The problem, is that people won't clue in to the facts that they need the cure which would make my efforts irrelevant...blimey shame...

joed
01-05-2011, 12:47 PM
Exactly. What people, even if they wish to spend foolishly, don't realize is that this tells automakers that there is a 'market' for super high fancy trim level TRUCKS, and that's what they build tons of because they make their money on the options/extra goodies. Then these are the same people who later lose clients that they were depending on to pay their $2K a month truck payment. Or, they complain about the price of fuel when they use it more as a daily driver than a work TRUCK. I should've finished my doctorate and found a cure for stupid. The problem, is that people won't clue in to the facts that they need the cure which would make my efforts irrelevant...blimey shame...

360,
Do you know what your friend with the 5.3/6 speed gets in the city for mileage? I went to the website:www.fueleconomy.gov It has the 4.8/4 speed rated at 13 mpg city and 18 mpg highway while the 5.3 is rated at 15 mpg city and 21 mpg highway. This is the U.S. govt rating system. It's apparently much more accurate than Transport Canada.

360ci
01-05-2011, 02:18 PM
360,
Do you know what your friend with the 5.3/6 speed gets in the city for mileage? I went to the website:www.fueleconomy.gov It has the 4.8/4 speed rated at 13 mpg city and 18 mpg highway while the 5.3 is rated at 15 mpg city and 21 mpg highway. This is the U.S. govt rating system. It's apparently much more accurate than Transport Canada.

I'm not sure what he gets, but I'd bet no more than 13mpg as he has a heavy foot in the city. If you were very cautious (only) can I see anyone getting 15mpg in town with a V8. Now, if you speed up fast and get into top gear, then V4 mode will kick in when you coast.

SimonCX
01-05-2011, 04:15 PM
I have a 2wd mason dump thats only used for lawn maintance, doesn't get used for plowing and rarely goes off the pavement. No point in getting 4wd if you really don't need it. Our plow trucks on the other hand I prefer 4wd, just in case.

joed
01-05-2011, 08:53 PM
I'm not sure what he gets, but I'd bet no more than 13mpg as he has a heavy foot in the city. If you were very cautious (only) can I see anyone getting 15mpg in town with a V8. Now, if you speed up fast and get into top gear, then V4 mode will kick in when you coast.

Thanks for the information. While looking at a GM dealer today, they had a hybrid 4X4 left from 2010. They were asking $35K for it. Don't know how true the fuel economy was but it was rated at 10.5L/100Km in the city. Have you heard anything about these hybrid Sierras?

joed
01-05-2011, 09:49 PM
I'm not sure what he gets, but I'd bet no more than 13mpg as he has a heavy foot in the city. If you were very cautious (only) can I see anyone getting 15mpg in town with a V8. Now, if you speed up fast and get into top gear, then V4 mode will kick in when you coast.

360,
I also saw a couple of specials for a 2011 Dodge Ram Quad Cab 4X4. One is the STX model for $25, 995 and the other is the SLT model for $29, 495. Both come with the 4.7L and 5 speed auto. Any experience with this engine?

360ci
01-06-2011, 01:16 AM
360,
I also saw a couple of specials for a 2011 Dodge Ram Quad Cab 4X4. One is the STX model for $25, 995 and the other is the SLT model for $29, 495. Both come with the 4.7L and 5 speed auto. Any experience with this engine?

No. I don't know much about their newer V8's. I know earlier (2000-2001) 4.7L engines had sludge problems due to too-small oil passageways for the oil drain intervals that Chrysler (at the time) recommended.

Latest versions (according to reports from my dodge forum) are in good favour from what I've read. A few HEMI owners complained of a tapping noise over the 100K mark, but nothing too major...

GreenI.A.
01-06-2011, 10:33 AM
Most dealers have these big expensive trucks on their lots and people buy them. Who needs a frigging King Ranch that costs you 75,000 for a freaking diesel pickup truck.

I shouldn't even say this, but I've been looking at the new 3500 HD dually Denali Pick-up

360ci
01-06-2011, 10:35 AM
I shouldn't even say this, but I've been looking at the new 3500 HD dually Denali Pick-up

Why shouldn't you say it?? Hell, you're more than welcome to 'look' just as long as you don't buy ha

GreenI.A.
01-06-2011, 10:44 AM
Why shouldn't you say it?? Hell, you're more than welcome to 'look' just as long as you don't buy ha

Ohh no I'm strongly considering buying, I'll be trading in my Denali (daily driver not work truck) I won't use this truck daily for work, It will be more for my daily driver (don't mention fuel I already know) and for towing. I plan on picking up a 5th wheel camper soon so I need something better for towing and want to keep with the luxury. Then I'll down grade my work truck to a 1500

360ci
01-06-2011, 11:07 AM
That'll work!