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MJ LANDSCAPING
10-27-2002, 10:34 AM
What are the going rates for constructing a raised patio? The old deck has to be removed which is 720sq. ft. The new raised patio will be almost double the old one at 1300sq. ft. The linear foot of the wall is 115'. The patio will also consist of tubbled pavers and 3 sets of bullnose steps at 5' wide. Any suggestions on how much to charge?

PAPS
10-27-2002, 12:36 PM
What I usually do for raised patios is figure out the price for the retaining wall/steps in terms of face sq/ ft and then figure out the sq/ft of the paver patio too.... ofcourse adding more becasue there is more materials to fill-in to get the patio raised.

based on your descript..... my estimate would be about the following:

1. 115' x 2' (you said 3 steps, I assume there 8'') = 230 sq/ft.
= $6900.00.
2. additional fill-dirt to raise patio = 1300 sq at 1.5' raise
= 74 yards + machine work = $625.00.
3. (3) steps @ $150.00 per step. = $450.00
4. Pavers @ 1300 sq. + 15% waste = 1500 sq. @$7.00 = $11,250.00


TOTAL : $19,225.00


note: I would have all materials on a direct delv. so my price per sq. ft on the pavers and wall stone would be significantly lower than if bought from retail supply.

jmleaver
10-27-2002, 08:33 PM
when doing walkway/patios. Is it a good rule of thumb to charge between 11.50-15.00 per square foot depending upon the size of job and types of pavers?

steveair
10-28-2002, 12:19 AM
Hello,

The main thing is to just sit down and break the job into parts.

1. Retaining wall
2. fill and compacting behind wall to bring up grade
3. pavers
4. steps.

Just figure each process as a individual job, and you should do fine. I would just be sure to include some extra time for compacting and filling the raised area.....it takes quite a while to fill and compact a large area in 6" lifts. Be sure to charge accordingly.

steve

Rex Mann
10-28-2002, 12:58 AM
MJ,

Some other elements to consider before pricing out this project.

is the patio edge straight or curved?

are the steps going to be internal or external

type of pattern to be laid

how high is the patio to be raised-if you are building 3 steps @ 8 inch per then your final elevation of the top of the patio would be about 32 inches- because building 3 steps will give you 4 steps-the 4th step is onto the yard

access to the project from the delivery point

time for removing decking including disposal costs

also will the deck footings stay or must the be removed

Everyone has their own pricing structure based on overhead, desired profit, market segment and percevied self-value.

If we were biding this job we would be around $13,600.00

This would be standard pavers, not tumbled. tumbled you could add another $1,000.00 bucks. We break down all of our costs.

From backyard access to a price on base by the square foot. We also have a 5% waste factor figured in. BTW: how do you charge full price for the waste factor? We get paid for only what goes in the ground. If the project has an overage than we must have a change order signed. Hope this helps you out.

Also, I would have uncovered your prospects budget, how much are they able and willing to spend on this project, during the first meeting. If the budget is not there then you are not needlessly using your time trying to come up with an accurate estimate. I am sure you had some idea of the retail cost.

Rex

MJ LANDSCAPING
11-17-2002, 05:56 PM
thanks everyone for the input.

SCL
11-18-2002, 09:59 AM
Rex,
Good post , but I have two questions. 1, you talk about getting a change order for extra materials. When we buy pavers and blocks they come in pallets or sections, and we build that price in the bid. What is the change for the order? And 2, you come up with 5% waste factor. That seems awful low, unless doing a straight line or measured square. On some projects we have as much as 15 to 20%. Works back into that overage thing. How do you come up with the low number?
Scott

Rex Mann
11-20-2002, 11:39 AM
SCL,

When our salespeople sell a job they are selling X amount of square feet. Let's say X=1300 square feet. The crew goes out and builds off the print or drawing, which the salesperson either drew or did the take offs. If they did this wrong, then we have a problem. Most of the time when this does happen it ends up being measured short. Therefore, we get a change order for the "missed" footage. That is another reason we charge by the square foot for pavers and by the square face foot for walls and by the linear foot for steps (diffrent prices on straight or curved). We break all the pricing down on the contract.

If you are effective in job planning, layout and desing you can be around 5% waste. However, you are correct. It can depend on the pattern and the shape. But, we do average 5% waste factor. When you do 600K square of residential pavers a year you learn to minimize your costs and maximize your efforts.

Peace,

Rex

Stonehenge
11-20-2002, 02:45 PM
Rex, I'm interested in your last post, about minimizing costs and maximizing efforts. But my approach is different from yours regarding waste.

And some of this is likely due to the prevalence of simple Hollandstone being the paver of choice in this area.

I find that about 10% waste or even a bit more works out best for us. For that kind of waste, we lay the entire field beyond the soldier course, then run a 12" cutoff saw for most cuts.

I find that the labor we save, coupled with our ability to plow through more work in a year because of that savings, more than justifies the extra waste cost.

Less waste than that and we have to handle pavers too much, trying to get the most sq ft out of each cut paver.

And did I read that right? You do 600,000 square feet of residential pavers per year? That's several thousands of square feet per day! That's much more than I thought you did.

BTW, you'll have to let me know how your version 2.0 of your CD-ROM is going. You were planning on adding video last time we chatted.

Jeff

SCL
11-20-2002, 09:04 PM
Rex, )
Thanks for some clarification, but a few more questions. Jeff asked the first one as to the amount of pavers. If thats correct, then all I have to say is 'you da man" Second, when you say you bid by the sq. foot, do you just give the customer your sq. ft. price and then hand them a total for whatever you installed with a change order for whatever may be over the original amount? (god I hope that came out right:rolleyes: ) If this works for you great, man I'd like to try that where I'm at. We use change orders for additions and changes spec'd by the customer. Most figure that if I screw up the bid I am going to eat it.

Thanks
Scott

Rex Mann
11-21-2002, 01:25 AM
Scott,

We tell them the price per square foot and we also inform them of the total projected cost.

Jeff,

I have joined forces with a company in Arizona. Here we utilize 9 crews which are spread out over Arizona and New Mexico. We do high volume in new residential driveways, condo complexes and basic residential projects. We have an entire subdivsion, 375 homes total, which each get a paver drive and front walkway as part of the purchase price. We got the developer to include it in the CCR's AKA deed restrictions. Lots of pavers out here plus we work year round! The CD is not used here. We have our own company marketing guy who is just amazing. The printed word can still be presented well enough to convey the texture, color and sense of beatuy pavers can evoke.

Peace,

Rex