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View Full Version : I nominate Kubota for worse welds


jonathanone
03-04-2011, 04:01 PM
If deck welding is an indication, and I believe that it is, of overall quality Kubota has issues. Three different decks with the same horrible welds, crooked, bulging and slag boogers-to say it was amateurish is being very, very kind.

What I did not realize is just how heavy the Kubota machines are: the smallest gas without deck, fuel, oil almost 1100lbs, the bigger diesels pushing 1600 DRY without the typical well nourished operator (at least in my instance) I cannot imagine over one ton running around.

Fit and finish is nice but Kubota still uses way way too many bolts on the hydro covers, not as many as the tractors (G series) but far too many.

Have not dismissed the brand but I can say that it would be the small gasser with the stamped deck-I really couldn't deal with the sloppy workmanship on the 'pro' decks.

Imagine what the stuff you are not able to see is like.

One dealer proudly stated that every mower he has is and has been inside since received-----

Darn that 0% for five years, they are clever, very clever.

MSS Mow
03-04-2011, 06:41 PM
I've got 2 Kubota "Pro" decks and they are bullet proof. They are the toughest decks I've ever seen. I've hit, banged, pushed some pretty solid items and have never had a problem with a "horrible weld, crooked, bulging and slag boogers". These machines are not made to model, they are made to work.

TNGrassCutter
03-04-2011, 06:45 PM
I've got 2 Kubota "Pro" decks and they are bullet proof. They are the toughest decks I've ever seen. I've hit, banged, pushed some pretty solid items and have never had a problem with a "horrible weld, crooked, bulging and slag boogers". These machines are not made to model, they are made to work.

Seriously, these people ragging on Kubota, do they even mow grass or just buy a brand new mower and take it home to look at for a few years? Commercial zero turn mowers are made to be put through the ringer, not enter in fashion shows.
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MSS Mow
03-04-2011, 07:02 PM
Seriously, these people ragging on Kubota, do they even mow grass or just buy a brand new mower and take it home to look at for a few years? Commercial zero turn mowers are made to be put through the ringer, not enter in fashion shows.
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Yeah I don't get it. I'm not spending 15 grand for a lawn ornament. I want a machine that is going to work hard and be tough as a bag of nails, not be pretty.

GMLC
03-04-2011, 07:14 PM
Pictures please. Welds are usually done by robots and are xrayed for imperfections. Its hard to tell by just looking at them if they are faulty. Kubota is known for very high quality and being built stronger than need be which explains lots of bolts and the weight. Fabricated decks are much much stronger than stamped decks.

Why all the recent Kubota hate?

doubleedge
03-04-2011, 07:29 PM
I haven't had a problem with welds breaking on my Kubota. The dealer, on the other hand, is a pain in the @$$.

Scagmower48
03-04-2011, 07:32 PM
As long as the welds don't break, who cares.

I have a kubota and the machine is really good.

Kubotas prices are even better

specialtylc
03-04-2011, 07:33 PM
I have 3 Kubota ZDs ,and a Tractor with loader, never had any trouble with welds. I guess im just lucky:cool2:

GMLC
03-04-2011, 07:48 PM
Maybe all the snow ruined the welds!!!:laugh:

jonathanone
03-04-2011, 09:12 PM
Guys a snake would break its back trying to follow the welds I saw, these could not possibly have been done by machine or not by a machine that was anywhere near in adjustment.
Scag, Hustler and Bob-Cat decks are works of art, not so with Kubota or at least no so with the ones I have looked at.

None of you find the weight of these monsters to be an issue?

LCPullman
03-04-2011, 10:54 PM
The weights you mentioned all sound in line with the rest of the full commercial ZTRs. The Diesels are generally heavy because of their diesel engine.

grassman177
03-05-2011, 12:15 AM
we have owned 7 of the ztrs, some of every generation of them in diesel and never an issue. they are the toughest built, and hence the near heaviest in all classes. but have not had one ever leave us hanging on anything. although hyro issues was a long story and had many, none of wich have been on the newest models.

I call bs without picks, and serious abuse would be the only reason for them to not hold up.

we have also owned 7 other kubota tractors and or mowers and have had almost zeroi issues other than maint. quality machines through and through.

kilgoja
03-05-2011, 12:25 AM
kubota sucks!!!..they keep their mowers outside!!! :o lol

TNGrassCutter
03-05-2011, 01:04 AM
Guys a snake would break its back trying to follow the welds I saw, these could not possibly have been done by machine or not by a machine that was anywhere near in adjustment.
Scag, Hustler and Bob-Cat decks are works of art, not so with Kubota or at least no so with the ones I have looked at.

None of you find the weight of these monsters to be an issue?
Posted via Mobile Device We get it, you don't like kubota. Move on to another brand and quit starting these I hate kubota threads.

TriCityLawnCareLLC
03-05-2011, 01:13 AM
I run Kubota, I love my Machine.

Scagmower48
03-05-2011, 01:31 AM
Posted via Mobile Device We get it, you don't like kubota. Move on to another brand and quit starting these I hate kubota threads.

You made me just realize that he is the one that has started these two useless threads.

If the fact that the dealers keep the mowers outside, and the welds dont "look" the best on a Kubota are all his simple mind can find wrong with kubota then it is a damm good machine. Mines great and I currently wouldn't trade it for anything else.

landers lawn
03-05-2011, 02:03 AM
i used to work at the kubota plant that built the loaders kie. the mowers were made at kma. nothing but quality at both plants. i have seen some bad welds on quite a few things. most of the time they got caught. sometimes they didnt. overall they make good products.

B&M
03-05-2011, 04:46 AM
We run kubota a mower and it's quality equipment in my book.

jonathanone
03-05-2011, 08:47 AM
Read what I post, I say that I like the fit and finish and that I am considering buying a Kubota and some of you interpret this as bashing, really boys you need to cook your pork to a higher internal temperature.

I stand by my comments about the welds -I- saw, they were the worst on any machine I have looked at, every other mower was a work of art deck to deck comparison.

I stand by my comments about outdoor storage of ANY brand mower. This is unequivically and categorically detrimental to the piece of equipment and with regard to KUBOTA this is contrary to their, Kubota's, guidelines for off season storage. Kubota wants the product either inside or under a tarp, but what do they know all they do is make the stuff.

As for the weight comment, the Kubota ZG 222 with the 48 fab deck tips in at 1177 lbs dry, the Hustler Fastrack SD, with a 48 fab deck is 835 lbs so to make this clear to some of you cognitively challenged members that is a 342 lb increase for the Kubota or, again to make sure some of you understand, the Kubota is nearly 30% heavier than the Hustler-advantage or disadvantage, I don't know but heavier HAS to mean that rutting is more likely.

But this also will be bashing correct?

Scagmower48
03-05-2011, 09:15 AM
Read what I post, I say that I like the fit and finish and that I am considering buying a Kubota and some of you interpret this as bashing, really boys you need to cook your pork to a higher internal temperature.

I stand by my comments about the welds -I- saw, they were the worst on any machine I have looked at, every other mower was a work of art deck to deck comparison.

I stand by my comments about outdoor storage of ANY brand mower. This is unequivically and categorically detrimental to the piece of equipment and with regard to KUBOTA this is contrary to their, Kubota's, guidelines for off season storage. Kubota wants the product either inside or under a tarp, but what do they know all they do is make the stuff.

As for the weight comment, the Kubota ZG 222 with the 48 fab deck tips in at 1177 lbs dry, the Hustler Fastrack SD, with a 48 fab deck is 835 lbs so to make this clear to some of you cognitively challenged members that is a 342 lb increase for the Kubota or, again to make sure some of you understand, the Kubota is nearly 30% heavier than the Hustler-advantage or disadvantage, I don't know but heavier HAS to mean that rutting is more likely.

But this also will be bashing correct?

The Hustler is a cheap POS compared the Kubota. The deck on the Kubota is much thicker and probably makes the biggest difference. The Kubota has a cast iron gear box vs hustler's pulley system. Kubota's have a hood over the engine which equals more weight. IDK how much H.P. the Hustler has but the Kubota probably has more.

Evrerything on a Kubota is much heavier duty. The are built like a tractor. (They have the same tranny setup like the tractor which weighs alot more than some cheap 10 or 12 cc pumps and motors. Yes Kubotas weigh more, but for all the right reasons.

grassman177
03-05-2011, 10:02 AM
:laugh:kubota sucks!!!..they keep their mowers outside!!! :o lol

nice of you to bring up that thread! that one really took off too.

grassman177
03-05-2011, 10:08 AM
i never thouight of you as bashing(OP). but i contend that we have never had any issues wiht all the machines i mentioned before.

everyone can get a lemon though, and maybe this guy did!?

either way, yes the weight can suck, but it is for the right reasons like said above. they are the toughest thind mowing grass. we use ours only on lalrge acreage though as the wieght is an issue for small areas and turning around in the same spot will wear turf.

these machines where designed for serious use, not moderate use on medium sized lawns, but for very large areas. they excell in this area with the torque and extra deep deck.

jonathanone
03-05-2011, 02:12 PM
Now scagmower lets quit that bashing and back your comments up with some pics.

grassman, there is alot to like about the Kubota product and some not to like, as with any machine I suppose. Having said this you really do have to take into account the additional heft with Kubota, probably not so much an issue with the diesel mowers but I believe a real area of concern for the gassers, its fair to say that significantly more weight usually means significantly more gph, and 30% is an awful lot more to have to move around.

Additionally, the astounding number of bolts that Kubota uses to keep the rear end together is another point of contention for us, regardless of whether or not you are considering a ZT or the small tractors you have roughly 32 fasteners to be concerned with. While I will say that I have never seen what any reasonable person would call a leak, I also have to state that every Kubota we have seen has had clear indications that something is coming out of the drive and catching dust or dirt-not a dripping leak but something.

If you are operating the big diesel Kubota zt you are most likely well over one ton and that I think we can all agree is an awful lot of weight.

grassman177
03-05-2011, 02:40 PM
It is heavy. Since I only use them in acre and larger lawns it its ok. We use regular gasser mowers otherwise.toro, wright etc
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specialtylc
03-05-2011, 06:45 PM
Guys a snake would break its back trying to follow the welds I saw, these could not possibly have been done by machine or not by a machine that was anywhere near in adjustment.
Scag, Hustler and Bob-Cat decks are works of art, not so with Kubota or at least no so with the ones I have looked at.

None of you find the weight of these monsters to be an issue?

Have you checked the weight specs on any of the other brands of diesel mowers. The Hustler with the Cat engine a couple years ago was even heavier than the Kubotas. And Hustler quit making them because the motors were shaking the machines to pieces.

jonathanone
03-05-2011, 08:42 PM
specialty, the only number I could find was for the Bad Boy, it was a little lighter-about 250 lbs or so- but you are correct in that there is not a lot of difference for the two I have seen so far.

GMLC
03-05-2011, 08:51 PM
The welds look good to me. Still cant figure out any reason why you think more bolts on the machine is a bad thing.

Scagmower48
03-05-2011, 10:33 PM
Now scagmower lets quit that bashing and back your comments up with some pics.

grassman, there is alot to like about the Kubota product and some not to like, as with any machine I suppose. Having said this you really do have to take into account the additional heft with Kubota, probably not so much an issue with the diesel mowers but I believe a real area of concern for the gassers, its fair to say that significantly more weight usually means significantly more gph, and 30% is an awful lot more to have to move around.

Additionally, the astounding number of bolts that Kubota uses to keep the rear end together is another point of contention for us, regardless of whether or not you are considering a ZT or the small tractors you have roughly 32 fasteners to be concerned with. While I will say that I have never seen what any reasonable person would call a leak, I also have to state that every Kubota we have seen has had clear indications that something is coming out of the drive and catching dust or dirt-not a dripping leak but something.

If you are operating the big diesel Kubota zt you are most likely well over one ton and that I think we can all agree is an awful lot of weight.

First of all Im not bashing. I state facts. Your the one that started the bashing and has no facts besides a few stupid observations about snow and the welds. I stated facts about the machine about why it is heavier and why it is a better machine. I don't know what you are trying to prove anyway.

The only thing you've proven is that is 300 pounds heavier than a POS Hustler, has some unattractive welds and has 32 more fastners. Big Deal.

The Kubota has 32 fastners (more like bolts) because it has a tractor like rear end that can be split if need be. More bolts the better (less chance of leaks)

Argue my points now

J.R. Services
03-06-2011, 12:01 AM
Wow this is a waste of a thread. I, personally, have never seen a kubota with anything but perfect welds, thus being said, that doesnt mean there isn't a bad apple out there, but I think that anyone who has owned a kubota can agree that they are built very well, cut very nicely for still using a belt and having large decks, and are probably one of the best machines to have if you do any large acreage properties, just my .02

jonathanone
03-06-2011, 01:32 PM
scag, I don't have alot to prove, you are doing it for me.

About the fasteners, it is not a selling point really-the hoses with pumps and motor/s would be easier, alot, to repair-and I think tighter in the long run.

gm, take a good look at the upper edge, near the sticker, opposite the discharge side and you will begin to get an idea of what I am typing about, and bear in mind that this deck was prepped for show. Hand welded I think. The ones I saw probably varied an eighth to three sixteeths of an inch from being straight for alot of the length of the weld, and alot of slag boogers also, really guys it was ugly.

Scagmower48
03-06-2011, 03:38 PM
scag, I don't have alot to prove, you are doing it for me.

About the fasteners, it is not a selling point really-the hoses with pumps and motor/s would be easier, alot, to repair-and I think tighter in the long run.

gm, take a good look at the upper edge, near the sticker, opposite the discharge side and you will begin to get an idea of what I am typing about, and bear in mind that this deck was prepped for show. Hand welded I think. The ones I saw probably varied an eighth to three sixteeths of an inch from being straight for alot of the length of the weld, and alot of slag boogers also, really guys it was ugly.

Like I said in the earlier post jonathan the Kubotas have the same kind of tranny/rear end setup like any hyrodastic tractor has. It has to be much more durable than any 10-16cc pump wheel motor setup. Im not a mechanic, but you are probably right that the other setup is easier to repair, I just feel that the repair is much less likely needed in the Kubota. A diesel Kubota Z turn will probably go 4000 hours with not much problems. Lets see a Hustler or a similar machine do that.

jonathanone
03-06-2011, 05:45 PM
scag, I will say that I have not seen what I could call a leak, something that is leaving fluid on the ground, but I can say that many Kubota mowers I have seen have alot of dust/dirt clinging to the hydro units along the bolts, no where else. A big deal ?, not really but as you have probably guessed I am a bit anal and focus on this type of thing immediately. Trying to get a torque wrench on all of these bolts looks like it cannot be done with the drive on the machine, I would be interested in learning whether or not the factory uses thread lock on these.

And of course the ZT drive from Hydrogear appears to use the same number of fasteners so it isn't a Kubota only application.

I guess I need to research what is really the tighter hydraulic system, unitized or pumps and motors, the two we have now; pump/motor arrangement are absolutely dry at all connections but I realize that this may not be the norm.

Scagmower48
03-06-2011, 06:48 PM
I have noticed that the dirt sticks to around the bolt in my rear end. There are no leaks at all though. If you are in the market for a z turn i do recomend the Kubota. It has been a great machine. I bought it from F&W equipment in Orange CT

grassman177
03-06-2011, 07:53 PM
Like I said in the earlier post jonathan the Kubotas have the same kind of tranny/rear end setup like any hyrodastic tractor has. It has to be much more durable than any 10-16cc pump wheel motor setup. Im not a mechanic, but you are probably right that the other setup is easier to repair, I just feel that the repair is much less likely needed in the Kubota. A diesel Kubota Z turn will probably go 4000 hours with not much problems. Lets see a Hustler or a similar machine do that.

i concur. they are bulletproof machines designed from tractors so they are way more durable than most other if not all other machines. they are a hybrid of tractor and ztr. this makes them desirable to parks svc, municipal and lco that mow very large acreage.

the trans will outlast any pump and wheel motor there is as far as hours. the previous models had issues, but only in hilly terrain and a baffling issue inside that left parts dry . but the new ones are virtually flawless and i have heard of NO issues at all with them.

it is about longevity of the machine really in their build, so it makes them a niche machine and def not for every lco or situation for mowing.

grassman177
03-06-2011, 07:55 PM
scag, I will say that I have not seen what I could call a leak, something that is leaving fluid on the ground, but I can say that many Kubota mowers I have seen have alot of dust/dirt clinging to the hydro units along the bolts, no where else. A big deal ?, not really but as you have probably guessed I am a bit anal and focus on this type of thing immediately. Trying to get a torque wrench on all of these bolts looks like it cannot be done with the drive on the machine, I would be interested in learning whether or not the factory uses thread lock on these.

And of course the ZT drive from Hydrogear appears to use the same number of fasteners so it isn't a Kubota only application.

I guess I need to research what is really the tighter hydraulic system, unitized or pumps and motors, the two we have now; pump/motor arrangement are absolutely dry at all connections but I realize that this may not be the norm.

we have had many a pump and hose leak over the years, they dont last very long compared to the kubota trans.