Why Wright over Great Dane ? Is there a major difference ?

[Turf Dancer]

The question I have is why are so many people more towards wright than Great dane ? I have had a demo on three Danes and the salesman came 210 miles to bring these machines for a one man show to demo. I can't seem to get any other dealers that are closer to demo anything . I thought the danes seemed like a great machine other than the scamper that I tested was kind of different as far as the controls on a walk behind. I am new to the big boy toys and I want to make the right choice the first time. I would like to if possible buy my machines from the guy I have been dealing with that did the dane demo , they also sell other machines as well : Dane, Honda, Bobcat,Ferris,Toro, Cub Cadet Pro, and I think one other. I have also heard alot about the Exmarks on here ? not sure about them

[AL Inc]

TD-I own a Stander and don't know why people favor one over the other. I've said it before- go with the machine from a dealer you know and trust. Someone to stand behind the machine and possibly fix it while you wait. Personally, I have a great dealer and will buy the equipment lines that they sell. I don't look anywhere else. I don't care about saving a few hundred on a machine, I can lose that money in one day if a machine goes down and can't be fixed quickly. Mike

[KLMlawn]

I also, have Wright Standers and have experience with Exmark too. There is a certain element of valididty in what AL Inc. says regarding doing busing with a dealer you are comfortable with, OR at least having a shop close by that you do business with often enough that would drop everything to help you, whether you purchased that particular machine there or not.
I happen to utilize both of these ideals in that I still look to see who might have the best price and availability on a certain peice of equipment I am looking to buy, but still have a shop that I do business with where the guys are great, if I have a problem, I can usually just pull in and tell them what is wrong, and one of them jumps right on it.
Personally I have demo-ed a GD and didn't like it, but it also had a vangard motor on it ... so now two reasons I don't like them !!
I still feel that the Wright is better built and more solid, and with regular maintenance, will last you far longer.
I think Exmark makes a fine product also, and I would probably have purchased one of their units (either a Turf Tracer HP or a Lazer HP) if trailer space wasn't an issue. Stander's save on trailer space BIG TIME!

[Doc Pete]

From what I've heard there's a big difference in the two machines. It seems it's in the patents for where the wheels/ motor must be located and where you stand. If you look at both machines there are different and as I understand it, one tracks much better on hills, up and down. I'm sure someone here is savy enough to know the answer.
Pete

[KLMlawn]

Switchless is correct, there is a difference in their design as per a settlement between Wright and Dane. This topic has been discussed at length in previous threads ... if you do a search on "Wright", you should find much information regarding it as well as the Great Dane. There is even a thread, which I believe Switchless is refering to, were Bill Wright (owner of Wright Manufacturing) responded and set the record straight as to what patent issues were in conflict and their overall result ... Wright won. Wright's design was the original, Dane was a copy and had to change their design ... for better or worse will be up to you to decide. If you want to know which I think is better ... just look below :cool:

[Bunton Guy]

Great Dane standers used to be awesome....then about the time that stander hit the market dane was bought out by John Deere and thats about the time when it hit the shitter.....deere started putting togather the Danes alot cheaper and mocking danes style with a green paint over danes equipment and putting the ones with the Deere sticker on them togather alot tighter and alot better.

[Flex-Deck]

Both good machines, Have a guy in Florida with a Wright Stander and he wants a Flex-Deck because he sees the trimming and flexibility to contour mow. The Dane is a fixed deck when down, where ours floats with terrain to contour mow.

Also the BIGGEST difference is the dane is lateral and behind the main deck so it can not mow between narrow bushes etc like the Flex-Deck which is on the front corner, and moves straight sideways when turning the machine. - I think the animated trimming moves on my web page shows this www.flex-deck.com

Thanks, Brad

[luv of green]

well i demoed both on the same properties and i fought the dane on hills the stander climbs like a spider really i am 200 lbs and it is as stable as a sulky just my opinion though

[chowe1613]

wright is by far the one.it is more user friendly call keen edge ask for tony 1-800-589-4145and get the inside of the best stand up mower.i love it no major break downs and parts are available unlike the dane

[Flex-Deck]

Take a look at my sponsor forum - I have now compiled sequential pictures of the trimming moves the Flex-Deck allows when put on a WB, or a Wright Stander, or a ZTR etc. I have pics of LGF's 52" WB which is now a 70" mower on a thread and Pics of my 36" eXmark Hydro with the Flex-Deck from the BBQ which is now a 54" mower. The trimming moves on the Walk Behinds on these threads are the same wheather on a tractor, ZTR, WB, or Front Mount. We now have signed a reverse exclusive with Dixie Chopper which allows Flex-Deck to sell to any ZTR owners now.

Thanks, Brad

[Doc Pete]

Originally posted by Flex-Deck
Take a look at my sponsor forum - I have now compiled sequential pictures of the trimming moves the Flex-Deck allows when put on a WB, or a Wright Stander, or a ZTR etc. I have pics of LGF's 52" WB which is now a 70" mower on a thread and Pics of my 36" eXmark Hydro with the Flex-Deck from the BBQ which is now a 54" mower. The trimming moves on the Walk Behinds on these threads are the same wheather on a tractor, ZTR, WB, or Front Mount. We now have signed a reverse exclusive with Dixie Chopper which allows Flex-Deck to sell to any ZTR owners now.
Thanks, Brad

Well since physics does not apply to the FD, I did look at the animated pics of the FD. Please tell me after the tractor has made the left square turn to trim and is now facing directly into the rest of what needs to be trimmed, how to you turn the tractor and FD to the right and not have it bump into the rest of the wood trim without backing up. Next, after you maneuver the FD in-between the flower pots, the next shot shows the FD “magically” out from between the pots. How does happen this if you continue going frontward, or do you have to backup.
Thanks,
Pete

[Flex-Deck]

Switchless - On a tractor the Flex-Deck moves directly left or right with the front wheels. When I mow between bushes with a tractor, I turn left, and the flex-deck moves straight laterally and this is because it is on the front corner, and not straight lateral or on the back corner like all the other decks out there - YES, I have to back up with a tractor to extract the Flex-Deck from these very narrow tight places. ZTR's and Hydro WB's just slide left then right and then head down the road.

I think you would have to agree now that the Flex-Deck does allow a tractor some maneuverability with wide decks that it did not have - For some real animated TRACTOR moves see www.flex-deck.com

Yes, it is quicker on the ZTR's and Hydro WB's, and it allows those type mowers to mow in places they have never been with a very very wide deck (60" main deck + 18" added by flex-deck = 78" of trimming and contour mowing abilities never seen before)http://52X-Between Post

[Doc Pete]

Originally posted by Flex-Deck
- YES, I have to back up with a tractor to extract the Flex-Deck from these very narrow tight places.

Thanks Brad. I think I'm beginning to understand more about the FD. FWIW, it sounds as though you haven't been around the rest of the country to see how the "other half" mows.;)
Your impression that you can get rid of the weed whacker, or that we turn the grass brown from improper weed whacker techniques and line size, or that we can afford the time to backup, with a tractor no less, IMO, are more orientated to the mid-west, rather that many other parts of the country.
Pete

[Flex-Deck]

switchless - Thanks, I appreciate your attention and questions, but I have never stated you get RID of the weed-whacker - I have said you will SAVE weed-whacking time due to the fact you do not have to stop and mow those large areas the main mower could not get to with the weed-whacker.

You just have very thin lines of grass along buildings etc. Then the neat deal is you get to keep the extra width of the Flex-Deck with you when you have to mow the big wide open spaces left after the trimming round is done.

Thanks, Brad


http://52X-Under Trees2

[Doc Pete]

Brad,

Well, after all our talks, I finally think that the FD with a 32/36 WB could be a real plus to those needing a "Gatemaster" type machine. And, after trying to find what doesn't fit in the picture correctly, I think I've put my finger on it. "Price".
I realize you're not a "full tilt" manufacturer, but if you want to play with the big dogs, you gotta find some way to compete. That price of $1,500 is just unacceptable.
I'm sorry, but you really need to find a fabrication shop somewhere, or not be so greedy. You can buy a brand new complete 36 WB belt drive for just another $500. Then, you can pay some no name $5/7 an hour, and make $30/45 an hour profit from him. You don't have to pay him benefits or hospitalization. Everyone does it, and you should know that.
There are many small shops around my area that do fabrication. I'd look around and find a better one than wherever you are going. Frankly, I hadn't been paying attention, and I thought the FD was $795 or something like that. But $1,500 for just 18 inches of cut, doesn't "cut it" with me.
I understand your dilemma, but to the educated landscaper I can't see anyone spending that amount for something that adds so little. This is just my opinion, but at $1,999 for a belt drive 14 Kaw WB, with the ability easily profit $30 from it, the decision to consider the FD for $1,495 is really a no brainer.
Now........ If your unit was $499 as it should be, that's another story. Hey, it's got no motor, and no drive system. It's just a housing with a wheel, a couple of bearings and a pulley or two. Hey, you can buy a fully supported (four wheels) 60 inch/12hp finish cutting deck for pulling behind a tractor for "less" than your product If I was gonna make money, I pull one those things, with one of the tractors you talk about and really cut some grass. You know, as a dentist, whoever is feeding the thought that you can sell the FD at $1,495 is really not doing you any favors. There's just way too many other cheaper options to choose from than your FD. Again, just my opinion.
Pete

[jkelton]

I agree $1500 is high for that unit, but we do not know all the costs that go into building that unit. Since the volume is relatively low compared to total units of walkbehinds sold, I would think the percentage of fixed cost vs. total cost per FD unit would be much higher than a walkbehind. But, I do think there is a market for something like that, even at that cost.

For example, my family sells the Grasshopper line of lawn mowing equipment. In the last few years (following the market trend), they have come out with the midmount lawn mowing equipment to complement the outfront deck machines. For us, the midmounts definitely outsell the outfront, mainly because they are lower priced than a comparable outfront machine. But, there are still customers that will pay the difference because they can get under trees and be able to get closer to objects (such as inside corners of buildings). They still have to trim, but just not as much total area. From what I have seen, it's the single operators who prefer this flexibilty. Most of it depends on the properties you have and how they are laid out - some would benefit from this flexibilty, others would not.Although this piece of equipment is not for everyone, I do think it is on the right track.

On a separate (but connected) subject, we all need to look at our everyday operations and find out better ways of accomplishing our tasks without throwing additional manpower at it. Although many do not think of landscaping/lawn maintenance as a bonifide "industry" (such as manufacturing), that is what we are. Every industry has made strives to reduce labor (i.e., automation equipment, robots, computers, etc.). Each of these advances focuses on one thing - labor reduction. I think this is one area we will be forced to deal with in the future. As profit margins shrink, labor will have to be cut. Many will resist, but I think in order to be successful (and stay afloat) in the future, these advances in labor reduction will need to be embraced.

Just my two cents.

[Doc Pete]

Originally posted by jkelton
I agree $1500 is high for that unit, but we do not know all the costs that go into building that unit. Since the volume is relatively low compared to total units of walkbehinds sold, I would think the percentage of fixed cost vs. total cost per FD unit would be much higher than a walkbehind. But, I do think there is a market for something like that, even at that cost.

Well, that's why I said it was just my opinion, and hopefully, people won't become stupid, if they start opening their mouths. However, "as someone" in the same situation as Brad, I found a way to be competitive with the product I sell, otherwise I would have been out of business long ago. Heck, you could have it built in Hong Kong, and shipped over here, and even with the freight, it would be cheap.
Pete

[Flex-Deck]

switchless - first of all we sell direct (shipping included) for $1299
and this also includes all the fixtures and manuals necessary for your welder to mount the deck which will take about three hrs for the first one - with experience and not having to wade thru the manual it is 1.5 hrs.

second you are only looking at the metal involved and the pulleys and bearings.

third - it is a very manufacturing unfriendly concept to get the bracket at mower to match and be able to be affixed to another deck.

forth - I would not even recommend it on a belt drive because you cannot realize its full potential. A hydro allows you to be quick in the trimming phase and on a 36" it will almost double your production. Ask Roy Meglie in Sterling Illinois. - he has one on a 36" Hydro eXmark (Old - about 1985 model - it even sends the leaves under the main deck so he can bag 54")

We have people out there that save one crew person for every Flex-Deck they put on. I do not know what you pay a crew person in your operation, but you mentioned that $7 per hr is done. That =$280/40 hr wk which means even in Iowa where we only mow for 25 weeks, a Flex-Deck would save you $7000 for a one time investment of $1299 -

I guess I am having a problem seeing where you are coming from

Do you look for efficiency in the machines you buy, or do you look at the # of pulleys and bearings.

Do you really look at what it can do, or do you look at what it is.

Thanks Brad

[Doc Pete]

Originally posted by Flex-Deck
switchless - first of all we sell direct (shipping included) for $1299
and this also includes all the fixtures and manuals necessary for Thanks Brad

Again, thanks for your input.....You may need to update your website because I seem to see a retail price of $1,495 on it. However, if the $1299 is a direct price, and you suggest the discount is for work to get the FD to fit, does that mean the price of $1,495 from a dealer is supposed to include the "Dealer" installing it for "$1,495". And, if not I don't think it will make dealers happy that you are selling it "out of their area" for less. And finally, if indeed the higher dealer price includes installation, then I assume you should be able to buy from a "dealer" for $1,299, if you install it yourself. Let me know,
Thanks,
Pete

[Flex-Deck]

Pete - I don't have any dealers - so it basically ends up that we sell direct for $1299 - and after paying the welder it will be close to $1495. If you do your own welding etc fine.

Thanks for the information - I am going to call my web site guy and clear that up.

Thanks, Brad

[Doc Pete]

I have a friend who does small fabrication/ welding for a lot of big companies.....AT&T and such. This guy can weld/ make anything. If you like I can give him a copy of your blueprints, and he could quote you on making them. Or, if there's a special sequence of holes and welding, he might be able to spit them out for you.
Pete

[Flex-Deck]

switchless - yes - give me his email address and I will send all the prints that need lazer cutting bending etc. and the weldment proofs, and we would also like a quote on the welding, assembling, printing of the manuals, boxing, mailing, purchase parts (wheels, bearings, belts, pulleys, bolts, etc) and everything that goes with a final product at the customers door. This would include shipping of course.

Thanks, Brad

[jsaunders]

I got the FD video tape from you acouple of days ago- The tape clears up alot of questions that are hard to answer on the website. BUT there needs to be some more DETAILS on how the FD can be mounted to a machine, and also how to shoot the clippings out in front of the main deck. The 1300 price tag would be easier to swallow if there were some more details about setting up the FD. The only real question of concern is Hp, I have a 17 Hp hydro 52 that also pulls a velkie- add a FD I now have 70 inchs being cut/moved/and pulling me around. IF I had a 23 hp motor I would order a FD but with only 17 I'm just not sure.

[Doc Pete]

Originally posted by jsaunders
I got the FD video tape from you acouple of days ago- The tape clears up alot of questions that are hard to answer on the website. BUT there needs to be some more DETAILS on how the FD can be mounted to a machine, and also how to shoot the clippings out in front of the main deck. The 1300 price tag would be easier to swallow if there were some more details about setting up the FD. The only real question of concern is Hp, I have a 17 Hp hydro 52 that also pulls a velkie- add a FD I now have 70 inchs being cut/moved/and pulling me around. IF I had a 23 hp motor I would order a FD but with only 17 I'm just not sure.

According to LawnGodFather, throw that physics book in the garage and just buy it. LGF has mentioned it works just fine. Hell, get it.......I wouldn't worry, it's already been tested by others and works great. OTOH, if it doesn't........ return it and get your money back........You can't lose.........
Good luck,
Pete

[Flex-Deck]

switchless - Just got the mounting manual on my web page - you need acrobat 4.0 reader to open it I think. It is just a general idea of what it takes to mount the deck. (requires some cutting and welding - the part about cutting off the on edge vertical support plate on the eXmark deck where the cover fits over is not always necessary - just need to have room for our bracket first, and the belt second.

Go to www.flex-deck.com and just a little ways down the home page there is a button to click on that say "Mounting manual for flat top decks."

This shoud give you an idea of what is involved. Be aware that once the flex-deck bracket is welded in the deck may even be stronger than it was due to all the triangulation supports of the pivot points etc.

If you have a 17HP 52 - in the finish mowing deal it would be enough, but you are right - if you tend to get behind in the spring with rain etc, a 20-22HP would be great. You would then have a machine that would blow your mind.

Thanks, Brad

[HarryD]

are there spacers on the blade bolt on the FD sp you can ajust blade height

[Flex-Deck]

We have two spacers on the spindle that ar 1/8" so we only have a 1/4" of quick adjustment available, However we also have spacers that can be put under the spindle body itself to raise it whatever you may need. The adjustments would take time though as you would also have to change the spacers under two other pulleys to keep them aligned with the spindle pulleyhttp://52X-Over Culvert1

[brucec32]

Originally posted by Switchless@aol.com
Brad,

Well, after all our talks, I finally think that the FD with a 32/36 WB could be a real plus to those needing a "Gatemaster" type machine. And, after trying to find what doesn't fit in the picture correctly, I think I've put my finger on it. "Price".
I realize you're not a "full tilt" manufacturer, but if you want to play with the big dogs, you gotta find some way to compete. That price of $1,500 is just unacceptable.
I'm sorry, but you really need to find a fabrication shop somewhere, or not be so greedy. You can buy a brand new complete 36 WB belt drive for just another $500. Then, you can pay some no name $5/7 an hour, and make $30/45 an hour profit from him. You don't have to pay him benefits or hospitalization. Everyone does it, and you should know that.
There are many small shops around my area that do fabrication. I'd look around and find a better one than wherever you are going. Frankly, I hadn't been paying attention, and I thought the FD was $795 or something like that. But $1,500 for just 18 inches of cut, doesn't "cut it" with me.
I understand your dilemma, but to the educated landscaper I can't see anyone spending that amount for something that adds so little. This is just my opinion, but at $1,999 for a belt drive 14 Kaw WB, with the ability easily profit $30 from it, the decision to consider the FD for $1,495 is really a no brainer.
Now........ If your unit was $499 as it should be, that's another story. Hey, it's got no motor, and no drive system. It's just a housing with a wheel, a couple of bearings and a pulley or two. Hey, you can buy a fully supported (four wheels) 60 inch/12hp finish cutting deck for pulling behind a tractor for "less" than your product If I was gonna make money, I pull one those things, with one of the tractors you talk about and really cut some grass. You know, as a dentist, whoever is feeding the thought that you can sell the FD at $1,495 is really not doing you any favors. There's just way too many other cheaper options to choose from than your FD. Again, just my opinion.
Pete

I agree the FD is too expensive for what it'd add for my needs, but it may have its place. And if you have trailer space, I think a 32" or 36" belt drive wb would be a better investment. But your idea of hiring some "no name" at $5-$7 and making a big profit off them is pretty wishfull thinking

1. Nobody around here at least making $5-$7 is a legal resident.
2. Nobody around here at least would work for those wages.
3. Anybody who would work for that wouldnt' last long, seeing it as a temporary thing.
4. Anybody who would HAVE to work for that wouldn't do quality work. They'd be mentally or morally deficient.
5. What does this individual do all day on properties where you don't need his 36" mower? He's less efficient then.
6. Real world, you probably have at least $20,000 a year in a guy to show up reliably and mow lawns well. Labor is much more expensive and hard to find than equipment these days. At least here it is. Nobody decent here works through summer then flakes off, then is ready to work for you again in the Spring. You wind up paying for hours in the off season for which they aren't very useful to you.
7. The flex deck doesn't call in sick, quit w/o notice, steal your blower when you turn around, or sue you if he gets hurt and you aren't carrying worker's comp on him.

[Flex-Deck]

burcec32 - I don't understand where you are coming from in the post above - I am assuming you read my web page, and the part you read is just a section where we state the Flex-Deck is on one time investment - don't have to pay wages after that and it will one average replace the need for one employee thru trimming and mowing time savings - I will also allow an operation to operate with a minimal # of main machines

I do agree that there are some machines that can not handle another 18" of cutting width, but there are a lot that can - My diesel 455's (22HP) have 78" cutting widths and do fine 60 + 18"

[Doc Pete]

Originally posted by Flex-Deck
I do agree that there are some machines that can not handle another 18" of cutting width, but there are a lot that can - My diesel 455's (22HP) have 78" cutting widths and do fine 60 + 18"

Yes, a lot of the newer WB's like Exmark, Scag, Hustler, etc. are coming through with big HP to drive the FD........ Now if we can just get the FD in Red, yellow and Orange;) ;)