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wanabe
05-14-2011, 12:36 PM
OK, I have been looking arround at a used Hydraulic Breaker for my CTL, but have no clue what to look for. How can I tell a good unit from a trashed out junk unit? How about the nitrogen charge? Is it expensive to refill? Is it bad news if the charge is gone? Thanks

bobcat_ron
05-14-2011, 01:35 PM
Give the point a shake and wiggle, lots of wiggle room and a short point means lots of use. The nitrogen chamber(s) need to be pressurized and kept under a pressure gauge over night to check for a leak, no pressure and it can blow out your hydraulic system.

If there are any internal leaks between the oil passages and the upper chambers, the grease used for lubrication can migrate up into the oil flow and cause a "stroke" in your machine's pumps, that's how my Dad's hammer killed the Hitachi ZX27 last year.

They are very tough to buy used unless it's certified rebuilt, but a hammer no bigger than 500 impact pounds would be good on a 3 ton skiddy.

AVOID Bobcat's used hammers like the plague, go towards Caterpillar, Deere, Rammer and Stanley brands, they are all good.

obie
05-14-2011, 08:38 PM
Check out a kent kf3 or kf4. I have been running the same Kent kf3 for 10 years it has never let me down. I have a kent kf5 for sale. It is most likely to big for your unit. Runs great on 236b or larger cat hydraulics but hits to hard for 4" concrete. Do not uses your breaker point as a pry bar. Good luck-make money.

wanabe
05-15-2011, 07:18 PM
How can I check the nitrogen pressure? What is the normal pressure range? Thanks

bobcat_ron
05-15-2011, 08:24 PM
Check the owners manuals for the correct pressures, don't try to do it yourself unless you have the right tools and pressure setting.
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ksss
05-16-2011, 09:04 PM
My experience has been the the different hammers have a proprietary adaptor on them to check the N level.

I have had a Stanley/Bobcat breaker and now an Okada. The Stanley hit hard for years until finally the accumulator went out. I put it on a RB sale and still got 2500 for it. Only paid 4600 brand new. My Okada is a better breaker, its easier on the couplers and after 5 years still has not needed a shot of N. I am very happy with it.

WillieWonka1850
05-16-2011, 09:48 PM
Give the point a shake and wiggle, lots of wiggle room and a short point means lots of use. The nitrogen chamber(s) need to be pressurized and kept under a pressure gauge over night to check for a leak, no pressure and it can blow out your hydraulic system.

If there are any internal leaks between the oil passages and the upper chambers, the grease used for lubrication can migrate up into the oil flow and cause a "stroke" in your machine's pumps, that's how my Dad's hammer killed the Hitachi ZX27 last year.

They are very tough to buy used unless it's certified rebuilt, but a hammer no bigger than 500 impact pounds would be good on a 3 ton skiddy.

AVOID Bobcat's used hammers like the plague, go towards Caterpillar, Deere, Rammer and Stanley brands, they are all good.
What ever happened to the ZX27, Ron? Did you guys fix it or what? I'm curious...

bobcat_ron
05-16-2011, 10:01 PM
What ever happened to the ZX27, Ron? Did you guys fix it or what? I'm curious...

Still going strong, Dad just had the entire jackhammer rebuilt, top to bottom, the way it should have been. The rebuilders said it was in pretty bad shape inside, blown seals and scored and scarred pistons.
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hammer66
05-17-2011, 04:07 AM
i have had good luck with npk breaking mostley ledge and granite boulders .we bought ours new for about $100,000 onley changed the tool twice since 2005 the host is a 330 cat excavator. it is critical to grease the tool often,you can replace the tool bushing,check the bolts on the rubber mounts for breakage hope this helps a little.

wanabe
05-18-2011, 03:16 AM
Ok, I found a older NPK unit, 500lb. The owner(second owner) said he bought it 10 years ago, used it for one small job, then parked it(outside). Said it worked good 10 years ago, but has not used it since. Would you buy one that has been laying outside in the weather for 10 years, Or do I steer clear of this one? The owner is asking $1750, but seems to be willing to deal on it. If I do buy it, do I need to have the local NPK dealer take a look at it before I run it? Thanks

hammer66
05-18-2011, 07:47 AM
if it was stored correctly,the tool all the way up,nitrogen discharged,on a slight downward angle i see no,problem(you can google a owners manueal ) but it would not hurt to have a npk rep take a look npk is the cadilac of hammers. let me no how you make out.

ksss
05-18-2011, 10:38 AM
Ok, I found a older NPK unit, 500lb. The owner(second owner) said he bought it 10 years ago, used it for one small job, then parked it(outside). Said it worked good 10 years ago, but has not used it since. Would you buy one that has been laying outside in the weather for 10 years, Or do I steer clear of this one? The owner is asking $1750, but seems to be willing to deal on it. If I do buy it, do I need to have the local NPK dealer take a look at it before I run it? Thanks



Price seems good. Other than checking the N, and a visual not sure what the Rep can tell you without seeing it run or taking it apart to inspect it which would cost money to do. I would run it on your machine for a good half an hour of breaking to make sure it does not lose its hitting ability once it gets warmed up. I would be concerned about seals and the accumulator (not sure how an NPK is built) after sitting so long.

wanabe
05-18-2011, 08:51 PM
OK got it bought for $1100 cash. Im going to run it by the NPK dealer before I even try to run it, to have them check the pressure. Thanks

wanabe
05-24-2011, 09:41 PM
Ok, got it up and going. It had about 120 psi on the nitrogen, so we recharged it back to 320 psi. Its up and working good. But my next problem is the hammer will not stay on the machine, and it jumps off breaking a hyd fitting every time. Im not sure whats going on here? When I couple the breaker plate up to the machine quick coupler plate, I have about 1/4 inch gap at the bottom, which seems normal to me. The latches go through the bottom of the plate on, and stick out about 3/4 of a inch. Some how when I use it to hammer, the latches jump out of their pockets and the hammer falls off. I think I need to re work/weld the plate up? Any temporary solutions to this? Thanks

hammer66
05-25-2011, 07:21 AM
got any pics?

ksss
05-25-2011, 05:58 PM
If the tension is not right at the pins on your quick coupler, they will walk out especially with a breaker. Had that issue from time to time with a couple 1800 series machines. Assuming thats not the problem the next issue is if your coupler is slipping out of the top of the attachment. This is usually due to the top of the attachment being bent out allowing the coupler to slip out of the attachment or sometimes the ledge is not large enough to contain the top of the coupler and it slips out.

wanabe
05-26-2011, 01:51 AM
Thanks for the reply. I took the plasma cutter and burned off the top ledge that somone re welded on, and got a new piece of 1/2" thick 2 inch wide flat iron to replace it in the morning. I think im also going to weld up the holes in the bottom of the plate so that the wedges actually tighten it up as well.

Hollowellreid
05-26-2011, 09:33 PM
I have had this happen a few times also in extreme cases.

I found that welding a piece of ~3/8" or maybe up to 1/2" square piece of bar stock "behind" and "above" the hole where the quick attach pin engages. Most machines have enough room to give there and it also strengthens a weaker mount.

wanabe
05-28-2011, 12:02 AM
Got it fixed and job done. I ended up welding on a new top bar, and welding up the bottom holes in the plate.

Skidsteerman
06-01-2011, 05:25 PM
Buying a hammer from around $3K under = buyer beware. Could be buying a boat anchor - not worth repairing. Repair cost on hammers is insane and little hammers are pretty much disposable hammers. Little means anything under 1,000lbs I wouldn't rebuild it.

NPK is a great hammer but In my comparisons side by side, they don't hit like the Deere hammer at all. I had a 500lb Deere hammer out perform an NPK 750lbs hammer by a margin. Larger (1,000lb >) NPK hammers kick butt though.

Deere just changed their hammers and went with one that will not function until the tip is set in the work = no dry firing.

If your hammer works at the cost you purchased it at, then run it until it fails, but I wouldn't recommend investing $$$ in repairs. IMO

bobcat_ron
06-01-2011, 07:21 PM
Who ever bought my hammer got a good one for $2400, but it needs some TLC.
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wanabe
06-01-2011, 11:16 PM
Buying a hammer from around $3K under = buyer beware. Could be buying a boat anchor - not worth repairing. Repair cost on hammers is insane and little hammers are pretty much disposable hammers. Little means anything under 1,000lbs I wouldn't rebuild it.

NPK is a great hammer but In my comparisons side by side, they don't hit like the Deere hammer at all. I had a 500lb Deere hammer out perform an NPK 750lbs hammer by a margin. Larger (1,000lb >) NPK hammers kick butt though.

Deere just changed their hammers and went with one that will not function until the tip is set in the work = no dry firing.

If your hammer works at the cost you purchased it at, then run it until it fails, but I wouldn't recommend investing $$$ in repairs. IMO

OK, well I got the job done with it, broke about 40 ton of concrete out with it. Some was 14 inches thick as well. Are you saying that if I would have spent 3k on one that it would be a good hammer vs my $1100 hammer? I really don't get that? I have seen alot of over priced junk out there as well. The previous owner was a doctor, who bought this hammer for one job. He unhooked it 5 foot away from this job and parked it for 10 years. He was digging a small walk out basment for a new office and ran into rock, thus the hammer need. This basment was very small and had a double wide sat on it for the office(no joke lol). He wanted it moved because he was tired of mowing arround it. I have no reason to think its junk now that I ran it for a day.

Skidsteerman
06-04-2011, 10:56 AM
OK, well I got the job done with it, broke about 40 ton of concrete out with it. Some was 14 inches thick as well. Are you saying that if I would have spent 3k on one that it would be a good hammer vs my $1100 hammer? I really don't get that? I have seen alot of over priced junk out there as well. The previous owner was a doctor, who bought this hammer for one job. He unhooked it 5 foot away from this job and parked it for 10 years. He was digging a small walk out basment for a new office and ran into rock, thus the hammer need. This basment was very small and had a double wide sat on it for the office(no joke lol). He wanted it moved because he was tired of mowing arround it. I have no reason to think its junk now that I ran it for a day.

I never said "your" hammer was junk and I never said NPK's little hammers were junk. I'm pointing out that the chances of finding a good working hammer in that price range will be very very very rare.

Not too many people would purchase a new ~$10K hammer for a little job and set it off to the side for 10 years. Usually they would rent one for the job at hand.

My other concern would be, if that hammer has sat for ten years out side, there's a pretty good chance the seals have turned hard and brittle on it. While it may work right now, things may change on it down the road. Setting for anything is hard on components. Just keep an eye on these things. It would be much cheaper to have it resealed then to run it until things get scored up inside - that's when it turns into a boat anchor.

You are very fortune enough to find a good working hammer on the very cheap side of things.

wanabe
06-04-2011, 05:57 PM
Do you sell NPK? Just wondering what a seal kit runs for a 2XA or 2AX hammer?