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kirk1701
08-10-2011, 01:46 PM
At least thats what I think they are, they are taking over the back yard and they dive at me everytime I go out. Now normally I'm not scared of yellowjackets, bee's or hornets; leave them alone they leave you alone and everyone gets along fine.

How do I get rid of these things (besides gas not interested in that) before me or the family end up in the ER and I just got my dad out of the hospital for other reasons so don't want to end up back there again.

http://img200.imageshack.us/img200/9979/img1180g.th.jpg (http://img200.imageshack.us/img200/9979/img1180g.jpg)

http://img535.imageshack.us/img535/4976/img1177jc.th.jpg (http://img535.imageshack.us/img535/4976/img1177jc.jpg)

http://img811.imageshack.us/img811/9638/img1176f.th.jpg (http://img811.imageshack.us/img811/9638/img1176f.jpg)

Thanks guys

sprayboy
08-10-2011, 02:02 PM
Cicada killers
you can put sevin in the nest at night and cover it up with the dirt.

I've never heard of anyone getting stung by them.

I do some vegetation work in rip rap and there must be thousands of them flying around, I just ignore them.

vencops
08-10-2011, 02:04 PM
cicada killers?

Learn something every day.

Ric
08-10-2011, 02:14 PM
At least thats what I think they are, they are taking over the back yard and they dive at me everytime I go out. Now normally I'm not scared of yellowjackets, bee's or hornets; leave them alone they leave you alone and everyone gets along fine.

How do I get rid of these things (besides gas not interested in that) before me or the family end up in the ER and I just got my dad out of the hospital for other reasons so don't want to end up back there again.

http://img200.imageshack.us/img200/9979/img1180g.th.jpg (http://img200.imageshack.us/img200/9979/img1180g.jpg)

http://img535.imageshack.us/img535/4976/img1177jc.th.jpg (http://img535.imageshack.us/img535/4976/img1177jc.jpg)

http://img811.imageshack.us/img811/9638/img1176f.th.jpg (http://img811.imageshack.us/img811/9638/img1176f.jpg)

Thanks guys


Kirk

If you have a skid sprayer, that might be the best way by hosing them down real heavy with a pyrethrin. It has a fast knock down and will be safer. Also do it at night if possible. A hose end bottle sprayer can work also if you don't have a skid sprayer. BTW add a heavy % of dish soap it helps to control.

These are stinging insect that can & have killed more than one person. Any time I have to get that close I wear a Bee Suit. Because they are not a pest of plants my state requires a Structural License to treat them. You may want to think about have a professional in your area treatment for you. They will or should have the proper PPE for getting the job done.

Ric
08-10-2011, 02:19 PM
Cicada killers
you can put sevin in the nest at night and cover it up with the dirt.

I've never heard of anyone getting stung by them.

I do some vegetation work in rip rap and there must be thousands of them flying around, I just ignore them.

Sprayboy

Ground Hornets are in fact very dangerous. Just run over a nest with a mower and see how long many stings you can take before dying.

kirk1701
08-10-2011, 02:31 PM
Kirk

If you have a skid sprayer, that might be the best way by hosing them down real heavy with a pyrethrin. It has a fast knock down and will be safer. Also do it at night if possible. A hose end bottle sprayer can work also if you don't have a skid sprayer. BTW add a heavy % of dish soap it helps to control.

These are stinging insect that can & have killed more than one person. Any time I have to get that close I wear a Bee Suit. Because they are not a pest of plants my state requires a Structural License to treat them. You may want to think about have a professional in your area treatment for you. They will or should have the proper PPE for getting the job done.

No skid sprayer and the closest thing I have is a pressure washer which isn't very close at all. However I haven't seen many of them, just the nest so I actually may get away with a Ortho hose end sprayer and spray the pyrethrin??

Sprayboy

Ground Hornets are in fact very dangerous. Just run over a nest with a mower and see how long many stings you can take before dying.

And that in fact is what I'm concerned about, I mowed last night and went over all the nest but was looking over my dam neck the whole time.

sprayboy
08-10-2011, 02:42 PM
Ric,
I agree the ground hornets are very dangerous and have known people to go to the emergency room from getting stung.

The pics he showed are the cicada killers which are not aggressive towards stinging humans as are the ground hornets.

I watched one last year trying to get a cicada through the cracks in my deck down to it's nest. Was interesting to watch.

rlitman
08-10-2011, 02:47 PM
These are stinging insect that can & have killed more than one person.

I'm pretty sure they're cicada killers too. I don't know of any other wasps in North America that look like that.
I challenge you to find a single report of someone killed by a cicada killer (even someone highly allergic). I don't expect anyone will be able to find a single legitimate instance.

The ones that "dive bomb" you are males, and don't even have a stinger.
You probably won't see the females, but their sting is rated as about as bad as a mosquito's bite. Nothing to be concerned with.

Now I certainly understand your wanting to kill them.
You may want to read this:
http://www.showmejoe.com/thriller/control.htm

If you decide to kill them, consider this: you'll need to spray lots of chemicals, and will likely not kill what's in the nests (because of how they are internally walled off). You can cover the nests (say with brick or stone), and that will stop them. But your best bet, is to sit back and watch nature. They're pretty cool creatures.

RussellB
08-10-2011, 03:16 PM
dang I feel bad now. The last two years I have killed them because I thought they were big bees. I used a can of hornet spray (the kind that is a foam and sprays about 10 plus feet) and it worked well. The guys are right, they are cool to watch and I won't be killing any more of them.
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RigglePLC
08-10-2011, 04:18 PM
I don't think they are cicada killer wasps. Cicada killers nest individually--not in a colony.
http://www.ca.uky.edu/entomology/entfacts/ef004.asp

For yellowjackets I suggest some Sevin dust. Sneak up on 'em at night when its cool and they won't be very active. Dump a couple ounces of dust down the hole. And on the dirt landing area in front of the nest. The dust will not evaporate and will stay around long enough to coat their bodies and get into the fine hairs of their bodies. With luck the whole colony is gone.

kirk1701
08-10-2011, 05:54 PM
I don't think they are cicada killer wasps. Cicada killers nest individually--not in a colony.
http://www.ca.uky.edu/entomology/entfacts/ef004.asp

For yellowjackets I suggest some Sevin dust. Sneak up on 'em at night when its cool and they won't be very active. Dump a couple ounces of dust down the hole. And on the dirt landing area in front of the nest. The dust will not evaporate and will stay around long enough to coat their bodies and get into the fine hairs of their bodies. With luck the whole colony is gone.

I'm going to try the seven dust first since I do have a ton of that on hand as we use it in the garden.

If it helps at all as to the confusion on Cicada killers/ground hornets; last year they went into a hole in the brick and into the attic which I stopped up last fall with silicon.

Ric
08-10-2011, 06:43 PM
Ric,
I agree the ground hornets are very dangerous and have known people to go to the emergency room from getting stung.

The pics he showed are the cicada killers which are not aggressive towards stinging humans as are the ground hornets.

I watched one last year trying to get a cicada through the cracks in my deck down to it's nest. Was interesting to watch.

Sprayboy

MY BAD, I didn't clink on the Picture and only assumed the right ID was a Ground Hornet. But with a larger infestation they can and will sting. While they might not be as dangerous as Ground Hornets, I would still want them gone.

humble1
08-11-2011, 06:47 AM
Cicada holes look like someone drilled a hole in the ground usually lots of seperate holes one for each larvae. But any dust like tempo connect a length of poly hose that goes over the tip, you can att the hose to a length of dowel to direct the end of the hose. Squirt some in the hole at night, hold your breath they can p/u on the CO2. When they beat their wings to cool the nest the insecticide will move they will all die w in days.


I don't think they are cicada killer wasps. Cicada killers nest individually--not in a colony.
http://www.ca.uky.edu/entomology/entfacts/ef004.asp

For yellowjackets I suggest some Sevin dust. Sneak up on 'em at night when its cool and they won't be very active. Dump a couple ounces of dust down the hole. And on the dirt landing area in front of the nest. The dust will not evaporate and will stay around long enough to coat their bodies and get into the fine hairs of their bodies. With luck the whole colony is gone.
Posted via Mobile Device

kirk1701
08-11-2011, 09:28 AM
Cicada holes look like someone drilled a hole in the ground usually lots of seperate holes one for each larvae. But any dust like tempo connect a length of poly hose that goes over the tip, you can att the hose to a length of dowel to direct the end of the hose. Squirt some in the hole at night, hold your breath they can p/u on the CO2. When they beat their wings to cool the nest the insecticide will move they will all die w in days.



Posted via Mobile Device

I put the seven out last night so we will see.

I'm starting to lean more toward Cicada killers and the reason I say this is because the amount of holes humble1 is refering too, there are at least 20 now in the back and it don't seem like there are more then one going into each hole???

Any thoughts?

While putting the seven out last night I could get close enough to hear it, sounds like a dirt dobber backing mud :laugh:

NattyLawn
08-11-2011, 11:00 AM
The first pic is of a cicada killer. They've been active the last few weeks here, and are considered beneficials by many books and manuals. They don't live in colonies and are very territorial from what I've read. I walk past 4 or 5 of them every morning the past week or so to get the paper and I walk right through. I have seen them do some damage in the summer months with all the holes, but that usually fills back in quickly early fall.

Daily Lawn/Landscape
08-11-2011, 02:33 PM
kirk,
These critters are not going to hurt you. They in fact are cicada killers. The reason I know is I'm highly allergic to stings. I ran across these a couple of years ago. Took one to friend of mine who is exterminator, and he stated, they are not aggressive to humans. I have been working in a yard over the past 2 weeks that has these guys flying around everywhere. We even got to see one take down a cicada, kill it and fly off with it( very cool).

James

kirk1701
08-11-2011, 05:02 PM
kirk,
These critters are not going to hurt you. They in fact are cicada killers. The reason I know is I'm highly allergic to stings. I ran across these a couple of years ago. Took one to friend of mine who is exterminator, and he stated, they are not aggressive to humans. I have been working in a yard over the past 2 weeks that has these guys flying around everywhere. We even got to see one take down a cicada, kill it and fly off with it( very cool).

James

We'll I haven't seen one take down a cicada however I have seen them today on the ground dragging the cicada's into the hole so they are in fact cicada killers. I've been working on that side of the yard all morning and had the chance to experience them at work.

Just watching them in the grass dragging the cicada into the hole is ahhhh wicked to say the least.

Mark Oomkes
08-11-2011, 06:44 PM
The first pic is plain as the nose on one's face, a cicada killer. The second pic is exactly what one of their nests\holes looks like.

I wasn't sure if they were aggressive either but was messing with one coming out of its den, flew around me but never came close to landing on me.

I'll try to take a pic of an infield that has probably at least 100 holes in it. So I wouldn't say they don't colonize, as I could see a half dozen at one time.

Ben Greener
08-12-2011, 02:25 AM
The cicada-killer wasps that are digging are not typically aggressive to the point of stinging someone. This is a seasonal thing and the wasps are the females digging a hole to bury the dead cicada with a single wasp egg inside. I was seeing them all over today, and while they will approach a person, I've never known this particular wasp to actually sting a person.

kirk1701
08-12-2011, 09:18 AM
The cicada-killer wasps that are digging are not typically aggressive to the point of stinging someone. This is a seasonal thing and the wasps are the females digging a hole to bury the dead cicada with a single wasp egg inside. I was seeing them all over today, and while they will approach a person, I've never known this particular wasp to actually sting a person.

Yea but if provoked or desterbed then what?

Like me mowing over there nest; I know if someone was mowing my roof I'd probably go out the door with a shot gun myself :laugh:

Thats what I'm afraid of while mowing

grassman177
08-12-2011, 09:24 AM
i used sevin dust and within 24hrs i had none left. i had about 30 in my back yard from tons of dif nests, was annoying and scared my dogs.

worked great and cheap. recommend it

Mark Oomkes
08-12-2011, 09:40 AM
Yea but if provoked or desterbed then what?

Like me mowing over there nest; I know if someone was mowing my roof I'd probably go out the door with a shot gun myself :laugh:

Thats what I'm afraid of while mowing

I was basically kicking at one, all it did was fly at eye level sort of circling me and took off.

It's not like it's a bear or gator that's going to really cause harm. Worst they can do is sting or bite.

kirk1701
08-12-2011, 10:10 AM
i used sevin dust and within 24hrs i had none left. i had about 30 in my back yard from tons of dif nests, was annoying and scared my dogs.

worked great and cheap. recommend it
Yea, I've been doing just that in the holes I'd found. Now I see them fly in and go in the ground in places there is no dirt so slowly finding those also.

I was basically kicking at one, all it did was fly at eye level sort of circling me and took off.

It's not like it's a bear or gator that's going to really cause harm. Worst they can do is sting or bite.
Problem is, others on here say if they do bite they can kill you :confused:

rlitman
08-12-2011, 10:42 AM
Yea but if provoked or desterbed then what?

Like me mowing over there nest; I know if someone was mowing my roof I'd probably go out the door with a shot gun myself :laugh:

Thats what I'm afraid of while mowing

Refer back to the link I sent earlier:
http://www.showmejoe.com/thriller/control.htm
He seems to deal with them on a regular basis.

I have a few of them in my yard. I've still never seen a female at home (although I have elsewhere), but have encountered many males flying around the nests. They've buzzed my head, and even bumped into me. Never been stung (which makes sense, because the males don't have a stinger).
I've gotten close enough to to some that landed on nearby plants to get some pretty cool pictures. When I offload my camera's card, I'll post some.

Now I don't at all disagree with your fear of them. They're quite intimidating, and I'm not going to look down on you for killing any and all you see, but I for one choose very carefully where I apply chemicals in my yard, and use the absolute least I can get away with, which means for me, sparing these odd and interesting creatures.

grassman177
08-12-2011, 04:01 PM
i dont care about them, but if my dogs wont go out to poop, then it is considered a pest. otherise, they dont bothe me that much, but this year was too much cuz i seriously had a swarm of them in my small back lawn.

Mark Oomkes
08-12-2011, 10:23 PM
Problem is, others on here say if they do bite they can kill you :confused:

Go back and reread Ric's post. He didn't realize they were cicada killers when he posted that.

rlitman
08-14-2011, 09:47 AM
Pictures as promised:

kirk1701
08-14-2011, 10:18 AM
Nice pics rlitman

The seven don't seem to be working, they just move and drill another hole :laugh:

rlitman
08-14-2011, 10:31 AM
You can see how close he let me get in the last shot, because one wing is in focus, and the other is not. I almost got him to land on me when something came up and I had to go.
This was of a male, hanging around the nests. He buzzed my head a few times before deciding that I was not a willing suitor and landing.
A few hours later I was back with the camera, and saw two males fighting in flight, but wasn't able to get off a shot.

I don't believe they live in the holes. The female digs the holes to place a paralyzed cicada with an egg in it. She then closes the hole. The egg hatches, and the larva eats the cicada until it is able to emerge from the ground. By then, the sevin is likely dissipated.

kirk1701
08-14-2011, 10:54 AM
You can see how close he let me get in the last shot, because one wing is in focus, and the other is not. I almost got him to land on me when something came up and I had to go.
This was of a male, hanging around the nests. He buzzed my head a few times before deciding that I was not a willing suitor and landing.
A few hours later I was back with the camera, and saw two males fighting in flight, but wasn't able to get off a shot.

I don't believe they live in the holes. The female digs the holes to place a paralyzed cicada with an egg in it. She then closes the hole. The egg hatches, and the larva eats the cicada until it is able to emerge from the ground. By then, the sevin is likely dissipated.

Do you know when the larva matures and surfaces?
I ask because 5 or 6 years ago I had a thread on here in the spring with what looked like an ant mound, but no ants???

I never did find out what it was

alanauer
08-15-2011, 03:29 PM
Thanks for the great photos, rlitman, especially the last one. Just to be sure: these are called Cicada Killers and they don't sting, but there are other species of underground wasp- or hornet-like ones that DO sting. If that's correct, how do the stinging ones differ in appearance?

rlitman
08-15-2011, 04:50 PM
There is a giant hornet I've read about in Japan that looks similar (but even larger). It's responsible for many deaths annually, and is quite scary for real. Not something you would see in North America though. You may want to google this one for some scary reading.


Ground hornets are nasty things.

Most recently I had a nest of them in a place that didn't get noticed, and both my son and I got stung. When I finally found the nest, I dumped about a cup of Sevin dust all around the multiple openings that night. The nest was dead within a day, but a year later I had to dig it up and cover with lime to get rid of the rotting smell (it was pretty bad).

I had a nest where they got under the flashing in a basement window, and started a nest in the foundation's cinder block hollows. When I sprayed a can of wasp killer into the opening I saw, it never made it to the actual colony because of the horizontal path they used to exit, and within a day, they were using a new entrance. I popped the tops on six cans of foaming wasp killer, and put one in each of my wife's hands.
She kept the opening completely covered in foam, as I worked my way in with an axe. I dusted everything with boric acid before I replaced the flashing. :) There's something particularly gratifying about this scorched earth approach.

They're easier to deal with when there is just one entrance in the middle of the ground. . .


But ground hornets and all of the wasps I've seen are all WAY smaller than a cicada killer (even carpenter bees are quite a bit smaller). First time I noticed a cicada killer in my back yard, I was thinking hummingbird, and not a wasp.

Anyway, if you see several wasps coming and going from the same hole in the ground, you've got a colony to be concerned with.
With cicada killers, you won't see more than one wasp enter and exit one hole. The female will burrow in, hunt down a cicada, and return with it, but you won't ever see two of them fly out of the same hole, and the larva will overwinter in that same hole in a cocoon, emerging the following spring (which is why treating with a pesticide will probably not kill them).

americanlawn
08-15-2011, 06:48 PM
Had a lady get stung last week because she was pruning shrubs near a nest. Our mowing crews have also been stung over the years, but it's rare. Only the female cicada killer wasps "sting". At most, the males can "prick" using the sharp tip from their belly, but it doesn't hurt much at all. However the female sting can swell up & cause an allergic reaction. Males are a little smaller than females. Females are normally solitary, while males can appear in "groups".

We've killed them 2 ways: Sevin "dust" or "drenching" the nest with liquid insecticides.

I never heard of kerosene, but here's an article :confused:

http://www.ehow.com/how_5498460_kill-cicada-killer-wasps.html

alanauer
08-15-2011, 08:58 PM
I should think that a nighttime dumping of a pail or two of topsoil over the nesting area would do the trick.

Hogjaw
08-15-2011, 09:19 PM
I DON'T RECOMMEND - but have eliminated over the years several underground operations by pouring diesel mixed with small amount of gas in entrance, waiting a few minutes then igniting with long trail of mixture.

However, this was in my younger years when I was more mobile, less conscious of the dangers, and could run considerably faster than now.

One problem is you don't know which direction tunnels run and may find yourself on top.

CAUTION: Explosion is rather like a boom, rattles everything for some distance, and take a chance on blowing yourself up.

PROGNOSIS: eliminated pest permanently.

AGAIN, I don't recommend or suggest this method.

I am highly allergic to both wasps and yellow jackets.

teejet
08-16-2011, 12:50 AM
Here is a novel idea. go out in the evening, stick your spray wand down the hole. Then spray some insecticide.

Ric
08-16-2011, 09:15 AM
Here is a novel idea. go out in the evening, stick your spray wand down the hole. Then spray some insecticide.

Be Careful sticking your wand in a hole and spraying Fertilizer, It can be very costly.

kirk1701
08-16-2011, 11:49 AM
Be Careful sticking your wand in a hole and spraying Fertilizer, It can be very costly.

I did something similar the other day, had the power washer out washing the mold off the north side of the garage and house so stuck the tip down in the hole of one of these nests and drowned them out :laugh:

Later that same day I was picking up the walnuts and one of those suckers point blank hit me in the ash while I was picking them up (didn't sting). Sure enough, I was cluse to its food :laugh: and while picking up the walnuts I found a dead cicada I guess it was attempting to get to the nest.

alanauer
08-16-2011, 02:09 PM
THIS JUST OUT. SOUNDS LIKE THE HELPFUL WASPS DESCRIBED BELOW COULD BE SIMILAR TO OR THE SAME AS THESE ONES THAT EVERYONE SEEMS TO WANT DEAD.



New Weapon in Emerald Ash Borer Detection

August 10, 2011


Researchers confirmed that Cerceris fumipennis (Cerceris), a native wasp that preys on Emerald Ash Borers (EAB), was found at Emerson Park in suburban Skokie, IL. The discovery was a result of a partnership between The Morton Arboretum and the Illinois Parks and Recreation Association.

Now, researchers hope that the wasp will serve as a sort of “canary in the coal mine”, or an early warning system for EAB infestation, in areas where EAB has not yet been found, according to Dr. Frederic Miller, Research Associate at The Morton Arboretum.

“By the time humans are able to detect EAB visually, the infestation is usually well-established. We hope this wasp will serve as an effective monitoring tool, giving us an earlier read as EAB makes its way across the country,” says Miller.

Researchers hope that earlier detection in ash trees will help communities’ better control and manage infestations.

Cerceris wasps nest in the ground, commonly in open areas of hard-packed sandy soil with ash trees nearby. Athletic fields, such as ball diamonds, volleyball courts, horse shoe pits, and even parking lots are common nesting locations. The nests are characterized by pencil-diameter holes on top of little mounds of sand. The wasps are most active during summer months, when they feed on a whole family of wood-boring insects called Buprestid, of which EAB is a member, according to Devin Krafka, Research Assistant at The Morton Arboretum.

“Cerceris is a parasitic wasp. It goes out to find a buprestid, or a wood-boring insect like EAB, stings it, and brings one back to its nest. Later, it will lay an egg on it and place it in its own chamber. When the egg hatches, the larva will eat the beetle,” said Krafka.

Hunting for wasps

To help in the hunt for the wasp, The Morton Arboretum set up a new ‘biosurveillance’ program. The Cerceris Identification and Awareness program (CIA for EAB) enlists the help of park district staff and park users to look for wasp nests and EAB carcasses near them. The Cerceris wasp is a good candidate for this pilot program, as it doesn’t harm humans. This new program asks the community to be ‘Citizen Scientists’ to help fight invasive pests.

“We need park professionals and residents to watch ball fields for signs of ground-nesting wasp activity or the actual nests,” said Edith Makra, Community Tree Advocate at The Morton Arboretum, who leads the CIA citizen science effort. “We first need to locate and confirm the presence of Cerceris so that we can enlist ‘Citizen Scientists’ in future monitoring that can help manage EAB to protect ash trees.”

Once park districts alert The Morton Arboretum about possible nests, Krafka and other research assistants will confirm they belong to Cerceris wasp.

The Cerceris is different from the Oobius wasps the city of Chicago recently released to fight EAB. Cerceris is native to the area and can thrive in our environment. Tiny, almost invisible, the Oobius wasps are from China. Federal officials introduced Oobius wasps in hope they will reduce the number of EAB in the city. Whereas researchers hope Cerceris, a much larger wasp easier for biosurveillance, will help them locate EAB infestations early.

humble1
08-21-2011, 06:49 PM
Yea,


Problem is, others on here say if they do bite they can kill you :confused:
They don't kill people they kill cicadas, also they do sting but not very likely
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rlitman
08-22-2011, 01:13 PM
They don't kill people they kill cicadas, also they do sting but not very likely
Posted via Mobile Device

Their sting doesn't even kill the cicada. It just paralyzes it.
Because the cicada is left alive, it doesn't rot, so the egg has time to hatch and eat it.

GordonCBP
08-22-2011, 04:13 PM
Their sting doesn't even kill the cicada. It just paralyzes it.
Because the cicada is left alive, it doesn't rot, so the egg has time to hatch and eat it.

Not aggressive at all to humans (unless you really want to pet one). They just buzz around till they find what they are looking for (cicadas/grubs). They only stay around for a few days to a week and they are gone.

alanauer
08-22-2011, 04:54 PM
Ya -- I was keeping an eye on them and trying to decide what if anything to do -- and a week later they were all gone on their own!

ohiolawnguy928
08-22-2011, 06:07 PM
Ive heard that just sticking sticks down in the holes and leaving them will take care of em and also bring about far fewer the next year. Better than applying a ton of fuel or excess insecticides. Cant say it definately works as ive never seen before and afters.