21" Toro Proline

[Ray&Christine]

Our 5 year old Toro with the 6.5 h.p. Briggs engine has finally died. We are going to get another Toro but are not sure which engine to get. Our choices are the same 6.5 h.p. Briggs 4 cycle, 6 h.p. Kawasaki 4 cycle or the 5.5 Suzuki 2 cycle. My only complaint about the Briggs motor is the price of the air/oil filters. Any feedback about these mowers would be great.

Ray

[ilovethisgame]

GO W/ THE 2 CYCLE!!! I'm about to drive four hours ( one way) to buy another one. They are great mowers you will never go back to a 4 cycle 21".

-Dave

[Scag48]

Either the 2 cycle or the 6 HP Kawi.

[Bunton Guy]

I had a 2-cycle toro about 2 years ago it was 8 years old when I scrapped it but it always had a problem cutting wet or tall grass the motor would bog down. I could never figure out what was wrong. We ran it a 32:1 oil ratio and the air filter was always clean and we put a fuel filter on it. And check the carb regularly it just didnt seem powerfull . but from what I hear the newer style is great.

[dlandscaping]

Get the suzuki 2 stroke toro proline. I got one in July for $950. This machine is indestructible. The engine has lots of power mulches excellent and bags great. I love toros and this is the ultimate 21. I dont care for hondas although i have one. I also have a deere with the commercial kawi. I still love the two stroke and this machine is just so solidly built. Pick one up drop it off the truck and nothing happens its overbuilt. Great machine IMHO.

[crew]

You might consider the Lawnboy. 2 cycle( the only way to go) and weighs about 30 pounds less. I have lawn boy and toro - both 2 cycles and the toro is heavy and way too complicated. Compare the wheel assemblies and youll see the whole story. Only Lawnboy 21's for me.

[Shady Brook]

The suzuki is a great motor, everyone I have talked to loves them, and I have 2 that have been worked like a dog, and keep on ticking.

Jay

[odin]

That 2 cycle suzuki is one of the finest little engine we've ever used .

It just runs and runs and takes a licking and keeps on ticking.
has plenty of power.

Only thing we ever had go wrong the exhaust port pluged from mixing the fuel at 32 to 1 .

useing amsoil now and no mere exhaust port plug up's

If they ever have a hall of fame for small engines the 2 cycle suzuki should be one of the charter members:D

[proline32]

I had a few 21 prolines with the 2 stroke suzuki engines, they were great but gettin old, Most guys here run either the 2 stroke prolines or JD JX85 mowers, I purchased a couple of Lawnboys A while back and while they are good, I miss my prolines, These lawnboys arn't as easy to get around with that staggerd wheel and I really can't use them in areas that have dips in them( they scalp) And if the use the rear bag, the opening isn't big enough to get wet grass thru and you have to use the side bag, The prooline had the same problem, rear opening just wasn't big enough where a JX 85 has a good size opening for grass to pass thru, But the JX85 is a heavy SOB (120 lbs) where the lawn boy is around 80lbs. I do love the way my lawnboy rips thru high grass though no problem, Lawnboy just needs to change that deck some and smooth out the bottom.

[rkbrown]

My vote is for the 2 cycle suzuki's as well. I have 2 prolines with the suzuki's. Great mower !!

[Ray&Christine]

Thanks for the reply to my post. It seems the majority likes 2 stroke suzuki.

Has anyone owned both the 2 stroke and the 4 stroke proline and if you have did you notice a difference in the power of the motor.

for example the 4 stroke proline seem to cut evenly as the lawnboy we have misses a few blades of grass so I have to recut lawn again.

also I find the lawnboy smokey and the 4 stroke proline isn't.

thanks again.

christine

[Bunton Guy]

I have run both 2 & 4 stroke I liked to 4-stroke was powerfull I think it was a B&S it ran smooooothe and had a very good amount of power rarely ever bogged down. Both are a good mower check your budget if it allows a 1,000 mower run the 2-stroke if less then get the 4-stroke.

[odin]

i agree with bunton guy

Either would be a good choice the 6 horse kaw is great to but with it you dont get the gallon gas tank you would with the suzuki.
The briggs 6.5 i think has the big gas tank.
Ive used all three kaw briggs and suzuki and id go with the suzuki.
All three are a good choice though

[TurfGuyTX]

I'm a Kawi fan.

[ilovethisgame]

The 6hp Kawasaki is real nice too. But again w/ the 2 cycle you have a one gallon gas tank and no more oil changes.

-Dave

[joed]

Ray & Christine,
I'm from your area too. I have the 6 hp Kawasaki on a John Deere JX85 and the 6.5 hp Briggs on a Toro Proline like yours. I like both motors though I think the Kawasaki is a bit bitter than the Briggs. However, the Briggs has been a pleasant surprise. Lots of power (more than the Kawasaki), great on fuel. quiet. However, the air filters and oil filters are expensive. Most people around here have the suzuki 2 stroke simply because it's a great motor and the maintenance is less than on a 4 stroke. However, if you factor in the cost of 2 cycle oil over the life of the machine, I think the savings advantage over a 4 stroke isn't that great. On top of this, I found that the 2 stroke engine I used to have on my Lawnboy tended to bog down in heavy grass.

[Green Pastures]

I love my Suzuki 2 -stroke Toro 21" Proline. Lots of power to mulgh, bag and run the 3 forward speeds.

I mow alot of steep slopes with my push mower and that's why I went 2-stroke. 4-strokes wear quicker when all the oil is puddled in the side of the pan. I dont have to worry when the oil is in the gas. Just my $.02.

Scott

[Tony Harrell]

Although I'm not familiar with these particular 2 cycle engines, I have had a few Lawnboy mowers and several other 2 cycle equipped machines. Small 2 cycle engines tend to bog down under a severe load because they don't have the torque that a 4 cycle engine has. They both have their good/bad points. I believe that 2 cycle engines are on the way out (sorry to say). Reed valves(70's) and power valves(80's) have done a lot for 2 cycle power curves. I don't know why these haven't been incorporated into the commercial small engine market. Heck, Saab had a 2 cycle car at one time. A buddy of mine had one and built an expansion chamber for it. Yamaha is building some of the most awsome 4 cycle engines around. Maybe they will enter the small engine market for commercial mowers and we will have some AWSOME engine choices.

[Nomoslowmow]

I have been using Toro 21" 2 cycles for about 9 years. I have 9 of them now. The first one I bought STILL RUNS. It's a little low on compression, but the motor has been perfect. I think it is on it's THIRD set of tires! I wish I knew how many hours it has on it. I love the low maint given by the washable air filter and no engine oil.

That much said here is what goes wrong with these mowers as the abuse and hours add up:

The rear wheel gears that drive the wheels wear out and are very expensive to replace. No amount of grease pumped into the supplied fittings will prevent this. On the last one I worked on, one side was full of grease and in good shape, and the other side was dry and totally wasted. The grease on the worn out side never got to the gears.

The control cables are prone to getting smashed when going down curbs. This is a result of bad cable routing and causes the cable to lock up or break.

The wheel height adjusters, front especially, either get too loose or feeze up. The bolts that adjust these are difficult to work on. My dealer saws them off and replaces them rather than fighting with them. Even when the adjusters are almost new they are better moved with your foot than your hand.

The handle support brackets break.

The rope on the recoil start breaks.

They are prone to heat induced vapor lock.

I am going to buy two more Toro 2 cycles and two Honda commercial Hydrostatic mowers next year and see how they compare on costs after a year. I am going to put hour meters on them and try to keep track of fuel use. Maybe a new set of problems from the Hondas are better than the old set of problems I have been fighting!

HTH

Bob